Win10 Mail Deletes Comcast Web Email

I've got a Win10 Home laptop, version 10.0.10586. I'm using the default
Microsoft Mail email program to collect my POP3 Comcast email. I dont have
any Microsoft accounts. None.

Since getting the laptop, I decided to try the default Microsoft Mail
program. In the past, I could permanently delete email using Microsoft
Mail, and it was still on my POP3 web Comcast account. This morning, I did
another permanently delete email, but this time, it was also deleted from
my web account. Crap.

So, was Microsoft Mail supposed to do this in the past, but didn't, or was
it not supposed to ever do this, and now it did?

I'm also using Thunderbird email.

TIA

On Sun, 7 Aug 2016 21:26:36 -0000 (UTC), Boris wrote:

I've got a Win10 Home laptop, version 10.0.10586. I'm using the default
Microsoft Mail email program to collect my POP3 Comcast email. I dont have
any Microsoft accounts. None.

Since getting the laptop, I decided to try the default Microsoft Mail
program. In the past, I could permanently delete email using Microsoft
Mail, and it was still on my POP3 web Comcast account. This morning, I did
another permanently delete email, but this time, it was also deleted from
my web account. Crap.

So, was Microsoft Mail supposed to do this in the past, but didn't, or was
it not supposed to ever do this, and now it did?

I'm also using Thunderbird email.

TIA

Boris, read the information at this link:

https://support.tigertech.net/windows-mail-lmos

Boris wrote:
I've got a Win10 Home laptop, version 10.0.10586. I'm using the default
Microsoft Mail email program to collect my POP3 Comcast email. I dont have
any Microsoft accounts. None.

Since getting the laptop, I decided to try the default Microsoft Mail
program. In the past, I could permanently delete email using Microsoft
Mail, and it was still on my POP3 web Comcast account. This morning, I did
another permanently delete email, but this time, it was also deleted from
my web account. Crap.

So, was Microsoft Mail supposed to do this in the past, but didn't, or was
it not supposed to ever do this, and now it did?

I'm also using Thunderbird email.

TIA

Did it connect using IMAP instead of POP3 ?

Paul

On 07 Aug 2016, Boris wrote in
alt.comp.os.windows-10:

I've got a Win10 Home laptop, version 10.0.10586. I'm using the
default Microsoft Mail email program to collect my POP3 Comcast
email.

Are you sure? I thought Win10's email program didn't do POP3.

This morning, I did another permanently delete email, but this
time, it was also deleted from my web account. Crap.

It sounds to me like you're mistaken about the POP connection and
that you are really connected via IMAP. In that case, this is normal
behavior.

Paul wrote in :

Boris wrote:
I've got a Win10 Home laptop, version 10.0.10586. I'm using the
default Microsoft Mail email program to collect my POP3 Comcast
email. I dont have any Microsoft accounts. None.

Since getting the laptop, I decided to try the default Microsoft Mail
program. In the past, I could permanently delete email using
Microsoft Mail, and it was still on my POP3 web Comcast account.
This morning, I did another permanently delete email, but this time,
it was also deleted from my web account. Crap.

So, was Microsoft Mail supposed to do this in the past, but didn't,
or was it not supposed to ever do this, and now it did?

I'm also using Thunderbird email.

TIA

Did it connect using IMAP instead of POP3 ?

Paul


That's the thing...when I set up Microsoft Mail months ago. I chose
Other type of account (not Microsoft, Gmail, Yahoo, etc.), and it just
automatically set it up. I didn't have to specify IMAP or POP3, or even
in/outgoing server names. And, I don't have IMAP set up with Comcast,
although it allows IMAP.

I was never able to figure out if the Microsoft Mail was using IMAP, but
I doubt it, because like I said, I never set up IMAP with any of my
other client based email programs which query the Comcast POP3 servers.

On 07 Aug 2016, Boris wrote in
alt.comp.os.windows-10:

That's the thing...when I set up Microsoft Mail months ago. I
chose Other type of account (not Microsoft, Gmail, Yahoo, etc.),
and it just automatically set it up. I didn't have to specify
IMAP or POP3, or even in/outgoing server names. And, I don't have
IMAP set up with Comcast, although it allows IMAP.

I don't think you have to set up anything on Comcast's end any more.
IMAP is enabled by default.

Stormin' Norman wrote in
:

On Sun, 7 Aug 2016 21:26:36 -0000 (UTC), Boris
wrote:

I've got a Win10 Home laptop, version 10.0.10586. I'm using the
default Microsoft Mail email program to collect my POP3 Comcast email.
I dont have any Microsoft accounts. None.

Since getting the laptop, I decided to try the default Microsoft Mail
program. In the past, I could permanently delete email using
Microsoft Mail, and it was still on my POP3 web Comcast account. This
morning, I did another permanently delete email, but this time, it was
also deleted from my web account. Crap.

So, was Microsoft Mail supposed to do this in the past, but didn't, or
was it not supposed to ever do this, and now it did?

I'm also using Thunderbird email.

TIA

Boris, read the information at this link:

https://support.tigertech.net/windows-mail-lmos

Hi there,

It looks like that article is for Windows Mail/Windows Live Mail, which
as far as I know, won't work on Win10, rather than the Win10 supplied
Microsoft Mail.

By the way, on all my other email clients, I do have "leave on server"
enabled so that I can read email from any machine. My problem today is
that Microsoft Mail deleted mail from my Comcast server's delete box
when I told Microsoft Mail on my Win10 machine to permanently delete.

That hadn't happened in the past. Microsoft Mail's permanently delete
was a safe command just recently. Seems no more.

Nil wrote in
:

On 07 Aug 2016, Boris wrote in
alt.comp.os.windows-10:

I've got a Win10 Home laptop, version 10.0.10586. I'm using the
default Microsoft Mail email program to collect my POP3 Comcast
email.

Are you sure? I thought Win10's email program didn't do POP3.
Hi, Nil,

If you look at step 11, he

http://www.simplehelp.net/2015/09/16...cast-email-in-
windows-10/

You'll see Other Account, POP, IMAP. I chose this, and was prepared to
be asked further down the line for Comcast email server settings. But,
I wasn't asked. (Looks like Comcast wanted me to use Advanced
Setup,which I don't remember seeing months ago, but it may have been
there). Most likely, the server setup was done for IMAP, without me
knowing.

However, had I chosen Advanced Setup, it looks like I would have had a
choice of POP or IMAP, but Comcast does want me to use IMAP here, as
shown in step 13.

I do find it odd that under Internet email, it says "POP or IMAP
accounts that let you view your email in a web browser". I guess, that
had I chosen this route, I'd have to use Edge/IE11/Firefox, etc to view
email. Not what I want. I want to have my email local.

This morning, I did another permanently delete email, but this
time, it was also deleted from my web account. Crap.

It sounds to me like you're mistaken about the POP connection and
that you are really connected via IMAP. In that case, this is normal
behavior.

I'll bet you're right.

The machine I'm on now runs Windows 7 home, with Windows Live Mail 12,
under POP3.

Thanks for the reply.

On Sun, 7 Aug 2016 23:38:10 -0000 (UTC), Boris
wrote:


It looks like that article is for Windows Mail/Windows Live Mail, which
as far as I know, won't work on Win10, rather than the Win10 supplied
Microsoft Mail.



Windows Live Mail definitely *does* work on Windows 10.

Ken Blake wrote in
:

On Sun, 7 Aug 2016 23:38:10 -0000 (UTC), Boris
wrote:


It looks like that article is for Windows Mail/Windows Live Mail,
which as far as I know, won't work on Win10, rather than the Win10
supplied Microsoft Mail.



Windows Live Mail definitely *does* work on Windows 10.


You're right.

I remember when my wife's Windows 8.1 laptop auto installed Windows 10.
She was using Windows Live Mail (I think from Windows Live Essentials
2011) with 8.1, and when the Windows 10 install happened, we wondered if
that was goint to break Windows Live Mail. No, it didn't. It worked
perfectly.

I then thought that I could also install Windows Live Mail on my new
Windows 10 laptop, and went here to get Windows Essentials 2012:

https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/...nload-windows-
essential
s

Under the column heading "Windows version", Windows 10 was not listed.

Clicking on "View system requirements" also did not list Windows 10. It
listed:

"Operating system. 32- or 64-bit version of Windows 7, or 32- or 64-bit
version of Windows 8, or Windows Server 2008 R2."

If you go he

https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/help/13785

"What operating system do I need to install Windows Essentials 2012?


Windows Essentials 2012 programs will run on Windows 7 (32-bit or 64-bit
versions), Windows 8.1 (32-bit or 64-bit versions), Windows Server 2008
R2, or Windows Server 2008 with Service Pack 2 and the Platform Update
for Windows Server 2008, or Windows Server 2012. Additional installation
requirements might be necessary to run Windows Essentials 2012 on
Windows Server or N SKUs."

On the other hand, gong back to the first link I list above, under the
wording "View System Requirements" (don't click on it this time), it
states, "Windows Essentials 2012 works with Windows 7, Windows 8,
Windows 8.1, and Windows 10. Windows Essentials includes the following
programs:"

I will try.

Thanks.

Boris wrote:

I've got a Win10 Home laptop, version 10.0.10586. I'm using the default
Microsoft Mail email program to collect my POP3 Comcast email. I dont have
any Microsoft accounts. None.

Since getting the laptop, I decided to try the default Microsoft Mail
program. In the past, I could permanently delete email using Microsoft
Mail, and it was still on my POP3 web Comcast account. This morning, I did
another permanently delete email, but this time, it was also deleted from
my web account. Crap.

So, was Microsoft Mail supposed to do this in the past, but didn't, or was
it not supposed to ever do this, and now it did?

I'm also using Thunderbird email.

The default for all POP e-mail clients that I have seen is to perform
the standard procedure of issuing RETR(ieve) followed by DELE(te)
commands. That means the POP client would retrieve the message and then
tell the server to delete its copy. The only exceptions that I've seen
for POP clients are "monitoring" programs: those that monitor your
e-mail accounts rather than act as full e-mail clients. However, the
better ones do not issue a RETR command (after issuing LIST or UID to
get a list of messages on the server). Instead they issue TOP n which
retrieves only the headers and optionally the first n lines of the body.
POP clients that issue TOP commands do not follow with DELE commands.
They are monitoring, not managing. POP clients that issue a RETR will,
by default, follow with a DELE command.

If it up to the *user* to decide how they configure their POP client.
There should be an option to "Leave message on server". That will omit
issuing a DELE command after issuing the RETR command.

I suspect you don't remember having to configure your old e-mail clients
to "leave message on server". Even way back to Outlook Express, its
default POP behavior was to issue RETR followed by DELE *unless* you
changed its configuration to enable the "leave message on server"
option.

https://www.greennet.org.uk/support/...essages-server
https://support.tigertech.net/thunderbird-lmos

So even Thunderbird's default is to issue RETR followed by DELE *unless*
you configure it otherwise. When you search on "pop leave keep message
on server", you find lots of articles telling you to *enable* an option
(which omits the DELE after RETR). That's because the default for POP
clients is to RETR followed by DELE.

"My Comcast e-mail". For a long time, Comcast only had POP access to
their e-mail service. They added IMAP quite awhile ago (Feb 2015).
They were perhaps the last major e-mail provider to add IMAP support.
They actually had IMAP support over a year before that but it was by
invite: they announced availability but you had to request adding IMAP
support to your account and wait up to 72 hours before the option became
available. You might like IMAP better than POP. IMAP keeps local
clients in sync with the server, so multiple IMAP clients (or
consecutive IMAP clients when migrating from one to another) will all
have the same content: what is on the IMAP server is on the IMAP client
and what one IMAP client sees is the same as seen by another IMAP
client.

On Mon, 8 Aug 2016 03:27:40 -0000 (UTC), Boris
wrote:

Ken Blake wrote in
:

On Sun, 7 Aug 2016 23:38:10 -0000 (UTC), Boris
wrote:


It looks like that article is for Windows Mail/Windows Live Mail,
which as far as I know, won't work on Win10, rather than the Win10
supplied Microsoft Mail.



Windows Live Mail definitely *does* work on Windows 10.


You're right.

I remember when my wife's Windows 8.1 laptop auto installed Windows 10.
She was using Windows Live Mail (I think from Windows Live Essentials
2011) with 8.1, and when the Windows 10 install happened, we wondered if
that was goint to break Windows Live Mail. No, it didn't. It worked
perfectly.


I wouldn't say "perfectly," but it works. Personally, I think it's a
very poor e-mail client.

VanguardLH wrote in :

Boris wrote:

I've got a Win10 Home laptop, version 10.0.10586. I'm using the
default Microsoft Mail email program to collect my POP3 Comcast
email. I dont have any Microsoft accounts. None.

Since getting the laptop, I decided to try the default Microsoft Mail
program. In the past, I could permanently delete email using
Microsoft Mail, and it was still on my POP3 web Comcast account.
This morning, I did another permanently delete email, but this time,
it was also deleted from my web account. Crap.

So, was Microsoft Mail supposed to do this in the past, but didn't,
or was it not supposed to ever do this, and now it did?

I'm also using Thunderbird email.

The default for all POP e-mail clients that I have seen is to perform
the standard procedure of issuing RETR(ieve) followed by DELE(te)
commands. That means the POP client would retrieve the message and
then tell the server to delete its copy. The only exceptions that
I've seen for POP clients are "monitoring" programs: those that
monitor your e-mail accounts rather than act as full e-mail clients.
However, the better ones do not issue a RETR command (after issuing
LIST or UID to get a list of messages on the server). Instead they
issue TOP n which retrieves only the headers and optionally the first
n lines of the body. POP clients that issue TOP commands do not follow
with DELE commands. They are monitoring, not managing. POP clients
that issue a RETR will, by default, follow with a DELE command.

If it up to the *user* to decide how they configure their POP client.
There should be an option to "Leave message on server". That will
omit issuing a DELE command after issuing the RETR command.

I suspect you don't remember having to configure your old e-mail
clients to "leave message on server". Even way back to Outlook
Express, its default POP behavior was to issue RETR followed by DELE
*unless* you changed its configuration to enable the "leave message on
server" option.

With every email client I've ever used (including OE, Thunderbird,
Eudora, etc.), I've always set them to leave mail on server, because I
want to be able to read and store email on every machine in the house.

I am running Thunderbird on one of my Win10 laptops, configured to leave
mail on server.

https://www.greennet.org.uk/support/...derbird-leave-
message
s-server https://support.tigertech.net/thunderbird-lmos

So even Thunderbird's default is to issue RETR followed by DELE
*unless* you configure it otherwise. When you search on "pop leave
keep message on server", you find lots of articles telling you to
*enable* an option (which omits the DELE after RETR). That's because
the default for POP clients is to RETR followed by DELE.

"My Comcast e-mail". For a long time, Comcast only had POP access to
their e-mail service. They added IMAP quite awhile ago (Feb 2015).
They were perhaps the last major e-mail provider to add IMAP support.
They actually had IMAP support over a year before that but it was by
invite: they announced availability but you had to request adding IMAP
support to your account and wait up to 72 hours before the option
became available.

I do remember that.

You might like IMAP better than POP. IMAP keeps
local clients in sync with the server, so multiple IMAP clients (or
consecutive IMAP clients when migrating from one to another) will all
have the same content: what is on the IMAP server is on the IMAP
client and what one IMAP client sees is the same as seen by another
IMAP client.

I will consider this.

Thanks.

Boris wrote:

VanguardLH wrote in :

Boris wrote:

I've got a Win10 Home laptop, version 10.0.10586. I'm using the
default Microsoft Mail email program to collect my POP3 Comcast
email. I dont have any Microsoft accounts. None.

Since getting the laptop, I decided to try the default Microsoft Mail
program. In the past, I could permanently delete email using
Microsoft Mail, and it was still on my POP3 web Comcast account.
This morning, I did another permanently delete email, but this time,
it was also deleted from my web account. Crap.

So, was Microsoft Mail supposed to do this in the past, but didn't,
or was it not supposed to ever do this, and now it did?

I'm also using Thunderbird email.

The default for all POP e-mail clients that I have seen is to perform
the standard procedure of issuing RETR(ieve) followed by DELE(te)
commands. That means the POP client would retrieve the message and
then tell the server to delete its copy. The only exceptions that
I've seen for POP clients are "monitoring" programs: those that
monitor your e-mail accounts rather than act as full e-mail clients.
However, the better ones do not issue a RETR command (after issuing
LIST or UID to get a list of messages on the server). Instead they
issue TOP n which retrieves only the headers and optionally the first
n lines of the body. POP clients that issue TOP commands do not follow
with DELE commands. They are monitoring, not managing. POP clients
that issue a RETR will, by default, follow with a DELE command.

If it up to the *user* to decide how they configure their POP client.
There should be an option to "Leave message on server". That will
omit issuing a DELE command after issuing the RETR command.

I suspect you don't remember having to configure your old e-mail
clients to "leave message on server". Even way back to Outlook
Express, its default POP behavior was to issue RETR followed by DELE
*unless* you changed its configuration to enable the "leave message on
server" option.

With every email client I've ever used (including OE, Thunderbird,
Eudora, etc.), I've always set them to leave mail on server, because I
want to be able to read and store email on every machine in the house.

That's why I wonder if you forgot to configure the Win10 e-mail client
to "leave message on server". However, as Nil queried, does the Win10
e-mail client even do POP?

As for the article you cited about how to configure the Win10 e-mail app
to access a Comcast e-mail account, I suspect the author is confused.
You do not log into "webmail". A local e-mail client logs into a
[e-mail] server. Webmail refers to the client via web browser used to
access your e-mail account; i.e., you use a web browser to connect to
their site and navigate to a web page that is their "webmail client" to
access your e-mail account. Even e-mail apps connect to a server. They
don't go screenscraping a webmail client (like how, for example,
YahooPOPs works to utilize the webmail client to access a Yahoo account
when Yahoo yanked away POP access to free accounts).

Since the Win10 mail app is showing more than just the Inbox folder, it
is not using POP. POP only understands the concept of a mailbox. There
are no folders in a mailbox. There are no commands in POP to add,
delete, or select folders. When using the webmail client to your
account, what you see as its Inbox folder is what that server presents
as the mailbox to a POP client. There is no way for a POP client to
show you the Sent [Items], Deleted [Items] or Trash, or Junk/Spam, or
user-created folders in your account. It can only retrieve the contents
of the mailbox and that's just the Inbox folder as represented by the
webmail client. So the Win10 mail app is using IMAP which does support
folders.

With IMAP access, the IMAP client can only subscribe to those folders to
which it is told to subscribe (if the user is offered that level of
configurability which is found in robust desktop e-mail programs but not
in small e-mail apps) and then only to those folders that the server
will publish (announce to the client). For example, you can go into a
Gmail account (using a webmail client) to decide which folders will be
accessible via IMAP, and the others cannot be seen by the client (the
server won't announce them to the client) so the client cannot subscribe
to them.

Since you are now using IMAP (instead of POP), the client and server
stay in sync. That means when you delete a message in the client that
it also gets deleted up on the server (and to every other IMAP client
that connects to the same e-mail account). The point of IMAP is not
only to support folders but keep everything in sync. Instead of
deleting messages you don't want to see in your Inbox because you want
to keep them around for awhile but not clutter your Inbox, create a
folder or use the Archive folder to move the less desirable but still
wanted messages from the Inbox to the other/archive folder. If you
delete then the server obeys. If you move to another folder, the server
obeys. It did what you asked.

If the Windows 10 mail app does support POP, you cannot use its wizard
to automatically make decisions for you regarding which protocol to use.
There is a bias to using IMAP due to sync and folder support. You need
to use the manual or advance config method. Usually that means you do
NOT input your e-mail address. The wizard will see your e-mail address
and note its domain to choose from the hardcoded preselections on how to
configure for that server and probably bias towards using IMAP. You
need to leave the e-mail address field empty, select manual or advanced
configuration, and in those screens input the POP server settings.

http://www.howtogeek.com/226010/how-...in-windows-10/

That mentions the advanced configuration will let you define a POP
account inside the Windows 10 mail app. While the article does not
mention it, I suspect you need to leave blank any query about your
e-mail address and go ahead with no specified e-mail address to get into
the advance configuration.

Here's a tutorial:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5BojigJzUGg

On 08/07/16 15:02, Stormin' Norman so wittily quipped:
On Sun, 7 Aug 2016 21:26:36 -0000 (UTC), Boris wrote:

I've got a Win10 Home laptop, version 10.0.10586. I'm using the default
Microsoft Mail email program to collect my POP3 Comcast email. I dont have
any Microsoft accounts. None.

Since getting the laptop, I decided to try the default Microsoft Mail
program. In the past, I could permanently delete email using Microsoft
Mail, and it was still on my POP3 web Comcast account. This morning, I did
another permanently delete email, but this time, it was also deleted from
my web account. Crap.

So, was Microsoft Mail supposed to do this in the past, but didn't, or was
it not supposed to ever do this, and now it did?

I'm also using Thunderbird email.

TIA

Boris, read the information at this link:

https://support.tigertech.net/windows-mail-lmos


strangely, the screen shots have a nice 3D skeuomorphic look to them,
unlike Win-10-nic [is it the SAME program this web site discusses?]

keep in mind Win-10-nic and "the METRO" _TAKE_ _CONFIG_ _THINGS_ _AWAY_
_FROM_ _YOU_ so maybe this won't work in Win-10-nic?


just a thought... I hate the "the METRO" mail client. I tried it _ONCE_
and it ****ed up my IMAP inbox by moving **** around and re-naming the
trashcan. As I recall I created a test IMAP login for it, so no REAL
damage to the REAL IMAP mail. [it was still being beta tested by
insiders at that time]. But the whole "the METRO"-ness nauseated me,
and that's NEVER been fixed.


--
your story is so touching, but it sounds just like a lie
"Straighten up and fly right"