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Lost space on HDD.



 
 
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  #16  
Old March 4th 19, 05:51 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Dan Purgert
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 281
Default Lost space on HDD.

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Ken Blake wrote:
[...]
Some people point out that the official international standard defines
the "T" of TB as one trillion, not 1,099,511,637,776. Correct though
they are, using the binary value of TB is so well established in the
computer world that I consider using the decimal value of a trillion
to be deceptive marketing on the part of the hard drive manufacturer.


Yeah, it's getting to that point -- my cutoff will probably be
Exabyte-range (we'll rise above 10% error). But, in general, I think
the population at large is more concerned with seeing "10Terabyte!" on
their drive's packaging than "9.09T"


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--
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|_|_|O| Github: https://github.com/dpurgert
|O|O|O| PGP: 05CA 9A50 3F2E 1335 4DC5 4AEE 8E11 DDF3 1279 A281
Ads
  #17  
Old March 4th 19, 06:02 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Christoph Müller
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5
Default Lost space on HDD.

Am 04.03.2019 um 15:48 schrieb Wolf K:
On 2019-03-03 21:29, Peter Jason wrote:


Where & what is this lost 191GB?


Similar problem he Missing 759 GB from 884 GB HD.

total size 884 GB

ProgrammData 6,62 GB
User 35,5 GB
Windows 33,2 GB
Drivers 0,938 GB
Intel 0,000232 GB
NVIDIA Corp. 0 GB
PerfLogs 0 GB
Programs 3,03 GB
Programs (x86) 3,27 GB
report 0 GB

Sum 83 GB
should be free 801 GB

displayed free 42,5 GB
so unknown space 759 GB

It's not lost. It's* used for housekeeping,


759 GB only for housekeeping?

and is absolutely necessary.


But not in this size.

Formatting sets aside a fixed space for this, which varies with the
file-system.

Also, it's 182 MB, not 191GB


GB here. Not MB.

--
Christoph Müller
https://www.astrail.de
  #18  
Old March 4th 19, 08:25 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Paul[_32_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 11,873
Default Lost space on HDD.

Christoph Müller wrote:
Am 04.03.2019 um 15:48 schrieb Wolf K:
On 2019-03-03 21:29, Peter Jason wrote:


Where & what is this lost 191GB?


Similar problem he Missing 759 GB from 884 GB HD.

total size 884 GB

ProgrammData 6,62 GB
User 35,5 GB
Windows 33,2 GB
Drivers 0,938 GB
Intel 0,000232 GB
NVIDIA Corp. 0 GB
PerfLogs 0 GB
Programs 3,03 GB
Programs (x86) 3,27 GB
report 0 GB

Sum 83 GB
should be free 801 GB

displayed free 42,5 GB
so unknown space 759 GB

It's not lost. It's used for housekeeping,


759 GB only for housekeeping?

and is absolutely necessary.


But not in this size.

Formatting sets aside a fixed space for this, which varies with the
file-system.

Also, it's 182 MB, not 191GB


GB here. Not MB.


It could be inside C:\System Volume Information

Shadow copies are kept in there.

System Restore Points are kept in there (System Protection).

Something may not be cleaning up after itself.

Few utilities do a good job of displaying the SVI folder.

It's even possible you've enabled File History or have
set up some sort of backup software, and that's what is
eating space.

*******

One way to examine the C: volume is

1) Make a backup with Macrium Reflect Free.
Enable compression so it takes less space.

2) Right-click the .mrimg file (700GB+) and
select "Examine" from the right-click menu.

You can specify a different letter for the mounted volume.

The important thing is the tick box near the bottom
of the dialog that says "give access to restricted areas".
For this is why you are using this method.

By poking at a "copy" of the C: drive, you cannot hurt
anything. If you want to look inside SVI, you can.

In this example, I mount a backup of a C: drive as letter T: .
And can see inside the System Volume Information folder
inside that backup.

https://i.postimg.cc/43pTL29f/lookin...nformation.gif

Paul
  #19  
Old March 4th 19, 09:55 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Peter Jason
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,310
Default Lost space on HDD.

On Mon, 4 Mar 2019 18:02:18 +0100, Christoph
Müller wrote:

Am 04.03.2019 um 15:48 schrieb Wolf K:
On 2019-03-03 21:29, Peter Jason wrote:


Where & what is this lost 191GB?


Similar problem he Missing 759 GB from 884 GB HD.

total size 884 GB

ProgrammData 6,62 GB
User 35,5 GB
Windows 33,2 GB
Drivers 0,938 GB
Intel 0,000232 GB
NVIDIA Corp. 0 GB
PerfLogs 0 GB
Programs 3,03 GB
Programs (x86) 3,27 GB
report 0 GB

Sum 83 GB
should be free 801 GB

displayed free 42,5 GB
so unknown space 759 GB

It's not lost. It's* used for housekeeping,


759 GB only for housekeeping?

and is absolutely necessary.


But not in this size.

Formatting sets aside a fixed space for this, which varies with the
file-system.

Also, it's 182 MB, not 191GB


GB here. Not MB.


As mentioned above, I transferred all the contents
over to another drive, then formatted the problem
drive, re-assigned the original drive letter,
transferred back all the old contents, and so got
back all the space.
  #20  
Old March 4th 19, 10:22 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Char Jackson
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,449
Default Lost space on HDD.

On Tue, 05 Mar 2019 07:55:46 +1100, Peter Jason wrote:

On Mon, 4 Mar 2019 18:02:18 +0100, Christoph
Müller wrote:

Am 04.03.2019 um 15:48 schrieb Wolf K:
On 2019-03-03 21:29, Peter Jason wrote:


Where & what is this lost 191GB?


Similar problem he Missing 759 GB from 884 GB HD.

total size 884 GB

ProgrammData 6,62 GB
User 35,5 GB
Windows 33,2 GB
Drivers 0,938 GB
Intel 0,000232 GB
NVIDIA Corp. 0 GB
PerfLogs 0 GB
Programs 3,03 GB
Programs (x86) 3,27 GB
report 0 GB

Sum 83 GB
should be free 801 GB

displayed free 42,5 GB
so unknown space 759 GB

It's not lost. It's* used for housekeeping,


759 GB only for housekeeping?

and is absolutely necessary.


But not in this size.

Formatting sets aside a fixed space for this, which varies with the
file-system.

Also, it's 182 MB, not 191GB


GB here. Not MB.


As mentioned above, I transferred all the contents
over to another drive, then formatted the problem
drive, re-assigned the original drive letter,
transferred back all the old contents, and so got
back all the space.


So I guess we, meaning you and all of us, will never know what the issue
was. I'd have been curious to see what was going on.

  #21  
Old March 4th 19, 10:39 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Peter Jason
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,310
Default Lost space on HDD.

On Mon, 04 Mar 2019 15:22:40 -0600, Char Jackson
wrote:

On Tue, 05 Mar 2019 07:55:46 +1100, Peter Jason wrote:

On Mon, 4 Mar 2019 18:02:18 +0100, Christoph
Müller wrote:

Am 04.03.2019 um 15:48 schrieb Wolf K:
On 2019-03-03 21:29, Peter Jason wrote:

Where & what is this lost 191GB?

Similar problem he Missing 759 GB from 884 GB HD.

total size 884 GB

ProgrammData 6,62 GB
User 35,5 GB
Windows 33,2 GB
Drivers 0,938 GB
Intel 0,000232 GB
NVIDIA Corp. 0 GB
PerfLogs 0 GB
Programs 3,03 GB
Programs (x86) 3,27 GB
report 0 GB

Sum 83 GB
should be free 801 GB

displayed free 42,5 GB
so unknown space 759 GB

It's not lost. It's* used for housekeeping,

759 GB only for housekeeping?

and is absolutely necessary.

But not in this size.

Formatting sets aside a fixed space for this, which varies with the
file-system.

Also, it's 182 MB, not 191GB

GB here. Not MB.


As mentioned above, I transferred all the contents
over to another drive, then formatted the problem
drive, re-assigned the original drive letter,
transferred back all the old contents, and so got
back all the space.


So I guess we, meaning you and all of us, will never know what the issue
was. I'd have been curious to see what was going on.


The rest is mystery. I tested that drive with
Seagate tools & HD Tune and found no faults.

  #22  
Old March 4th 19, 11:47 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Char Jackson
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,449
Default Lost space on HDD.

On Tue, 05 Mar 2019 08:39:26 +1100, Peter Jason wrote:

On Mon, 04 Mar 2019 15:22:40 -0600, Char Jackson
wrote:

On Tue, 05 Mar 2019 07:55:46 +1100, Peter Jason wrote:

On Mon, 4 Mar 2019 18:02:18 +0100, Christoph
Müller wrote:

Am 04.03.2019 um 15:48 schrieb Wolf K:
On 2019-03-03 21:29, Peter Jason wrote:

Where & what is this lost 191GB?

Similar problem he Missing 759 GB from 884 GB HD.

total size 884 GB

ProgrammData 6,62 GB
User 35,5 GB
Windows 33,2 GB
Drivers 0,938 GB
Intel 0,000232 GB
NVIDIA Corp. 0 GB
PerfLogs 0 GB
Programs 3,03 GB
Programs (x86) 3,27 GB
report 0 GB

Sum 83 GB
should be free 801 GB

displayed free 42,5 GB
so unknown space 759 GB

It's not lost. It's* used for housekeeping,

759 GB only for housekeeping?

and is absolutely necessary.

But not in this size.

Formatting sets aside a fixed space for this, which varies with the
file-system.

Also, it's 182 MB, not 191GB

GB here. Not MB.

As mentioned above, I transferred all the contents
over to another drive, then formatted the problem
drive, re-assigned the original drive letter,
transferred back all the old contents, and so got
back all the space.


So I guess we, meaning you and all of us, will never know what the issue
was. I'd have been curious to see what was going on.


The rest is mystery. I tested that drive with
Seagate tools & HD Tune and found no faults.


I would have tested with MiniTool Partition Wizard and Treesize Free.

The former will show you the size of the physical drive, as well as the
size of any partitions and unallocated space. It's all graphical, so
there's no hard work involved.

The latter will show you the space used by each folder, including SVI.
You had enough space missing that it would have made itself known very
quickly. As it turns out, you blew away the evidence. Oh well.

The tools that you mentioned above wouldn't have helped to solve the
mystery, except under extreme and limited circumstances.

  #23  
Old March 5th 19, 12:53 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Peter Jason
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,310
Default Lost space on HDD.

On Mon, 04 Mar 2019 16:47:39 -0600, Char Jackson
wrote:

On Tue, 05 Mar 2019 08:39:26 +1100, Peter Jason wrote:

On Mon, 04 Mar 2019 15:22:40 -0600, Char Jackson
wrote:

On Tue, 05 Mar 2019 07:55:46 +1100, Peter Jason wrote:

On Mon, 4 Mar 2019 18:02:18 +0100, Christoph
Müller wrote:

Am 04.03.2019 um 15:48 schrieb Wolf K:
On 2019-03-03 21:29, Peter Jason wrote:

Where & what is this lost 191GB?

Similar problem he Missing 759 GB from 884 GB HD.

total size 884 GB

ProgrammData 6,62 GB
User 35,5 GB
Windows 33,2 GB
Drivers 0,938 GB
Intel 0,000232 GB
NVIDIA Corp. 0 GB
PerfLogs 0 GB
Programs 3,03 GB
Programs (x86) 3,27 GB
report 0 GB

Sum 83 GB
should be free 801 GB

displayed free 42,5 GB
so unknown space 759 GB

It's not lost. It's* used for housekeeping,

759 GB only for housekeeping?

and is absolutely necessary.

But not in this size.

Formatting sets aside a fixed space for this, which varies with the
file-system.

Also, it's 182 MB, not 191GB

GB here. Not MB.

As mentioned above, I transferred all the contents
over to another drive, then formatted the problem
drive, re-assigned the original drive letter,
transferred back all the old contents, and so got
back all the space.

So I guess we, meaning you and all of us, will never know what the issue
was. I'd have been curious to see what was going on.


The rest is mystery. I tested that drive with
Seagate tools & HD Tune and found no faults.


I would have tested with MiniTool Partition Wizard and Treesize Free.

The former will show you the size of the physical drive, as well as the
size of any partitions and unallocated space. It's all graphical, so
there's no hard work involved.

The latter will show you the space used by each folder, including SVI.
You had enough space missing that it would have made itself known very
quickly. As it turns out, you blew away the evidence. Oh well.

The tools that you mentioned above wouldn't have helped to solve the
mystery, except under extreme and limited circumstances.


I did download & test with "Folder Size"
https://www.mindgems.com/products/Fo...lder-Size.html
.....but no problem detected!

And I'll check with "Treesize" etc in future.
  #24  
Old March 5th 19, 02:19 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Paul[_32_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 11,873
Default Lost space on HDD.

Peter Jason wrote:

I did download & test with "Folder Size"
https://www.mindgems.com/products/Fo...lder-Size.html
....but no problem detected!

And I'll check with "Treesize" etc in future.


You'll need better forensics than that...

To detect an envelope problem, you could try

fsutil fsinfo ntfsinfo H:

to get the number of clusters defined for the partition.
Multiply number of clusters by bytes-per-cluster to
get size.

L:\fsutil fsinfo ntfsinfo H:
NTFS Volume Serial Number : 0x16ac8949ac892479
Version : 3.1
Number Sectors : 0x00000000aea8287f
Total Clusters : 0x00000000015d5050 === 22,892,624
Free Clusters : 0x000000000015cc26
Total Reserved : 0x000000000000025c
Bytes Per Sector : 512
Bytes Per Cluster : 65536 === non-standard, used for data drive
Bytes Per FileRecord Segment : 1024
Clusters Per FileRecord Segment : 0
Mft Valid Data Length : 0x000000000c9a0000
Mft Start Lcn : 0x000000000000c000
Mft2 Start Lcn : 0x0000000000aea828
Mft Zone Start : 0x0000000000c440e0
Mft Zone End : 0x0000000000cf52c0

The guts of the file system use 22,892,624 * 65536 = 1,500,291,006,464
And that's the size in the Explorer Properties pie chart.

You can see this utility claims the outside of the file system is
one cluster bigger than the previous number. 72000-6464=65536.
The "Volume size" is marked as being a sector shorter than
the entire partition size.

L:\ disktype /dev/sdc # Cygwin utility

Partition 4: 1.365 TiB (1500291072000 bytes, 2930256000 sectors from 976768065)
Type 0x07 (HPFS/NTFS)
Windows NTLDR boot loader
NTFS file system
Volume size 1.365 TiB (1500291071488 bytes, 2930255999 sectors)

Sysinternals ntfsinfo:

L:\ntfsinfo h:

NtfsInfo v1.2 - NTFS Information Dump
Copyright (C) 2005-2016 Mark Russinovich
Sysinternals - www.sysinternals.com


Volume Size
-----------
Volume size : 1430789 MB
Total sectors : 2930255999
Total clusters : 22892624
Free clusters : 1428518
Free space : 89282 MB (6% of drive)

Allocation Size
----------------
Bytes per sector : 512
Bytes per cluster : 65536
Bytes per MFT record : 0
Clusters per MFT record: 0

MFT Information
---------------
MFT size : 201 MB (0% of drive)
MFT start cluster : 49152
MFT zone clusters : 12861664 - 13587136
MFT zone size : 45342 MB (3% of drive)
MFT mirror start : 11446312

Meta-Data files
---------------

PTEDIT32 says:

Partition 4: Sectors 2930256000 (header sector plus rest)

So in the end, it works like this

================ 1500291072000 bytes =============================
=512= ======== 1500291006464 bytes ===== === 65024 bytes ===

NTFS single 65536 cluster
HDR == 22892624 * 65536 as clusters == at end, minus the 512
Sector byte header sector

The slack at the end is slightly less than one cluster.

*******

Once you make yourself a virtual copy of the file system
in question, and all the permissions have been smashed,
you'll be able to query *everything*. Not just the
slop Windows normally gives you. Using the Macrium Reflect
Free backup mounter, you can switch off restrictions on
permissions. Attributes still apply, which Is why I was
using "dir /ah" in a previous posting.

Paul
  #25  
Old March 5th 19, 03:25 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Peter Jason
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,310
Default Lost space on HDD.

On Mon, 04 Mar 2019 20:19:54 -0500, Paul
wrote:

Peter Jason wrote:

I did download & test with "Folder Size"
https://www.mindgems.com/products/Fo...lder-Size.html
....but no problem detected!

And I'll check with "Treesize" etc in future.


You'll need better forensics than that...

To detect an envelope problem, you could try

fsutil fsinfo ntfsinfo H:

to get the number of clusters defined for the partition.
Multiply number of clusters by bytes-per-cluster to
get size.

L:\fsutil fsinfo ntfsinfo H:
NTFS Volume Serial Number : 0x16ac8949ac892479
Version : 3.1
Number Sectors : 0x00000000aea8287f
Total Clusters : 0x00000000015d5050 === 22,892,624
Free Clusters : 0x000000000015cc26
Total Reserved : 0x000000000000025c
Bytes Per Sector : 512
Bytes Per Cluster : 65536 === non-standard, used for data drive
Bytes Per FileRecord Segment : 1024
Clusters Per FileRecord Segment : 0
Mft Valid Data Length : 0x000000000c9a0000
Mft Start Lcn : 0x000000000000c000
Mft2 Start Lcn : 0x0000000000aea828
Mft Zone Start : 0x0000000000c440e0
Mft Zone End : 0x0000000000cf52c0

The guts of the file system use 22,892,624 * 65536 = 1,500,291,006,464
And that's the size in the Explorer Properties pie chart.

You can see this utility claims the outside of the file system is
one cluster bigger than the previous number. 72000-6464=65536.
The "Volume size" is marked as being a sector shorter than
the entire partition size.

L:\ disktype /dev/sdc # Cygwin utility

Partition 4: 1.365 TiB (1500291072000 bytes, 2930256000 sectors from 976768065)
Type 0x07 (HPFS/NTFS)
Windows NTLDR boot loader
NTFS file system
Volume size 1.365 TiB (1500291071488 bytes, 2930255999 sectors)

Sysinternals ntfsinfo:

L:\ntfsinfo h:

NtfsInfo v1.2 - NTFS Information Dump
Copyright (C) 2005-2016 Mark Russinovich
Sysinternals - www.sysinternals.com


Volume Size
-----------
Volume size : 1430789 MB
Total sectors : 2930255999
Total clusters : 22892624
Free clusters : 1428518
Free space : 89282 MB (6% of drive)

Allocation Size
----------------
Bytes per sector : 512
Bytes per cluster : 65536
Bytes per MFT record : 0
Clusters per MFT record: 0

MFT Information
---------------
MFT size : 201 MB (0% of drive)
MFT start cluster : 49152
MFT zone clusters : 12861664 - 13587136
MFT zone size : 45342 MB (3% of drive)
MFT mirror start : 11446312

Meta-Data files
---------------

PTEDIT32 says:

Partition 4: Sectors 2930256000 (header sector plus rest)

So in the end, it works like this

================ 1500291072000 bytes =============================
=512= ======== 1500291006464 bytes ===== === 65024 bytes ===

NTFS single 65536 cluster
HDR == 22892624 * 65536 as clusters == at end, minus the 512
Sector byte header sector

The slack at the end is slightly less than one cluster.

*******

Once you make yourself a virtual copy of the file system
in question, and all the permissions have been smashed,
you'll be able to query *everything*. Not just the
slop Windows normally gives you. Using the Macrium Reflect
Free backup mounter, you can switch off restrictions on
permissions. Attributes still apply, which Is why I was
using "dir /ah" in a previous posting.

Paul



Thanks Paul. I've filed this for future
disasters, but in the meantime would some
'advanced' app help?
https://www.easeus.com/ppc/partition....google.com%2F

  #26  
Old March 5th 19, 08:17 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Paul[_32_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 11,873
Default Lost space on HDD.

Peter Jason wrote:
On Mon, 04 Mar 2019 20:19:54 -0500, Paul
wrote:

Peter Jason wrote:

I did download & test with "Folder Size"
https://www.mindgems.com/products/Fo...lder-Size.html
....but no problem detected!

And I'll check with "Treesize" etc in future.

You'll need better forensics than that...

To detect an envelope problem, you could try

fsutil fsinfo ntfsinfo H:

to get the number of clusters defined for the partition.
Multiply number of clusters by bytes-per-cluster to
get size.

L:\fsutil fsinfo ntfsinfo H:
NTFS Volume Serial Number : 0x16ac8949ac892479
Version : 3.1
Number Sectors : 0x00000000aea8287f
Total Clusters : 0x00000000015d5050 === 22,892,624
Free Clusters : 0x000000000015cc26
Total Reserved : 0x000000000000025c
Bytes Per Sector : 512
Bytes Per Cluster : 65536 === non-standard, used for data drive
Bytes Per FileRecord Segment : 1024
Clusters Per FileRecord Segment : 0
Mft Valid Data Length : 0x000000000c9a0000
Mft Start Lcn : 0x000000000000c000
Mft2 Start Lcn : 0x0000000000aea828
Mft Zone Start : 0x0000000000c440e0
Mft Zone End : 0x0000000000cf52c0

The guts of the file system use 22,892,624 * 65536 = 1,500,291,006,464
And that's the size in the Explorer Properties pie chart.

You can see this utility claims the outside of the file system is
one cluster bigger than the previous number. 72000-6464=65536.
The "Volume size" is marked as being a sector shorter than
the entire partition size.

L:\ disktype /dev/sdc # Cygwin utility

Partition 4: 1.365 TiB (1500291072000 bytes, 2930256000 sectors from 976768065)
Type 0x07 (HPFS/NTFS)
Windows NTLDR boot loader
NTFS file system
Volume size 1.365 TiB (1500291071488 bytes, 2930255999 sectors)

Sysinternals ntfsinfo:

L:\ntfsinfo h:

NtfsInfo v1.2 - NTFS Information Dump
Copyright (C) 2005-2016 Mark Russinovich
Sysinternals - www.sysinternals.com


Volume Size
-----------
Volume size : 1430789 MB
Total sectors : 2930255999
Total clusters : 22892624
Free clusters : 1428518
Free space : 89282 MB (6% of drive)

Allocation Size
----------------
Bytes per sector : 512
Bytes per cluster : 65536
Bytes per MFT record : 0
Clusters per MFT record: 0

MFT Information
---------------
MFT size : 201 MB (0% of drive)
MFT start cluster : 49152
MFT zone clusters : 12861664 - 13587136
MFT zone size : 45342 MB (3% of drive)
MFT mirror start : 11446312

Meta-Data files
---------------

PTEDIT32 says:

Partition 4: Sectors 2930256000 (header sector plus rest)

So in the end, it works like this

================ 1500291072000 bytes =============================
=512= ======== 1500291006464 bytes ===== === 65024 bytes ===

NTFS single 65536 cluster
HDR == 22892624 * 65536 as clusters == at end, minus the 512
Sector byte header sector

The slack at the end is slightly less than one cluster.

*******

Once you make yourself a virtual copy of the file system
in question, and all the permissions have been smashed,
you'll be able to query *everything*. Not just the
slop Windows normally gives you. Using the Macrium Reflect
Free backup mounter, you can switch off restrictions on
permissions. Attributes still apply, which Is why I was
using "dir /ah" in a previous posting.

Paul



Thanks Paul. I've filed this for future
disasters, but in the meantime would some
'advanced' app help?
https://www.easeus.com/ppc/partition....google.com%2F


If you decide to download a trial, don't forget to scan it.
Just for fun. This is the consumer version of epm.exe version 12.5.

https://www.virustotal.com/#/file/02...857f/detection

What features would a Partition Management utility offer ?

It has a partition check, but it calls CHKDSK if there
is a problem detected.

https://i.postimg.cc/dV0YgZ1X/easeus...on-manager.gif

Paul
  #27  
Old March 5th 19, 10:19 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Char Jackson
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,449
Default Lost space on HDD.

On Mon, 04 Mar 2019 20:19:54 -0500, Paul wrote:

Peter Jason wrote:

I did download & test with "Folder Size"
https://www.mindgems.com/products/Fo...lder-Size.html
....but no problem detected!

And I'll check with "Treesize" etc in future.


You'll need better forensics than that...

To detect an envelope problem, you could try

fsutil fsinfo ntfsinfo H:

to get the number of clusters defined for the partition.
Multiply number of clusters by bytes-per-cluster to
get size.

L:\fsutil fsinfo ntfsinfo H:
NTFS Volume Serial Number : 0x16ac8949ac892479
Version : 3.1
Number Sectors : 0x00000000aea8287f
Total Clusters : 0x00000000015d5050 === 22,892,624
Free Clusters : 0x000000000015cc26
Total Reserved : 0x000000000000025c
Bytes Per Sector : 512
Bytes Per Cluster : 65536 === non-standard, used for data drive
Bytes Per FileRecord Segment : 1024
Clusters Per FileRecord Segment : 0
Mft Valid Data Length : 0x000000000c9a0000
Mft Start Lcn : 0x000000000000c000
Mft2 Start Lcn : 0x0000000000aea828
Mft Zone Start : 0x0000000000c440e0
Mft Zone End : 0x0000000000cf52c0

The guts of the file system use 22,892,624 * 65536 = 1,500,291,006,464
And that's the size in the Explorer Properties pie chart.

You can see this utility claims the outside of the file system is
one cluster bigger than the previous number. 72000-6464=65536.
The "Volume size" is marked as being a sector shorter than
the entire partition size.

L:\ disktype /dev/sdc # Cygwin utility

Partition 4: 1.365 TiB (1500291072000 bytes, 2930256000 sectors from 976768065)
Type 0x07 (HPFS/NTFS)
Windows NTLDR boot loader
NTFS file system
Volume size 1.365 TiB (1500291071488 bytes, 2930255999 sectors)

Sysinternals ntfsinfo:

L:\ntfsinfo h:

NtfsInfo v1.2 - NTFS Information Dump
Copyright (C) 2005-2016 Mark Russinovich
Sysinternals - www.sysinternals.com


Volume Size
-----------
Volume size : 1430789 MB
Total sectors : 2930255999
Total clusters : 22892624
Free clusters : 1428518
Free space : 89282 MB (6% of drive)

Allocation Size
----------------
Bytes per sector : 512
Bytes per cluster : 65536
Bytes per MFT record : 0
Clusters per MFT record: 0

MFT Information
---------------
MFT size : 201 MB (0% of drive)
MFT start cluster : 49152
MFT zone clusters : 12861664 - 13587136
MFT zone size : 45342 MB (3% of drive)
MFT mirror start : 11446312

Meta-Data files
---------------

PTEDIT32 says:

Partition 4: Sectors 2930256000 (header sector plus rest)

So in the end, it works like this

================ 1500291072000 bytes =============================
=512= ======== 1500291006464 bytes ===== === 65024 bytes ===

NTFS single 65536 cluster
HDR == 22892624 * 65536 as clusters == at end, minus the 512
Sector byte header sector

The slack at the end is slightly less than one cluster.

*******

Once you make yourself a virtual copy of the file system
in question, and all the permissions have been smashed,
you'll be able to query *everything*. Not just the
slop Windows normally gives you. Using the Macrium Reflect
Free backup mounter, you can switch off restrictions on
permissions. Attributes still apply, which Is why I was
using "dir /ah" in a previous posting.


For the record, none of that would have been required in order to answer
his original question regarding 'lost space on HDD'.

  #28  
Old March 5th 19, 12:45 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Carlos E.R.[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,356
Default Lost space on HDD.

On 04/03/2019 16.57, Ken Blake wrote:
On Mon, 4 Mar 2019 09:48:36 -0500, Wolf K
wrote:


NB that 191,291,392 bytes = 182MB. That's because the first number is
the actual number of bytes in decimal notation, but 1MB is a binary
number, equivalent to 1,048,576 bytes or 1,024 kilobytes. 1KB =1,024
bytes. Since 1,024 is "about" 1,000 bytes, it's called kilobyte. This
fudging has caused a lot of grief, but it's irreversible. [1].




Yes. No argument with anything there, but I'll just add my standard
post on the subject:

All hard drive manufacturers define 1TB as 1,000,000,000,000 bytes,
while the rest of the computer world, including Windows, defines it as
2 to the 40th power (1,099,511,637,776) bytes. So a 5 trillion byte
drive is actually around 4.5TB.

Some people point out that the official international standard defines
the "T" of TB as one trillion, not 1,099,511,637,776. Correct though
they are, using the binary value of TB is so well established in the
computer world that I consider using the decimal value of a trillion
to be deceptive marketing on the part of the hard drive manufacturer.


And I consider the HD manufacturers correct and the rest using the wrong
units.

--
Cheers, Carlos.
  #29  
Old March 5th 19, 03:28 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Paul[_32_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 11,873
Default Lost space on HDD.

Char Jackson wrote:
On Mon, 04 Mar 2019 20:19:54 -0500, Paul wrote:

Peter Jason wrote:

I did download & test with "Folder Size"
https://www.mindgems.com/products/Fo...lder-Size.html
....but no problem detected!

And I'll check with "Treesize" etc in future.

You'll need better forensics than that...

To detect an envelope problem, you could try

fsutil fsinfo ntfsinfo H:

to get the number of clusters defined for the partition.
Multiply number of clusters by bytes-per-cluster to
get size.

L:\fsutil fsinfo ntfsinfo H:
NTFS Volume Serial Number : 0x16ac8949ac892479
Version : 3.1
Number Sectors : 0x00000000aea8287f
Total Clusters : 0x00000000015d5050 === 22,892,624
Free Clusters : 0x000000000015cc26
Total Reserved : 0x000000000000025c
Bytes Per Sector : 512
Bytes Per Cluster : 65536 === non-standard, used for data drive
Bytes Per FileRecord Segment : 1024
Clusters Per FileRecord Segment : 0
Mft Valid Data Length : 0x000000000c9a0000
Mft Start Lcn : 0x000000000000c000
Mft2 Start Lcn : 0x0000000000aea828
Mft Zone Start : 0x0000000000c440e0
Mft Zone End : 0x0000000000cf52c0

The guts of the file system use 22,892,624 * 65536 = 1,500,291,006,464
And that's the size in the Explorer Properties pie chart.

You can see this utility claims the outside of the file system is
one cluster bigger than the previous number. 72000-6464=65536.
The "Volume size" is marked as being a sector shorter than
the entire partition size.

L:\ disktype /dev/sdc # Cygwin utility

Partition 4: 1.365 TiB (1500291072000 bytes, 2930256000 sectors from 976768065)
Type 0x07 (HPFS/NTFS)
Windows NTLDR boot loader
NTFS file system
Volume size 1.365 TiB (1500291071488 bytes, 2930255999 sectors)

Sysinternals ntfsinfo:

L:\ntfsinfo h:

NtfsInfo v1.2 - NTFS Information Dump
Copyright (C) 2005-2016 Mark Russinovich
Sysinternals - www.sysinternals.com


Volume Size
-----------
Volume size : 1430789 MB
Total sectors : 2930255999
Total clusters : 22892624
Free clusters : 1428518
Free space : 89282 MB (6% of drive)

Allocation Size
----------------
Bytes per sector : 512
Bytes per cluster : 65536
Bytes per MFT record : 0
Clusters per MFT record: 0

MFT Information
---------------
MFT size : 201 MB (0% of drive)
MFT start cluster : 49152
MFT zone clusters : 12861664 - 13587136
MFT zone size : 45342 MB (3% of drive)
MFT mirror start : 11446312

Meta-Data files
---------------

PTEDIT32 says:

Partition 4: Sectors 2930256000 (header sector plus rest)

So in the end, it works like this

================ 1500291072000 bytes =============================
=512= ======== 1500291006464 bytes ===== === 65024 bytes ===

NTFS single 65536 cluster
HDR == 22892624 * 65536 as clusters == at end, minus the 512
Sector byte header sector

The slack at the end is slightly less than one cluster.

*******

Once you make yourself a virtual copy of the file system
in question, and all the permissions have been smashed,
you'll be able to query *everything*. Not just the
slop Windows normally gives you. Using the Macrium Reflect
Free backup mounter, you can switch off restrictions on
permissions. Attributes still apply, which Is why I was
using "dir /ah" in a previous posting.


For the record, none of that would have been required in order to answer
his original question regarding 'lost space on HDD'.


Only lost space with regard to the size of the hard
drive. You can be prevented from using the entire
drive if that situation happens, and it's just one
consideration when "my drive is prematurely full".

I only mentioned it, because people might not be
aware of it.

Using the backup image of the drive, and removing permission
problems with the Macrium tick box, will allow more easily
examining the drive and "looking in places" where normally
permissions would prevent you from looking.

Paul
 




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