A Windows XP help forum. PCbanter

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Home » PCbanter forum » Windows 10 » Windows 10 Help Forum
Site Map Home Register Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

Can Adobe Illustrator read in a Microsoft PowerPoint & with fonts?



 
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #91  
Old April 2nd 18, 11:48 AM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Ragnusen Ultred
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 178
Default Can Adobe Illustrator read in a Microsoft PowerPoint & with fonts?

Am Fri, 30 Mar 2018 20:25:54 -0400, schrieb Neil:

Bottom line is this: hand them an Illustrator file and pay the print
shop for doing manual layout.


Hi Neil,

Remember you asked me to ask the shop?

Well, I sent them the output from Adobe Illustrator (in both PDF and in AI)
where neither can 'embed' the font (which seems crazy, but that's what my
tests clearly showed).

At the same time, I asked them WHY Adobe Illustrator.

This is what I got back by way of answer...
"The Vinyl Cutter uses a cut extension through Adobe Illustrator,
thus the need to format the art through Illustrator.
We program what is cut through Illustrator.
Your pdf files will work fine. I have to install the fonts
you gave, which is no big deal. Changing the fonts so that
the cut is easy. No new layout work will need to be done."
Ads
  #92  
Old April 2nd 18, 05:43 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Ragnusen Ultred
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 178
Default Can Adobe Illustrator read in a Microsoft PowerPoint & with fonts?

Am Mon, 2 Apr 2018 01:15:12 -0700, schrieb Ragnusen Ultred:

Which results in the perfectly faithful result after selecting
the Roadgeek font.
http://i.cubeupload.com/CnFAUN.gif
https://u.cubeupload.com/M873ot.gif

And the fantastically beautiful result after I select the Roadgeek font.
http://i.cubeupload.com/CnFAUN.gif


POWERFUL TAKEAWAYS FROM THE SOLUTION!

Based on our experiments and this email below, I think the shop was
purposefully evasive all this time simply because of this simple fact:
*There is almost zero manual layout effort*!

The only manual "layout effort" required is the minute it takes to download
and install the font set into the Mac and then to point to the Roadgeek
2005 Series B font once the PDF is opened in Adobe Illustrator.

That's a big deal, because it tells us the shop was handing us mush for an
explanation. Now all the obtuse explanations make complete sense.

This is what I got back by way of answer when I asked why the shop chose
Adobe Illustrator...
"The Vinyl Cutter uses a cut extension through Adobe Illustrator,
thus the need to format the art through Illustrator.
We program what is cut through Illustrator.
Your pdf files will work fine. I have to install the fonts
you gave, which is no big deal. Changing the fonts so that
the cut is easy. No new layout work will need to be done."

There's another astoundingly huge takeaway from this process, which is that
PowerPoint is the absolutely *perfect* tool for this job, not only because
we have a score of people editing the same file, but because that file can
have the fonts *embedded* (which is something Adobe Illustrator can't do!).

So, there are two huge takeaways that we learned in this solution.

1. PowerPoint is the *best* format possible for the layout task, and,
2. Adobe Illustrator has almost literally zero manual layout required!

Thanks for all your help to arrive at that simple, and yet powerful
conclusion, where I thank everyone for being an adult, and especially Paul
for enabling the solution by diligent research (which some people naysayed,
but which was instrumental at arriving at the truth).

Thanks!
  #93  
Old April 2nd 18, 08:14 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Ragnusen Ultred
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 178
Default Can Adobe Illustrator read in a Microsoft PowerPoint & with fonts?

Am Mon, 2 Apr 2018 09:43:01 -0700, schrieb Ragnusen Ultred:

There's another astoundingly huge takeaway from this process, which is that
PowerPoint is the absolutely *perfect* tool for this job, not only because
we have a score of people editing the same file, but because that file can
have the fonts *embedded* (which is something Adobe Illustrator can't do!).


The shop has instantly been far more responsive now that I provided them
with the Adobe Illustrator file, where they emailed how I could eliminate
the need for them to load the font altogether, which I reproduce below for
the tribal knowledge record to benefit.
"You can embed a font in AI, by turning the font into a shape.
1) Select the font with the black arrow tool.
2) Go to the TYPE drop down menu at the top of the AI app.
3) Select "create outlines".
You would do this as you very last step ... after the layout
was correct and everything was spelled & set up correctly."

I tried it and was successful, where I outline the steps in more detail:

1. I started Windows Adobe Illustrator 12.0.0 (from the CS2 suite)
2. I opened the PDF from PowerPoint into Adobe Illustrator (AI)
3. In AI, I ran "AI: Type Find Font" to find all the fonts
4. In that form I changed "Document" to "System"
Fonts in Document: 1*
Change from: Replace with Font From: [Document]
Change to: Replace with Font From: [System]
Then change the font from: 1*
Then change the font to: Roadgeek 2005 Series B
Then hit "Change All" and then "Done"
5. The Adobe Illustrator layout is now perfectly faithful to the original
6. In AI, I pressed "V" to get into the selection tool.
7. In AI, I pressed "Control+A" to select everything.
8. In AI, I pressed "Control+Shift+O" to create outlines
9. In AI, I pressed "Save As" to saved the *outlined.ai file
10. In AI, I also saved as a PDF to create the *outlined.pdf file
11. I checked with Ai: Type "Find Fonts"
12. That showed there were no longer any fonts in the document

Voila! No fonts needed. A perfect layout.
No manual layout required whatsoever in Adobe Illustrator.
Just load the file, and print it to vinyl.

Efficiency at last!
  #94  
Old April 2nd 18, 10:21 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Paul[_32_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 11,873
Default Can Adobe Illustrator read in a Microsoft PowerPoint & with fonts?

Ragnusen Ultred wrote:
Am Fri, 30 Mar 2018 20:25:54 -0400, schrieb Neil:

Bottom line is this: hand them an Illustrator file and pay the print
shop for doing manual layout.


Hi Neil,

Remember you asked me to ask the shop?

Well, I sent them the output from Adobe Illustrator (in both PDF and in
AI) where neither can 'embed' the font (which seems crazy, but that's
what my tests clearly showed).

At the same time, I asked them WHY Adobe Illustrator.

This is what I got back by way of answer...
"The Vinyl Cutter uses a cut extension through Adobe Illustrator,
thus the need to format the art through Illustrator. We program
what is cut through Illustrator.
Your pdf files will work fine. I have to install the fonts you
gave, which is no big deal. Changing the fonts so that
the cut is easy. No new layout work will need to be done."


This is an example of an embedded font from a PDF,
as seen in FontForge. There's a table, but there are
empty cells. Using a subset of the font like that,
prevents "theft" of licensed fonts - only
enough of the font is present, to support
printing.

https://s11.postimg.org/jenzczpcz/fontforge.gif

Tools are supposed to insist on full fonts (or use
Adobe Type Manager to approximate fonts), when making
changes to something that had a subset font.

Now, my example is "lucky" as it has all the upper case
letters. But it also has none of the lower case letters.
So that's hardly a usable set, for any purpose.

Some embedded font tables only have five letters or one
letter. For example, someone who wanted to "booby trap"
a certain document, put a single special character
(that looked like the letter "i" but wasn't), and it
was a pain to deal with that.

It took me two weeks once, as an experiment, to remove
the following "protective" technique from a PDF file. Using
FontForge, I was able to edit all the embedded (subset)
fonts and re-distill the file and make a (pretty well)
working copy afterwards. Such that if you did
wipe over some text, copy and paste, you actually
got the correct letters in your paste. There is
apparently commercial word processing software
that supports this obfuscation technique (during print output).
Font lookups are done in two stages, and by remapping the fonts
and making the step between the two stages non-linear,
you can prevent copy/paste of "content". It's a pretty
evil protection method. PDFs have a setting for "Do Not Copy",
but this technique augments the status bit, and adds a
second barrier to prevent plagiarism. The fastest way
to defeat this is OCR, but OCR isn't really all that
accurate. And the "Ohs" and "Zeroes" get mixed up.

http://spivey.oriel.ox.ac.uk/corner/Obfuscated_PDF

Paul
  #95  
Old April 3rd 18, 12:01 AM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Ragnusen Ultred
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 178
Default Can Adobe Illustrator read in a Microsoft PowerPoint & with fonts?

Am Mon, 02 Apr 2018 17:21:17 -0400, schrieb Paul:

It took me two weeks once, as an experiment, to remove
the following "protective" technique from a PDF file. Using
FontForge, I was able to edit all the embedded (subset)
fonts and re-distill the file and make a (pretty well)
working copy afterwards. Such that if you did
wipe over some text, copy and paste, you actually
got the correct letters in your paste.


Hi Paul,
I think we're going with the opposite of embedding fonts, moving forward,
since Windows MS Office has no problems embedding fonts (which makes
collaboration amount Windows users fantastic since we embedded the entire
font set).

What we're likely to do, moving forward, is, in Adobe Illustrator, we'll
convert the font to shapes. That will eliminate any font issue on the Mac
side since there won't be any fonts by the time the shop gets the file.

Thanks for all your advice and help, where, if we knew then what we know
now, this thread would be all of a handful of posts!

What solved all the questions was just the experience of *doing* it, which
answered every remaining question instantly.

e.g.c Can AI read in PowerPoint.
Answer = nope.

That kind of stuff.

Thanks!
  #96  
Old April 6th 18, 04:17 AM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Ken Springer[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,817
Default Can Adobe Illustrator read in a Microsoft PowerPoint & withfonts?

On 3/29/18 9:39 PM, Neil wrote:
On 3/29/2018 8:05 PM, Ragnusen Ultred wrote:
Am Thu, 29 Mar 2018 19:04:03 -0400, schrieb Neil:

To be clear, I didn't say that raster versus vector would be relevant
to what you are attempting to do. Small road signs like yours that are
viewed from a distance that would make it possible to use a number of
programs to generate adequate images. However, that does not negate
the point I was making about bitmap resolution and file formats.


Agreed and understood that there certainly are applications where the exact
color and curved shapes would matter greatly.

Luckily, this is only a question about what format can come out of
PowerPoint that has the lowest possible setup in Adobe Illustrator.

You keep asking about importing a PowerPoint file into Illustrator, but
you don't say why you think that's necessary. It probably isn't. One
more time; Illustrator is not a PDF editor, and PowerPoint is not a
vector graphics program. If you can grasp that, then know that there is
no compatibility between those programs that will save someone time or
effort. Just the opposite, in fact.


Hi, Neil,

I just finished reading this entire thread, and the more I read, the
more angry I got.

Since I wasn't going to offer any solutions, I was able to stand back
and look at Ragnusen's project as he described it. And I came to the
following conclusions...

1. Failure to follow the 6P rule.
2. Lack of knowledge about computer software available to do the job.
3. Insistence on using the wrong tools for the job. Cost is a red
herring here.

I see this all the time, and wonder if business owners realize how much
money they are losing due to ignorance on their part.

I wish Ragnusen had posted a couple samples of the desired finished
product, or the general idea. I suspect there are hours and hours in
this that was not necessary.

Kind of feel sorry for the folks involved in this. And, I don't even
know them. :-(


--
Ken
Mac OS X 10.11.6
Firefox 59.0.1 (64 bit)
Thunderbird 52.6.0
"My brain is like lightning, a quick flash
and it's gone!"
  #97  
Old April 6th 18, 01:04 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Neil
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 714
Default Can Adobe Illustrator read in a Microsoft PowerPoint & withfonts?

On 4/5/2018 11:17 PM, Ken Springer wrote:
On 3/29/18 9:39 PM, Neil wrote:
On 3/29/2018 8:05 PM, Ragnusen Ultred wrote:
Am Thu, 29 Mar 2018 19:04:03 -0400, schrieb Neil:

To be clear, I didn't say that raster versus vector would be relevant
to what you are attempting to do. Small road signs like yours that are
viewed from a distance that would make it possible to use a number of
programs to generate adequate images. However, that does not negate
the point I was making about bitmap resolution and file formats.

Agreed and understood that there certainly are applications where the
exact
color and curved shapes would matter greatly.

Luckily, this is only a question about what format can come out of
PowerPoint that has the lowest possible setup in Adobe Illustrator.

Â*
You keep asking about importing a PowerPoint file into Illustrator, but
you don't say why you think that's necessary. It probably isn't. One
more time; Illustrator is not a PDF editor, and PowerPoint is not a
vector graphics program. If you can grasp that, then know that there is
no compatibility between those programs that will save someone time or
effort. Just the opposite, in fact.


Hi, Neil,

I just finished reading this entire thread, and the more I read, the
more angry I got.

Since I wasn't going to offer any solutions, I was able to stand back
and look at Ragnusen's project as he described it.Â* And I came to the
following conclusions...

1.Â*Â*Â* Failure to follow the 6P rule.
2.Â*Â*Â* Lack of knowledge about computer software available to do the job.
3.Â*Â*Â* Insistence on using the wrong tools for the job.Â* Cost is a red
herring here.

I see this all the time, and wonder if business owners realize how much
money they are losing due to ignorance on their part.

I wish Ragnusen had posted a couple samples of the desired finished
product, or the general idea.Â* I suspect there are hours and hours in
this that was not necessary.

Kind of feel sorry for the folks involved in this.Â* And, I don't even
know them.Â* :-(


I understand your frustration with the course this topic has taken, and
I'm sure you're right about the real costs of his project. I'm OK with
the idea that Ragnusen has a "solution" that satisfies him, even if it
isn't the most logical or cost-effective process.

--
best regards,

Neil
  #98  
Old April 9th 18, 01:52 AM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Ragnusen Ultred
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 178
Default Can Adobe Illustrator read in a Microsoft PowerPoint & with fonts?

Am Thu, 5 Apr 2018 21:17:46 -0600, schrieb Ken Springer:

I wish Ragnusen had posted a couple samples of the desired finished
product, or the general idea. I suspect there are hours and hours in
this that was not necessary.


Not only did I post finished samples, I posted the actual PowerPoint files,
the actual PDF files, the actual fonts, and even the actual software.

What on earth *more* could you possibly want?

Really.
I gave you *everything*.

Seriously.
I gave *everything* and so did Paul!

We poured our hearts out in this thread.
And we accomplished a lot.

Do you want me to dig up the posts (there were more than one) that had
everything?

HINT: I have been on Usenet for *decades* so I often write a post saying
"SOLVED" which not only explaines everything we learned, but which also is
purposefully threaded as a *reply to the original post!".

I have you *everything* you could possibly want.
In fact, what more on earth could you ask for.

I gave you everything on a silver platter.
And you disparage that immense effort for what reason?

BTW, I'm not complaining.
I'm simply pointing out that almost all of your assumptions are dead wrong.
Mine can all be proven simply by reading the thread.

You said you read the thread.
But you can't have.

Otherwise, most of your conclusions would not have been wrong.
that's simply a fact.

I'm not disparaging you.
You're allowed to have an opinion that is not based on facts.

I'm just pointing out that your statements don't hold up to basic logic.

That's a fact I can prove simply by what I said above being correct.
Another way to prove that fact is that most of what you said is dead wrong.
(not all of it - but most of it)
  #99  
Old April 9th 18, 01:58 AM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Ragnusen Ultred
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 178
Default Can Adobe Illustrator read in a Microsoft PowerPoint & with fonts?

Am Fri, 6 Apr 2018 08:04:53 -0400, schrieb Neil:

I understand your frustration with the course this topic has taken, and
I'm sure you're right about the real costs of his project. I'm OK with
the idea that Ragnusen has a "solution" that satisfies him, even if it
isn't the most logical or cost-effective process.


Bear in mind that Ken Springer has every right to come to dead wrong
conclusions (which he did in the post you are responding to).

Ken was dead wrong about almost everything he said.
That's a fact which is easily proven in this thread.

It's Ken's prerogative to be dead wrong.
I don't begrudge him his own opinions.

He wasn't wrong about everything.
He was just dead wrong about almost everything he said.

What that means though, is that Ken "might" be dead wrong about everything.
Who knows since he clearly didn't check a single fact before he made his
statements.

I must repeat that I am NOT desparaging Ken.
I'm not.

I'm simply stating an emotionless fact.
Ken's statements are mostly dead wrong.

I proved that by the mere fact that what he said was wrong.
He can prove it to himself too (if he wanted to).

The fact that Ken got almost all his facts wrong means something *else* is
going on in Ken's head.

That's OK. We all have "psychology".
So, I don't really know what is going on inside of Ken's head.

All I can tell you, and Ken, is that almost all of what Ken said in the
post you are responding to is easily proven to be dead wrong.

So maybe Ken should start over?

Hi Ken,
Given that most of what you said is easily proven to be dead wrong, would
you do us all a favor and just read the "SOLVED" solution I provided (that
you said I didn't provide which just means you didn't read the thread).

Once you read that, then you can start over stating what your conclusions
are.

But you have to get your facts straight first.
Otherwise, your conclusions will be totally bogus.

So just start fresh since you know more about this than I do.
I just know the facts.
  #100  
Old April 9th 18, 02:00 AM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Ragnusen Ultred
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 178
Default Can Adobe Illustrator read in a Microsoft PowerPoint & with fonts?

Am Fri, 6 Apr 2018 10:36:35 -0400, schrieb Wolf K:

IMO Ultra-nym-shifter is deliberately inventing weird "problems" just to
see how many fish he can catch.


Hi Wolf K,
As always, you just make up ****.

Why?
Probably because you have zero technical competence.
Or, maybe you don't like Adobe Illustrator?
Or maybe you don't like printers?
Or perhaps, since you seem to hate people who prefer privacy, you just
don't like facts comeing out of people who happen to like their privacy?

I don't know why you act always like a small child.
I really don't.

Maybe you can explain to everyone your 'solution' to the problem set?

*Do you even *understand* the problem set?*

HINT: The answer is already obvious to all sentient adults.
  #101  
Old April 9th 18, 02:52 AM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Ragnusen Ultred
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 178
Default Can Adobe Illustrator read in a Microsoft PowerPoint & with fonts?

Am Sun, 8 Apr 2018 21:39:55 -0400, schrieb Wolf K:

What's obvious to any sentient adult is that you didn't understand your
own problem, which, put simply enough for an obstreperous child to
understand is: "I have a Powerpoint file here with an image I want my
printer to print for me. How do I get that image into a format that's
easy for me to send to him?"


Hi Wolf,
You missed the problem set.

The problem set is a score of people have to edit their version of the file
without making their life miserable.

There is no better answer to that question other than to hand them a file
with the fonts already embedded, which means they have to all be on Windows
(which they are) and that they all need to have MS Office (which they do),
and that they need to know how to type (which they do).

That's the *only skill set* needed by a score of people.
You have to *understand* that, because I know Ken doesn't understand that.

Ken thinks like a print shop thinks, which is perfectly fine if the score
of people were each their own print shop. But they're not. They're just
normal people.

So the first thing you needed to understand in the problem set is what the
problem set was.

Once we had *that* problem set understood, the rest was technically easy.

1. One person loads the font into the system & sends out the template.
2. A score of people edit their version of the template & hand it back.
3. We give the print shop the file in whatever format is best.

We have many choices for the print shop, and, in fact, we already gave the
file to the print shop (who has finally admitted the truth once we proved
it to them).

It's all explained in detail in the "SOLVED" post which is what I often do
on Usenet when we have solved a problem where I state the facts from where
to get the template, what steps to use, even down to the links for the
software and the serial numbers (if appropriate to publish).

The problem has been solved & documented so others can reproduce if they
want to (that's how facts are). It's the scientific method at work.
  #102  
Old April 9th 18, 02:00 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Neil
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 714
Default Can Adobe Illustrator read in a Microsoft PowerPoint & withfonts?

On 4/8/2018 8:58 PM, Ragnusen Ultred wrote:
Am Fri, 6 Apr 2018 08:04:53 -0400, schrieb Neil:

I understand your frustration with the course this topic has taken,
and I'm sure you're right about the real costs of his project. I'm OK
with the idea that Ragnusen has a "solution" that satisfies him, even
if it isn't the most logical or cost-effective process.


Bear in mind that Ken Springer has every right to come to dead wrong
conclusions (which he did in the post you are responding to).

Ken was dead wrong about almost everything he said.
That's a fact which is easily proven in this thread.

It's Ken's prerogative to be dead wrong. I don't begrudge him his own
opinions.

He wasn't wrong about everything.
He was just dead wrong about almost everything he said.

What that means though, is that Ken "might" be dead wrong about everything.
Who knows since he clearly didn't check a single fact before he made his
statements.

I must repeat that I am NOT desparaging Ken.
I'm not.

I'm simply stating an emotionless fact.
Ken's statements are mostly dead wrong.

I proved that by the mere fact that what he said was wrong.
He can prove it to himself too (if he wanted to).

The fact that Ken got almost all his facts wrong means something *else* is
going on in Ken's head.

That's OK. We all have "psychology". So, I don't really know what is
going on inside of Ken's head.

All I can tell you, and Ken, is that almost all of what Ken said in the
post you are responding to is easily proven to be dead wrong.

I'm not sure why you are responding to *my* post with your opinions
about Ken's comments. But my response is that you didn't understand
Ken's comments. The only thing I saw that he "got wrong" was thinking
that you didn't post examples of your project, which you did. His other
points, that you didn't follow the 6P rule, don't understand the
software and are using the wrong tools for the job were pretty accurate,
IMO, and would be so for any graphics professional. But as I said, I'm
OK with that because you're satisfied and it costs me nothing.

I think there is more for you to learn by showing a bit more humility
toward those of us with the knowledge that you lack than by tossing
insults such as those in your reply to me that actually expose your
inexperience.

--
best regards,

Neil
  #103  
Old April 9th 18, 04:35 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Ragnusen Ultred
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 178
Default Can Adobe Illustrator read in a Microsoft PowerPoint & with fonts?

Am Mon, 9 Apr 2018 09:00:11 -0400, schrieb Neil:

I'm not sure why you are responding to *my* post with your opinions
about Ken's comments.


Thank you Neil, for bringing up your concerns.

You had responded to Ken so I was adding actual facts to both of your
responses as a factual courtesy to you both.

But my response is that you didn't understand
Ken's comments. The only thing I saw that he "got wrong" was thinking
that you didn't post examples of your project, which you did.


I agree with you Neil, and I appreciate that you make factual comments.

Remember, I did say (repeatedly) that Ken was "mostly" wrong, but not
completely wrong. Ken simply made up most of what he said, but some of what
he said was actually factual.

points, that you didn't follow the 6P rule, don't understand the
software and are using the wrong tools for the job were pretty accurate,
IMO, and would be so for any graphics professional. But as I said, I'm
OK with that because you're satisfied and it costs me nothing.


I think Ken didn't understand that a score of people have to be able to
follow the process.

As you are aware, training a score of people on the software that Ken feels
is the best graphics editor is just about the opposite of the requirements.

So my point was that Ken didn't understand the requirements.

I posited that Ken was thinking only of the graphic requirements, which was
the *easiest* part of the job (since the graphics for a 12x18" sign won't
make a bit of practical difference whether they're raster or vector based).

I think there is more for you to learn by showing a bit more humility
toward those of us with the knowledge that you lack than by tossing
insults such as those in your reply to me that actually expose your
inexperience.


You are welcome to your opinion, Neil, as I understand what you're saying.

I only wish to clarify that I've been on Usenet for as many decades as
anyone here, where my modus operandi is to ask a question, test all viable
answers, and report back with a "SOLVED" solution (which has workable
tested proven steps!) that is then archived for everyone to use.

In performing that task, I run into plenty of purposefully unhelpful
comments, which, my MO is to squelch, since I do not use the chit-chat
model of Usenet (I use the Q&A model of Usenet).

In my Q&A model, I respond to almost all comments, but ... I respond in
like manner. If the comment is meant to be helpful, I respond in a helpful
manner (in that I mirror the intent).

If the comment is meant to be unhelpful (as most of Wolf's were, for
example), then I respond to strongly squelch that behavior.

If, as in the case of Ken's comments, the comments were almost entirely
dead wrong, then I simply correct those comments that were dead wrong
(while accepting those that are correct).

What you incorrectly assume is me "insulting" someone is simply mirroring
what they wrote, by correct or admonishing them to be better more factual
posters.

In summary, I never act first.
a. I ask questions
b. I respond in like manner to each post by others
c. I summarize the solution for all to benefit from in the end

Hence, my summaries can be trusted as fact.
By way of stark comparison, Ken's summaries were (mostly) dead wrong.

That's a big difference, Neil.

You may disagree, and you should disagree if I do not speak facts, but I
believe I backed up all my facts (since that's my MO).

Have I not faithfully followed that Usenet MO this entire thread, Neil?
  #104  
Old April 9th 18, 09:01 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Neil
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 714
Default Can Adobe Illustrator read in a Microsoft PowerPoint & withfonts?

On 4/9/2018 11:35 AM, Ragnusen Ultred wrote:
Am Mon, 9 Apr 2018 09:00:11 -0400, schrieb Neil:

I'm not sure why you are responding to *my* post with your opinions
about Ken's comments.


Thank you Neil, for bringing up your concerns.

You had responded to Ken so I was adding actual facts to both of your
responses as a factual courtesy to you both.

I didn't see Ken's comments as all that complex, and I certainly didn't
reference anything beyond what he addressed to me. In that context, no
facts were added to my comments in your response, as they referenced
posts that I was not involved in. I saw it merely as an attempt to draw
me into the interaction between the two of you, and I'm not interested
in that.

But my response is that you didn't understand Ken's comments. The only
thing I saw that he "got wrong" was thinking that you didn't post
examples of your project, which you did.


I agree with you Neil, and I appreciate that you make factual comments.

Remember, I did say (repeatedly) that Ken was "mostly" wrong, but not
completely wrong. Ken simply made up most of what he said, but some of what
he said was actually factual.

As I understand the term "mostly", it would mean that the majority of
his comments were wrong. I saw only 1 out of the 4 as such. That means
that he was "mostly" right, and that your assessment is wrong.

points, that you didn't follow the 6P rule, don't understand the
software and are using the wrong tools for the job were pretty
accurate, IMO, and would be so for any graphics professional. But as I
said, I'm OK with that because you're satisfied and it costs me nothing.


This kind of "snipping" is not useful, as it destroys context. Why do
you do that?


I think Ken didn't understand that a score of people have to be able to
follow the process.

That is not relevant to the comments he made in the post under
discussion. Your "process" is problematic in the ways that he noted.

As you are aware, training a score of people on the software that Ken feels
is the best graphics editor is just about the opposite of the requirements.

So my point was that Ken didn't understand the requirements.

See my comments about insults (below), and that is why I understood his
frustration.

I posited that Ken was thinking only of the graphic requirements, which was
the *easiest* part of the job (since the graphics for a 12x18" sign won't
make a bit of practical difference whether they're raster or vector based).
Raster vs. vector art is not relevant, since the "process" is actually

one of producing a small sign. What lead me to think it might be was,
prior to any mention of the size of the sign, your insistence on trying
to integrate the two into an application that was designed for other
purposes.

[...]

What you incorrectly assume is me "insulting" someone is simply mirroring
what they wrote, by correct or admonishing them to be better more factual
posters.

Sometimes one doesn't recognize the insults in their posts. It is clear
to the graphics pros among us that your company is one that disrespects
the education and experience of pros by assigning graphics production to
a group of people so clueless about the process that they don't
understand the basics of fonts, the real issues involved and use the
wrong tools to execute the job. Just to be clear; that is insulting.

Have I not faithfully followed that Usenet MO this entire thread, Neil?

Your method of losing context by incomplete snips, while not uncommon,
is an MO that could stand some reconsideration.

--
best regards,

Neil
  #105  
Old April 9th 18, 10:10 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Ragnusen Ultred
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 178
Default Can Adobe Illustrator read in a Microsoft PowerPoint & with fonts?

Am Mon, 9 Apr 2018 10:55:32 -0400, schrieb Wolf K:

That's a "skill set" that any competent user of Word (etc) already has.
So why di you post a question about PowerPoint and Illustrator?

As I said....


Hi Wolf,

You have shown an inability to help answer almost any technical question in
almost every one of your posts, and, yet - you come back, after the
question posed in this technical thread is essentially SOLVED ... where
your new question benefits nobody - and almost certainly wasn't posed with
a single iota of helpful intent on your part (I posit).

Hence, to answer your question won't even benefit you ... it's that useless
(I posit).

However...

Let's answer a different question, which *is* useful (INHO).

Q: What value added did this thread accomplish?

Do you know the answer to that Wolf?
Probably not (based on your lack of technical grasp of the issues
involved).

So I'll answer that for you, is that OK with you Wolf?

*Q: What value added did this thread accomplish?*
A: I posit the value added includes:
a. Paul provided the software and the links to the license;
b. Paul and I tested that software and proved the following:
c. Adobe Illustrator does not comprehend embedded fonts;
d. Adobe Illustrator can convert those fonts to shapes;
e. But only if the fonts are manually installed into the system;
f. Adobe Illustrator cannot read PowerPoint files under any circumstance;
g. But AI can read PDF files created from PowerPoint;
h. However AI still can't read the fonts embedded into that PDF file;
i. If you load the font into the system, AI can substitute that font;
j. But even then, if you pass
k. If you then convert the fonts to "shapes", AI is now portable
l. Adobe Illustrator needs no layout to just print to vinyl cutters;
m. Both Paul and I provided fully tested original files for all of this;
n. And I provided a detailed summary sufficient for anyone to reproduce.
etc.

I realize people like you, Wolf, will say "I knew that"; but the proof is
that you didn't know that - otherwise, this thread would have been only two
posts long (or so), in that those answers would have been provided early by
'someone', and the fact that they were not provided, indicates that this is
value added information for the SOVLED summary (which I already performed).

Let's ask another question, shall we, Wolf?

This is not intended as an insult.
It's just intended to ask you to reflect on your added value.

Q: What technical value have you, Wolf, added to this discussion?
A: ?
 




Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off






All times are GMT +1. The time now is 10:45 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004-2024 PCbanter.
The comments are property of their posters.