Windows 10 Update

philo wrote:
On 12/15/2017 7:45 AM, Jonathan N. Little wrote:
philo wrote:
Mine is an Epson V600 and it was onlyÂ* $225 or so.

Does it have a WIA driver, work in 64-bit applications and in Windows
10? My figgin' Canon 4200f only has a 32-bit TWAIN that has been most
problematic in 7 & 10




I guess you will have to investigate that but it works absolutely great
on my Win10 64 bit machine

Well since you have the scanner that was why I was asking you, because
Canon "said" they has a 64-bit driver but in reality it was 32-bit TWAIN
driver with no WIA driver. What applications do you use for editing and
are they 64-bit editors? Is scanner recognized in them?

--
Take care,

Jonathan
-------------------
LITTLE WORKS STUDIO
http://www.LittleWorksStudio.com

On 12/15/2017 9:12 AM, Jonathan N. Little wrote:
philo wrote:
On 12/15/2017 7:45 AM, Jonathan N. Little wrote:
philo wrote:
Mine is an Epson V600 and it was onlyÂ* $225 or so.

Does it have a WIA driver, work in 64-bit applications and in Windows
10? My figgin' Canon 4200f only has a 32-bit TWAIN that has been most
problematic in 7 & 10




I guess you will have to investigate that but it works absolutely
great on my Win10 64 bit machine

Well since you have the scanner that was why I was asking you, because
Canon "said" they has a 64-bit driver but in reality it was 32-bit TWAIN
driver with no WIA driver. What applications do you use for editing and
are they 64-bit editors? Is scanner recognized in them?




Sorry for my ignorance in that area but I never even investigated since
when I scan, I simply use the good software Epson provides with the scanner.


Once scanned, if I have to do post-processing I can of course do
so...but I do not, for example scan from within Photoshop itself.

That's why I suggested you do you own research as more than likely I'd
answer your question wrong.

Just because I've been doing photography for 60 years and have computer
experience back to the 60's , does not imply in any way I know anything
about what I am doing

On 12/15/2017 10:23 AM, philo wrote:
On 12/15/2017 9:12 AM, Jonathan N. Little wrote:
philo wrote:
On 12/15/2017 7:45 AM, Jonathan N. Little wrote:
philo wrote:
Mine is an Epson V600 and it was onlyÂ* $225 or so.

Does it have a WIA driver, work in 64-bit applications and in
Windows 10? My figgin' Canon 4200f only has a 32-bit TWAIN that has
been most problematic in 7 & 10




I guess you will have to investigate that but it works absolutely
great on my Win10 64 bit machine

Well since you have the scanner that was why I was asking you, because
Canon "said" they has a 64-bit driver but in reality it was 32-bit
TWAIN driver with no WIA driver. What applications do you use for
editing and are they 64-bit editors? Is scanner recognized in them?




Sorry for my ignorance in that area but I never even investigated since
when I scan, I simply use the good software Epson provides with the
scanner.


Once scanned, if I have to do post-processing I can of course do
so...but I do not, for example scan from within Photoshop itself.

That's why I suggested you do you own research as more than likely I'd
answer your question wrong.

Just because I've been doing photography for 60 years and have computer
experience back to the 60's , does not imply in any way I know anything
about what I am doing
Thanks to both of you for the information.

I have been working with computers since the early 1980's. I made the
mistake of taking a computer magazine to work, and from the time my boss
saw it, I became the computer expert at the company. I had to work hard
to keep ahead of him because he was also interested in computers.
However because of the magazine, I learned about LAN's, computer
imaging, electronic signal analysis, and many other aspects of the
computer world.

--
2017: The year we learn to play the great game of Euchre

Jonathan N. Little wrote:
philo wrote:
On 12/15/2017 7:45 AM, Jonathan N. Little wrote:
philo wrote:
Mine is an Epson V600 and it was only $225 or so.

Does it have a WIA driver, work in 64-bit applications and in Windows
10? My figgin' Canon 4200f only has a 32-bit TWAIN that has been most
problematic in 7 & 10




I guess you will have to investigate that but it works absolutely
great on my Win10 64 bit machine

Well since you have the scanner that was why I was asking you, because
Canon "said" they has a 64-bit driver but in reality it was 32-bit TWAIN
driver with no WIA driver. What applications do you use for editing and
are they 64-bit editors? Is scanner recognized in them?


"Epson Perfection V600 Photo"

https://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2355184,00.asp

"I installed it on a system running Windows Vista, but
according to Epson, it also comes with drivers and a full
set of software for Windows 7, XP, 2000 and Mac OX 10.3.9
through 10.6.

Like most scanners, the V600 comes with TWAIN and WIA drivers,
so you can scan from most programs with a scan command. Also
included are Adobe Photoshop Elements and Abbyy FineReader 6.0 Sprint
for optical character recognition (OCR)."

https://epson.com/Support/Scanners/P...dows+10+64-bit

https://ftp.epson.com/drivers/epson15563.exe 48,892,192 bytes

ESA1.inf

https://pastebin.com/AxqN9jaV

I see WIA mentioned in there, but I don'[t know how WIA
has changed since Vista/Win7 era, and whether that works
for everything. The driver came from the Win10 section of
the site.

Epson even have a button on their site for Windows 10-S
which is pretty weird. So I guess when Microsoft does something
stupid, everyone snaps to attention :-) I suppose in this case,
they'd have to re-do their scanning application (in the 48MB package)
but the drivers might be left alone.

Paul

Paul wrote:

Â*Â*Â* PCMag quote: "Like most scanners, the V600 comes with TWAIN and WIA drivers,
Â*Â*Â* so you can scan from most programs with a scan command. Also
Â*Â*Â* included are Adobe Photoshop Elements and Abbyy FineReader 6.0 Sprint
Â*Â*Â* for optical character recognition (OCR)."

Yeah, unfortunately Canon didn't follow the trend. Sad part is it really
scans slides well for a flatbed.


--
Take care,

Jonathan
-------------------
LITTLE WORKS STUDIO
http://www.LittleWorksStudio.com

On 12/15/2017 10:20 AM, Keith Nuttle wrote:


Just because I've been doing photography for 60 years and have
computer experience back to the 60's , does not imply in any way I
know anything about what I am doing
Thanks to both of you for the information.

I have been working with computers since the early 1980's.Â* I made the
mistake of taking a computer magazine to work, and from the time my boss
saw it, I became the computer expert at the company.Â* I had to work hard
to keep ahead of him because he was also interested in computers.
However because of the magazine, I learned about LAN's, computer
imaging,Â* electronic signal analysis, and many other aspects of the
computer world.




I got back into it in 1999 when my (now) wife gave me her old P-1

Within six months I had pretty well gotten pretty good but my learning
really began when I tired to install Linux on it.

(Red Hat 5.2) I was totally clueless at first, I did not even know
what a partition was...but in another six months I really had learned a lot.


I can build and repair them but have barely scratched the surface with
Photoshop etc.

On 12/15/2017 11:24 AM, Jonathan N. Little wrote:
Paul wrote:

Â*Â*Â*Â* PCMag quote: "Like most scanners, the V600 comes with TWAIN and
WIA drivers,
Â*Â*Â*Â* so you can scan from most programs with a scan command. Also
Â*Â*Â*Â* included are Adobe Photoshop Elements and Abbyy FineReader 6.0
Sprint
Â*Â*Â*Â* for optical character recognition (OCR)."

Yeah, unfortunately Canon didn't follow the trend. Sad part is it really
scans slides well for a flatbed.





Thank you Paul.


When you seen the name "Paul" here you are getting expert advice.


When you see the name "Philo" it's hard to tell what you will get.

philo wrote:
On 12/15/2017 11:24 AM, Jonathan N. Little wrote:
Paul wrote:

PCMag quote: "Like most scanners, the V600 comes with TWAIN and
WIA drivers,
so you can scan from most programs with a scan command. Also
included are Adobe Photoshop Elements and Abbyy FineReader 6.0
Sprint
for optical character recognition (OCR)."

Yeah, unfortunately Canon didn't follow the trend. Sad part is it
really scans slides well for a flatbed.





Thank you Paul.


When you seen the name "Paul" here you are getting expert advice.


When you see the name "Philo" it's hard to tell what you will get.

Well, that was just a quick check. You can't tell
from that, whether it really works.

The driver mentions WIA2, and it looks like that hails from 2012 or so.

https://web.archive.org/web/20120201...=vs.85%29.aspx

That's why you never really know whether something is going to
work, because they keep messing with it. (Video card wddm
comes to mind. 8 versions so far.)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Window...y_Driver_Model

Paul

On 12/15/2017 11:45 AM, Paul wrote:
philo wrote:
On 12/15/2017 11:24 AM, Jonathan N. Little wrote:
Paul wrote:

Â*Â*Â*Â* PCMag quote: "Like most scanners, the V600 comes with TWAIN and
WIA drivers,
Â*Â*Â*Â* so you can scan from most programs with a scan command. Also
Â*Â*Â*Â* included are Adobe Photoshop Elements and Abbyy FineReader 6.0
Sprint
Â*Â*Â*Â* for optical character recognition (OCR)."

Yeah, unfortunately Canon didn't follow the trend. Sad part is it
really scans slides well for a flatbed.





Thank you Paul.


When you seen the name "Paul" here you are getting expert advice.


When you see the name "Philo" it's hard to tell what you will get.

Well, that was just a quick check. You can't tell
from that, whether it really works.

The driver mentions WIA2, and it looks like that hails from 2012 or so.

https://web.archive.org/web/20120201...=vs.85%29.aspx


That's why you never really know whether something is going to
work, because they keep messing with it. (Video card wddm
comes to mind. 8 versions so far.)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Window...y_Driver_Model

Â*Â* Paul



I don't usually investigate any more than "does it work?"

Wolf K wrote:
On 2017-12-14 21:29, Keith Nuttle wrote:
On 12/14/2017 6:09 PM, philo wrote:

In the past three days I've spent 30 hours scanning old negatives.


My uncle's estate left me a box of negatives from 1935 - 1955 and my
machine handled it without the slightest glitch...I was doing other
work while scanning etc

What are you using to scan the negatives. It sounds like you have
quite a few to scan as I have. Doing it three at a time as my stand
alone scanner does takes for ever.

If it is an automatic scanner what is the brand and model.

Thank you.


FWIW, I use a Canon Canoscan 9000F Mark II, faster than the Mark I,
which is why I bought it. I gave away the Mark I. Flatbed, max optical
resolution for film will reveal grain for lo-res films. I go on a
scanning binge every month or so, but still have lots of slides and negs
to get through. The scanning software than came with out offers preview
with tweaking mode, very handy.

Tip 1: not every negative or slide is worth scanning.

Tip 2: negative/slide scanners are an obsolescing technology. Get one
while you can. Look for at least 1200 dpi _optical_ resolution.

The advice I'd add to that, is check the reviews of the product,
to see if people actually scan film with it. Or, it's a joke.

My scanner has 1200 DPI native resolution, came with a set of
the appropriate trays for large format and 35mm negatives, and
I wouldn't scan a picture of my dog with it. The conversion from
negative to positive is good - I set KodaChrome 100 or whatever,
and it does get the colors right. But the scanning noise and grain
at 1200 DPI is unbelievable - it's a scanning artifact. The film
itself looks better than the scans of it. The prints of the pictures
I took, don't look like that.

https://www.scanyourentirelife.com/q...ilm-negatives/

"my suggestion to anyone is never to go beyond the optical resolution
of your scanner. So at the highest, with the Epson V600 don’t scan
your prints, slides or negatives above 9600 dpi ["native" resolution].

But, even that is overkill and you will see not only a massively huge
file size, but also too much grain when scanning film"

"I would recommend going with a dpi between 3000 dpi – 4000 dpi."

Scanners will also have issues with any optics between
the bed and the sensor. And the optics can also contribute
to a "max DPI" that makes sense. It is for that reason
that the 3000-4000 rule is a good one, as the optical
properties of the scan aren't good enough to go higher.
Adding more pixels to the sensor actually doesn't help
at some point. Providing 9600 wasn't being all that clever.
Since Philo actually owns a V600, he can repeat the experiment
some other photographer did on "blades of grass" in some
negatives, to spot the actual improvements between
4800 and 9600.

Paul

Wolf K wrote:
On 2017-12-15 22:19, Paul wrote:
[...]
My scanner has 1200 DPI native resolution, came with a set of
the appropriate trays for large format and 35mm negatives, and
I wouldn't scan a picture of my dog with it. The conversion from
negative to positive is good - I set KodaChrome 100 or whatever,
and it does get the colors right. But the scanning noise and grain
at 1200 DPI is unbelievable - it's a scanning artifact. The film
itself looks better than the scans of it. The prints of the pictures
I took, don't look like that.

Sounds like the 1200DPI is interpolated digital, not optical.

https://www.scanyourentirelife.com/q...ilm-negatives/


"my suggestion to anyone is never to go beyond the optical resolution
of your scanner. So at the highest, with the Epson V600 don’t scan
your prints, slides or negatives above 9600 dpi ["native"
resolution].

But, even that is overkill and you will see not only a massively
huge
file size, but also too much grain when scanning film"

"I would recommend going with a dpi between 3000 dpi – 4000 dpi."

Scanners will also have issues with any optics between
the bed and the sensor. And the optics can also contribute
to a "max DPI" that makes sense. It is for that reason
that the 3000-4000 rule is a good one, as the optical
properties of the scan aren't good enough to go higher.
Adding more pixels to the sensor actually doesn't help
at some point. Providing 9600 wasn't being all that clever.
Since Philo actually owns a V600, he can repeat the experiment
some other photographer did on "blades of grass" in some
negatives, to spot the actual improvements between
4800 and 9600.

Paul

I've used 4800 and 9600 on Kodak disc negatives, which are very small.
The result is a grainy (noisy) scan, but then the film is grainy.

The scanning software has "reduce grain" setting, but when a spot on the
photographed object is physically in the same size range as grain, the
algorithm has a problem. I haven't used that setting in a long time.

AFAICT, there is no standard way of describing scanning resolution, but
the Optical spec seems to be the most reliable. If it says "Up to [some
humongous number]DPI" on the box, that's digital, and you're placing a
bet, which will you will most likely lose.

From my own experience and that of others, I'd say that for the
non-professional the Canon and Epson flatbed scanners are best.

HTH


There is "native" and "interpolated" resolution, and usually
the product descriptions are careful to avoid selling
the interpolated value as the actual native pixel density.

And my 1200 DPI is native. It also has some absurdly high
interpolated value, which I've never tried. It's an older
design that uses a CCD sensor, rather than the current day
contact CMOS sensor.

To average out random effects, you can do two scans, and
compute (A+B)/2 in Photoshop and "average out the noise".
I used that to improve some web cam pictures I took
for a user manual, before I got a point and shoot camera
with a better sensor in it. Averaging additional images,
doesn't offer nearly as much incremental improvement,
as averaging just two pictures (I tested for that). And
this only applies to still shots, where objects aren't
moving around. So it might be good for
interior shots... or for scanner scans.

Paul

On Fri, 15 Dec 2017 09:31:51 -0500, Big Al wrote
in

On 12/15/2017 09:24 AM, CRNG wrote:
On 14 Dec 2017 22:11:02 GMT, "Alexander Shofner-Geidt"
wrote in


Thanks for the adventure, Microsoft. It's been real.

Take a look at this

https://www.oo-software.com/en/shutup10

install it and lock-down your computer so M$ can't update it anymore.

I used that once and not knocking the program just the user, but I
locked the machine down so much I had problems with getting a lot of
things to work. So just don't do like I did and turn every friggin'
thing off. Be cautious and do a few things at a time. :-)


Good advice.
--
Web based forums are like subscribing to 10 different newspapers
and having to visit 10 different news stands to pickup each one.
Email list-server groups and USENET are like having all of those
newspapers delivered to your door every morning.

On 15/12/2017 15:05, Good Guy wrote:
On 15/12/2017 14:24, CRNG wrote:
Take a look at this

https://www.oo-s

install it and lock-down your computer so M$ can't update it anymore.

you are the most stupid person I have seen on the Internet this
Christmas.Â* Why use 3rd party tools to stop Windows update when the OP
can so it from within Windows by going to services app and disabling
Windows update.

Why did your parents not abort you in fetus when the scan would have
told them that they have a stupid idiot baby.

--
With over 600 million devices now running Windows 10, customer
satisfaction is higher than any previous version of windows.


I say, rather obnoxious, don't yah know

On 12/17/2017 10:36 AM, critcher wrote:
On 15/12/2017 15:05, Good Guy wrote:
On 15/12/2017 14:24, CRNG wrote:
Take a look at this

https://www.oo-s

install it and lock-down your computer so M$ can't update it anymore.

you are the most stupid person I have seen on the Internet this
Christmas.Â* Why use 3rd party tools to stop Windows update when the OP
can so it from within Windows by going to services app and disabling
Windows update.

Why did your parents not abort you in fetus when the scan would have
told them that they have a stupid idiot baby.

--
With over 600 million devices now running Windows 10, customer
satisfaction is higher than any previous version of windows.


I say, rather obnoxious, don't yah know

He's just a pimple on the buttocks of the world.
"M*A*S*H*"

Rene

On 12/14/17 7:47 PM, Big Al wrote:
On 12/14/2017 09:29 PM, Keith Nuttle wrote:
On 12/14/2017 6:09 PM, philo wrote:

In the past three days I've spent 30 hours scanning old negatives.


My uncle's estate left me a box of negatives from 1935 - 1955 and my
machine handled it without the slightest glitch...I was doing other
work while scanning etc

What are you using to scan the negatives. It sounds like you have
quite a few to scan as I have. Doing it three at a time as my stand
alone scanner does takes for ever.

If it is an automatic scanner what is the brand and model.

Thank you.

Sorry to but in, but I have
http://www.konicaminoltasupport.com/...ua.3204.0.html
Used it years ago to scan some 1000 slides (a year or so of time).
The only issue is that it only had drivers for XP. I kept a dual boot
of XP and Win7 for years. Now I have no XP. I do have the scanner
though, even though I don't know why. It only did 35MM slides or
negatives in a caddy I think 4 at a time.

Have you tried VueScan from Hamrick Software?


--
Ken
Mac OS X 10.11.6
Firefox 53.0.2 (64 bit)
Thunderbird 52.0
"My brain is like lightning, a quick flash
and it's gone!"