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#61
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No email on W-7
On 6/19/12 4:22 PM, Gene Wirchenko wrote:
GUIs are so much more intuitive than CLIs. cough, cough I never bought that argument. Methinks the biggest problem with the "GUI is more intuitive" is what one person finds intuitive is not intuitive to another. -- Ken Mac OS X 10.6.8 Firefox 12.0 Thunderbird 12.0.1 LibreOffice 3.5.2.2 |
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#62
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No email on W-7
Gene E. Bloch wrote:
Sam Hill wrote: Ken Blake wrote: RH Breener wrote: Bruce Hagen wrote: FYI: Outlook does not do news. OK, then I would not be interested at all. Your choice, of course, and I'm not trying to talk you into anything, but I never understand why anyone insists on using the same program for e-mail and newsgroups. I don't at all mind having two programs, one for each use, and in some ways I ever prefer it--for example, I can have both open at once. Using separate applications removes you from the possibility of sending a private email to a newsgroup. Not quite. Both of the newsreaders that are currently set up here will let me reply to a Usenet post via e-mail. So would mine -- if I set up an email account within its settings. I don't, of course. I usually don't click the wrong button :-) Attaboy! |
#63
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No email on W-7
On Wed, 20 Jun 2012 00:05:24 +0000 (UTC), Sam Hill wrote:
Gene E. Bloch wrote: Sam Hill wrote: Ken Blake wrote: RH Breener wrote: Bruce Hagen wrote: FYI: Outlook does not do news. OK, then I would not be interested at all. Your choice, of course, and I'm not trying to talk you into anything, but I never understand why anyone insists on using the same program for e-mail and newsgroups. I don't at all mind having two programs, one for each use, and in some ways I ever prefer it--for example, I can have both open at once. Using separate applications removes you from the possibility of sending a private email to a newsgroup. Not quite. Both of the newsreaders that are currently set up here will let me reply to a Usenet post via e-mail. So would mine -- if I set up an email account within its settings. I don't, of course. I usually don't click the wrong button :-) Attaboy! Thanks for the encouragement :-) BTW, I don't think I set up e-mail accounts in my newsreaders. Or maybe I did :-) And to be fair, I don't think either one can act as a real e-mail program, i.e., read e-mail as well as send it. Besides, they probably would send e-mail only by invoking the default e-mail program. -- Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch) |
#64
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No email on W-7
On 6/19/12 3:21 PM, RH Breener wrote:
I can't locate the place to make the rules, and for some reason the software downloads old messages from the gmail server that I've seen months ago. Hi, RH, Two things: First......... I've just read through this entire thread of messages as it exists at this moment, saw no one with any real information about your Gmail issue. Some time back, I was helping a friend in setting up his Thunderbird client, and we had a lot of problems getting the results we expected. To put it mildly, we were getting pi$$ed! LOL Turns out, Google/Gmail handles mail differently than many if not most places. It wasn't until we really got into how you needed to configure Gmail at Gmail's end that we finally started to see the results we wanted. Moral of this short story? It's best if you go to Gmail and thoroughly understand how Gmail handles POP3 and IMAP requests before placing the blame on an email client when you don't get the results you expected. Second......... I'm not here to denigrate, malign, or in some way badmouth the other posters, but I was not shocked to find almost no one offered any other solutions to you for an email client. Most seem fixated on the MS and Mozilla products. I saw Pegasus Mail mentioned, but I believe development has stopped. Also Agent (sophisticated, I tried it and decided against it), which is still being developed. There was one other, I think, but I'm not going looking! LOL As you see from my sig, I'm a TB user, but definitely not 100% happy with it. But it is better *for me* than Apple Mail. LOL If I ever get the ambition, I'll go look for something else. As for Windows alternatives other than MS products that everyone acknowledges don't work correctly in many areas, and TB which you don't care for, Mozilla also has the SeaMonkey browser which includes an email client as does the Opera browser, should you wish to look at different browsers as a package. The open source version of Eudora is based on TB code. I switched from Eudora a couple years ago to TB, but if/when I go looking for a TB replacement, I'll check it out again. I'm sure there's a lot of changes, and I honestly do not remember why I changed. I know I *really* liked their last commercial version for Windows. I'd recommend you check out this site: http://www.windows7download.com/free...lient/0-r.html It lists 316 email clients for Win7. Surely more than enough to boggle the mind. 74 are freeware, and the list includes shareware, trial, and commercial programs. I'd think you'd find something there that would appeal to you and what you want in a client. Do not depend on what you see on the site as being all encompassing. There's a client called Mahogany listed for Win7, but it's cross platform and the screenshot is from Mac's OS X! grin I'll have to remember to check it out. And the TB listed at the beginning is so far out of date. If you see something that looks appealing or sparks your curiosity, use your favorite search engine to find the home page. HTH -- Ken Mac OS X 10.6.8 Firefox 12.0 Thunderbird 12.0.1 LibreOffice 3.5.2.2 |
#65
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No email on W-7
On Tue, 19 Jun 2012 15:24:02 -0700, RH Breener wrote:
Actually after working with Thunderbird for awhile I think I'll be able to live with it. It's just more confusing than WM, and after using one type of email program for 12 years, it's hard to switch By "more confusing" do you actually mean "unfamiliar"? Of course using anything new there will be a bit of a learning curve. Windows* 7 itself is a dramatic example of that. -- Stan Brown, Oak Road Systems, Tompkins County, New York, USA http://OakRoadSystems.com Shikata ga nai... |
#66
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No email on W-7
On Tue, 19 Jun 2012 17:52:39 -0600, Ken Springer
wrote: On 6/19/12 4:22 PM, Gene Wirchenko wrote: GUIs are so much more intuitive than CLIs. cough, cough I never bought that argument. Methinks the biggest problem with the "GUI is more intuitive" is what one person finds intuitive is not intuitive to another. I think that it is that it often depends on hidden knowledge. I remember when GUIs were just getting out there that the word "intuitive" got thrown about a lot, and it seemed that so often "It's intuitive!" was code for "Well, I know it! What's wrong with you? Are you stupid of something?" and delivered in about that tone of voice. Supposed intuitiveness plays to programmers not wanting to document their code. Or if they must, to keep it to a minimum. One game on armorgames.com (Hack Slash Crawl) has one page of documentation. Would it have really hurt for them to explain what the number next to each spell was? It turned out they were keyboard shortcuts. I only found out by accident. Had I known, it would have made playing the game easier. How many users of programs do not know of some features that would be very useful for them if only they could easily find out? Sincerely, Gene Wirchenko |
#67
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No email on W-7
On Tue, 19 Jun 2012 18:40:34 -0600, Ken Springer
wrote: I've just read through this entire thread of messages as it exists at this moment, saw no one with any real information about your Gmail issue. Some time back, I was helping a friend in setting up his Thunderbird client, and we had a lot of problems getting the results we expected. To put it mildly, we were getting pi$$ed! LOL Turns out, Google/Gmail handles mail differently than many if not most places. It wasn't until we really got into how you needed to configure Gmail at Gmail's end that we finally started to see the results we wanted. Moral of this short story? It's best if you go to Gmail and thoroughly understand how Gmail handles POP3 and IMAP requests before placing the blame on an email client when you don't get the results you expected. I respectfully disagree. I've set up quite a few GMail accounts and have never visited the GMail website. Everything you need should be available within your client. Second......... I'm not here to denigrate, malign, or in some way badmouth the other posters, but I was not shocked to find almost no one offered any other solutions to you for an email client. I think you missed the point of several posters. The best advice was for the person to try several clients and decide for himself which one works best for him. We're all different and have our unique expectations and requirements, and as a result there is no single best solution for everyone. -- Char Jackson |
#68
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No email on W-7
On 6/19/12 9:49 PM, Gene Wirchenko wrote:
How many users of programs do not know of some features that would be very useful for them if only they could easily find out? Which is why I'm continually b***ching about the lack of documentation these days for all things computer. -- Ken Mac OS X 10.6.8 Firefox 13.0.1 Thunderbird 13.0.1 LibreOffice 3.5.2.2 |
#69
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No email on W-7
Hi, RH.
This thread has grown so long that it's hard to know where to jump in with a couple more points about WLM 15, so I'll put them here... Rules in WLM 15 are not hidden, just in an illogical (in my opinion) place: On the "Folders" ribbon; the rightmost button is for "Message rules". Click this and you should see screens very similar to the ones in OE and WM. But note that the rules for Mail and for News are completely separate; you'll have to click either the Mail or the News icon at the bottom of the Folders pane to get WLM into the proper mood...er...mode before you click the Folders tab. WLM 15's Ribbon GUI hides the Tools screen TOO well! :( Not intuitive at all. That button in the upper left corner of the main screen has no label at all - until you hover over it and the uninformative popup says simply "Windows Live Mail". But if you click that button you'll get a drop-down menu. The sixth choice on that menu is "Options". Hovering there gets another menu with 5 choices. The top choice, "Mail", is the magic button! Click that and you'll get the familiar "Tools|Options" screen that OE/WM users know so well, with its tabs for Read, Send, Spelling, etc. To make this easier for the future, you need to also discover the QAT, the Quick Action Toolbar. Go back and click that WLM button again, hover over Options, then RIGHT-click on Mail and choose "Add to Quick Action Toolbar". A new icon will appear on the QAT; it looks like a page with a yellow (gold?) checkmark on it; the Tooltip popup says "Mail". Now you have one-click access to that Options screen. ;) The QAT is your friend! It makes WLM 15 much easier to customize and use. Too bad Microsoft made it so hard to find. :( RC -- R. C. White, CPA San Marcos, TX Microsoft Windows MVP (2002-2010) Windows Live Mail 2011 (Build 15.4.3555.0308) in Win7 Ultimate x64 SP1 "RH Breener" wrote in message ... "R. C. White" wrote in message ecom... Hi, RH. As you probably have learned by now, Win7 comes from Microsoft with NO mail/news client at all. HP must have added WLM to your machine. Microsoft got tired of complaints about "bloat" in Windows Vista and prior, so they removed several add-on features, including mail/news, from Win7. They say that we are now free to select any mail/news client we want (Thunderbird, Agent, or any of several others) and install it ourselves. OE will not run on Win7. WM will not run on Win7, either, officially. But some users have made it work with a patch that should not be too hard to find. (I haven't looked for it because I prefer WLM to WM. I'll probably get flamed for that.) RC No flames. To each is or her own. smile |
#70
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No email on W-7
On 6/19/12 10:01 PM, Char Jackson wrote:
Hi, Char, On Tue, 19 Jun 2012 18:40:34 -0600, Ken Springer wrote: I've just read through this entire thread of messages as it exists at this moment, saw no one with any real information about your Gmail issue. Some time back, I was helping a friend in setting up his Thunderbird client, and we had a lot of problems getting the results we expected. To put it mildly, we were getting pi$$ed! LOL Turns out, Google/Gmail handles mail differently than many if not most places. It wasn't until we really got into how you needed to configure Gmail at Gmail's end that we finally started to see the results we wanted. Moral of this short story? It's best if you go to Gmail and thoroughly understand how Gmail handles POP3 and IMAP requests before placing the blame on an email client when you don't get the results you expected. I respectfully disagree. I've set up quite a few GMail accounts and have never visited the GMail website. Everything you need should be available within your client. Possibly we were dealing with something unique my friend wanted that most do not. I do remember that Gmail doesn't delete mail on it's server, even if the email client requests it, unless your Gmail settings tell Gmail to honor the request. That was one thing that hampered our efforts. Second......... I'm not here to denigrate, malign, or in some way badmouth the other posters, but I was not shocked to find almost no one offered any other solutions to you for an email client. I think you missed the point of several posters. The best advice was for the person to try several clients and decide for himself which one works best for him. We're all different and have our unique expectations and requirements, and as a result there is no single best solution for everyone. What I noticed was no one actually made much of an effort to suggest alternative clients to help him find and try other clients, but continued on and on about TB and MS clients. To me, that rather left the OP somewhat in ignorance of other alternatives. -- Ken Mac OS X 10.6.8 Firefox 13.0.1 Thunderbird 13.0.1 LibreOffice 3.5.2.2 |
#71
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No email on W-7
On Tue, 19 Jun 2012 22:08:36 -0600, Ken Springer
wrote: On 6/19/12 9:49 PM, Gene Wirchenko wrote: How many users of programs do not know of some features that would be very useful for them if only they could easily find out? Which is why I'm continually b***ching about the lack of documentation these days for all things computer. Likewise. Sincerely, Gene Wirchenko |
#72
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No email on W-7
On Tue, 19 Jun 2012 22:18:02 -0600, Ken Springer
wrote: On 6/19/12 10:01 PM, Char Jackson wrote: Hi, Char, On Tue, 19 Jun 2012 18:40:34 -0600, Ken Springer wrote: I've just read through this entire thread of messages as it exists at this moment, saw no one with any real information about your Gmail issue. Some time back, I was helping a friend in setting up his Thunderbird client, and we had a lot of problems getting the results we expected. To put it mildly, we were getting pi$$ed! LOL Turns out, Google/Gmail handles mail differently than many if not most places. It wasn't until we really got into how you needed to configure Gmail at Gmail's end that we finally started to see the results we wanted. Moral of this short story? It's best if you go to Gmail and thoroughly understand how Gmail handles POP3 and IMAP requests before placing the blame on an email client when you don't get the results you expected. I respectfully disagree. I've set up quite a few GMail accounts and have never visited the GMail website. Everything you need should be available within your client. Possibly we were dealing with something unique my friend wanted that most do not. I do remember that Gmail doesn't delete mail on it's server, even if the email client requests it, unless your Gmail settings tell Gmail to honor the request. That was one thing that hampered our efforts. Second......... I'm not here to denigrate, malign, or in some way badmouth the other posters, but I was not shocked to find almost no one offered any other solutions to you for an email client. I think you missed the point of several posters. The best advice was for the person to try several clients and decide for himself which one works best for him. We're all different and have our unique expectations and requirements, and as a result there is no single best solution for everyone. What I noticed was no one actually made much of an effort to suggest alternative clients to help him find and try other clients, I see that part as a good thing. but continued on and on about TB and MS clients. To me, that rather left the OP somewhat in ignorance of other alternatives. Ignorance can be temporary, so this too is not a bad thing. I get your point, though, even if I mildly disagree. Thanks. -- Char Jackson |
#73
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No email on W-7
On Tue, 19 Jun 2012 14:59:24 -0700, "RH Breener"
wrote: "VanguardLH" wrote in message ... RH Breener wrote: I can't locate the place to make the rules, ... See my earlier reply. Yes, you can define a rule that prevents downloading messages that exceed a specified size. The clauses were available in the prior version so I suspect they are still available in the newer version. And, yes, Microsoft likes to make difficult finding how to define rules in WLM. I eventually decided to stop hunting around the given UI and use the options to show the menu bar. Once I got the menu bar displayed, finding where to define the rules was easy. That was under the older version of WLM that will install on Windows XP. The latest version won't install on Windows XP. The new version incorporates Microsoft's penchant for GUI changes by using the ribbon bar. From articles I've read for that newer version, you go under the Folders tab in the ribbon bar whereupon then you get to see the Message Rules button. Create a New Mail Rule in Windows Live Mail in Windows 7 http://ww2.cox.com/residential/centr...ternet/article. cox?articleId=%7Bb7514210-62b6-11df-ccef-000000000000%7D (found by Google search on: "windows live mail" create rule) I found it. Thank you. Of the two though, I think I'll end up using Thunderbird if I can't get WM to work. I don't understand why MS doesn't have it as a download since a lot of people don't seem to like WLM and are looking for ways to get WM to work on their W7 computers. It's a thing called progress. How many new cars sold today come with a 8-track tape player? -- Sent from Groundhog on my Sony Tablet S. |
#74
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No email on W-7
On Tue, 19 Jun 2012 22:08:36 -0600, Ken Springer
wrote: On 6/19/12 9:49 PM, Gene Wirchenko wrote: How many users of programs do not know of some features that would be very useful for them if only they could easily find out? Which is why I'm continually b***ching about the lack of documentation these days for all things computer. Makes you miss the days of when buying a computer also meant that you were buying a library of books on how to use and program it as well. -- Sent from Groundhog on my Sony Tablet S. |
#75
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No email on W-7
Snippage
"RH Breener" wrote in message ... And what I was told to do to delete a large number of email in WLM doesn't work. I can only delete 3 at a time and the same emails keep coming back every time I open WLM. I've deleted the same ones now for the 3rd or 4th time. Why do they keep downloading after being deleted? This never happened with OE or WM. What a waste of my time messing with WLM. I have no idea why you can't delete more than 3 messages at a time, but make sure you empty Deleted Items and compact the folders. That may help. Regarding receiving the same messages over and over: 1: Did you uncheck "Leave a copy on the server"? 2: Temporarily uncheck: Get messages every X minutes. If WLMail polls for new messages before the download completes, it will start over again from message one. -- Bruce Hagen MS-MVP Oct. 1, 2004 ~ Sept. 30, 2010 Imperial Beach, CA |
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