HD Cloning Help Needed - Argh!

So last night I used Acronis True Image 11 Home to clone my existing 120 GB
hard drive onto a new 650 GB Seagate drive. I had to run chkdsk a couple of
times on the existing drive to clear out some bad spots. After I did that, I
ran Acronis using the "proportional" scaling option so that each partition
would be scaled up proportional to its current size. The system partion
(13.97 GB) was scaled up to a new size (75.67GB). It took almost an hour to
complete, so I know it was doing something...

The cloning operation was a success! After Acronis was finished, I shut
down completely, swapped the new drive into the Master spot on the IDE cable,
removed the old drive, and tried to boot. Of course, I forgot to remove the
CD, so I booted into the Acronis startup mode. I removed the CD and tried
again. I got a beep and an error message (I forget exactly what it was -
something about unable to boot from boot device, insert bootable media and
hit any key?). The system did not recognize the new hard drive!

Then I put the old drive back in, leaving the new drive out completely.
Same error message! It would not boot from the old drive either.

Then I went into BIOS to try to figure out what was wrong. Before I did, I
installed both of the hard drives - old one in Master, new one in Slave.
Once in BIOS, I saw that neither of the hard drives were being recognized -
the IDE slots were shown as empty. So I gave up because I'm not smart enough
to know what was happening.

I'm sure there's a simple fix to this. Can anyone tell me what I did wrong,
and what I need to do to at least get the old hard drive to boot again?
Better yet, if you could also tell me how to get the new drive to boot (my
original goal), that would be great! I have a Sony VAIO running windows XP
with all the latest and greatest updates. I think the original drive is a
Samsung. I had both drives set to "cable select" mode.

Sorry for the long-winded post.

TIA,

Eric
---------------------
If toast always lands butter-side down, and cats always land on their feet,
what happen if you strap toast on the back of a cat and drop it?
Steven Wright (1955 - )

Whoever solves this problem gets 4 stars.
Acronis support was never able to solve it for me.
Ended up completely formatting drive and reinstalling XP.
Since this was a test PC nothing of value was lost.

--
JS
http://www.pagestart.com



"EricG" wrote in message
...
So last night I used Acronis True Image 11 Home to clone my existing 120
GB
hard drive onto a new 650 GB Seagate drive. I had to run chkdsk a couple
of
times on the existing drive to clear out some bad spots. After I did
that, I
ran Acronis using the "proportional" scaling option so that each partition
would be scaled up proportional to its current size. The system partion
(13.97 GB) was scaled up to a new size (75.67GB). It took almost an hour
to
complete, so I know it was doing something...

The cloning operation was a success! After Acronis was finished, I shut
down completely, swapped the new drive into the Master spot on the IDE
cable,
removed the old drive, and tried to boot. Of course, I forgot to remove
the
CD, so I booted into the Acronis startup mode. I removed the CD and tried
again. I got a beep and an error message (I forget exactly what it was -
something about unable to boot from boot device, insert bootable media and
hit any key?). The system did not recognize the new hard drive!

Then I put the old drive back in, leaving the new drive out completely.
Same error message! It would not boot from the old drive either.

Then I went into BIOS to try to figure out what was wrong. Before I did,
I
installed both of the hard drives - old one in Master, new one in Slave.
Once in BIOS, I saw that neither of the hard drives were being
recognized -
the IDE slots were shown as empty. So I gave up because I'm not smart
enough
to know what was happening.

I'm sure there's a simple fix to this. Can anyone tell me what I did
wrong,
and what I need to do to at least get the old hard drive to boot again?
Better yet, if you could also tell me how to get the new drive to boot (my
original goal), that would be great! I have a Sony VAIO running windows
XP
with all the latest and greatest updates. I think the original drive is a
Samsung. I had both drives set to "cable select" mode.

Sorry for the long-winded post.

TIA,

Eric
---------------------
If toast always lands butter-side down, and cats always land on their
feet,
what happen if you strap toast on the back of a cat and drop it?
Steven Wright (1955 - )

Whoever solves this problem gets 4 stars.
Acronis support was never able to solve it for me.
Ended up completely formatting drive and reinstalling XP.
Since this was a test PC nothing of value was lost.

--
JS
http://www.pagestart.com



"EricG" wrote in message
...
So last night I used Acronis True Image 11 Home to clone my existing 120
GB
hard drive onto a new 650 GB Seagate drive. I had to run chkdsk a couple
of
times on the existing drive to clear out some bad spots. After I did
that, I
ran Acronis using the "proportional" scaling option so that each partition
would be scaled up proportional to its current size. The system partion
(13.97 GB) was scaled up to a new size (75.67GB). It took almost an hour
to
complete, so I know it was doing something...

The cloning operation was a success! After Acronis was finished, I shut
down completely, swapped the new drive into the Master spot on the IDE
cable,
removed the old drive, and tried to boot. Of course, I forgot to remove
the
CD, so I booted into the Acronis startup mode. I removed the CD and tried
again. I got a beep and an error message (I forget exactly what it was -
something about unable to boot from boot device, insert bootable media and
hit any key?). The system did not recognize the new hard drive!

Then I put the old drive back in, leaving the new drive out completely.
Same error message! It would not boot from the old drive either.

Then I went into BIOS to try to figure out what was wrong. Before I did,
I
installed both of the hard drives - old one in Master, new one in Slave.
Once in BIOS, I saw that neither of the hard drives were being
recognized -
the IDE slots were shown as empty. So I gave up because I'm not smart
enough
to know what was happening.

I'm sure there's a simple fix to this. Can anyone tell me what I did
wrong,
and what I need to do to at least get the old hard drive to boot again?
Better yet, if you could also tell me how to get the new drive to boot (my
original goal), that would be great! I have a Sony VAIO running windows
XP
with all the latest and greatest updates. I think the original drive is a
Samsung. I had both drives set to "cable select" mode.

Sorry for the long-winded post.

TIA,

Eric
---------------------
If toast always lands butter-side down, and cats always land on their
feet,
what happen if you strap toast on the back of a cat and drop it?
Steven Wright (1955 - )

Unfortunately, mine is not a test PC. Mine is the only PC I have, and
backing up hasn't been my specialty. That's the other reason I got the
Acronis software. How ironic! I have a second 650 GB drive that I'm
planning to use as the backup drive. I guess I should have backed up first...


"JS" wrote:

Since this was a test PC nothing of value was lost.

Unfortunately, mine is not a test PC. Mine is the only PC I have, and
backing up hasn't been my specialty. That's the other reason I got the
Acronis software. How ironic! I have a second 650 GB drive that I'm
planning to use as the backup drive. I guess I should have backed up first...


"JS" wrote:

Since this was a test PC nothing of value was lost.

"EricG" wrote in message
...
So last night I used Acronis True Image 11 Home to clone my existing 120
GB
hard drive onto a new 650 GB Seagate drive. I had to run chkdsk a couple
of
times on the existing drive to clear out some bad spots. After I did
that, I
ran Acronis using the "proportional" scaling option so that each partition
would be scaled up proportional to its current size. The system partion
(13.97 GB) was scaled up to a new size (75.67GB). It took almost an hour
to
complete, so I know it was doing something...

The cloning operation was a success! After Acronis was finished, I shut
down completely, swapped the new drive into the Master spot on the IDE
cable,
removed the old drive, and tried to boot. Of course, I forgot to remove
the
CD, so I booted into the Acronis startup mode. I removed the CD and tried
again. I got a beep and an error message (I forget exactly what it was -
something about unable to boot from boot device, insert bootable media and
hit any key?). The system did not recognize the new hard drive!

Then I put the old drive back in, leaving the new drive out completely.
Same error message! It would not boot from the old drive either.

Then I went into BIOS to try to figure out what was wrong. Before I did,
I
installed both of the hard drives - old one in Master, new one in Slave.
Once in BIOS, I saw that neither of the hard drives were being
recognized -
the IDE slots were shown as empty. So I gave up because I'm not smart
enough
to know what was happening.

I'm sure there's a simple fix to this. Can anyone tell me what I did
wrong,
and what I need to do to at least get the old hard drive to boot again?
Better yet, if you could also tell me how to get the new drive to boot (my
original goal), that would be great! I have a Sony VAIO running windows
XP
with all the latest and greatest updates. I think the original drive is a
Samsung. I had both drives set to "cable select" mode.

Sorry for the long-winded post.

TIA,

Eric


Eric:
First of all you needn't apologize "for the long-winded post". On the
contrary; you provided an excellent description of the problem you're
experiencing and the steps leading up to it. Most responders (and potential
responders) welcome this kind of detail when a poster posts his or her
problem.

Anyway...

1. It's hard to imagine there's a hardware-issue involved here. Presumably
your "old" 120 GB HDD booted & functioned without any problems prior to the
disk-cloning operation, right?

2. And we'll assume that your new 650 GB Seagate is non-defective. There's
no reason to think otherwise, is there?

3. There's an old saying that if you "clone garbage, garbage is what you'll
get". You have indicated that prior to the disk-cloning operation "I had to
run chkdsk a couple of times on the existing drive to clear out some bad
spots."

You're pretty sure you "clear(ed) out" these "bad spots"? After doing so can
we assume that you booted to the 120 GB HDD and it functioned perfectly?
Booted without incident and no problems with any programs, etc.? And it was
at that point that you undertook the disk-cloning operation?

4. Setting aside the 650 GB HDD...when you install *only* the 120 GB HDD in
the system, you've checked the BIOS boot priority (boot preference) setting
and does it indicate a first HDD boot to that drive? Are you indicating that
the disk is not recognized at all in the motherboard's BIOS (again, when
connected as the sole HDD in the system)?

5. Have you tried jumpering the 120 GB HDD as Master (or Single if it's a WD
disk) in lieu of Cable Select?

6. Saving the worst for last, it's possible that the ATI disk-cloning
operation went awry in such a way as to cause substantial corruption in the
source HDD. To the point where the disk becomes an unbootable device. While
rare in our experience with various versions of the ATI program, we *have*
encountered that misery more than once. And we could never account for that
problem.

7. Since you obviously have another PC at your disposal, is there any chance
you can install the 120 GB HDD as a *secondary* HDD in that machine to
determine if it's detected by the system and you can access its contents?

8. Can I assume you've previously used the ATI version you're working with
for routine disk-cloning purposes? You're reasonably familiar with the
program?

(Hopefully) there's no chance you might have confused the "source" &
"destination" drives while undertaking the disk-cloning operation, is there?
Anna

"EricG" wrote in message
...
So last night I used Acronis True Image 11 Home to clone my existing 120
GB
hard drive onto a new 650 GB Seagate drive. I had to run chkdsk a couple
of
times on the existing drive to clear out some bad spots. After I did
that, I
ran Acronis using the "proportional" scaling option so that each partition
would be scaled up proportional to its current size. The system partion
(13.97 GB) was scaled up to a new size (75.67GB). It took almost an hour
to
complete, so I know it was doing something...

The cloning operation was a success! After Acronis was finished, I shut
down completely, swapped the new drive into the Master spot on the IDE
cable,
removed the old drive, and tried to boot. Of course, I forgot to remove
the
CD, so I booted into the Acronis startup mode. I removed the CD and tried
again. I got a beep and an error message (I forget exactly what it was -
something about unable to boot from boot device, insert bootable media and
hit any key?). The system did not recognize the new hard drive!

Then I put the old drive back in, leaving the new drive out completely.
Same error message! It would not boot from the old drive either.

Then I went into BIOS to try to figure out what was wrong. Before I did,
I
installed both of the hard drives - old one in Master, new one in Slave.
Once in BIOS, I saw that neither of the hard drives were being
recognized -
the IDE slots were shown as empty. So I gave up because I'm not smart
enough
to know what was happening.

I'm sure there's a simple fix to this. Can anyone tell me what I did
wrong,
and what I need to do to at least get the old hard drive to boot again?
Better yet, if you could also tell me how to get the new drive to boot (my
original goal), that would be great! I have a Sony VAIO running windows
XP
with all the latest and greatest updates. I think the original drive is a
Samsung. I had both drives set to "cable select" mode.

Sorry for the long-winded post.

TIA,

Eric


Eric:
First of all you needn't apologize "for the long-winded post". On the
contrary; you provided an excellent description of the problem you're
experiencing and the steps leading up to it. Most responders (and potential
responders) welcome this kind of detail when a poster posts his or her
problem.

Anyway...

1. It's hard to imagine there's a hardware-issue involved here. Presumably
your "old" 120 GB HDD booted & functioned without any problems prior to the
disk-cloning operation, right?

2. And we'll assume that your new 650 GB Seagate is non-defective. There's
no reason to think otherwise, is there?

3. There's an old saying that if you "clone garbage, garbage is what you'll
get". You have indicated that prior to the disk-cloning operation "I had to
run chkdsk a couple of times on the existing drive to clear out some bad
spots."

You're pretty sure you "clear(ed) out" these "bad spots"? After doing so can
we assume that you booted to the 120 GB HDD and it functioned perfectly?
Booted without incident and no problems with any programs, etc.? And it was
at that point that you undertook the disk-cloning operation?

4. Setting aside the 650 GB HDD...when you install *only* the 120 GB HDD in
the system, you've checked the BIOS boot priority (boot preference) setting
and does it indicate a first HDD boot to that drive? Are you indicating that
the disk is not recognized at all in the motherboard's BIOS (again, when
connected as the sole HDD in the system)?

5. Have you tried jumpering the 120 GB HDD as Master (or Single if it's a WD
disk) in lieu of Cable Select?

6. Saving the worst for last, it's possible that the ATI disk-cloning
operation went awry in such a way as to cause substantial corruption in the
source HDD. To the point where the disk becomes an unbootable device. While
rare in our experience with various versions of the ATI program, we *have*
encountered that misery more than once. And we could never account for that
problem.

7. Since you obviously have another PC at your disposal, is there any chance
you can install the 120 GB HDD as a *secondary* HDD in that machine to
determine if it's detected by the system and you can access its contents?

8. Can I assume you've previously used the ATI version you're working with
for routine disk-cloning purposes? You're reasonably familiar with the
program?

(Hopefully) there's no chance you might have confused the "source" &
"destination" drives while undertaking the disk-cloning operation, is there?
Anna

Anna,

Thanks for your response. My "other PC" is my laptop at work. I only have
the one PC at home. I can answer some of your questions now, but I can't do
any testing until I get home. My wife has a laptop (at home) so I'll be able
to talk to the NG after doing any suggested tests. See my responses to your
questions below.

Eric

"Anna" wrote:


1. It's hard to imagine there's a hardware-issue involved here. Presumably
your "old" 120 GB HDD booted & functioned without any problems prior to the
disk-cloning operation, right?

The old HD booted and functioned fine prior to the disk-cloning. The only
problem I was having was a constant stream of "you're almost out of disk
space on drive C:" messages. I was down to about 200MB of free space in the
system partition, and I had done all the cleaning, deleting and compressing I
could stand. Hence the desire for a larger HD.

2. And we'll assume that your new 650 GB Seagate is non-defective. There's
no reason to think otherwise, is there?

The new drive had been installed in the same PC and was being used (although
sparingly) to store some data temporarily. Didn't have any problems with it.
It was recognized by Windows from the beginning.

3. There's an old saying that if you "clone garbage, garbage is what you'll
get". You have indicated that prior to the disk-cloning operation "I had to
run chkdsk a couple of times on the existing drive to clear out some bad
spots."

You're pretty sure you "clear(ed) out" these "bad spots"? After doing so can
we assume that you booted to the 120 GB HDD and it functioned perfectly?
Booted without incident and no problems with any programs, etc.? And it was
at that point that you undertook the disk-cloning operation?

The first chkdsk pass found about four bad "segments"?? in the first of the
three chkdsk phases and fixed them. The second pass found one thing wrong in
the file index (again ?? not sure of the terminology) in (I think) the second
chkdsk phase and fixed that. The third pass was completely clean, with no
complaints from chkdsk. After the third pass, I continued to boot the
machine and had no problems. And yes, I then did the disk-cloning operation
(after rebooting yet again to start up with the Acronis CD).

4. Setting aside the 650 GB HDD...when you install *only* the 120 GB HDD in
the system, you've checked the BIOS boot priority (boot preference) setting
and does it indicate a first HDD boot to that drive? Are you indicating that
the disk is not recognized at all in the motherboard's BIOS (again, when
connected as the sole HDD in the system)?

I tried installing either drive by itself, and neither worked. When I had
only the 120GB drive installed, I figured out how to get into the BIOS, and
looked at the installed hardware. The drive did not show up in the primary
IDE list at all. Nothing did. The CD and DVD drives showed up in the
secondary IDE list. The boot settings only allowed selection of either the
CD or the DVD drives. No HD showed up in the list. I also installed BOTH
drives (original=Master, new=Slave), and neither one showed up in the BIOS.

5. Have you tried jumpering the 120 GB HDD as Master (or Single if it's a WD
disk) in lieu of Cable Select?

Yes, I move the jumper for the 120GB drive to the "Master" setting, plugged
it into the "Master" connector on the IDE cable, and tried booting. I got
the same error message.

6. Saving the worst for last, it's possible that the ATI disk-cloning
operation went awry in such a way as to cause substantial corruption in the
source HDD. To the point where the disk becomes an unbootable device. While
rare in our experience with various versions of the ATI program, we *have*
encountered that misery more than once. And we could never account for that
problem.

This is only the worst if it means I lose all my data. That would be bad.
I can probably live with having to reload XP from my recovery disks. I'm
just hoping I don't have to because of all the programs, etc. to be reloaded
also.

7. Since you obviously have another PC at your disposal, is there any chance
you can install the 120 GB HDD as a *secondary* HDD in that machine to
determine if it's detected by the system and you can access its contents?

Unfortunately, I don't have another PC. I'll have to find a friend with one
and try installing the drive(s) in their PC.

8. Can I assume you've previously used the ATI version you're working with
for routine disk-cloning purposes? You're reasonably familiar with the
program?

This is my first time using the software. It was recommended by a friend
who found it "easy and reliable". I played with its features for a while
before I was comfortable with the approach I took. It seemed to work very
smoothly, although it took a while to finish.

(Hopefully) there's no chance you might have confused the "source" &
"destination" drives while undertaking the disk-cloning operation, is there?

That is highly unlikely. The graphical display clearly showed the
destination drive having a 13.97GB system partition, and the new drive having
a proportionally larger system partition.

Anna


Any suggestions you have in terms of things for me to try will be greatly
appreciated. I have become aware that Acronis provides absolutely no
technical support for their product, unless you're willing to pay much more
than the product itself cost.

Eric

Anna,

Thanks for your response. My "other PC" is my laptop at work. I only have
the one PC at home. I can answer some of your questions now, but I can't do
any testing until I get home. My wife has a laptop (at home) so I'll be able
to talk to the NG after doing any suggested tests. See my responses to your
questions below.

Eric

"Anna" wrote:


1. It's hard to imagine there's a hardware-issue involved here. Presumably
your "old" 120 GB HDD booted & functioned without any problems prior to the
disk-cloning operation, right?

The old HD booted and functioned fine prior to the disk-cloning. The only
problem I was having was a constant stream of "you're almost out of disk
space on drive C:" messages. I was down to about 200MB of free space in the
system partition, and I had done all the cleaning, deleting and compressing I
could stand. Hence the desire for a larger HD.

2. And we'll assume that your new 650 GB Seagate is non-defective. There's
no reason to think otherwise, is there?

The new drive had been installed in the same PC and was being used (although
sparingly) to store some data temporarily. Didn't have any problems with it.
It was recognized by Windows from the beginning.

3. There's an old saying that if you "clone garbage, garbage is what you'll
get". You have indicated that prior to the disk-cloning operation "I had to
run chkdsk a couple of times on the existing drive to clear out some bad
spots."

You're pretty sure you "clear(ed) out" these "bad spots"? After doing so can
we assume that you booted to the 120 GB HDD and it functioned perfectly?
Booted without incident and no problems with any programs, etc.? And it was
at that point that you undertook the disk-cloning operation?

The first chkdsk pass found about four bad "segments"?? in the first of the
three chkdsk phases and fixed them. The second pass found one thing wrong in
the file index (again ?? not sure of the terminology) in (I think) the second
chkdsk phase and fixed that. The third pass was completely clean, with no
complaints from chkdsk. After the third pass, I continued to boot the
machine and had no problems. And yes, I then did the disk-cloning operation
(after rebooting yet again to start up with the Acronis CD).

4. Setting aside the 650 GB HDD...when you install *only* the 120 GB HDD in
the system, you've checked the BIOS boot priority (boot preference) setting
and does it indicate a first HDD boot to that drive? Are you indicating that
the disk is not recognized at all in the motherboard's BIOS (again, when
connected as the sole HDD in the system)?

I tried installing either drive by itself, and neither worked. When I had
only the 120GB drive installed, I figured out how to get into the BIOS, and
looked at the installed hardware. The drive did not show up in the primary
IDE list at all. Nothing did. The CD and DVD drives showed up in the
secondary IDE list. The boot settings only allowed selection of either the
CD or the DVD drives. No HD showed up in the list. I also installed BOTH
drives (original=Master, new=Slave), and neither one showed up in the BIOS.

5. Have you tried jumpering the 120 GB HDD as Master (or Single if it's a WD
disk) in lieu of Cable Select?

Yes, I move the jumper for the 120GB drive to the "Master" setting, plugged
it into the "Master" connector on the IDE cable, and tried booting. I got
the same error message.

6. Saving the worst for last, it's possible that the ATI disk-cloning
operation went awry in such a way as to cause substantial corruption in the
source HDD. To the point where the disk becomes an unbootable device. While
rare in our experience with various versions of the ATI program, we *have*
encountered that misery more than once. And we could never account for that
problem.

This is only the worst if it means I lose all my data. That would be bad.
I can probably live with having to reload XP from my recovery disks. I'm
just hoping I don't have to because of all the programs, etc. to be reloaded
also.

7. Since you obviously have another PC at your disposal, is there any chance
you can install the 120 GB HDD as a *secondary* HDD in that machine to
determine if it's detected by the system and you can access its contents?

Unfortunately, I don't have another PC. I'll have to find a friend with one
and try installing the drive(s) in their PC.

8. Can I assume you've previously used the ATI version you're working with
for routine disk-cloning purposes? You're reasonably familiar with the
program?

This is my first time using the software. It was recommended by a friend
who found it "easy and reliable". I played with its features for a while
before I was comfortable with the approach I took. It seemed to work very
smoothly, although it took a while to finish.

(Hopefully) there's no chance you might have confused the "source" &
"destination" drives while undertaking the disk-cloning operation, is there?

That is highly unlikely. The graphical display clearly showed the
destination drive having a 13.97GB system partition, and the new drive having
a proportionally larger system partition.

Anna


Any suggestions you have in terms of things for me to try will be greatly
appreciated. I have become aware that Acronis provides absolutely no
technical support for their product, unless you're willing to pay much more
than the product itself cost.

Eric

(Hopefully) there's no chance you might have confused the "source" &
"destination" drives while undertaking the disk-cloning operation, is
there?

That is highly unlikely. The graphical display clearly showed the
destination drive having a 13.97GB system partition, and the new drive
having a proportionally larger system partition.


If what you state above is true and not a typo, the destination (new
drive) would be the drive to clone to, not the source (original drive). You
stated in your original post: quote
The system partion (13.97 GB) was scaled up to a new size (75.67GB).
/quote

If that is the case the destination (new drive) would be reported as
75.67GB and the source (original drive) would be reported as 13.97GB.
Hopefully the above was a typo.

Another thing to try that the others have not mentioned. With the ATI
disk in the CD/DVD drive, both the new and old hard drives installed and
jumpered as you had them when all worked properly and you performed the
cloning operation, if you boot to the ATI disk are you able to see the
drives?

If you can see the drives does it show the size of the drives and/or do
you have any option to clone, copy or restore?


--

Brian A. Sesko
Conflicts start where information lacks.
http://basconotw.mvps.org/

Suggested posting do's/don'ts: http://www.dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
How to ask a question: http://support.microsoft.com/kb/555375

(Hopefully) there's no chance you might have confused the "source" &
"destination" drives while undertaking the disk-cloning operation, is
there?

That is highly unlikely. The graphical display clearly showed the
destination drive having a 13.97GB system partition, and the new drive
having a proportionally larger system partition.


If what you state above is true and not a typo, the destination (new
drive) would be the drive to clone to, not the source (original drive). You
stated in your original post: quote
The system partion (13.97 GB) was scaled up to a new size (75.67GB).
/quote

If that is the case the destination (new drive) would be reported as
75.67GB and the source (original drive) would be reported as 13.97GB.
Hopefully the above was a typo.

Another thing to try that the others have not mentioned. With the ATI
disk in the CD/DVD drive, both the new and old hard drives installed and
jumpered as you had them when all worked properly and you performed the
cloning operation, if you boot to the ATI disk are you able to see the
drives?

If you can see the drives does it show the size of the drives and/or do
you have any option to clone, copy or restore?


--

Brian A. Sesko
Conflicts start where information lacks.
http://basconotw.mvps.org/

Suggested posting do's/don'ts: http://www.dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
How to ask a question: http://support.microsoft.com/kb/555375

Sorry - yes, that's a typo. Instead of "destination drive", I meant the
original (120GB) drive.

Hmm...that's something I didn't try - see if I can start a new cloning
operation and if ATI sees the disks. I'll try that when I get home.

Thanks for the idea.

Eric

"Brian A." wrote:


(Hopefully) there's no chance you might have confused the "source" &
"destination" drives while undertaking the disk-cloning operation, is
there?

That is highly unlikely. The graphical display clearly showed the
destination drive having a 13.97GB system partition, and the new drive
having a proportionally larger system partition.


If what you state above is true and not a typo, the destination (new
drive) would be the drive to clone to, not the source (original drive). You
stated in your original post: quote
The system partion (13.97 GB) was scaled up to a new size (75.67GB).
/quote

If that is the case the destination (new drive) would be reported as
75.67GB and the source (original drive) would be reported as 13.97GB.
Hopefully the above was a typo.

Another thing to try that the others have not mentioned. With the ATI
disk in the CD/DVD drive, both the new and old hard drives installed and
jumpered as you had them when all worked properly and you performed the
cloning operation, if you boot to the ATI disk are you able to see the
drives?

If you can see the drives does it show the size of the drives and/or do
you have any option to clone, copy or restore?


--

Brian A. Sesko
Conflicts start where information lacks.
http://basconotw.mvps.org/

Suggested posting do's/don'ts: http://www.dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
How to ask a question: http://support.microsoft.com/kb/555375

Sorry - yes, that's a typo. Instead of "destination drive", I meant the
original (120GB) drive.

Hmm...that's something I didn't try - see if I can start a new cloning
operation and if ATI sees the disks. I'll try that when I get home.

Thanks for the idea.

Eric

"Brian A." wrote:


(Hopefully) there's no chance you might have confused the "source" &
"destination" drives while undertaking the disk-cloning operation, is
there?

That is highly unlikely. The graphical display clearly showed the
destination drive having a 13.97GB system partition, and the new drive
having a proportionally larger system partition.


If what you state above is true and not a typo, the destination (new
drive) would be the drive to clone to, not the source (original drive). You
stated in your original post: quote
The system partion (13.97 GB) was scaled up to a new size (75.67GB).
/quote

If that is the case the destination (new drive) would be reported as
75.67GB and the source (original drive) would be reported as 13.97GB.
Hopefully the above was a typo.

Another thing to try that the others have not mentioned. With the ATI
disk in the CD/DVD drive, both the new and old hard drives installed and
jumpered as you had them when all worked properly and you performed the
cloning operation, if you boot to the ATI disk are you able to see the
drives?

If you can see the drives does it show the size of the drives and/or do
you have any option to clone, copy or restore?


--

Brian A. Sesko
Conflicts start where information lacks.
http://basconotw.mvps.org/

Suggested posting do's/don'ts: http://www.dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
How to ask a question: http://support.microsoft.com/kb/555375

"EricG" wrote in message
...
Anna,
Thanks for your response. My "other PC" is my laptop at work. I only
have
the one PC at home. I can answer some of your questions now, but I can't
do
any testing until I get home. My wife has a laptop (at home) so I'll be
able
to talk to the NG after doing any suggested tests. See my responses to
your
questions below.

Eric


"Anna" wrote:
1. It's hard to imagine there's a hardware-issue involved here.
Presumably
your "old" 120 GB HDD booted & functioned without any problems prior to
the
disk-cloning operation, right?

Eric wrote...
The old HD booted and functioned fine prior to the disk-cloning. The only
problem I was having was a constant stream of "you're almost out of disk
space on drive C:" messages. I was down to about 200MB of free space in
the
system partition, and I had done all the cleaning, deleting and
compressing I
could stand. Hence the desire for a larger HD.


"Anna" wrote:
2. And we'll assume that your new 650 GB Seagate is non-defective.
There's
no reason to think otherwise, is there?

Eric wrote...
The new drive had been installed in the same PC and was being used
(although
sparingly) to store some data temporarily. Didn't have any problems with
it.
It was recognized by Windows from the beginning.


"Anna" wrote:
3. There's an old saying that if you "clone garbage, garbage is what
you'll
get". You have indicated that prior to the disk-cloning operation "I had
to
run chkdsk a couple of times on the existing drive to clear out some bad
spots."

You're pretty sure you "clear(ed) out" these "bad spots"? After doing so
can
we assume that you booted to the 120 GB HDD and it functioned perfectly?
Booted without incident and no problems with any programs, etc.? And it
was
at that point that you undertook the disk-cloning operation?

Eric wrote...
The first chkdsk pass found about four bad "segments"?? in the first of
the
three chkdsk phases and fixed them. The second pass found one thing wrong
in
the file index (again ?? not sure of the terminology) in (I think) the
second
chkdsk phase and fixed that. The third pass was completely clean, with no
complaints from chkdsk. After the third pass, I continued to boot the
machine and had no problems. And yes, I then did the disk-cloning
operation
(after rebooting yet again to start up with the Acronis CD).


"Anna" wrote:
4. Setting aside the 650 GB HDD...when you install *only* the 120 GB HDD
in
the system, you've checked the BIOS boot priority (boot preference)
setting
and does it indicate a first HDD boot to that drive? Are you indicating
that
the disk is not recognized at all in the motherboard's BIOS (again, when
connected as the sole HDD in the system)?

Eric wrote...
I tried installing either drive by itself, and neither worked. When I had
only the 120GB drive installed, I figured out how to get into the BIOS,
and
looked at the installed hardware. The drive did not show up in the
primary
IDE list at all. Nothing did. The CD and DVD drives showed up in the
secondary IDE list. The boot settings only allowed selection of either
the
CD or the DVD drives. No HD showed up in the list. I also installed BOTH
drives (original=Master, new=Slave), and neither one showed up in the
BIOS.


"Anna" wrote:
5. Have you tried jumpering the 120 GB HDD as Master (or Single if it's a
WD
disk) in lieu of Cable Select?

Eric wrote...
Yes, I move the jumper for the 120GB drive to the "Master" setting,
plugged
it into the "Master" connector on the IDE cable, and tried booting. I got
the same error message.


"Anna" wrote:
6. Saving the worst for last, it's possible that the ATI disk-cloning
operation went awry in such a way as to cause substantial corruption in
the
source HDD. To the point where the disk becomes an unbootable device.
While
rare in our experience with various versions of the ATI program, we
*have*
encountered that misery more than once. And we could never account for
that
problem.

Eric wrote...
This is only the worst if it means I lose all my data. That would be bad.
I can probably live with having to reload XP from my recovery disks. I'm
just hoping I don't have to because of all the programs, etc. to be
reloaded
also.


7. Since you obviously have another PC at your disposal, is there any
chance
you can install the 120 GB HDD as a *secondary* HDD in that machine to
determine if it's detected by the system and you can access its contents?

Eric wrote...
Unfortunately, I don't have another PC. I'll have to find a friend with
one
and try installing the drive(s) in their PC.


8. Can I assume you've previously used the ATI version you're working
with
for routine disk-cloning purposes? You're reasonably familiar with the
program?

Eric wrote...
This is my first time using the software. It was recommended by a friend
who found it "easy and reliable". I played with its features for a while
before I was comfortable with the approach I took. It seemed to work very
smoothly, although it took a while to finish.


"Anna" wrote:
(Hopefully) there's no chance you might have confused the "source" &
"destination" drives while undertaking the disk-cloning operation, is
there?

Eric wrote...
That is highly unlikely. The graphical display clearly showed the
destination drive having a 13.97GB system partition, and the new drive
having
a proportionally larger system partition.


Eric wrote...
Any suggestions you have in terms of things for me to try will be greatly
appreciated. I have become aware that Acronis provides absolutely no
technical support for their product, unless you're willing to pay much
more
than the product itself cost.

Eric


Eric...
We'll assume that there's no hardware-issue involved here re either HDD (or
any other component) and that your source HDD (the 120 GB one) was
completely bootable/functional at the time you undertook the disk-cloning
operation.

Also that you carried out the disk-cloning operation without error and that
all connections involving the source & destination disks were proper &
secure.

So, if the preceding is correct, something (obviously) went awry with the
disk-cloning operation.

You've got to examine your 120 GB HDD to determine if the drive is at least
detectable by another PC and you can access its contents and as best you can
determine whether it appears the drive contains a bootable, functional OS.
The only practical way to do this is (at the minimum) install it as a
secondary HDD in another machine. I realize this process is not definitive
in terms of determining whether the drive is potentially bootable &
functional, but it's a start.

The disk-cloning program we use nearly exclusively these days is the Casper
5 program. For a variety of reasons which I won't go into here & now we find
it a superior product and generally prefer it to the Acronis True Image
program. On the other hand the ATI v11 program you already have is a sound
program and also highly recommended by many users.

Under ordinary circumstances I would recommend you download/install the
trial version of the Casper 5 program and undertake the disk-cloning
operation with that program. But obviously that's not an option since
there's no way to install the trial version of that program (at least for
the moment) on a non-bootable HDD.

And while you're going through this diagnosis process you may also want to
download the HDD diagnostic utility from the manufacturer of the 120 GB HDD
to verify that the disk is non-defective.

Anyway, keep us informed of your progress and/or developments.
Anna

"EricG" wrote in message
...
Anna,
Thanks for your response. My "other PC" is my laptop at work. I only
have
the one PC at home. I can answer some of your questions now, but I can't
do
any testing until I get home. My wife has a laptop (at home) so I'll be
able
to talk to the NG after doing any suggested tests. See my responses to
your
questions below.

Eric


"Anna" wrote:
1. It's hard to imagine there's a hardware-issue involved here.
Presumably
your "old" 120 GB HDD booted & functioned without any problems prior to
the
disk-cloning operation, right?

Eric wrote...
The old HD booted and functioned fine prior to the disk-cloning. The only
problem I was having was a constant stream of "you're almost out of disk
space on drive C:" messages. I was down to about 200MB of free space in
the
system partition, and I had done all the cleaning, deleting and
compressing I
could stand. Hence the desire for a larger HD.


"Anna" wrote:
2. And we'll assume that your new 650 GB Seagate is non-defective.
There's
no reason to think otherwise, is there?

Eric wrote...
The new drive had been installed in the same PC and was being used
(although
sparingly) to store some data temporarily. Didn't have any problems with
it.
It was recognized by Windows from the beginning.


"Anna" wrote:
3. There's an old saying that if you "clone garbage, garbage is what
you'll
get". You have indicated that prior to the disk-cloning operation "I had
to
run chkdsk a couple of times on the existing drive to clear out some bad
spots."

You're pretty sure you "clear(ed) out" these "bad spots"? After doing so
can
we assume that you booted to the 120 GB HDD and it functioned perfectly?
Booted without incident and no problems with any programs, etc.? And it
was
at that point that you undertook the disk-cloning operation?

Eric wrote...
The first chkdsk pass found about four bad "segments"?? in the first of
the
three chkdsk phases and fixed them. The second pass found one thing wrong
in
the file index (again ?? not sure of the terminology) in (I think) the
second
chkdsk phase and fixed that. The third pass was completely clean, with no
complaints from chkdsk. After the third pass, I continued to boot the
machine and had no problems. And yes, I then did the disk-cloning
operation
(after rebooting yet again to start up with the Acronis CD).


"Anna" wrote:
4. Setting aside the 650 GB HDD...when you install *only* the 120 GB HDD
in
the system, you've checked the BIOS boot priority (boot preference)
setting
and does it indicate a first HDD boot to that drive? Are you indicating
that
the disk is not recognized at all in the motherboard's BIOS (again, when
connected as the sole HDD in the system)?

Eric wrote...
I tried installing either drive by itself, and neither worked. When I had
only the 120GB drive installed, I figured out how to get into the BIOS,
and
looked at the installed hardware. The drive did not show up in the
primary
IDE list at all. Nothing did. The CD and DVD drives showed up in the
secondary IDE list. The boot settings only allowed selection of either
the
CD or the DVD drives. No HD showed up in the list. I also installed BOTH
drives (original=Master, new=Slave), and neither one showed up in the
BIOS.


"Anna" wrote:
5. Have you tried jumpering the 120 GB HDD as Master (or Single if it's a
WD
disk) in lieu of Cable Select?

Eric wrote...
Yes, I move the jumper for the 120GB drive to the "Master" setting,
plugged
it into the "Master" connector on the IDE cable, and tried booting. I got
the same error message.


"Anna" wrote:
6. Saving the worst for last, it's possible that the ATI disk-cloning
operation went awry in such a way as to cause substantial corruption in
the
source HDD. To the point where the disk becomes an unbootable device.
While
rare in our experience with various versions of the ATI program, we
*have*
encountered that misery more than once. And we could never account for
that
problem.

Eric wrote...
This is only the worst if it means I lose all my data. That would be bad.
I can probably live with having to reload XP from my recovery disks. I'm
just hoping I don't have to because of all the programs, etc. to be
reloaded
also.


7. Since you obviously have another PC at your disposal, is there any
chance
you can install the 120 GB HDD as a *secondary* HDD in that machine to
determine if it's detected by the system and you can access its contents?

Eric wrote...
Unfortunately, I don't have another PC. I'll have to find a friend with
one
and try installing the drive(s) in their PC.


8. Can I assume you've previously used the ATI version you're working
with
for routine disk-cloning purposes? You're reasonably familiar with the
program?

Eric wrote...
This is my first time using the software. It was recommended by a friend
who found it "easy and reliable". I played with its features for a while
before I was comfortable with the approach I took. It seemed to work very
smoothly, although it took a while to finish.


"Anna" wrote:
(Hopefully) there's no chance you might have confused the "source" &
"destination" drives while undertaking the disk-cloning operation, is
there?

Eric wrote...
That is highly unlikely. The graphical display clearly showed the
destination drive having a 13.97GB system partition, and the new drive
having
a proportionally larger system partition.


Eric wrote...
Any suggestions you have in terms of things for me to try will be greatly
appreciated. I have become aware that Acronis provides absolutely no
technical support for their product, unless you're willing to pay much
more
than the product itself cost.

Eric


Eric...
We'll assume that there's no hardware-issue involved here re either HDD (or
any other component) and that your source HDD (the 120 GB one) was
completely bootable/functional at the time you undertook the disk-cloning
operation.

Also that you carried out the disk-cloning operation without error and that
all connections involving the source & destination disks were proper &
secure.

So, if the preceding is correct, something (obviously) went awry with the
disk-cloning operation.

You've got to examine your 120 GB HDD to determine if the drive is at least
detectable by another PC and you can access its contents and as best you can
determine whether it appears the drive contains a bootable, functional OS.
The only practical way to do this is (at the minimum) install it as a
secondary HDD in another machine. I realize this process is not definitive
in terms of determining whether the drive is potentially bootable &
functional, but it's a start.

The disk-cloning program we use nearly exclusively these days is the Casper
5 program. For a variety of reasons which I won't go into here & now we find
it a superior product and generally prefer it to the Acronis True Image
program. On the other hand the ATI v11 program you already have is a sound
program and also highly recommended by many users.

Under ordinary circumstances I would recommend you download/install the
trial version of the Casper 5 program and undertake the disk-cloning
operation with that program. But obviously that's not an option since
there's no way to install the trial version of that program (at least for
the moment) on a non-bootable HDD.

And while you're going through this diagnosis process you may also want to
download the HDD diagnostic utility from the manufacturer of the 120 GB HDD
to verify that the disk is non-defective.

Anyway, keep us informed of your progress and/or developments.
Anna