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XP Browser
Using Chrome For XP Version 49.0.2623.75
Works well despite warnings that it will soon no longer be supported. Has any figured out how to avoid the 'Your clock is ahead/behind?' I have IE8 installed but it won't open any https website. Any other browsers that work well with XP? |
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#2
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XP Browser
"Norm Cook" wrote
| Using Chrome For XP Version 49.0.2623.75 | Works well despite warnings that it will soon no longer be | supported. | | Has any figured out how to avoid the 'Your clock is ahead/behind?' | | I have IE8 installed but it won't open any https website. | | Any other browsers that work well with XP? | I don't understand the clock question. As for browsers, I'm using Firefox 52.9 and New Moon 28.6. I got the latest NM awhile back but had problems with it. I don't remember offhand what they were. Another good thing to do, which Chrome may not allow, is to spoof the userAgent. Demanding only the latest browser has become an epidemic of incompetence and exploitation online. (I'm often not sure whether they don't know what they're doing or whether they only accept the latest in the sense of wanting to track data like geo-location from the browser.) Most sites will stop complaining with the userAgent spoofed. I think I'm currently running as Win7-64 with FF 76. Are there sites that *really* won't work without a browser less than a year old? I don't know. It's possible. If anyone knows of such a case I'd be interested to know exactly what functionality such a website depends on. I don't use my main machine to do risky things like enabling script, and I don't use any kind of social media, so I haven't tried to access many sites. I wonder if some of those sites are eventually just going to break on desktop computers, demanding the tracking options available on phones. A separate factor that may become an increasing problem is that there seems to be a new browser wars brewing. MS is trying to force New Edge on people. Google is trying to recreate AOL and force Chrome on people. It could get ugly. |
#3
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Norm Cook wrote:
Using Chrome For XP Version 49.0.2623.75 Works well despite warnings that it will soon no longer be supported. Has any figured out how to avoid the 'Your clock is ahead/behind?' I have IE8 installed but it won't open any https website. Any other browsers that work well with XP? The unfortunate division of labor, is browsers sometimes rely on system services, for part of their protocol support. On Linux, you might have the crypto as local code within the browser program. And that means, if they wanted, they could use that Linux code, on Windows. On Windows, there's an SChannel, which is great, except when OS updates stop and it drifts "out of date". A few web servers rely on TLS 1.3 and CHACHA20 for an https connection. There are also certificates that must be maintained on the client connection, in order for https to work. If you rely on an OS that stopped support in 2014, there will eventually be consequences. The whole thing turns into a "maintenance-full" exercise. It pays lip service to backward compatibility, in that the participants pretend that every version *except* the current bleeding edge, is hopelessly compromised and insecure. The server decides whether a client gets in. And if you see some of the comments about Internet Explorer on the web, you'll understand how it's easy for some people to break it and offer a degraded user experience. Some day soon, the degraded user experience will be reserved for everyone not using Chrome, and it'll have to be a modern version of Chrome too. They'll even **** on Chrome 49. The web will become MonoChromeAtic. Paul |
#4
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Norm Cook wrote:
Using Chrome For XP Version 49.0.2623.75 Works well despite warnings that it will soon no longer be supported. Has any figured out how to avoid the 'Your clock is ahead/behind?' I have IE8 installed but it won't open any https website. Any other browsers that work well with XP? SSL/TLS used in encrypting the handshake between the endpoint hosts involves sending time sensitive tokens. If the time of one host is way off (I don't know by how much) then the other end thinks the token it got has already expired, and the session gets cancelled. What is so tough about keeping your host correct for its time? You have an Internet connection, so you can access the 2nd and 3rd tier atomic clocks to keep your OS (and RTC) clock in sync. I don't remember under what conditions Windows XP will do an NTP (Network Time Protocol) sync. One is when you connect to a domain where the PDC provides the time sync, but you're not likely in a corporate domain network. I'd have to research, but my guess the default time sync is once per week for XP. Your RTC chip shouldn't drift by more than a minute, or two, over an entire year, so weekly updates mean you won't have SSL connect issues. You can also get atomic clock sync software for free. I used to use Socke****ch, even in later versions of Windows. Socke****ch came with a long list of time servers. The list was old, so many were dead (no longer existed) or were unreachable. I went through the list to delete the dead ones although that was just me being neat until I realized they demoted the dead ones. They would test the lag in response from the time servers (they tried 5 at a time) and kept a score on how quick you got a response, so the fastest ones got used. You can also edit the list to add your own, like I added a couple public ones ran by a local university. Eventually I discarded Socke****ch because I found the registry settings for the Windows Time service which let me change the sync interval to once per day. As with Socke****ch, I can edit registry settings to add NTP servers, so I added the university's. The NTP servers are listed under: HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\Curr entVersion\DateTime\Servers Then I went into the time config, and selected one of those. The Microsoft ones are the default ones, so they get slammed by the vast majority of Windows hosts and can get too busy. A better choice would be to change to using time.nist.gov which Microsoft already pre-defined. If you want to change the NTP polling interval, there are plenty of online articles telling which registry entries to edit. Easier is to use the command-line program w32tm.exe. You can add an event in Task Scheduler to run "w32tm.exe /resync /nowait" that runs once per day, or at whatever interval you want. Run "w32tm.exe /?" to see a list of all its arguments. I found it easier to schedule the resync event than have to remember where in the registry to shorten the polling interval. Actually I schedule a .bat file to run once per day which has: @echo off cls echo Force a time synchronization ... echo (This batch script must be ran inside an elevated command shell.) :REM - Make sure the time service is running. net start w32time :REM Force a time sync. w32tm /resync /nowait Whether using the batch file or the .exe file, the scheduled event MUST run with elevated privileges. I simply added the 'net start' command to ensure the Windows Time service was in Running state. Such commands are asynchronous: they send a request to start the service, but the command does not wait until the service is ready. Well, if the service was stopped for some reason, it could take longer to startup than when the w32tm command was next executed in the batch file. Oh well, if it wasn't ready today, the service will be ready tomorrow. I'm sync'ing once per day. The defaults are something like at Windows startup, once per week, or at login to a domain, so my once-per-day sync was a lot shorter (I never logout unless I have to, and leave Windows running 24x7). I could use 3rd party time sync software, but it wouldn't do any more than what I can by editing the registry to add my own NTP servers or to change the polling interval (for which a scheduled event is easier to manage instead of registry edits). Yes, you *must* have your host synchronized regarding its time for encrypted handshaking to work between endpoint hosts. The host to which you connect is not an NTP server. It's not their job to run an NTP server to keep your host up to date on its time and date. Since the endpoints are independent, they don't sync with each other, so they sync with a reference, like an NTP server that is part of the worldwide mesh network of NTP servers. You don't get to sync with tier 1 NTP servers. Only gov't and colleges can do that. You get to use 2nd or 3rd tier NTP servers, and only those that are publicly accessible. By your endpoint synchronizing to an NTP server, and by the server to which you want to connect also synchronizing to an NTP server (they don't have to be the same one), the endpoint hosts will have times that are very close and prevent the SSL/TLS tokens from looking like they are already expired when received. When the tokens are created, they are timestamped. There is also an expiration, but I don't know what that it. The expiration allows some slack to afford a small difference in times between the endpoint hosts. I don't know if there is a default expiration in the protocol, or if the endpoint is allowed to determine how much difference in timestamp is too much. I didn't dig that deep into NTP. If instead the "Your clock is ahead/behind" message is about your timezone, sounds like a timezone sync problem due to Daylight Savings. Since Windows XP support ended long ago (extended support ended in 2014, and mainstream support died before that), you won't be getting any updates to the DST table. Previously the DST on/off dates were not fixed, so a table held when DST went on or off. If you don't care about the timezone on your computer matching the timezone in your region, you could just turn off the "automatic" change. Or, when you go around your house changing all your other clocks, you could also change your computer's clock. Go into the Date & Time settings, Date and Time tab, and deselect the "Notify me when the clock changes" option. Then click on the "Change time zone" button, and deselect the "Automatically adjust clock for Daylight Saving Time" option. Not everywhere bothers with the DST idiocracy. The notify setting may be all you need. I'm doing a resync every day, and it's possible the clock changes by a few milliseconds, but I don't get a prompt telling me there was a sync. Likely the prompt shows only when the clock changes by some threshold. |
#5
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XP Browser
On 7/8/2020 5:29 AM, Norm Cook wrote:
Using Chrome For XP Version 49.0.2623.75 Works well despite warnings that it will soon no longer be supported. Has any figured out how to avoid the 'Your clock is ahead/behind?' It's possible that the motherboard's battery needs to be replaced - that battery maintains the clock when computer is shut down or hibernating. If you decide to replace it, write down all of your BIOS settings and reenter them after the battery replacement. Some motherboards give you an option to backup settings to a USB thumb drive. This would be a rare capability to find on an old XP device. -- Jeff Barnett |
#6
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On 7/8/2020 7:29 AM, Norm Cook wrote:
Using Chrome For XP Version 49.0.2623.75 Works well despite warnings that it will soon no longer be supported. Has any figured out how to avoid the 'Your clock is ahead/behind?' I have IE8 installed but it won't open any https website. Any other browsers that work well with XP? Norm: FWIIW I am using "MyPal 28.10.0" and it seems to work well for most things except video which I can do without. More Info; https://feodor2.github.io/Mypal/ Download; https://github.com/Feodor2/Mypal/releases HTH & GL John -- |
#7
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XP Browser
"Norm Cook" wrote in news:re4all$m3n$1@dont-
email.me: Using Chrome For XP Version 49.0.2623.75 Works well despite warnings that it will soon no longer be supported. Has any figured out how to avoid the 'Your clock is ahead/behind?' I have IE8 installed but it won't open any https website. Any other browsers that work well with XP? I had been using Chrome version 49.0.2623.112 which worked really well at first, but then became slower and slower and slower with "Establishing secure connection..." Rather than try to figure out that problem, I switched back to Firefox 52.9.0 which so far has been fine. Dee |
#8
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XP Browser
On Wed, 8 Jul 2020 06:29:06 -0500, "Norm Cook"
wrote: Using Chrome For XP Version 49.0.2623.75 Works well despite warnings that it will soon no longer be supported. Has any figured out how to avoid the 'Your clock is ahead/behind?' I use Firefox 41 where possible, because it runs NoScript, and therefore stops news sites interrupting my reading with loud voices. It also stops the text jumpinmg around when I'm trying to read it while it loads graphics that I'm not interested in looking at. For things that don't work under Firfox I use Maxthon, but that tends to do the things that NoScript stops -- lets loud voices interrupt, and makes the text jump around. .. -- Steve Hayes http://www.khanya.org.za/stevesig.htm http://khanya.wordpress.com |
#9
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"Steve Hayes" wrote
| | I use Firefox 41 where possible, because it runs NoScript For what it's worth, I'm running FF 52.9 with NoScript 5.1.9. I have xpinstall.signatures.required set to false. I don't recall the details on this, but the way I remember it was that ESR releases allow using "unverified" extensions. I can't seem to find any other prefs settings that might affect the functionality. I have several extensions in the add-ons list that show a ninny message above the listing: "NoScript could not be verified. Proceed with caution." Proceed with caution. So I guess it should be fine as long as you wear your seatbelt, don't drive over the speed limit, and you watch out for deer running across the road. |
#10
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XP Browser
"John Dulak" wrote
| FWIIW I am using "MyPal 28.10.0" and it seems to work well for most things | except video which I can do without. | I got curious about this, as I'd never heard of it. MyPal, despite being a very dumb name, seems to be based on the very latest Pale Moon. And unlike the latest New Moon, it seems to work with all of my extensions just fine. (NoScript, Secret Agent, Disable Style Button, Restore View Source, etc.) On the other hand, when I installed, it tried to call out to 3 different IPs without asking. After shutting off all possible call-home and update settings, I started installing extensions. But it tried to call 69.195.158.198 with each install! Huh? That resolve's to "Joe's Datacenter, LLC". That seems to be a legitimate hosting site, but still... I'm wondering whether anyone knows more about this product. It seems very promising, but not if it's tracking usage with spyware reporting. |
#11
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On 7/10/2020 9:03 AM, Mayayana wrote:
I got curious about this, as I'd never heard of it. MyPal, despite being a very dumb name, seems to be based on the very latest Pale Moon. And unlike the latest New Moon, it seems to work with all of my extensions just fine. (NoScript, Secret Agent, Disable Style Button, Restore View Source, etc.) On the other hand, when I installed, it tried to call out to 3 different IPs without asking. After shutting off all possible call-home and update settings, I started installing extensions. But it tried to call 69.195.158.198 with each install! Huh? That resolve's to "Joe's Datacenter, LLC". That seems to be a legitimate hosting site, but still... I'm wondering whether anyone knows more about this product. It seems very promising, but not if it's tracking usage with spyware reporting. Mayayana; It has been a long tome since I first installed MyPal but I don't recall it doing anything nefarious when first run. I think it just went to some sort of welcome or release notes page. When installing new versions it does nothing but offer to restart. John -- |
#12
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"John Dulak" wrote
| It has been a long tome since I first installed MyPal but I don't recall it | doing anything nefarious when first run. I think it just went to some sort of | welcome or release notes page. That's typical. Many browsers now try to do that. And some extensions. So that may be it. Still, it's an awfully lot of calling home, and the attempts when extensions were loaded were all to the same IP, not to those extension homepages. That's weird. So I was wondering if other people know about it. Other than that it's very promising; apparently an up-to-date version of gecko without that crap and restrictions of late-model Firefox. |
#13
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You are not authorised to read my posts in plain text. Please install HTML enabled newsreader, such as latest Thunderbird https://www.thunderbird.net, to benefit from solutions posted in my posts.
-- With over 1.2 billion devices now running Windows 10, customer satisfaction is higher than any previous version of windows. |
#14
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On Fri, 10 Jul 2020 at 20:40:44, Mayayana
wrote: "John Dulak" wrote | It has been a long tome since I first installed MyPal but I don't recall it | doing anything nefarious when first run. I think it just went to some sort of | welcome or release notes page. That's typical. Many browsers now try to do that. And some extensions. So that may be it. Still, it's an Not just browsers and extensions; a lot of software in general. Even IrfanView (or its add-on package [which I always get at the same time], I don't remember for sure, though I think it's the core) takes you to a page showing what's new in the new edition. I don't mind that. (Don't even mind if that visit _does_ collect some data about me, though I've no reason to believe it does.) awfully lot of calling home, and the attempts when extensions were loaded were all to the same IP, not to those extension homepages. That's weird. So I was wondering if other people know about it. Other than that it's very promising; apparently an up-to-date version of gecko without that crap and restrictions of late-model Firefox. Does that mean it works with the old-style extensions that versions after 5x (I can never remember whether it's 52 or 59 - one is the extensions and one XP, IIRR) won't? -- J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf "Bother," said Pooh, as Windows crashed into piglet. |
#15
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"J. P. Gilliver (John)" wrote
| Not just browsers and extensions; a lot of software in general. Even | IrfanView I don't think it's ever done that to me, but I think there's a checkbox I uncheck in the installer. (IV does just about everything just right. But calling someone to report extensions installed? That's just weird. | Does that mean it works with the old-style extensions that versions | after 5x (I can never remember whether it's 52 or 59 - one is the | extensions and one XP, IIRR) won't? Yes. It seems to be the very latest gecko update, coming out just after Pale Moon, but it works with everything. I haven't updated to the latest New Moon because it broke my CSS toggle button. But that works just fine in MyPal. Of course, those extensions are not so easy to get anymore, but I always save them as part of my backup. |
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