$B#W#i#n!!#X#P!!(Bdoes not turn off Why?

My Win XP Pro does not turn off or restart even after repeated attempt
using usual Start/Turn Off Computer/ Turn off. I also tried to turn it
off through Task Manager/Turn Off in vain. This problem started
recently. I checked possible virus/malware infection, but apparently no
such a thing exists in my computer.
Can someone help?

On Sat, 04 Dec 2010 23:24:18 -0600, Beyond X wrote:

My Win XP Pro does not turn off or restart even after repeated attempt
using usual Start/Turn Off Computer/ Turn off. I also tried to turn it
off through Task Manager/Turn Off in vain.

I suspect that is the same thing, but iirc once I could get there when
I couldn't get to shutdown from the Windows logo key.

This problem started
recently.

What else have you checked. For example, have you saved all your
work, closed all your programs, and then unplugged it? What happened
on restart?

I checked possible virus/malware infection, but apparently no
such a thing exists in my computer.
Can someone help?

You can always consider using System Restore to a point in time before this
happened, assuming you have such a restore point, and it wasn't too long
ago.

Beyond X wrote:
My Win XP Pro does not turn off or restart even after repeated attempt
using usual Start/Turn Off Computer/ Turn off. I also tried to turn it
off through Task Manager/Turn Off in vain. This problem started
recently. I checked possible virus/malware infection, but apparently no
such a thing exists in my computer.
Can someone help?

On Sun, 5 Dec 2010 00:53:14 -0700, "Bill in Co"
wrote:

You can always consider using System Restore to a point in time before this
happened, assuming you have such a restore point, and it wasn't too long
ago.

I don't understand System Restore and that scares me. If I installed
a program earlier today, and then restore to yesterday, will the
program still work?

Will fixing it be as simple as reinstalling? What if, say, I forget
where I put it the first time and put it some place else.

Aren't there other things that have been done since the restore point
chosen, that I won't remember maybe, that won't work anymore, that I
won't even notice?

Beyond X wrote:
My Win XP Pro does not turn off or restart even after repeated attempt
using usual Start/Turn Off Computer/ Turn off. I also tried to turn it
off through Task Manager/Turn Off in vain. This problem started
recently. I checked possible virus/malware infection, but apparently no
such a thing exists in my computer.
Can someone help?

mm wrote:
On Sun, 5 Dec 2010 00:53:14 -0700, "Bill in Co"
wrote:

You can always consider using System Restore to a point in time before
this
happened, assuming you have such a restore point, and it wasn't too long
ago.

I don't understand System Restore and that scares me. If I installed
a program earlier today, and then restore to yesterday, will the
program still work?

Not until you reinstall it. Anything installed since the restore point
will become effectively uninstalled, and you will have to reinstall it.
(Think of it like restoring the registry, PLUS some (i.e. it does a bit more
than just that. More on that below, but you can find some more details on
System Restore, online).

I'll use use SR to stand for System Restores sometimes below.

Will fixing it be as simple as reinstalling? What if, say, I forget
where I put it the first time and put it some place else.

I don't understand what "it" is above. You mean the program?
Well, as I said, you'd have to reinstall it.

But NOTE:
if you recently saved some newly added program file somewhere on the hard
drive (and not in a designated safe (off limits to SR place), like My
Documents), that program exe file would be removed too, after a System
Restore rollback. Why? Because System Restore assumes such recently added
files could be potentially problematic (there is no way System Restore can
know for sure, so it just assumes that to be safe, and removes it). (I'm
talking about something added later in time than the restore point you roll
back to).

Which files are monitored by System Restore, and where, etc, are all covered
in the several references on System Restore online.

Aren't there other things that have been done since the restore point
chosen, that I won't remember maybe, that won't work anymore, that I
won't even notice?

Anything you have configured or added since then will be undone - yes, just
like you would expect if rolling back to a previous registry - just like
what happens when you use "scanreg /restore" in Win98, but plus some (as I
mentioned above). System Restore does a bit more than just rollback the
registry, in other words. And IF you don't have a good disk backup (clone
or image), it can come in handy on some troublesome occasions.


Beyond X wrote:
My Win XP Pro does not turn off or restart even after repeated attempt
using usual Start/Turn Off Computer/ Turn off. I also tried to turn it
off through Task Manager/Turn Off in vain. This problem started
recently. I checked possible virus/malware infection, but apparently no
such a thing exists in my computer.
Can someone help?

On Sat, 04 Dec 2010 23:24:18 -0600, Beyond X wrote:

My Win XP Pro does not turn off or restart even after repeated attempt
using usual Start/Turn Off Computer/ Turn off. I also tried to turn it
off through Task Manager/Turn Off in vain. This problem started
recently. I checked possible virus/malware infection, but apparently no
such a thing exists in my computer.
Can someone help?

Possibly corupt software . Installed any new programs ?

From the original poster
Thanks a lot for your kind thought and time.
After many trials of imaginable causes I found that for some reason the
activity to download numerous bodies associated with messages in
newsgroup sites using a newsreader program apparently still
takes/occupies/constrains a large chank of RAM memory even after the
program is terminated. I have naively believed that once an application
is cancelled (confirmed by Task Manager), all memory usage by the
application is completely freed for the use of other programs including
the process to close Windows. Apparently this is not true because when I
deleted the messages with bodies in the newsreader, I become able to
turn off Windows--normally. This is a puzzling finding because the
bodies were downloaded and stored in a partition completely separated
from the one where the application is (the system partition), meaning
the downloaded files are on the harddrive, not in memory.
I checked the memory system using MS Memory Diagnostic program. The
result was no errors.
I did not try SR because I thought it would delete the downloaded files
so that the previous conditions are restored. Am I wrong?

Beyond X wrote:
From the original poster
Thanks a lot for your kind thought and time.
After many trials of imaginable causes I found that for some reason the
activity to download numerous bodies associated with messages in
newsgroup sites using a newsreader program apparently still
takes/occupies/constrains a large chank of RAM memory even after the
program is terminated. I have naively believed that once an application
is cancelled (confirmed by Task Manager), all memory usage by the
application is completely freed for the use of other programs including
the process to close Windows. Apparently this is not true because when I
deleted the messages with bodies in the newsreader, I become able to
turn off Windows--normally.

That sounds weird, and doesn't make much sense to me. Perhaps something
else was going on behind the scenes.

This is a puzzling finding because the
bodies were downloaded and stored in a partition completely separated
from the one where the application is (the system partition), meaning
the downloaded files are on the harddrive, not in memory.

Right! Or at least should be.

I checked the memory system using MS Memory Diagnostic program. The
result was no errors.
I did not try SR because I thought it would delete the downloaded files
so that the previous conditions are restored. Am I wrong?

SR can delete some downloaded files since the last restore point (of the
monitored types, like EXEs, COMs, DLLs, etc), but shouldn't delete newsgroup
messages.

(But anyways, if you really wanted to play it safe and cover all bets you
could always temporarily save them to another disk or flash drive (or
partition that is not being monitored by SR) and bring them back, if
needbe). But I've never had a problem with newsgroup files being removed.
(Program and EXE files - that's a whole nother story, however).

I've got SR here only monitoring the C: partition, as a simple insurance
policy. But I have rarely had to use it, since I can restore a backup
image or clone (for a truly clean and thorough system restore).

Bill in Co wrote:
Beyond X wrote:
From the original poster
Thanks a lot for your kind thought and time.
After many trials of imaginable causes I found that for some reason the
activity to download numerous bodies associated with messages in
newsgroup sites using a newsreader program apparently still
takes/occupies/constrains a large chank of RAM memory even after the
program is terminated. I have naively believed that once an application
is cancelled (confirmed by Task Manager), all memory usage by the
application is completely freed for the use of other programs including
the process to close Windows. Apparently this is not true because when I
deleted the messages with bodies in the newsreader, I become able to
turn off Windows--normally.

That sounds weird, and doesn't make much sense to me. Perhaps something
else was going on behind the scenes.

This is a puzzling finding because the
bodies were downloaded and stored in a partition completely separated
from the one where the application is (the system partition), meaning
the downloaded files are on the harddrive, not in memory.

Right! Or at least should be.

I checked the memory system using MS Memory Diagnostic program. The
result was no errors.
I did not try SR because I thought it would delete the downloaded files
so that the previous conditions are restored. Am I wrong?

SR can delete some downloaded files since the last restore point (of the
monitored types, like EXEs, COMs, DLLs, etc), but shouldn't delete newsgroup
messages.

(But anyways, if you really wanted to play it safe and cover all bets you
could always temporarily save them to another disk or flash drive (or
partition that is not being monitored by SR) and bring them back, if
needbe). But I've never had a problem with newsgroup files being removed.
(Program and EXE files - that's a whole nother story, however).

I've got SR here only monitoring the C: partition, as a simple insurance
policy. But I have rarely had to use it, since I can restore a backup
image or clone (for a truly clean and thorough system restore).



Microsoft likes to remove pages that document the older OSes,
and Wikipedia gives a reference here, which is stored on web.archive.org.

"Frequently Asked Questions Regarding System Restore in Windows XP"
http://web.archive.org/web/200802050...753.aspx#EUAAC

Even with all of that info, I never feel exactly sure, what's going to get
deleted. I've lost a couple big downloads, by using SR to go backwards
in time. I didn't notice they'd disappeared at the time, and only
noticed later.

Putting user data, on a partition which has SR disabled, should be pretty
safe. But how many programs store their data, off of C: ?

With regard to that last paragraph, WinXP also has a habit of turning
on SR again, any time the identity of a partition changes. That can
happen with portable storage devices (plug them in later, and SR might
be turned on again). It might also happen, if you've been using some
disk maintenance tools, and some change causes the partition to be
treated as new.

Paul

Paul wrote:
Bill in Co wrote:
Beyond X wrote:
From the original poster
Thanks a lot for your kind thought and time.
After many trials of imaginable causes I found that for some reason the
activity to download numerous bodies associated with messages in
newsgroup sites using a newsreader program apparently still
takes/occupies/constrains a large chank of RAM memory even after the
program is terminated. I have naively believed that once an application
is cancelled (confirmed by Task Manager), all memory usage by the
application is completely freed for the use of other programs including
the process to close Windows. Apparently this is not true because when I
deleted the messages with bodies in the newsreader, I become able to
turn off Windows--normally.

That sounds weird, and doesn't make much sense to me. Perhaps something
else was going on behind the scenes.

This is a puzzling finding because the
bodies were downloaded and stored in a partition completely separated
from the one where the application is (the system partition), meaning
the downloaded files are on the harddrive, not in memory.

Right! Or at least should be.

I checked the memory system using MS Memory Diagnostic program. The
result was no errors.
I did not try SR because I thought it would delete the downloaded files
so that the previous conditions are restored. Am I wrong?

SR can delete some downloaded files since the last restore point (of the
monitored types, like EXEs, COMs, DLLs, etc), but shouldn't delete
newsgroup messages.

(But anyways, if you really wanted to play it safe and cover all bets you
could always temporarily save them to another disk or flash drive (or
partition that is not being monitored by SR) and bring them back, if
needbe). But I've never had a problem with newsgroup files being
removed.
(Program and EXE files - that's a whole nother story, however).

I've got SR here only monitoring the C: partition, as a simple insurance
policy. But I have rarely had to use it, since I can restore a backup
image or clone (for a truly clean and thorough system restore).



Microsoft likes to remove pages that document the older OSes,
and Wikipedia gives a reference here, which is stored on web.archive.org.

"Frequently Asked Questions Regarding System Restore in Windows XP"
http://web.archive.org/web/200802050...753.aspx#EUAAC

That's a great article. Thanks for posting it, Paul. Maybe mm and some
others can check it out too, as it has a LOT of good info on System Restore.
I seem to remember another Microsoft article on it that was a bit more
detailed on the list of file extensions and locations being monitored or
not, but maybe that has been removed, as you implied. But this article is
pretty good!

Even with all of that info, I never feel exactly sure, what's going to get
deleted. I've lost a couple big downloads, by using SR to go backwards
in time. I didn't notice they'd disappeared at the time, and only
noticed later.

Yeah, I learned that firsthand, after one or two episodes. After that, I
started copying all recently downloaded exe's and program type files
temporarily over to "My Documents", just prior to rolling back using SR.
But I haven't had to use SR for some time. I have, however, made fair use
of Erunt to "undo" some undesired changes made to the system after messing
around with some programs, and just to play it safe (after uninstalling the
experimental program first). For just minor stuff, this is simpler and
faster than restoring an image, and is less invasive than using SR (but
admitedly SR can be more "thorough").

Putting user data, on a partition which has SR disabled, should be pretty
safe. But how many programs store their data, off of C: ?

Right. I keep most of my personal user data on the C: partition, but then
again, most of the user stuff like personal documents is not touched by SR,
so it's not a big issue to me.

With regard to that last paragraph, WinXP also has a habit of turning
on SR again, any time the identity of a partition changes. That can
happen with portable storage devices (plug them in later, and SR might
be turned on again). It might also happen, if you've been using some
disk maintenance tools, and some change causes the partition to be
treated as new.

Yeah, I know, and that's somewhat annoying. After some such changes, it
seems SR gets turned back on again for monitoring all of the partitions, and
you have to go back and decheck some of those other partitions being
monitored. Still, when all is said and done, I keep SR active on the C:
partition, as just another insurance policy, and recommend others do too.
You never know when it might come in handy.