Need Multimedia Audio Controller for W7 installation

On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 05:54:09 -0400, wrote:

On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 00:46:10 -0500, Char Jackson
wrote:

On Thu, 16 Aug 2018 15:52:01 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 16 Aug 2018 13:10:34 -0500, Char Jackson
wrote:

On Thu, 16 Aug 2018 13:02:37 -0400, Paul wrote:

wrote:
On Thu, 16 Aug 2018 09:03:30 -0400, Paul
wrote:

wrote:
On Thu, 16 Aug 2018 01:58:31 +0100, Patrick
wrote:

On 16/08/2018 01:55, Patrick wrote:
On 15/08/2018 22:41, wrote:
On Fri, 10 Aug 2018 16:59:10 -0400, wrote:

I installed W7 on the antique emachines T3104, and all is fine except
I have no audio. Device Manager says it needs drivers for Multimedia
Audio Controller. Anyone tell me where I can find/download same? I
sure can't find it.
Thanks
J
Hi

Well I found the site with the downloads I wanted:
http://www.emachines.com/ec/en/US/content/drivers.html

This emachine T3104 ran fine then - had both internet and audio once I
installed the drivers, However it was horrendously slow, so I decided
to try XP on it. Now I have reached the point where I can't connect
to the web. All else seems fine. I have tried and tried to
install/reinstall the connection, but I can't find the place wherein I
supply my modem info. I intend to go to a XP group to ask help.

Thanks for helps you guys.
J

Drivers for XP 32 bit only (try all three of the LAN drivers there);
http://www.emachines.com/ec/en/US/content/drivers.html
Sorry, that's the same address you gave, anyway find your model and see
there are 3 LAN drivers there.
Thanks. I had downloaded all the drivers from that support site, and
I think they are all installed okay on the XP SP3 installation. See
my current, but unanswered post on the xp group alt.windows-xp.
Anyway, the XP device manager looks to be fine. I even have audio. I
think what I need is 1-2-3 guidance on how to set up the XP network
setup wizard and/or network connection in control panel so it knows
the name/password of my router. At least that would seem so. That's
what I have done in the past. I can't seem to find/do that. My
old-age dumbness is probably my problem.
Sorry to be a nuisance.
J
You should be able to use a web browser,
to access the router.

Keep the router password written on a PostIT note and
tape the note to the router so it doesn't get lost. That's
the password that gets you into the router.

That's different than the username/password actually
*in* the router setup.

The "address" of the router can be found one of two ways.
It could be the numeric gateway address.

http://192.168.1.1

Or on some routers, there is a symbolic address
mentioned in the user manual for the router. The router
has an address translation for whatever magic word they use
for the symbolic value. So in this example, the router
looks up "router" and gets 192.168.1.1 as the answer.
Each cheesy router brand, uses a different word.

http://router

If you need a further hint, you could always try
"ipconfig" in a Command Prompt window, and the
Default Gateway numeric address could be the address
of the router.

But sometimes it's just better to crack open the router
manual and refresh your memory about "how to get there".

Paul

Hi Paul:

My Verizon router ls cat5-connected (altho it is wireless which I
tried and thought it was too slow), and it came with a sticker
identifier stating the router's wifi name and password. In the past
when I installed W7, W8, or W10, I have had to supply both of those to
the installed OS.

On this XP installation, Device Manager shows the internet drivers are
installed, but when I try Internet Explorer, it hangs because it
cannot find the internet. Ergo I figger I have to use the Control
Panel's Network Setup and/or Network Connection to supply the
aforementioned names, like I did before, but have forgotten how.

This XP's connections are 3-fold and are said to be:
(1) a Broadband WAN miniport said to be My ISP and disconnected
(2) a Internet Gateway said to be a connected internet connection
and (3) a LAN or High-Speed Internet said to be a connected local
area Realtek RTL8139 Family PCI Fast connection

Having said all that then - what do I need to do? I'll write it down
this time!
Thanks again
J

OK, I see a problem with my answer.

My answer assumed a wired connection to the router, and
we were just solving the broadband authentication.

Your questions amounts to "how do I connect the wifi
on my desktop to the router". And the connection could
be using WPA2 and using some sort of key. That's
another step involving authentication.

At some point, this process was called

"Wireless Zero Config"

and WZC took the place of the custom dialogs provided
with the actual Wifi driver for the OS.

1) You need a Wifi driver to start.
Check in Device Manager and see if the WIfi device
is present and it has no yellow marks or anything.

2) Verify that WZC service is running.

https://kb.netgear.com/20021/Enablin...-on-Windows-XP

3) Follow the rest of the instructions to actually use
the Networking panel (now that WZC is running and
the Networking panel can see wifi stuff).

Here's another example, where they work on using a
secure method for the setup. Notice how unlike the
Netgear article, they click Properties and do a bit
more work. A passphrase is used to protect the
connection. This is a passphrase you set on the
router when setting up the Wifi. Or, the ISP put
a long string of random crap on some sort of label
for you to use - that's if you don't remember
writing the passPhrase on a PostIT note earlier
on when setting up the router.

http://www.wi-fiplanet.com/tutorials...ep-by-Step.htm

Just a guess, as I have *no Wifi here at all* to test with.
All I can do is read web pages :-) Oh, and
remember the odd keyword. Keywords are my breadcrumbs.

He mentions that he's connected via Cat5 cable and that wireless was too
slow when he tried it, so I'd focus on the wired connection.

Copied from above:
My Verizon router ls cat5-connected (altho it is wireless which I
tried and thought it was too slow),

He provided the following info on his current connection status:
This XP's connections are 3-fold and are said to be:
(1) a Broadband WAN miniport said to be My ISP and disconnected
(2) a Internet Gateway said to be a connected internet connection
and (3) a LAN or High-Speed Internet said to be a connected local
area Realtek RTL8139 Family PCI Fast connection


If it were me, I'd run "ipconfig /all" in a Command Prompt to see the
current status of everything. I could list and chase 3 dozen possible
situations, but things get narrowed down immensely when you can see the
output of that command.

I'll add one thing, though: assuming the network adapter has a valid IP
address, netmask, and gateway, he can try to ping an address on his LAN
and an address on the Internet. The results of those tests (ipconfig and
two pings) will tell you just about everything you need to know in order
to proceed.

Here is my output of ipconfig /all:
Host Name................................ : main
Primary Dns Suffix.................
Node Type ............................... : Unknown
IP Routing Enabled................ : No
WINS Proxy Enabled ............ : No
DNS Suffix Search List ........ : fios-router.home

Ethernet adapter Local Area Connection:
Connection-specific DNS Suffix : fios-router.home
Description .......................................: Realtek
RTL8139 Family PCI Fast Ethernet NIC
Physical Address .....................: 00-40-CA-A8-8B-A7
Dhcp Enabled ................ : Yes
Autoconfiguration Enabled .. : Yes
IP Address ................................ : 192.168.1.200
Subnet Mask ............................. : 255.255.255.0
Default Gateway ...................... : 192.168.1.1
DHCP Server ............................ : 192.168.1.1
DNS Servers ............................. : 192.168.1.1
Lease Obtained ........................ : Sunday, July 16, 2017
Lease Expires.... ....................... : Monday, July 17,2017

We can see that this XP PC obtained a valid IP address (192.168.1.200)
and a valid subnet mask (255.255.255.0) via DHCP, and that it thinks its
gateway resides at 192.168.1.1.

From this PC, I would have pinged 192.168.1.1 to make sure it responds.
That has to work before you can expect anything else to work, and I
assume it will. Assuming it does, I would ping an IP address on the
Internet. I use 8.8.8.8 simply because it's easy to type. If that also
works, then you have Internet connectivity.

If the 192.168.1.1 ping fails, the problem is local: the XP PC, its
Ethernet cable (check the status LEDs next to the Ethernet port on your
XP PC), or the router/modem.

If the 192.168.1.1 ping is successful but the 8.8.8.8 ping fails, then
the issue lies with your router/modem.
ping 8.8.8.8
You can (and should) run the ping tests from your W10 PC, as well, and
compare the results, but pinging one PC from the other PC introduces
other variables, such as Windows Firewall configs. I'd just keep things
simple until you get it figured out.

I pinged the above 192.168.1.200 from my W10 PC and it found it.
I pinged this W10PC IPV4 Address 192.168.1.155 (taken from ping on
that machine) from the emachine WXP and it did not.

Mean anything?

Could just be that ICMP is disabled on the W10 firewall.


192.168.1.1 worked - 4 packets sent and received.
8.8.8.8 worked - 4 packets sent and received.
216.58.203.133 (gmail.com) - worked - 4 packets sent and received.
both machines. One is WXP, one is W10.

Now what?
Thanks

You've confirmed that both PCs do indeed have Internet access, so that's
good. There are no issues with network drivers or TCP/IP configuration
or the Ethernet cables or the router/modem.

As near as I can tell, the issue seems to be that the browser on your XP
PC doesn't support the HTTPS protocol properly/fully. You could try a
different browser, or possibly try some different websites. Just now, I
tried to find a web site that doesn't use https, but those are becoming
rare. There's been increasing talk lately about certain browsers no
longer supporting XP, but I'm not sure that explanation fits your
situation.

Now that you've confirmed that your networking stack is working
properly, I'll hand you off to folks who are better at troubleshooting
the Layer 7 applications, such as web browsers. Layers 1 thru 4 seem to
be fine.

--

Char Jackson

On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 08:16:12 -0400, wrote:

On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 08:12:53 -0400, wrote:

On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 11:28:20 +0100, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
wrote:

In message ,
writes:
On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 00:46:10 -0500, Char Jackson
wrote:

On Thu, 16 Aug 2018 15:52:01 -0400, wrote:

[]
On 15/08/2018 22:41, wrote:
[]
This emachine T3104 ran fine then - had both internet and
audio once I
installed the drivers, However it was horrendously slow, so
I decided
to try XP on it. Now I have reached the point where I can't connect
to the web. All else seems fine. I have tried and tried to
install/reinstall the connection, but I can't find the place
[]
I pinged the above 192.168.1.200 from my W10 PC and it found it.
I pinged this W10PC IPV4 Address 192.168.1.155 (taken from ping on
that machine) from the emachine WXP and it did not.

Mean anything?

Could just be that ICMP is disabled on the W10 firewall.


192.168.1.1 worked - 4 packets sent and received.
8.8.8.8 worked - 4 packets sent and received.
216.58.203.133 (gmail.com) - worked - 4 packets sent and received.
both machines. One is WXP, one is W10.

Now what?
Thanks
J

That's weird! Sounds like you have a connection. (Did you ping gmail.com
using its name, or did you specify its numerical IP address?)
numerical
J


Be sure to check that your DNS is working properly by pinging a site by
its name rather than its IP address.

--

Char Jackson

wrote:
On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 11:28:20 +0100, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
wrote:

In message ,
writes:
On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 00:46:10 -0500, Char Jackson
wrote:

On Thu, 16 Aug 2018 15:52:01 -0400, wrote:

[]
On 15/08/2018 22:41, wrote:
[]
This emachine T3104 ran fine then - had both internet and
audio once I
installed the drivers, However it was horrendously slow, so
I decided
to try XP on it. Now I have reached the point where I can't connect
to the web. All else seems fine. I have tried and tried to
install/reinstall the connection, but I can't find the place
[]
I pinged the above 192.168.1.200 from my W10 PC and it found it.
I pinged this W10PC IPV4 Address 192.168.1.155 (taken from ping on
that machine) from the emachine WXP and it did not.

Mean anything?
Could just be that ICMP is disabled on the W10 firewall.

192.168.1.1 worked - 4 packets sent and received.
8.8.8.8 worked - 4 packets sent and received.
216.58.203.133 (gmail.com) - worked - 4 packets sent and received.
both machines. One is WXP, one is W10.

Now what?
Thanks
J
That's weird! Sounds like you have a connection. (Did you ping gmail.com
using its name, or did you specify its numerical IP address?) Maybe
something about the browser setup.

If you put http://216.58.203.133/ into the browser, do you get anything?


I get:

There is a problem with this website's security certificate

It recommended not going to it.
but I did anyway.
It went into a network diagnostic wherein it checked connectivity
wherein it said:

windows cannot conect to the internet using HTTP, HTTPS, or FTP.
Probably caused by firewall settings. Check firewall settings to the
HTTP port (80), HTTPS port (443) and FTP port (21).

I dunno how to do that. I will try.,

I do see errors in the Network Diagnostic under connectivity:
HTTP Successfully connected to www.microsoft.com
HTTPS Error 12157 an error occurred in the secure channel support
FTP(Active) Error 12029 connecting to ftp.microsoft.com A
connection with the server could not be established.
Could not make an HTTPS connection
Could not make an FTP connection
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!

Ohboy!
J


Are you running that diagnostic from WinXP ?

What were you expecting exactly ?

*******

Of course HTTP worked successfully. There's no crypto
involved with that test case.

HTTPS has many variables, including certificates
and crypto choices for the connection. WinXP certificate
store might not be the same as other OSes. It's
easy to fail this test.

And ftp.microsoft.com is still running ???
The last time I tested that, it was borked.
Whether PASV or not.

In summary, your test shows you can reach the
Internet. The other test cases are inconclusive.
Maybe ten years ago, I would be more concerned
about the results. Today, that result is "normal"
for some values of "broken or borked" Internet.
You expect stuff like that to happen in 2018.

*******

If the only node you can't ping is the other
computer, then you have a NAT router in the
picture you're not telling us about.

Verify the wiring used on the two computers
and the router. And make sure there aren't
more networking boxes you aren't telling us
about.

I can just smell a complicated networking
setup in that room... Start tracing the wires.

Paul

On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 12:31:28 -0400, Paul wrote:

wrote:
On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 11:28:20 +0100, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
wrote:

In message ,
writes:
On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 00:46:10 -0500, Char Jackson
wrote:

On Thu, 16 Aug 2018 15:52:01 -0400, wrote:

[]
On 15/08/2018 22:41, wrote:
[]
This emachine T3104 ran fine then - had both internet and
audio once I
installed the drivers, However it was horrendously slow, so
I decided
to try XP on it. Now I have reached the point where I can't connect
to the web. All else seems fine. I have tried and tried to
install/reinstall the connection, but I can't find the place
[]
I pinged the above 192.168.1.200 from my W10 PC and it found it.
I pinged this W10PC IPV4 Address 192.168.1.155 (taken from ping on
that machine) from the emachine WXP and it did not.

Mean anything?
Could just be that ICMP is disabled on the W10 firewall.

192.168.1.1 worked - 4 packets sent and received.
8.8.8.8 worked - 4 packets sent and received.
216.58.203.133 (gmail.com) - worked - 4 packets sent and received.
both machines. One is WXP, one is W10.

Now what?
Thanks
J
That's weird! Sounds like you have a connection. (Did you ping gmail.com
using its name, or did you specify its numerical IP address?) Maybe
something about the browser setup.

If you put http://216.58.203.133/ into the browser, do you get anything?


I get:

There is a problem with this website's security certificate

It recommended not going to it.
but I did anyway.
It went into a network diagnostic wherein it checked connectivity
wherein it said:

windows cannot conect to the internet using HTTP, HTTPS, or FTP.
Probably caused by firewall settings. Check firewall settings to the
HTTP port (80), HTTPS port (443) and FTP port (21).

I dunno how to do that. I will try.,

I do see errors in the Network Diagnostic under connectivity:
HTTP Successfully connected to www.microsoft.com
HTTPS Error 12157 an error occurred in the secure channel support
FTP(Active) Error 12029 connecting to ftp.microsoft.com A
connection with the server could not be established.
Could not make an HTTPS connection
Could not make an FTP connection
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!

Ohboy!
J


Are you running that diagnostic from WinXP ?

What were you expecting exactly ?

*******

Of course HTTP worked successfully. There's no crypto
involved with that test case.

HTTPS has many variables, including certificates
and crypto choices for the connection. WinXP certificate
store might not be the same as other OSes. It's
easy to fail this test.

And ftp.microsoft.com is still running ???
The last time I tested that, it was borked.
Whether PASV or not.

In summary, your test shows you can reach the
Internet. The other test cases are inconclusive.
Maybe ten years ago, I would be more concerned
about the results. Today, that result is "normal"
for some values of "broken or borked" Internet.
You expect stuff like that to happen in 2018.

*******

If the only node you can't ping is the other
computer, then you have a NAT router in the
picture you're not telling us about.

??? More likely it's just a case of inbound ICMP being disabled on the
Win10 firewall. He can ping _from_ Win10, but not _to_ it. That smells
like a firewall configuration. IIRC, when I created a couple of Win10
VMs here a while back, they defaulted to inbound ICMP being disabled, so
it's probably a default setting.

Verify the wiring used on the two computers
and the router. And make sure there aren't
more networking boxes you aren't telling us
about.

I can just smell a complicated networking
setup in that room... Start tracing the wires.

I'll be surprised if that's the case. So far, his network setup appears
to be plain jane vanilla - two PCs connected to a combo router/modem
box. The two PCs are essentially connected to each other via the
embedded switch in the combo unit. It doesn't get much simpler than
that. I do agree, though, if somehow that's not the case, (although I've
seen no evidence), he should say so.

--

Char Jackson

On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 10:00:22 -0500, Char Jackson
wrote:

On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 08:16:12 -0400, wrote:

On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 08:12:53 -0400, wrote:

On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 11:28:20 +0100, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
wrote:

In message ,
writes:
On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 00:46:10 -0500, Char Jackson
wrote:

On Thu, 16 Aug 2018 15:52:01 -0400, wrote:

[]
On 15/08/2018 22:41, wrote:
[]
This emachine T3104 ran fine then - had both internet and
audio once I
installed the drivers, However it was horrendously slow, so
I decided
to try XP on it. Now I have reached the point where I can't connect
to the web. All else seems fine. I have tried and tried to
install/reinstall the connection, but I can't find the place
[]
I pinged the above 192.168.1.200 from my W10 PC and it found it.
I pinged this W10PC IPV4 Address 192.168.1.155 (taken from ping on
that machine) from the emachine WXP and it did not.

Mean anything?

Could just be that ICMP is disabled on the W10 firewall.


192.168.1.1 worked - 4 packets sent and received.
8.8.8.8 worked - 4 packets sent and received.
216.58.203.133 (gmail.com) - worked - 4 packets sent and received.
both machines. One is WXP, one is W10.

Now what?
Thanks
J

That's weird! Sounds like you have a connection. (Did you ping gmail.com
using its name, or did you specify its numerical IP address?)
numerical
J


Be sure to check that your DNS is working properly by pinging a site by
its name rather than its IP address.

Sorry I have not replied. Had to take wifey to doc.

on w10 PC:
ping gmail.com worked fine (got IP add for gmail,com = 74.208.232.28)

on XP PC:
ping gmail.com worked too (got IP add for gmail,com = 172.217.15.69))
Thanks
J

On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 12:31:28 -0400, Paul
wrote:

wrote:
On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 11:28:20 +0100, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
wrote:

In message ,
writes:
On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 00:46:10 -0500, Char Jackson
wrote:

On Thu, 16 Aug 2018 15:52:01 -0400, wrote:

[]
On 15/08/2018 22:41, wrote:
[]
This emachine T3104 ran fine then - had both internet and
audio once I
installed the drivers, However it was horrendously slow, so
I decided
to try XP on it. Now I have reached the point where I can't connect
to the web. All else seems fine. I have tried and tried to
install/reinstall the connection, but I can't find the place
[]
I pinged the above 192.168.1.200 from my W10 PC and it found it.
I pinged this W10PC IPV4 Address 192.168.1.155 (taken from ping on
that machine) from the emachine WXP and it did not.

Mean anything?
Could just be that ICMP is disabled on the W10 firewall.

192.168.1.1 worked - 4 packets sent and received.
8.8.8.8 worked - 4 packets sent and received.
216.58.203.133 (gmail.com) - worked - 4 packets sent and received.
both machines. One is WXP, one is W10.

Now what?
Thanks
J
That's weird! Sounds like you have a connection. (Did you ping gmail.com
using its name, or did you specify its numerical IP address?) Maybe
something about the browser setup.

If you put http://216.58.203.133/ into the browser, do you get anything?


I get:

There is a problem with this website's security certificate

It recommended not going to it.
but I did anyway.
It went into a network diagnostic wherein it checked connectivity
wherein it said:

windows cannot conect to the internet using HTTP, HTTPS, or FTP.
Probably caused by firewall settings. Check firewall settings to the
HTTP port (80), HTTPS port (443) and FTP port (21).

I dunno how to do that. I will try.,

I do see errors in the Network Diagnostic under connectivity:
HTTP Successfully connected to www.microsoft.com
HTTPS Error 12157 an error occurred in the secure channel support
FTP(Active) Error 12029 connecting to ftp.microsoft.com A
connection with the server could not be established.
Could not make an HTTPS connection
Could not make an FTP connection
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!

Ohboy!
J


Are you running that diagnostic from WinXP ?

Yes - the problem emachine xp pc.

What were you expecting exactly ?

dunno.


*******

Of course HTTP worked successfully. There's no crypto
involved with that test case.

HTTPS has many variables, including certificates
and crypto choices for the connection. WinXP certificate
store might not be the same as other OSes. It's
easy to fail this test.

And ftp.microsoft.com is still running ???
The last time I tested that, it was borked.
Whether PASV or not.

In summary, your test shows you can reach the
Internet. The other test cases are inconclusive.
Maybe ten years ago, I would be more concerned
about the results. Today, that result is "normal"
for some values of "broken or borked" Internet.
You expect stuff like that to happen in 2018.

*******

If the only node you can't ping is the other
computer, then you have a NAT router in the
picture you're not telling us about.

Verify the wiring used on the two computers
and the router. And make sure there aren't
more networking boxes you aren't telling us
about.

I have a single Verizon router cat5-wired to two computers and to
wireless AIO and laser printers, I have a remote laptop that at least
used to print on either printer. Wud have been wireless of course.
Have not printed from it in years. The printers are also direct-wired
USB to the xp10 pc and they work nicely.


I can just smell a complicated networking
setup in that room... Start tracing the wires.

Paul

I will double check wiring tho. Maybe there is something amiss there
fho.
But remember now. Earlier I said I did have W7 installed on the
emachine and internet worked fine - just too too too slow. When I
changed the emachine to xp, I did not change any wires. That's when
the problem started. Really I didn't.
Thanks
J

On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 12:37:19 -0500, Char Jackson
wrote:

On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 12:31:28 -0400, Paul wrote:

wrote:
On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 11:28:20 +0100, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
wrote:

In message ,
writes:
On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 00:46:10 -0500, Char Jackson
wrote:

On Thu, 16 Aug 2018 15:52:01 -0400, wrote:

[]
On 15/08/2018 22:41, wrote:
[]
This emachine T3104 ran fine then - had both internet and
audio once I
installed the drivers, However it was horrendously slow, so
I decided
to try XP on it. Now I have reached the point where I can't connect
to the web. All else seems fine. I have tried and tried to
install/reinstall the connection, but I can't find the place
[]
I pinged the above 192.168.1.200 from my W10 PC and it found it.
I pinged this W10PC IPV4 Address 192.168.1.155 (taken from ping on
that machine) from the emachine WXP and it did not.

Mean anything?
Could just be that ICMP is disabled on the W10 firewall.

192.168.1.1 worked - 4 packets sent and received.
8.8.8.8 worked - 4 packets sent and received.
216.58.203.133 (gmail.com) - worked - 4 packets sent and received.
both machines. One is WXP, one is W10.

Now what?
Thanks
J
That's weird! Sounds like you have a connection. (Did you ping gmail.com
using its name, or did you specify its numerical IP address?) Maybe
something about the browser setup.

If you put http://216.58.203.133/ into the browser, do you get anything?


I get:

There is a problem with this website's security certificate

It recommended not going to it.
but I did anyway.
It went into a network diagnostic wherein it checked connectivity
wherein it said:

windows cannot conect to the internet using HTTP, HTTPS, or FTP.
Probably caused by firewall settings. Check firewall settings to the
HTTP port (80), HTTPS port (443) and FTP port (21).

I dunno how to do that. I will try.,

I do see errors in the Network Diagnostic under connectivity:
HTTP Successfully connected to www.microsoft.com
HTTPS Error 12157 an error occurred in the secure channel support
FTP(Active) Error 12029 connecting to ftp.microsoft.com A
connection with the server could not be established.
Could not make an HTTPS connection
Could not make an FTP connection
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!

Ohboy!
J


Are you running that diagnostic from WinXP ?

What were you expecting exactly ?

*******

Of course HTTP worked successfully. There's no crypto
involved with that test case.

HTTPS has many variables, including certificates
and crypto choices for the connection. WinXP certificate
store might not be the same as other OSes. It's
easy to fail this test.

And ftp.microsoft.com is still running ???
The last time I tested that, it was borked.
Whether PASV or not.

In summary, your test shows you can reach the
Internet. The other test cases are inconclusive.
Maybe ten years ago, I would be more concerned
about the results. Today, that result is "normal"
for some values of "broken or borked" Internet.
You expect stuff like that to happen in 2018.

*******

If the only node you can't ping is the other
computer, then you have a NAT router in the
picture you're not telling us about.

??? More likely it's just a case of inbound ICMP being disabled on the
Win10 firewall. He can ping _from_ Win10, but not _to_ it. That smells
like a firewall configuration. IIRC, when I created a couple of Win10
VMs here a while back, they defaulted to inbound ICMP being disabled, so
it's probably a default setting.

Verify the wiring used on the two computers
and the router. And make sure there aren't
more networking boxes you aren't telling us
about.

I can just smell a complicated networking
setup in that room... Start tracing the wires.

I'll be surprised if that's the case. So far, his network setup appears
to be plain jane vanilla - two PCs connected to a combo router/modem
box. The two PCs are essentially connected to each other via the
embedded switch in the combo unit. It doesn't get much simpler than
that. I do agree, though, if somehow that's not the case, (although I've
seen no evidence), he should say so.

As I think I have said, and as I sit here pondering - that is true.
Simple. Right now I have two pc's cat5-connected to the only router
I have )Verizon), One has w10 and works and still does. The other
now has XP and used to have w7 and now fails. The remote laptop I
just mentioned is in another room and is off.

Maybe I shud turn this w10 pc off and retest the xp machine? Can't
talk to u then.
J

Char Jackson wrote:


I'll be surprised if that's the case. So far, his network setup appears
to be plain jane vanilla - two PCs connected to a combo router/modem
box. The two PCs are essentially connected to each other via the
embedded switch in the combo unit. It doesn't get much simpler than
that. I do agree, though, if somehow that's not the case, (although I've
seen no evidence), he should say so.

I did a ping test from the WinXP setup
to the Win10 setup, and had no problem
getting a response.

*******

If you want file sharing to work between WinXP
and Win10, the Win10 needs SMBV1 installed.

Both machines have to belong to the same Workgroup.
The System control panel may give you access to that.

To access Control Panels:

Right-Click Start : Run : control.exe

(The Control Panels icon can be "pinned" to the Task Bar for later)

Then open "Programs and Features" control panel.
Use the Windows Features tab.

There should be two SMB packages to install in there.
An SMBV1 client and an SMBV1 server. Older versions
of Win10 have three tick boxes, and simply read the
values to figure out whether you want them or not.

Those are the only easy tricks I know of right off
hand. If Homegroup services were interacting poorly
with File Sharing, that's a whole research project to
track down an answer. There were still complaints
after Homegroups were deprecated, that indicated not
all was well there.

*******

This program can list machines on your network,
and may be able to point out Workgroup mis-configurations.

http://www.unixwiz.net/tools/nbtscan.html

http://www.unixwiz.net/tools/nbtscan-1.0.35.exe

Change the filename to something a bit shorter,
and just run the portable EXE. It doesn't need to
install or anything. The number on the end, indicates
it's to examine a 32-24 = 8 bits worth of computers,
or about 2^8 or 256 addresses.

nbtscan 192.168.1.0/24

The output looks like this

192.168.1.2 WORKGROUP\Phobos SHARING
192.168.1.3 MSHOME\Deimos SHARING

And what that example tells you, is the two machines aren't
on the same Workgroup=WORKGROUP choice. The OS may
select "MSHOME" automatically if you're using
the HomeGroup concept.

If the output comes back like this, sharing should work.
(Well, as well as it ever works, plus or minus hair loss.)

192.168.1.2 WORKGROUP\Phobos SHARING
192.168.1.3 WORKGROUP\Deimos SHARING

Paul

On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 18:12:31 -0400, Paul
wrote:

Char Jackson wrote:


I'll be surprised if that's the case. So far, his network setup appears
to be plain jane vanilla - two PCs connected to a combo router/modem
box. The two PCs are essentially connected to each other via the
embedded switch in the combo unit. It doesn't get much simpler than
that. I do agree, though, if somehow that's not the case, (although I've
seen no evidence), he should say so.

I did a ping test from the WinXP setup
to the Win10 setup, and had no problem
getting a response.

*******

If you want file sharing to work between WinXP
and Win10, the Win10 needs SMBV1 installed.

Both machines have to belong to the same Workgroup.
The System control panel may give you access to that.

To access Control Panels:

Right-Click Start : Run : control.exe

(The Control Panels icon can be "pinned" to the Task Bar for later)

Then open "Programs and Features" control panel.
Use the Windows Features tab.

There should be two SMB packages to install in there.
An SMBV1 client and an SMBV1 server. Older versions
of Win10 have three tick boxes, and simply read the
values to figure out whether you want them or not.

Those are the only easy tricks I know of right off
hand. If Homegroup services were interacting poorly
with File Sharing, that's a whole research project to
track down an answer. There were still complaints
after Homegroups were deprecated, that indicated not
all was well there.

*******

This program can list machines on your network,
and may be able to point out Workgroup mis-configurations.

http://www.unixwiz.net/tools/nbtscan.html

http://www.unixwiz.net/tools/nbtscan-1.0.35.exe

Change the filename to something a bit shorter,
and just run the portable EXE. It doesn't need to
install or anything. The number on the end, indicates
it's to examine a 32-24 = 8 bits worth of computers,
or about 2^8 or 256 addresses.

nbtscan 192.168.1.0/24

The output looks like this

192.168.1.2 WORKGROUP\Phobos SHARING
192.168.1.3 MSHOME\Deimos SHARING

And what that example tells you, is the two machines aren't
on the same Workgroup=WORKGROUP choice. The OS may
select "MSHOME" automatically if you're using
the HomeGroup concept.

If the output comes back like this, sharing should work.
(Well, as well as it ever works, plus or minus hair loss.)

192.168.1.2 WORKGROUP\Phobos SHARING
192.168.1.3 WORKGROUP\Deimos SHARING

Paul
Thanks Paul
I'll save all this for later. I am nowhere need being able to share
these two pcs. My need to be able to access the internet on the XP pc
is a basic need that I have to solve first. Until that works, nothing
else in this area will.
J
J

wrote:
On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 18:12:31 -0400, Paul
wrote:

Char Jackson wrote:

I'll be surprised if that's the case. So far, his network setup appears
to be plain jane vanilla - two PCs connected to a combo router/modem
box. The two PCs are essentially connected to each other via the
embedded switch in the combo unit. It doesn't get much simpler than
that. I do agree, though, if somehow that's not the case, (although I've
seen no evidence), he should say so.
I did a ping test from the WinXP setup
to the Win10 setup, and had no problem
getting a response.

*******

If you want file sharing to work between WinXP
and Win10, the Win10 needs SMBV1 installed.

Both machines have to belong to the same Workgroup.
The System control panel may give you access to that.

To access Control Panels:

Right-Click Start : Run : control.exe

(The Control Panels icon can be "pinned" to the Task Bar for later)

Then open "Programs and Features" control panel.
Use the Windows Features tab.

There should be two SMB packages to install in there.
An SMBV1 client and an SMBV1 server. Older versions
of Win10 have three tick boxes, and simply read the
values to figure out whether you want them or not.

Those are the only easy tricks I know of right off
hand. If Homegroup services were interacting poorly
with File Sharing, that's a whole research project to
track down an answer. There were still complaints
after Homegroups were deprecated, that indicated not
all was well there.

*******

This program can list machines on your network,
and may be able to point out Workgroup mis-configurations.

http://www.unixwiz.net/tools/nbtscan.html

http://www.unixwiz.net/tools/nbtscan-1.0.35.exe

Change the filename to something a bit shorter,
and just run the portable EXE. It doesn't need to
install or anything. The number on the end, indicates
it's to examine a 32-24 = 8 bits worth of computers,
or about 2^8 or 256 addresses.

nbtscan 192.168.1.0/24

The output looks like this

192.168.1.2 WORKGROUP\Phobos SHARING
192.168.1.3 MSHOME\Deimos SHARING

And what that example tells you, is the two machines aren't
on the same Workgroup=WORKGROUP choice. The OS may
select "MSHOME" automatically if you're using
the HomeGroup concept.

If the output comes back like this, sharing should work.
(Well, as well as it ever works, plus or minus hair loss.)

192.168.1.2 WORKGROUP\Phobos SHARING
192.168.1.3 WORKGROUP\Deimos SHARING

Paul
Thanks Paul
I'll save all this for later. I am nowhere need being able to share
these two pcs. My need to be able to access the internet on the XP pc
is a basic need that I have to solve first. Until that works, nothing
else in this area will.
J

True, but some of these tests involve things
other than ICMP.

Paul

On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 16:48:08 -0400, wrote:

On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 12:37:19 -0500, Char Jackson
wrote:

On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 12:31:28 -0400, Paul wrote:

wrote:
On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 11:28:20 +0100, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
wrote:

In message ,
writes:
On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 00:46:10 -0500, Char Jackson
wrote:

On Thu, 16 Aug 2018 15:52:01 -0400, wrote:

[]
On 15/08/2018 22:41, wrote:
[]
This emachine T3104 ran fine then - had both internet and
audio once I
installed the drivers, However it was horrendously slow, so
I decided
to try XP on it. Now I have reached the point where I can't connect
to the web. All else seems fine. I have tried and tried to
install/reinstall the connection, but I can't find the place
[]
I pinged the above 192.168.1.200 from my W10 PC and it found it.
I pinged this W10PC IPV4 Address 192.168.1.155 (taken from ping on
that machine) from the emachine WXP and it did not.

Mean anything?
Could just be that ICMP is disabled on the W10 firewall.

192.168.1.1 worked - 4 packets sent and received.
8.8.8.8 worked - 4 packets sent and received.
216.58.203.133 (gmail.com) - worked - 4 packets sent and received.
both machines. One is WXP, one is W10.

Now what?
Thanks
J
That's weird! Sounds like you have a connection. (Did you ping gmail.com
using its name, or did you specify its numerical IP address?) Maybe
something about the browser setup.

If you put http://216.58.203.133/ into the browser, do you get anything?


I get:

There is a problem with this website's security certificate

It recommended not going to it.
but I did anyway.
It went into a network diagnostic wherein it checked connectivity
wherein it said:

windows cannot conect to the internet using HTTP, HTTPS, or FTP.
Probably caused by firewall settings. Check firewall settings to the
HTTP port (80), HTTPS port (443) and FTP port (21).

I dunno how to do that. I will try.,

I do see errors in the Network Diagnostic under connectivity:
HTTP Successfully connected to www.microsoft.com
HTTPS Error 12157 an error occurred in the secure channel support
FTP(Active) Error 12029 connecting to ftp.microsoft.com A
connection with the server could not be established.
Could not make an HTTPS connection
Could not make an FTP connection
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!

Ohboy!
J


Are you running that diagnostic from WinXP ?

What were you expecting exactly ?

*******

Of course HTTP worked successfully. There's no crypto
involved with that test case.

HTTPS has many variables, including certificates
and crypto choices for the connection. WinXP certificate
store might not be the same as other OSes. It's
easy to fail this test.

And ftp.microsoft.com is still running ???
The last time I tested that, it was borked.
Whether PASV or not.

In summary, your test shows you can reach the
Internet. The other test cases are inconclusive.
Maybe ten years ago, I would be more concerned
about the results. Today, that result is "normal"
for some values of "broken or borked" Internet.
You expect stuff like that to happen in 2018.

*******

If the only node you can't ping is the other
computer, then you have a NAT router in the
picture you're not telling us about.

??? More likely it's just a case of inbound ICMP being disabled on the
Win10 firewall. He can ping _from_ Win10, but not _to_ it. That smells
like a firewall configuration. IIRC, when I created a couple of Win10
VMs here a while back, they defaulted to inbound ICMP being disabled, so
it's probably a default setting.

Verify the wiring used on the two computers
and the router. And make sure there aren't
more networking boxes you aren't telling us
about.

I can just smell a complicated networking
setup in that room... Start tracing the wires.

I'll be surprised if that's the case. So far, his network setup appears
to be plain jane vanilla - two PCs connected to a combo router/modem
box. The two PCs are essentially connected to each other via the
embedded switch in the combo unit. It doesn't get much simpler than
that. I do agree, though, if somehow that's not the case, (although I've
seen no evidence), he should say so.

As I think I have said, and as I sit here pondering - that is true.
Simple. Right now I have two pc's cat5-connected to the only router
I have )Verizon), One has w10 and works and still does. The other
now has XP and used to have w7 and now fails. The remote laptop I
just mentioned is in another room and is off.

Maybe I shud turn this w10 pc off and retest the xp machine? Can't
talk to u then.

No need to do that specific test. The W10 PC is not affecting the
results.

As a test, I fired up a WinXP virtual machine, bone stock with IE 6.0,
and tried to access a few https sites. Some loaded, others loaded
partially, and some failed completely with an error saying:

The page cannot be displayed
lots of semi-helpful text snipped
Cannot find server or DNS Error

The above was from https://www.cnn.com, and note that the last line
about not being able to find the server or getting a DNS error is
completely incorrect. It's just the browser being stupid.

One of the suggestions was to check IE's Security settings, specifically
suggesting that I enable TLS 1.0. When I did that, the error changed to:

CNN.com does not support this browser
To continue using CNN.com, you need to update your web browser or use
a different one.

If that's the same issue you're seeing, it should make perfect sense why
it's not working.

The good news, again, is that you don't have a basic networking issue.
Your IP address is fine, your netmask is fine, the gateway and your
connection to it is fine, your DNS is fine, etc. It's just an old,
unsupported, browser mucking things up.


--

Char Jackson

On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 16:39:19 -0400, wrote:

On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 12:31:28 -0400, Paul
wrote:

wrote:
On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 11:28:20 +0100, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
wrote:

In message ,
writes:
On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 00:46:10 -0500, Char Jackson
wrote:

On Thu, 16 Aug 2018 15:52:01 -0400, wrote:

[]
On 15/08/2018 22:41, wrote:
[]
This emachine T3104 ran fine then - had both internet and
audio once I
installed the drivers, However it was horrendously slow, so
I decided
to try XP on it. Now I have reached the point where I can't connect
to the web. All else seems fine. I have tried and tried to
install/reinstall the connection, but I can't find the place
[]
I pinged the above 192.168.1.200 from my W10 PC and it found it.
I pinged this W10PC IPV4 Address 192.168.1.155 (taken from ping on
that machine) from the emachine WXP and it did not.

Mean anything?
Could just be that ICMP is disabled on the W10 firewall.

192.168.1.1 worked - 4 packets sent and received.
8.8.8.8 worked - 4 packets sent and received.
216.58.203.133 (gmail.com) - worked - 4 packets sent and received.
both machines. One is WXP, one is W10.

Now what?
Thanks
J
That's weird! Sounds like you have a connection. (Did you ping gmail.com
using its name, or did you specify its numerical IP address?) Maybe
something about the browser setup.

If you put http://216.58.203.133/ into the browser, do you get anything?


I get:

There is a problem with this website's security certificate

It recommended not going to it.
but I did anyway.
It went into a network diagnostic wherein it checked connectivity
wherein it said:

windows cannot conect to the internet using HTTP, HTTPS, or FTP.
Probably caused by firewall settings. Check firewall settings to the
HTTP port (80), HTTPS port (443) and FTP port (21).

I dunno how to do that. I will try.,

I do see errors in the Network Diagnostic under connectivity:
HTTP Successfully connected to www.microsoft.com
HTTPS Error 12157 an error occurred in the secure channel support
FTP(Active) Error 12029 connecting to ftp.microsoft.com A
connection with the server could not be established.
Could not make an HTTPS connection
Could not make an FTP connection
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!

Ohboy!
J


Are you running that diagnostic from WinXP ?

Yes - the problem emachine xp pc.

What were you expecting exactly ?

dunno.


*******

Of course HTTP worked successfully. There's no crypto
involved with that test case.

HTTPS has many variables, including certificates
and crypto choices for the connection. WinXP certificate
store might not be the same as other OSes. It's
easy to fail this test.

And ftp.microsoft.com is still running ???
The last time I tested that, it was borked.
Whether PASV or not.

In summary, your test shows you can reach the
Internet. The other test cases are inconclusive.
Maybe ten years ago, I would be more concerned
about the results. Today, that result is "normal"
for some values of "broken or borked" Internet.
You expect stuff like that to happen in 2018.

*******

If the only node you can't ping is the other
computer, then you have a NAT router in the
picture you're not telling us about.

Verify the wiring used on the two computers
and the router. And make sure there aren't
more networking boxes you aren't telling us
about.

I have a single Verizon router cat5-wired to two computers and to
wireless AIO and laser printers, I have a remote laptop that at least
used to print on either printer. Wud have been wireless of course.
Have not printed from it in years. The printers are also direct-wired
USB to the xp10 pc and they work nicely.


I can just smell a complicated networking
setup in that room... Start tracing the wires.

Paul

I will double check wiring tho. Maybe there is something amiss there
fho.
But remember now. Earlier I said I did have W7 installed on the
emachine and internet worked fine - just too too too slow. When I
changed the emachine to xp, I did not change any wires. That's when
the problem started. Really I didn't.

Your tests have already confirmed that your network wiring is fine.
Don't spend too much time looking at that.


--

Char Jackson

On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 16:14:53 -0400, wrote:

On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 10:00:22 -0500, Char Jackson
wrote:

On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 08:16:12 -0400, wrote:

On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 08:12:53 -0400, wrote:

On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 11:28:20 +0100, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
wrote:

In message ,
writes:
On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 00:46:10 -0500, Char Jackson
wrote:

On Thu, 16 Aug 2018 15:52:01 -0400, wrote:

[]
On 15/08/2018 22:41, wrote:
[]
This emachine T3104 ran fine then - had both internet and
audio once I
installed the drivers, However it was horrendously slow, so
I decided
to try XP on it. Now I have reached the point where I can't connect
to the web. All else seems fine. I have tried and tried to
install/reinstall the connection, but I can't find the place
[]
I pinged the above 192.168.1.200 from my W10 PC and it found it.
I pinged this W10PC IPV4 Address 192.168.1.155 (taken from ping on
that machine) from the emachine WXP and it did not.

Mean anything?

Could just be that ICMP is disabled on the W10 firewall.


192.168.1.1 worked - 4 packets sent and received.
8.8.8.8 worked - 4 packets sent and received.
216.58.203.133 (gmail.com) - worked - 4 packets sent and received.
both machines. One is WXP, one is W10.

Now what?
Thanks
J

That's weird! Sounds like you have a connection. (Did you ping gmail.com
using its name, or did you specify its numerical IP address?)
numerical
J


Be sure to check that your DNS is working properly by pinging a site by
its name rather than its IP address.

Sorry I have not replied. Had to take wifey to doc.

on w10 PC:
ping gmail.com worked fine (got IP add for gmail,com = 74.208.232.28)

on XP PC:
ping gmail.com worked too (got IP add for gmail,com = 172.217.15.69))

Cool, DNS works. From a networking perspective, you're golden!

--

Char Jackson

In message , Char Jackson
writes:
On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 16:14:53 -0400, wrote:
[]
on w10 PC:
ping gmail.com worked fine (got IP add for gmail,com = 74.208.232.28)

on XP PC:
ping gmail.com worked too (got IP add for gmail,com = 172.217.15.69))

Cool, DNS works. From a networking perspective, you're golden!

But why did he get different IP addresses?
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Intelligence isn't complete without the full picture and the full picture is
all about doubt. Otherwise, you go the way of George Bush. - baroness Eliza
Manningham-Buller (former head of MI5), Radio Times 3-9 September 2011.

On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 18:12:31 -0400, Paul wrote:

Char Jackson wrote:


I'll be surprised if that's the case. So far, his network setup appears
to be plain jane vanilla - two PCs connected to a combo router/modem
box. The two PCs are essentially connected to each other via the
embedded switch in the combo unit. It doesn't get much simpler than
that. I do agree, though, if somehow that's not the case, (although I've
seen no evidence), he should say so.

Johnny has since responded, confirming that he only has a plain vanilla
network setup, as I suspected.

I did a ping test from the WinXP setup
to the Win10 setup, and had no problem
getting a response.

On my Win10 VM images, inbound ICMP was disabled by default. I need
that, so I enabled it. I'm not sure why yours was already enabled, but
it could just be version differences. It's not like Win10 has a stable
feature set or anything.

If you want file sharing to work between WinXP
and Win10, the Win10 needs SMBV1 installed.

Was he asking for file sharing? I missed that, but I agree, XP only
supports SMB v1.0, so Win10 would need to have SMB v1.0 enabled. On
Win8.1 it's in Windows Features. I don't have Win10 running at the
moment so I can't see if it's different. On 10, it may need to be
installed and enabled, versus simply enabling.

Both machines have to belong to the same Workgroup.

Workgroup settings affect a user's ability to browse to a specific
network share, but they have no effect on actual sharing. If you know
the IP address and the share name of the network resource, you can
connect to it directly, without regard for any workgroup name. If you
don't know the share name but you know the IP address, you can request a
list of available shares from the remote PC, then just pick one and use
it, optionally mapping it to a drive letter for easier subsequent
access.

My various physical and virtual PCs have different workgroup names and I
share just fine across XP, 7, 8.1, and 10.


--

Char Jackson