networking performance issue(s)

On 12/3/2018 11:58 AM, 123456789 wrote:
On 12/3/2018 8:22 AM, Ken Blake wrote:

How would anyone know your router is on? Yes, it's easy to see what
routers in the neighborhood are on, but how would a stranger identify
one of them as yours?

My neighbor's names are George and Betty. One of their SSID names is
"George's Guest Network" and the other is "Betty's WiFi Network". So ID
is relatively easy in their case. BTW George's SSID is UNLOCKED and has
come in very handy at times, like when my service goes down.

If I look at the list of running routers here, I can identify a
couple, but I can't tell whose most of them are.

But most as you say are unidentifiable. One SSID in my neighborhood
is quite creative. It's "FBI Van #3"...Â* :-)


While I mentioned that I leave my LAN on and the reasons, I looked at
the LANs picked up by my computer. T Here are 19.

The names of 11 have either the ISP or the equipment in their name. A
couple are named for the LAN printer. 4 are versions of the family
name, one is named 7Heaven, and one is name BedRoomspeakers.

I suspect this is pretty normal for LAN names







--
2018: The year we learn to play the great game of Euchre

On Mon, 3 Dec 2018 12:45:40 -0500, Keith Nuttle
wrote:

On 12/3/2018 11:58 AM, 123456789 wrote:
On 12/3/2018 8:22 AM, Ken Blake wrote:

How would anyone know your router is on? Yes, it's easy to see what
routers in the neighborhood are on, but how would a stranger identify
one of them as yours?

My neighbor's names are George and Betty. One of their SSID names is
"George's Guest Network" and the other is "Betty's WiFi Network". So ID
is relatively easy in their case. BTW George's SSID is UNLOCKED and has
come in very handy at times, like when my service goes down.

If I look at the list of running routers here, I can identify a
couple, but I can't tell whose most of them are.

But most as you say are unidentifiable. One SSID in my neighborhood
is quite creative. It's "FBI Van #3"...Â* :-)


While I mentioned that I leave my LAN on and the reasons, I looked at
the LANs picked up by my computer. T Here are 19.

The names of 11 have either the ISP or the equipment in their name. A
couple are named for the LAN printer. 4 are versions of the family
name, one is named 7Heaven, and one is name BedRoomspeakers.

I suspect this is pretty normal for LAN names


How does the ISP name, other equipment name, the LAN Printer name,
7Heaven, or BedRoomspeakers help a burglar identify the house it's in?
The four with versions of the family name may be normal in your
neighborhood, but not in mine.

I just checked again, on my phone. It now finds nine, including my
own. Of the nine, I could identify only one beside my own, since it
used the homeowner's name. I had also checked when I posted my earlier
message and at that time none were identifiable.

When I created my own network, I was very careful to choose a name for
it that nobody could identify as being mine--not so much for
protection from burglars, but more to stop any neighbors from trying
to hack into it.

And as I said, from the burglar's point of view, a name isn't good
enough. He needs the address. He might be able to find an address with
the name, but he might not; he might not even know how to try. And he
might not be willing to take the time to even try.

And to add one more point to all of the above: the average burglar
probably has very little in the way of technical skills and couldn't
even begin to do any of things either of us mentioned. It would take a
professional burglar, not some teenage drug addict to do this. I don't
know about your neighborhood, but most professional burglars won't
operate in a neighborhood like mine. They specialize in neighborhoods
with multi-million dollar houses.

In article , Ken Blake
wrote:

The names of 11 have either the ISP or the equipment in their name. A
couple are named for the LAN printer. 4 are versions of the family
name, one is named 7Heaven, and one is name BedRoomspeakers.

I suspect this is pretty normal for LAN names

How does the ISP name, other equipment name, the LAN Printer name,
7Heaven, or BedRoomspeakers help a burglar identify the house it's in?
The four with versions of the family name may be normal in your
neighborhood, but not in mine.

then your neighborhood is unusual. it's very common to see identifying
information. however, that isn't actually needed.

I just checked again, on my phone. It now finds nine, including my
own. Of the nine, I could identify only one beside my own, since it
used the homeowner's name. I had also checked when I posted my earlier
message and at that time none were identifiable.

walk around with a phone and wifi app and it's trivial to figure out
which wifi network goes with which house. or, as i said, use online
tools, because it's already been mapped out.

When I created my own network, I was very careful to choose a name for
it that nobody could identify as being mine--not so much for
protection from burglars, but more to stop any neighbors from trying
to hack into it.

the name makes no difference. if someone wants to hack into it, they
will, regardless of what you call it or whether the ssid is hidden.

the best you can do is make it more difficult than the others so that
they hack someone else's network first, but if you're the target, that
isn't going to matter.

And as I said, from the burglar's point of view, a name isn't good
enough. He needs the address. He might be able to find an address with
the name, but he might not; he might not even know how to try. And he
might not be willing to take the time to even try.

And to add one more point to all of the above: the average burglar
probably has very little in the way of technical skills and couldn't
even begin to do any of things either of us mentioned. It would take a
professional burglar, not some teenage drug addict to do this. I don't
know about your neighborhood, but most professional burglars won't
operate in a neighborhood like mine. They specialize in neighborhoods
with multi-million dollar houses.

they only need technical skills if they want to hack your wifi, which
wouldn't be a burglary.

On 12/3/2018 11:42 AM, Ken Blake wrote:

And as I said, from the burglar's point of view, a [SSID] name isn't
good enough. He needs the address. He might be able to find an
address with the name, but he might not;

Maybe I'm missing something but how would knowing which SSID went to
which house help a burglar?

And to add one more point to all of the above: the average burglar
probably has very little in the way of technical skills

Yup. Just ringing the door bell to see if you are home is much easier.

It would take a professional burglar, not some teenage drug addict to
do this.

Not sure what your definition of "professional" burglar is. Most (all?)
do it to get your stuff or money.

I don't know about your neighborhood, but most professional burglars
won't operate in a neighborhood like mine. They specialize in
neighborhoods with multi-million dollar houses.

I've had occasion to talk with hundreds of burglars in my past life and
they are all quite varied. They work in all parts of town (my metro area
is 6 mil) and use many different techniques to break in from door kicks
to stealing garage door openers from parked cars. But not once have I
ever heard of any burglar WiFi stalking...

On 12/3/2018 10:45 AM, Keith Nuttle wrote:

I looked at the LANs picked up by my computer. T Here are 19.

The names of 11 have either the ISP or the equipment in their name.
A couple are named for the LAN printer. 4 are versions of the
family name, one is named 7Heaven, and one is name BedRoomspeakers.

I suspect this is pretty normal for LAN names

I named my guest WiFi SSID "Rattler" and the password is "badsnake". The
grandkids get a kick out of that. Now you know my secret if you're ever
in the area...

In article , 123456789
wrote:

Maybe I'm missing something but how would knowing which SSID went to
which house help a burglar?

if wifi that's normally on is now off, it's an indication that nobody
is home, and for an extended period of time.

nospam wrote in
:

In article , Ken Blake
wrote:


houses are generally far enough apart that it's easy to tell which one
a given wifi network belongs. even easier, some people use their name
or address or other identifying information as an ssid name.

I personally like the name I saw one time: 'The FBI Surveillence van down
the street'

On Mon, 03 Dec 2018 14:00:50 -0500, nospam
wrote:

In article , Ken Blake
wrote:

The names of 11 have either the ISP or the equipment in their name. A
couple are named for the LAN printer. 4 are versions of the family
name, one is named 7Heaven, and one is name BedRoomspeakers.

I suspect this is pretty normal for LAN names

How does the ISP name, other equipment name, the LAN Printer name,
7Heaven, or BedRoomspeakers help a burglar identify the house it's in?
The four with versions of the family name may be normal in your
neighborhood, but not in mine.

then your neighborhood is unusual. it's very common to see identifying
information. however, that isn't actually needed.

I just checked again, on my phone. It now finds nine, including my
own. Of the nine, I could identify only one beside my own, since it
used the homeowner's name. I had also checked when I posted my earlier
message and at that time none were identifiable.

walk around with a phone and wifi app and it's trivial to figure out
which wifi network goes with which house. or, as i said, use online
tools, because it's already been mapped out.

Using a phone and app, I've never lived or walked in a neighborhood
where I've been able to figure out which SSID belongs to which house. If
I made a project out of it, I could probably narrow it down to 3 or 4,
at best. For example, if I stand on the sidewalk in front of my house, 3
other SSIDs are stronger than mine. You're probably thinking of a
McMansion neighborhood, where the houses are far enough apart to make
identification easy. A typical suburban neighborhood isn't like that. I
could probably do a little better if I cobbled together something with a
highly directional antenna, but I just use the phone.

I have no comment and no experience with online mapping tools.

I know, I know, you'll claim "nonsense" or "user error". I thought I'd
save you the time.

BTW, of the 20-25 SSIDs that I can see from my home office, only two
include the family name as part of the SSID. One of them, "Watsons", is
my neighbor diagonal across the street. The other, "Emler_kids", is a
bit more difficult. Google says my city of ~3 million people does have
some Emlers, but not any that are out this way.

In article , Char Jackson
wrote:

I just checked again, on my phone. It now finds nine, including my
own. Of the nine, I could identify only one beside my own, since it
used the homeowner's name. I had also checked when I posted my earlier
message and at that time none were identifiable.

walk around with a phone and wifi app and it's trivial to figure out
which wifi network goes with which house. or, as i said, use online
tools, because it's already been mapped out.

Using a phone and app, I've never lived or walked in a neighborhood
where I've been able to figure out which SSID belongs to which house.

that doesn't mean it can't be done.

If
I made a project out of it, I could probably narrow it down to 3 or 4,
at best. For example, if I stand on the sidewalk in front of my house, 3
other SSIDs are stronger than mine. You're probably thinking of a
McMansion neighborhood, where the houses are far enough apart to make
identification easy. A typical suburban neighborhood isn't like that. I
could probably do a little better if I cobbled together something with a
highly directional antenna, but I just use the phone.

i'm thinking of a typical suburban neighborhood.

I have no comment and no experience with online mapping tools.

it's both useful and scary, depending on one's point of view.

here's one: https://wigle.net

zoom into your neighborhood, or anywhere else.

On Mon, 3 Dec 2018 13:15:40 -0700, 123456789 wrote:

On 12/3/2018 11:42 AM, Ken Blake wrote:

And as I said, from the burglar's point of view, a [SSID] name isn't
good enough. He needs the address. He might be able to find an
address with the name, but he might not;

Maybe I'm missing something but how would knowing which SSID went to
which house help a burglar?


My point was to disagree with Keith's claim that knowing what routers
are turned on tells a burglar who is at home.


And to add one more point to all of the above: the average burglar
probably has very little in the way of technical skills

Yup. Just ringing the door bell to see if you are home is much easier.


Yes, I agree. And doing that requires no technical skills.


It would take a professional burglar, not some teenage drug addict to
do this.

Not sure what your definition of "professional" burglar is. Most (all?)
do it to get your stuff or money.


OK, change "professional" to "skilled."


I don't know about your neighborhood, but most professional burglars
won't operate in a neighborhood like mine. They specialize in
neighborhoods with multi-million dollar houses.

I've had occasion to talk with hundreds of burglars in my past life and
they are all quite varied. They work in all parts of town (my metro area
is 6 mil) and use many different techniques to break in from door kicks
to stealing garage door openers from parked cars. But not once have I
ever heard of any burglar WiFi stalking...


I've never talked with a burglar (at least not with some who I knew
was a burglar), but again, my message was in response to Keith's
statement "My router is on all of the time, even when we are a way for
several days. To me turning it off would be like putting a sign in
the window, there is no one home so you can take what ever you like."

The average burglar would never use the knowledge of whether your
router was on to tell whether you are home. He wouldn't think of doing
that, and he probably wouldn't know how to find out. And even if he
knew a lot about routers, finding what routers were on is very
unlikely to tell him which houses had their routers on.

If anyone were to try to do this, it would only be a burglar very
skilled technically, and probably only one that operated in expensive
neighborhoods.

In article , Ken Blake
wrote:

And as I said, from the burglar's point of view, a [SSID] name isn't
good enough. He needs the address. He might be able to find an
address with the name, but he might not;

Maybe I'm missing something but how would knowing which SSID went to
which house help a burglar?

My point was to disagree with Keith's claim that knowing what routers
are turned on tells a burglar who is at home.

it's not which ones are turned on, but which ones that are normally on
and are now turned *off*, indicating the residents are not around, and
for an extended period of time (versus going out to eat or something).

In article , Wolf K
wrote:

Not sure what your definition of "professional" burglar is. Most (all?)
do it to get your stuff or money.

Talk to one of your police buddies. They know the diff. So does the mob.
They _hate_ amateurs.

actually, they like amateurs because they're easy to catch. pros make
the cops work hard, which cuts into their donut consumption.

On 12/3/2018 5:01 PM, Wolf K wrote:
On 2018-12-03 15:15, 123456789 wrote:

Not sure what your definition of "professional" burglar is.
Talk to one of your police buddies. They know the diff.

So does the mob. They _hate_ amateurs.

Hey Wolfie...What's the diff. Youse guys on the lam?

(You've been watching too many movies...

On 12/3/2018 5:07 PM, Ken Blake wrote:

The average burglar would never use the knowledge of whether your
router was on to tell whether you are home.

Agreed. Especially a non-neighborhood burglar that wouldn't even know a
WiFi signal is missing.

He wouldn't think of doing
that, and he probably wouldn't know how to find out.

Course I suppose some technical savvy neighbors might notice. How well
do you trust your neighbors? Or your neighbors kids... 8-O

If anyone were to try to do this, it would only be a burglar very
skilled technically, and probably only one that operated in expensive
neighborhoods.

If this is a targeted burglary then there are many other easier ways to
determine if the residence is occupied than to monitor the WiFi.

In article , Wolf K
wrote:

Not sure what your definition of "professional" burglar is. Most (all?)
do it to get your stuff or money.

Talk to one of your police buddies. They know the diff. So does the mob.
They _hate_ amateurs.

actually, they like amateurs because they're easy to catch. pros make
the cops work hard, which cuts into their donut consumption.

Er, the mob owns the donut shops????

possibly, but i was referring to the cops.

the mob likes amateurs because those are the ones who get caught. they
might even utilize a few to keep the cops busy while they escape.