Restoring an image backup to a brand new HD?

On Wed, 21 Mar 2012 11:05:29 -0500, "Jo-Anne"
wrote:

"Char Jackson" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 20 Mar 2012 22:43:42 -0600, "Bill in Co"
wrote:

Char Jackson wrote:
On Tue, 20 Mar 2012 21:57:26 -0600, "Bill in Co"
wrote:

Char Jackson wrote:
On Tue, 20 Mar 2012 20:59:32 -0600, "Bill in Co"
wrote:

Let's suppose you have a disk with 4 partitions on it. AFAIK, you
can
either clone the disk (the entire disk), or choose which partitions
to
image, but not image the whole disk in one image, and one simple
operation,
unless I'm missing something.

Yes, you're missing something. When you choose to create an image, you
can select one partition, multiple partitions, all partitions, or the
entire disk.

OK, I looked again at Acronis True Image, and the only way I see to do
that
is by individually selecting each partition in its own separate
checkbox.
There was no "entire disk" image selection, per se (unlike for
cloning),
but
selecting ALL the partitions would presumably be doing that (i.e
imaging
the entire disk stucture). (MBR and Track0 are not listed as
selections,
so
I guess that's automatically taken care of when you backup C

Look closer when you open ATI. The Backup section defaults to
"partition mode", which is what you described above, but you can also
switch to "disk mode".

I'm using ATI Home version 11, and don't see that. Maybe it's in the
newer
ones.

I think it's in every version going back to at least 2009. Try this:
Launch ATI and let it settle at the screen where "Disk and Partition
Backup" is the first choice. ("Disk and partition" is the first clue,
BTW.)

Click on Disk and Partition Backup and allow the next screen to open.
Toward the top, above the partitions, it says "What to back up", with
a thin line stretching to the right, ending where it says "Switch to
disk mode." There you go, click that text and it switches to disk
mode. In disk mode, that text changes to "Switch to partition mode",
allowing you to toggle back and forth between the two modes.

Ask for screenshots if you still don't see it.


I use ATI 11 Home, and it works differently.

When you guys talk about ATI 11, do you mean ATI 2011? If so, that's
what I'm using as a basis for my responses in this thread. I'm not
aware of an actual version 11 of the program so I assume you folks are
using shorthand. With the program running, if you go to Help, About
Acronis True Image Home, does the window that opens say "Acronis True
Image Home 11"?

You can back up either "Disks
and partitions" or "System state." If you choose "Disks and partitions," the
next screen is "Partitions Selection," and you can select either individual
partitions or the entire hard drive.

I think the interface is confusing at this point. My disk, labeled Disk 1 by
Acronis, has only two partitions--C: and FAT16. The screen shows a large
green dot in the box at the left of Disk 1 and a green checkmark in the box
at the left of C:--but nothing in the box at the left of FAT16 (which I
believe is a Restore partition created by the computer manufacturer).

If you just look at the large dot at Disk 1, you might think you're backing
up everything--but to back up all partititons you have to left click on that
dot. I assume that if you don't either click on each partitition to get the
checkmark to appear or click on the Disk 1 dot to checkmark all the
partitions, then the partitions other than C: won't get backed up.

I have no "large dots" on mine, so I think it's becoming clear that
we're not using the same version. Therefore, the specific steps will
be slightly different. I've used several versions of ATI and all have
been capable of selecting entire disks versus individual partitions,
so I'm betting your version is capable, as well.

On 3/21/2012 3:14 PM, Char Jackson wrote:
When you guys talk about ATI 11, do you mean ATI 2011? If so, that's
what I'm using as a basis for my responses in this thread. I'm not
aware of an actual version 11 of the program so I assume you folks are
using shorthand. With the program running, if you go to Help, About
Acronis True Image Home, does the window that opens say "Acronis True
Image Home 11"?

I have both Acronis True Image 2009 (v12) and 2011 (v14). And I believe
the version numbers show up in the build numbers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acronis_True_Image#History


--
Bill
Gateway M465e ('06 era) - Thunderbird v3.0
Centrino Core2 Duo T7400 2.16 GHz - 1.5GB - Windows 8 CP

On Wed, 21 Mar 2012 15:32:06 -0500, BillW50 wrote:

On 3/21/2012 3:14 PM, Char Jackson wrote:
When you guys talk about ATI 11, do you mean ATI 2011? If so, that's
what I'm using as a basis for my responses in this thread. I'm not
aware of an actual version 11 of the program so I assume you folks are
using shorthand. With the program running, if you go to Help, About
Acronis True Image Home, does the window that opens say "Acronis True
Image Home 11"?

I have both Acronis True Image 2009 (v12) and 2011 (v14). And I believe
the version numbers show up in the build numbers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acronis_True_Image#History

Thanks. Looks like they're using a version from 2007 then. I'm no
longer familiar with any ATI versions that old.

dadiOH wrote:
Bill in Co wrote:
I'm a little confused about this seemingly basic issue, in this case
involving the use of Acronis True Image and its backup images, but it
could be more general, too.

Is it possible to restore an image backup of your system to a
*completely brand new hard drive* that has never been used or
initialized? Let me explain further:

Suppose your main hard drive dies, and that you also have another HD
that only contains some Acronis True Image backups of your system
stored on it, AND that you also have an Acronis True Image Boot CD
handy.
So you replace the bad drive with a brand new drive (which naturally
is unbootable if you just tried to boot up on it).

However, using your Acronis boot CD, you can use that to boot up into
the boot CD, and then presumably select a backup image you'd like to
restore from the other HD.

BUT will the restore operation work for a brand new virgin hard drive
that has never been used before (i.e. make the brand new hard drive
bootable into windows, etc)? I'm guessing it will, but that's only
an assumption on my part. I know the operation works well on a
normal HD, but have never tried it out on a brand new hard drive, and
am wondering if there is some limitation there I'm not aware of (like
you can't restore an image to a virgin hard drive that has never been
initialized or whatever).

Suppose you didn't have an image, what would you do? You'd use the new
drive manufacturer's program to clone the existing drive. So yes, you can
restore an image you have to the new drive.

?? Not sure what you meant here. If your original main HD failed, you
can't clone or access it under any situation, as its completely borked. By
borked I mean it's toast.

Char Jackson wrote:
On Tue, 20 Mar 2012 22:43:42 -0600, "Bill in Co"
wrote:

Char Jackson wrote:
On Tue, 20 Mar 2012 21:57:26 -0600, "Bill in Co"
wrote:

Char Jackson wrote:
On Tue, 20 Mar 2012 20:59:32 -0600, "Bill in Co"
wrote:

Let's suppose you have a disk with 4 partitions on it. AFAIK, you
can
either clone the disk (the entire disk), or choose which partitions
to
image, but not image the whole disk in one image, and one simple
operation,
unless I'm missing something.

Yes, you're missing something. When you choose to create an image, you
can select one partition, multiple partitions, all partitions, or the
entire disk.

OK, I looked again at Acronis True Image, and the only way I see to do
that
is by individually selecting each partition in its own separate
checkbox.
There was no "entire disk" image selection, per se (unlike for
cloning),
but
selecting ALL the partitions would presumably be doing that (i.e
imaging
the entire disk stucture). (MBR and Track0 are not listed as
selections,
so
I guess that's automatically taken care of when you backup C

Look closer when you open ATI. The Backup section defaults to
"partition mode", which is what you described above, but you can also
switch to "disk mode".

I'm using ATI Home version 11, and don't see that. Maybe it's in the
newer
ones.

I think it's in every version going back to at least 2009. Try this:
Launch ATI and let it settle at the screen where "Disk and Partition
Backup" is the first choice. ("Disk and partition" is the first clue,
BTW.)

Click on Disk and Partition Backup and allow the next screen to open.
Toward the top, above the partitions, it says "What to back up", with
a thin line stretching to the right, ending where it says "Switch to
disk mode." There you go, click that text and it switches to disk
mode. In disk mode, that text changes to "Switch to partition mode",
allowing you to toggle back and forth between the two modes.

Ask for screenshots if you still don't see it.

I think that's the difference. Acronis True Image Home version 11 dates
back to 2007. And it's a bit different. If you want to image the whole
disk, you have to manually select all the partitions in their respective
checkboxes.

Char Jackson wrote:
On Wed, 21 Mar 2012 11:05:29 -0500, "Jo-Anne"
wrote:

"Char Jackson" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 20 Mar 2012 22:43:42 -0600, "Bill in Co"
wrote:

Char Jackson wrote:
On Tue, 20 Mar 2012 21:57:26 -0600, "Bill in Co"
wrote:

Char Jackson wrote:
On Tue, 20 Mar 2012 20:59:32 -0600, "Bill in Co"
wrote:

Let's suppose you have a disk with 4 partitions on it. AFAIK, you
can
either clone the disk (the entire disk), or choose which partitions
to
image, but not image the whole disk in one image, and one simple
operation,
unless I'm missing something.

Yes, you're missing something. When you choose to create an image,
you
can select one partition, multiple partitions, all partitions, or
the
entire disk.

OK, I looked again at Acronis True Image, and the only way I see to
do
that
is by individually selecting each partition in its own separate
checkbox.
There was no "entire disk" image selection, per se (unlike for
cloning),
but
selecting ALL the partitions would presumably be doing that (i.e
imaging
the entire disk stucture). (MBR and Track0 are not listed as
selections,
so
I guess that's automatically taken care of when you backup C

Look closer when you open ATI. The Backup section defaults to
"partition mode", which is what you described above, but you can also
switch to "disk mode".

I'm using ATI Home version 11, and don't see that. Maybe it's in the
newer
ones.

I think it's in every version going back to at least 2009. Try this:
Launch ATI and let it settle at the screen where "Disk and Partition
Backup" is the first choice. ("Disk and partition" is the first clue,
BTW.)

Click on Disk and Partition Backup and allow the next screen to open.
Toward the top, above the partitions, it says "What to back up", with
a thin line stretching to the right, ending where it says "Switch to
disk mode." There you go, click that text and it switches to disk
mode. In disk mode, that text changes to "Switch to partition mode",
allowing you to toggle back and forth between the two modes.

Ask for screenshots if you still don't see it.


I use ATI 11 Home, and it works differently.

When you guys talk about ATI 11, do you mean ATI 2011? If so, that's
what I'm using as a basis for my responses in this thread. I'm not
aware of an actual version 11 of the program so I assume you folks are
using shorthand. With the program running, if you go to Help, About
Acronis True Image Home, does the window that opens say "Acronis True
Image Home 11"?

You can back up either "Disks
and partitions" or "System state." If you choose "Disks and partitions,"
the
next screen is "Partitions Selection," and you can select either
individual
partitions or the entire hard drive.

I think the interface is confusing at this point. My disk, labeled Disk 1
by
Acronis, has only two partitions--C: and FAT16. The screen shows a large
green dot in the box at the left of Disk 1 and a green checkmark in the
box
at the left of C:--but nothing in the box at the left of FAT16 (which I
believe is a Restore partition created by the computer manufacturer).

If you just look at the large dot at Disk 1, you might think you're
backing
up everything--but to back up all partititons you have to left click on
that
dot. I assume that if you don't either click on each partitition to get
the
checkmark to appear or click on the Disk 1 dot to checkmark all the
partitions, then the partitions other than C: won't get backed up.

I have no "large dots" on mine, so I think it's becoming clear that
we're not using the same version. Therefore, the specific steps will
be slightly different. I've used several versions of ATI and all have
been capable of selecting entire disks versus individual partitions,
so I'm betting your version is capable, as well.

As I mentioned in the previous post, I think that's the difference. Acronis
True Image Home version 11 dates back to 2007. And it's a bit different.
If you want to image the whole disk, you have to manually select all the
partitions in their respective checkboxes.

Jo-Anne wrote:
"Mayayana" wrote in message
...
I'm a little confused about this seemingly basic issue, in this case
involving the use of Acronis True Image and its backup images, but it
could
be more general, too.

Is it possible to restore an image backup of your system to a
*completely
brand new hard drive* that has never been used or initialized?

There's really no such thing as "initialized". A new
disk doesn't get broken in. The only difference is that
it doesn't yet have partitions.

I use BootIt. I can copy an image from CD or disk
to any empty space that will fit it, on any disk. The
only difference is that I always partition the new drive
before installing OSs. (I leave room for 3 primaries in
front and then apportion the rest for logical data
partitions in an extended partition.)

This isn't an Acronis issue. It's about how disks work.
But the software you use could have limitations in what
it can do. Also, there seem to be different definitions used,
which can make things confusing. (In this thread, one
person defines an image as a partition backup while
another defines it as a section-of-disk backup.)



The discussion til now has been about restoring to a brand new hard drive.
No mention has been made of the possibility that the new drive is in a new
computer. What if you want to restore the image to a new computer that has
come with, say, Windows 7? Would you be able to do a full restore,
including
your old Windows XP operating system, on the new drive in the new
computer?
And if you could, would Microsoft consider it valid and allow it to be
used?

Jo-Anne

I used "Laplink PC Mover" to transfer my Win98SE installation over to my
newer WinXP computer, and it worked pretty well (but a couple of programs or
so had to be reactivated - no biggie). And BillW mentioned two other
programs (Paragon and Acronis). I don't know the pros and cons of each,
however.

BillW50 wrote:
On 3/20/2012 8:58 PM, David H. Lipman wrote:
From: "BillW50"

On 3/20/2012 8:06 PM, David H. Lipman wrote:
From: "Bill in Co"

David H. Lipman wrote:
From: "Bill in Co"

I'm a little confused about this seemingly basic issue, in this case
involving the use of Acronis True Image and its backup images, but
it
could be more general, too.

Is it possible to restore an image backup of your system to a
*completely
brand new hard drive* that has never been used or initialized? Let
me
explain further:

Suppose your main hard drive dies, and that you also have another HD
that
only contains some Acronis True Image backups of your system stored
on it,
AND that you also have an Acronis True Image Boot CD handy.

So you replace the bad drive with a brand new drive (which
naturally is
unbootable if you just tried to boot up on it).

However, using your Acronis boot CD, you can use that to boot up
into the
boot CD, and then presumably select a backup image you'd like to
restore
from the other HD.

BUT will the restore operation work for a brand new virgin hard
drive that
has never been used before (i.e. make the brand new hard drive
bootable
into windows, etc)? I'm guessing it will, but that's only an
assumption
on my part. I know the operation works well on a normal HD, but have
never tried it out on a brand new hard drive, and am wondering if
there is
some limitation there I'm not aware of (like you can't restore an
image to
a virgin hard drive that has never been initialized or whatever).

Yes. That's the whole idea of an "image".

In fact you can have a 80GB hard disk with 10GB free and image it.

The install a 250GB bare hard disk and restore the image and now have
the
same OS on that 250GB hard disk with 180GB free.

I knew it worked well on a functional hard drive, but I didn't know if
it would work ok on a brand new, unformatted and unitialized, hard
drive. From what you're saying it does, and it takes care of all of
that automatically. Which is good to know.

So from that point of view, you don't really ever need a disk CLONE,
assuming you have some image backups, a bootable CD with ATI on it,
AND a brand new hard drive handy.

I guess the only disadvantage of this emergency backup method (i.e.,
for a completely ruined defective main hard drive) is that it relies
on having a bootable ATI restore CD handy, and a good reliable image
backup on another drive, AND on having a brand new hard drive handy -
instead of just replacing the drive with a CLONE.

A clone is disk to disk.

An image is the disk made to a disk file.

I can clone a drive goingf from disk to disk but I can also clone a
drive going from disk to image and then from image to disk.

True, but the latter takes twice as long. Plus in the time you can do
a backup image, you could be testing the clone to see if everything is
ok.


Yes, it takes longer but there are advantages.

For example you can't clone an 80GB drive with 40GB free to a 60GB drive
but you can image that 80GB drive with 40GB free and then restore that
image to a 60GB drive.

I don't know what clone utilities you have been using? But you *can*
indeed clone to a smaller drive as long as the used space will still fit
on the smaller drive with most modern cloning utilities. ATI, Paragon,
and XXClone to name a few for example that doesn't care if you clone to
a smaller drive.

Then there is the concept of image distribution. Software can use
multicast IP to restore one image to multiple computers at the same time.

Then there is the concept of a failing drive. It is better to get an
iumage than a clone because you want to get that image down and onece
you have it you can use it over and over. You might get one cahnce from
the failing drive. Make a mistake that causes you to repeat the process
and if that drive fails, you are too late.

Same is true for a cloned drive.

Then there is the concept of disater recovery. You have that image for
the recovery.

Also true for cloning drives. Better yet, your original drive gets
toasted for some reason... pop in one of your clones and you are off and
running once again. ;-)

Whereas if you're relying on an image backup, you have to go through a few
more steps, and hope that the imaging covers all bases. The MBR and Track0
stuff is still confusing to me (and whether or not its automatically taken
care of), plus the fact that this is a Dell, which uses its own boot loader
to go to Partition 2 at bootup to boot into windows, as I recall. (loading
PBR for partition 2...is seen at bootup) Hopefully that would all be taken
care of with the image.

I have read this, however: IF you go the CLONE route, I believe you're
supposed to initially boot up on the clone drive once to properly initialize
it as the boot drive. Meaning, if you don't do this, and by mistake leave
the clone plugged in at first bootup (and are still using your *original*
boot drive), it might make the clone drive unbootable (without some
patching). I'm not sure why though. I assume this is related to the MBR
and Track0 stuff. ??

On Wed, 21 Mar 2012 15:10:11 -0600, "Bill in Co"
wrote:

Char Jackson wrote:
On Tue, 20 Mar 2012 22:43:42 -0600, "Bill in Co"
wrote:

Char Jackson wrote:
On Tue, 20 Mar 2012 21:57:26 -0600, "Bill in Co"
wrote:

Char Jackson wrote:
On Tue, 20 Mar 2012 20:59:32 -0600, "Bill in Co"
wrote:

Let's suppose you have a disk with 4 partitions on it. AFAIK, you
can
either clone the disk (the entire disk), or choose which partitions
to
image, but not image the whole disk in one image, and one simple
operation,
unless I'm missing something.

Yes, you're missing something. When you choose to create an image, you
can select one partition, multiple partitions, all partitions, or the
entire disk.

OK, I looked again at Acronis True Image, and the only way I see to do
that
is by individually selecting each partition in its own separate
checkbox.
There was no "entire disk" image selection, per se (unlike for
cloning),
but
selecting ALL the partitions would presumably be doing that (i.e
imaging
the entire disk stucture). (MBR and Track0 are not listed as
selections,
so
I guess that's automatically taken care of when you backup C

Look closer when you open ATI. The Backup section defaults to
"partition mode", which is what you described above, but you can also
switch to "disk mode".

I'm using ATI Home version 11, and don't see that. Maybe it's in the
newer
ones.

I think it's in every version going back to at least 2009. Try this:
Launch ATI and let it settle at the screen where "Disk and Partition
Backup" is the first choice. ("Disk and partition" is the first clue,
BTW.)

Click on Disk and Partition Backup and allow the next screen to open.
Toward the top, above the partitions, it says "What to back up", with
a thin line stretching to the right, ending where it says "Switch to
disk mode." There you go, click that text and it switches to disk
mode. In disk mode, that text changes to "Switch to partition mode",
allowing you to toggle back and forth between the two modes.

Ask for screenshots if you still don't see it.

I think that's the difference. Acronis True Image Home version 11 dates
back to 2007. And it's a bit different. If you want to image the whole
disk, you have to manually select all the partitions in their respective
checkboxes.

I don't keep old versions of software around very long after I
upgrade, so I can't go back and see for myself. You're probably right
regarding v11, but in later versions it works differently. Thanks.

I use ATI 11 Home, and it works differently.

When you guys talk about ATI 11, do you mean ATI 2011? If so, that's
what I'm using as a basis for my responses in this thread. I'm not
aware of an actual version 11 of the program so I assume you folks are
using shorthand. With the program running, if you go to Help, About
Acronis True Image Home, does the window that opens say "Acronis True
Image Home 11"?

It really is version 11, and it came out long before 2011. Mine says
"Acronis® True Image Home® version 11.0 (build 8,101)."

Jo-Anne

"Bill in Co" wrote in message
news
Jo-Anne wrote:
"Mayayana" wrote in message
...
I'm a little confused about this seemingly basic issue, in this case
involving the use of Acronis True Image and its backup images, but it
could
be more general, too.

Is it possible to restore an image backup of your system to a
*completely
brand new hard drive* that has never been used or initialized?

There's really no such thing as "initialized". A new
disk doesn't get broken in. The only difference is that
it doesn't yet have partitions.

I use BootIt. I can copy an image from CD or disk
to any empty space that will fit it, on any disk. The
only difference is that I always partition the new drive
before installing OSs. (I leave room for 3 primaries in
front and then apportion the rest for logical data
partitions in an extended partition.)

This isn't an Acronis issue. It's about how disks work.
But the software you use could have limitations in what
it can do. Also, there seem to be different definitions used,
which can make things confusing. (In this thread, one
person defines an image as a partition backup while
another defines it as a section-of-disk backup.)



The discussion til now has been about restoring to a brand new hard
drive.
No mention has been made of the possibility that the new drive is in a
new
computer. What if you want to restore the image to a new computer that
has
come with, say, Windows 7? Would you be able to do a full restore,
including
your old Windows XP operating system, on the new drive in the new
computer?
And if you could, would Microsoft consider it valid and allow it to be
used?

Jo-Anne

I used "Laplink PC Mover" to transfer my Win98SE installation over to my
newer WinXP computer, and it worked pretty well (but a couple of programs
or so had to be reactivated - no biggie). And BillW mentioned two other
programs (Paragon and Acronis). I don't know the pros and cons of each,
however.


Thank you, Bill! I suspect that when I do finally get a new computer,
probably with Windows 7 (or, if I can wait long enough, Windows 8), I'll
want to transfer everything EXCEPT the operating system. I'm guessing any of
the versions of Acronis can do that.

Jo-Anne

On 3/21/2012 4:31 PM, Bill in Co wrote:
I have read this, however: IF you go the CLONE route, I believe you're
supposed to initially boot up on the clone drive once to properly initialize
it as the boot drive. Meaning, if you don't do this, and by mistake leave
the clone plugged in at first bootup (and are still using your *original*
boot drive), it might make the clone drive unbootable (without some
patching). I'm not sure why though. I assume this is related to the MBR
and Track0 stuff. ??

The only thing I can think of that sounds similar is this. If you clone
under Windows (or Windows has ever seen this drive before) and not a
boot disc, Windows will see the new drive and give it a drive letter.
Now you clone and all is well so far.

Now you dump or save the original drive and boot up the clone. And let's
say the original drive running Windows saw this new drive as drive F or
something. And say the original drive Windows was on drive C. Now
Windows remembers this new drive is drive F, but the OS expects to be on
drive C. Now lots of problems.

This was an old problem. And the old fix was to use a Windows 98 Startup
Disc and to create a new MBR. Which has a bug or a feature that corrupts
part of the drive's serial number that Windows uses to track. Thus when
you boot the clone for the first time, Windows will claim it has never
seen this drive before and will assign it as the C drive. Now all is well.

Nowadays I don't know any modern day cloning software that doesn't know
how to get around this problem. So the user should never see this. And
that is the only thing that I can think of.

--
Bill
Gateway M465e ('06 era) - Thunderbird v3.0
Centrino Core2 Duo T7400 2.16 GHz - 1.5GB - Windows 8 CP

Jo-Anne wrote:
"Bill in Co" wrote in message
news
Jo-Anne wrote:
"Mayayana" wrote in message
...
I'm a little confused about this seemingly basic issue, in this case
involving the use of Acronis True Image and its backup images, but it
could
be more general, too.

Is it possible to restore an image backup of your system to a
*completely
brand new hard drive* that has never been used or initialized?

There's really no such thing as "initialized". A new
disk doesn't get broken in. The only difference is that
it doesn't yet have partitions.

I use BootIt. I can copy an image from CD or disk
to any empty space that will fit it, on any disk. The
only difference is that I always partition the new drive
before installing OSs. (I leave room for 3 primaries in
front and then apportion the rest for logical data
partitions in an extended partition.)

This isn't an Acronis issue. It's about how disks work.
But the software you use could have limitations in what
it can do. Also, there seem to be different definitions used,
which can make things confusing. (In this thread, one
person defines an image as a partition backup while
another defines it as a section-of-disk backup.)



The discussion til now has been about restoring to a brand new hard
drive.
No mention has been made of the possibility that the new drive is in a
new
computer. What if you want to restore the image to a new computer that
has
come with, say, Windows 7? Would you be able to do a full restore,
including
your old Windows XP operating system, on the new drive in the new
computer?
And if you could, would Microsoft consider it valid and allow it to be
used?

Jo-Anne

I used "Laplink PC Mover" to transfer my Win98SE installation over to my
newer WinXP computer, and it worked pretty well (but a couple of programs
or so had to be reactivated - no biggie). And BillW mentioned two other
programs (Paragon and Acronis). I don't know the pros and cons of each,
however.


Thank you, Bill! I suspect that when I do finally get a new computer,
probably with Windows 7 (or, if I can wait long enough, Windows 8), I'll
want to transfer everything EXCEPT the operating system. I'm guessing any
of
the versions of Acronis can do that.

Jo-Anne

Point of correction - what I meant was I used PC Mover to transfer
everything over EXCEPT the OS! Meaning, it's WindowsXP but with all of
my previously installed stuff.

As for Acronis, I think BillW said you have to use the Plus version, as I
recall.

But the bottom line is, you need one of these programs to move the stuff
over - you can't simply image or clone it (or if you do, you'll have a lot
of headaches, lol)

How many headaches, I don't know. Perhaps someone has tried it and comment
on it. By "it", I mean taking a brand new computer with Win7 on it,
pulling out its hard drive, and then trying to restore an image backup of
your older WinXP computer to its drive (OR, as the alternate approach,
simply taking out its hard drive and inserting your older WinXP's hard
drive, ahd hoping for the best.

I suspect you'd have to go through a bunch of driver related stuff, and on
top of that, possibly some of the new hardware of the new computer may
present some driver related issues - and possibly some that can't be
resolved for the new hardware, with your existing programs. But my
knowledge is sketchy here.

On 3/21/2012 4:43 PM, Jo-Anne wrote:
Thank you, Bill! I suspect that when I do finally get a new computer,
probably with Windows 7 (or, if I can wait long enough, Windows 8), I'll
want to transfer everything EXCEPT the operating system. I'm guessing any of
the versions of Acronis can do that.

Well you can get Windows 8 now for free from Microsoft if you are
interested (this trial version works until Jan 15, 2013). I am running
it now in fact. And Windows 8 doesn't have a Start button anymore. So if
that bothers you, you might want to go with Windows 7 instead. They
replaced the Start button with what they call a Metro UI. Which is much
like a smart phone desktop.

--
Bill
Gateway M465e ('06 era) - Thunderbird v3.0
Centrino Core2 Duo T7400 2.16 GHz - 1.5GB - Windows 8 CP

BillW50 wrote:
On 3/21/2012 4:31 PM, Bill in Co wrote:
I have read this, however: IF you go the CLONE route, I believe you're
supposed to initially boot up on the clone drive once to properly
initialize
it as the boot drive. Meaning, if you don't do this, and by mistake
leave
the clone plugged in at first bootup (and are still using your *original*
boot drive), it might make the clone drive unbootable (without some
patching). I'm not sure why though. I assume this is related to the MBR
and Track0 stuff. ??

The only thing I can think of that sounds similar is this. If you clone
under Windows (or Windows has ever seen this drive before) and not a
boot disc, Windows will see the new drive and give it a drive letter.
Now you clone and all is well so far.

Now you dump or save the original drive and boot up the clone. And let's
say the original drive running Windows saw this new drive as drive F or
something. And say the original drive Windows was on drive C. Now
Windows remembers this new drive is drive F, but the OS expects to be on
drive C. Now lots of problems.

This was an old problem. And the old fix was to use a Windows 98 Startup
Disc and to create a new MBR. Which has a bug or a feature that corrupts
part of the drive's serial number that Windows uses to track. Thus when
you boot the clone for the first time, Windows will claim it has never
seen this drive before and will assign it as the C drive. Now all is well.

Nowadays I don't know any modern day cloning software that doesn't know
how to get around this problem. So the user should never see this. And
that is the only thing that I can think of.

Thanks. Yes, this sounds like what I was thinking of. I wonder when, and
basically how, this issue was ever resolved, with the newer programs?

For example, if you simply create the clone and leave it plugged in but
along with the original source drive, and reboot, won't it still be assigned
a letter like F:? Your original source hard drive is still there and is
still C:, naturally.

So that next time, IF you detach the clone and replace the original drive
with the clone, it's still F? How could the cloning software take care of
that, unless it creates some new MBR on the clone drive, forcing it to be
seen as C:? But that won't work right if you leave both the original drive
and the clone drive plugged in simultaneously. There would be a conflict.