Unknown download activity in background - how to determine what it is?

Andy,

What does the -b parameter do?
I couldn't find it, and when I included it, I got the help legend.
After looking at the legend, I did this...
c:\netstat -na netstat.txt
Did you mean to use another pararmeter
and if so, what is the command
What is this for? c:\more netstat.txt
Just trying to learn...

thanks in advance,
dc


"Andy Walker" wrote in message
...
Cyberiade.it Anonymous Remailer wrote:

Use a software firewall that shows you the current connections and
level of traffic. Comodo has a good firewall for free.

Or, you could simply run some simple DOS commands to determine what
program(s) are using external connections.

c:\netstat -nab netstat.txt
c:\more netstat.txt

Look for established connections using foreign addresses other than
127.x.x.x. You should be able to determine what port and what process
is communicating, as well as the external IP address.

To check the external IP address go to http://www.dnsstuff.com and
enter it into the "IP Information" box.

--
Peter

Please Reply to Newsgroup for the benefit of others
Requests for assistance by email can not and will not be acknowledged.

"BoaterDave" wrote in message ...
Hi Doc

I've been led to believe that, just like one should only ever have a single
active antivirus programme, one should only have a single software firewall
operative. In other words, disable MS Windows firewall if you are using Zone
Alarm.

HTH

David

__________________________________________________ ____________________________________________
"Doc" wrote in message
ups.com...
I'm using WinXP Media Center, the last few days I've noticed that
there's some kind of d/l actitivity showing even when I'm doing
nothing online even with the Windows firewall up as well as
ZoneAlarm. I'm on 56k dialup. How do I determine what this is? I
don't have Windows update on automatic. I ran AdAware with the latest
definitions but it's still doing it.

Thanks.

"John John" wrote in message
...
Kerry Brown wrote:

"John John" wrote in message
...

Kayman wrote:


and scroll down to:
Myth: Host-Based Firewalls Must Filter Outbound Traffic to be Safe.


That article itself is baloney. It is true that any malware can
circumvent a firewall's outbound protection but it is also true that a
lot of malware is detected by firewall outbound monitoring. The
outbound monitoring also alerts you when otherwise legitimate software
is trying to call home. Perhaps you like it better when things like
Media player call home without your knowledge, a pesky annoyance that
you should be aware of things like that.

The article states:

"Speaking of host firewalls, why is there so much noise about outbound
filtering? Think for a moment about how ordinary users would interact
with a piece of software that bugged them every time a program on their
computer wanted to communicate with the Internet..." What a pile of
baloney!"

Firewall have rules, it appears no one at Microsoft knows this, which
isn't really surprising to tell you the truth. Microsoft's logic is
that "you don't need seat belts if you have airbags". And you don't
need to know what it is that things like Media Player doing. Baloney
indeed!



There is no way a software firewall can guarantee it will stop outbound
traffic on the computer it is running on regardless of the OS. Software
firewalls can be useful for stopping programs communicating outbound
through normal channels. That's it, period. The fact that some firewalls
notify you about malware communicating out is a function of how poorly
the malware is programmed not the firewall. Intel motherboards can
communicate though the onboard NICs at the BIOS level with no OS present.
Rootkits can easily modify all traffic going through any NIC in the
computer. Malware running in Windows can easily corrupt traffic from
legitimate programs. Malware can even create it's own TCP/IP stack and
bypass Windows (or other OS') networking stack altogether. Virtual server
software is capable of spoofing a MAC and getting multiple IP addresses
for one NIC from a DHCP server. What makes you think malware can't do the
same type of thing?

All that you say is true and I never said or argued otherwise. But
software firewalls that monitor outbound connections can be useful and can
help to keep some applications in check, just because the Microsoft
firewall can't do it doesn't mean that all others are not good.



You said that this: "Myth: Host-Based Firewalls Must Filter Outbound Traffic
to be Safe." was baloney. It is not. You are talking about privacy not
safety. Software firewalls do nothing to improve your safety. They may
actually decrease your safety by giving you a false sense of security. They
can as you say be used to protect your privacy. You went on to say this:
"Firewall have rules, it appears no one at Microsoft knows this" which is
also false. All of the firewalls in Microsoft OS' use rules. Some of them
don't monitor outgoing traffic but they all use rules.

--
Kerry Brown
Microsoft MVP - Shell/User
http://www.vistahelp.ca

On Jul 28, 12:51 pm, Doc wrote:
I'm using WinXP Media Center, the last few days I've noticed that
there's some kind of d/l actitivity showing even when I'm doing
nothing online even with the Windows firewall up as well as
ZoneAlarm. I'm on 56k dialup. How do I determine what this is? I
don't have Windows update on automatic. I ran AdAware with the latest
definitions but it's still doing it.

Thanks.

A long shot: A couple of months back, I had downloaded and installed a
free "flash video player" that was seen on Firefox. The same day, I
found that my Internet account had been drained out, because some 2GB
was "downloaded" in the matter of a few hours, although I had shut
down the program after using it for just a few minutes. I could not
locate any downloaded files even in the "Temporary Internet Files"
folder to account for that size, and my hard disk space was not
decreased. Apparently, the program continued to run in the background
even after I shut it off. When I opened the "Local Area Connection
Status" by clicking on the double-computer icon in system tray area, I
saw that heavy downloading was gong on. I am not absolutely sure that
the Flash Video Player was the culprit, but I after I uninstalled the
program, the unknown internet activity also stopped.
I suggest that you check for something similar on your computer.

Had you intended to comment, Peter?

Nothing seen here.

BD

******************************
"Peter Foldes" wrote in message
...


--
Peter

Please Reply to Newsgroup for the benefit of others
Requests for assistance by email can not and will not be acknowledged.

"BoaterDave" wrote in message
...
Hi Doc

I've been led to believe that, just like one should only ever have a
single
active antivirus programme, one should only have a single software
firewall
operative. In other words, disable MS Windows firewall if you are using
Zone
Alarm.

HTH

David

__________________________________________________ ____________________________________________
"Doc" wrote in message
ups.com...
I'm using WinXP Media Center, the last few days I've noticed that
there's some kind of d/l actitivity showing even when I'm doing
nothing online even with the Windows firewall up as well as
ZoneAlarm. I'm on 56k dialup. How do I determine what this is? I
don't have Windows update on automatic. I ran AdAware with the latest
definitions but it's still doing it.

Thanks.

Kayman wrote:

"John John" wrote in message

It's a pc, apply your own logic (utilise sensible apps.); So take
ownership, do some research, do not consult advertisement-driven
publications and be responsible - *you* are in charge! If you don't like
pc go for available alternatives.

Regardless of what you might think I am no slouch at computers and I
don't use Adware! Did you know that some of the new Sysinternal
(Microsoft) utilities call home without your knowledge? Did you know
that these Sysinternal utilities do not tell you that they call home and
that they provide no inbuilt mechanism to stop this behaviour? Do you
agree that those applications, amongst others, should be calling home
without the user's knowledge? Do you agree that users should have no
easy method to detect and stop these unwanted connections? By the
contents of your posts I would say obviously not! There are many other
legitimate applications that call home for no valid reasons, when you
install these application they don't always tell you that they will be
calling home and they don't always make it easy to find that out or to
disable "call home" features. I am sure you didn't know of the
Sysinternal utilities calling home and I am sure that you are not in
charge of your computer as much as you thing that you are! But then you
don't think that users should have a way of being made aware or of
stopping those outbound connections so who cares about "being in charge"
of their computers?


M/S firewall *can't* do (but they could) because it's recognised to be
waste of resources and time. And yes, PFW's are IMO of no value
whatsoever; I know because I operate without these apps.
John John, don't get blinded by all the marketing hype

Marketing hype? It appears that you are the one blinded by marketing
hype! Microsoft marketing hype! The misinformation published in one of
the Microsoft articles provided by another poster makes it clear that
Microsoft and its shills are on a mission to discredit all firewalls
that monitor outbound connections and to insist that the Microsoft
firewall is somehow or other superior to all others. Quite amusing when
it's coming from an outfit that until a few years ago didn't even know
what a firewall was! As for your comments of "waste of resources" it is
laughable to say the least. It this day and age of fast processors and
large amounts of RAM this is a non issue. Also, the firewall will be
using resources just to do its basic job of keeping intruder out, the
little extra needed to monitor outbound connections is negligible.

Lets get one thing perfectly clear here, I am not claiming, nor have I
ever claimed that outbound connection monitoring was an effective method
of dealing with all sorts of malware. I am simply saying that outbound
monitoring is a useful tool that can alert you to some not so clever
malware trying to call home and that it can alert you that something
like your printer software, or Microsoft components might be trying to
access the internet for no good reason at all. But then it appears that
you think that users shouldn't know that these things are calling home.
Neither you, nor Microsoft, nor anyone else will ever convince me that
outbound connection monitoring is not a useful feature. Period!

John

Kerry Brown wrote:

You said that this: "Myth: Host-Based Firewalls Must Filter Outbound
Traffic to be Safe." was baloney.

I never said that and don't attribute things that I have not said to me!
Reread my post!

I quoted this from the article:

"Speaking of host firewalls, why is there so much noise about outbound
filtering? Think for a moment about how ordinary users would interact
with a piece of software that bugged them every time a program on their
computer wanted to communicate with the Internet..."

And I said that (quoted material) was baloney! A firewall monitoring
outbound connections will ask you if you want to permanently allow or
disallow the connection, you will not be "...bugged them every time a
program on their computer wanted to communicate with the Internet...".
That is false information in the article, and for some reason or other
and for sometime now Microsoft has been trying to discredit *all*
firewalls except its own. What is it that Microsoft is hiding? Why are
they so adamant that users not be aware of outgoing connections on their
computers?

John

Which Sysinternals apps call home?

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS-MVP Shell/User
www.grystmill.com

"John John" wrote in message
...
Kayman wrote:

"John John" wrote in message

It's a pc, apply your own logic (utilise sensible apps.); So take
ownership, do some research, do not consult advertisement-driven
publications and be responsible - *you* are in charge! If you don't like
pc go for available alternatives.

Regardless of what you might think I am no slouch at computers and I don't
use Adware! Did you know that some of the new Sysinternal (Microsoft)
utilities call home without your knowledge? Did you know that these
Sysinternal utilities do not tell you that they call home and that they
provide no inbuilt mechanism to stop this behaviour? Do you agree that
those applications, amongst others, should be calling home without the
user's knowledge? Do you agree that users should have no easy method to
detect and stop these unwanted connections? By the contents of your posts
I would say obviously not! There are many other legitimate applications
that call home for no valid reasons, when you install these application
they don't always tell you that they will be calling home and they don't
always make it easy to find that out or to disable "call home" features.
I am sure you didn't know of the Sysinternal utilities calling home and I
am sure that you are not in charge of your computer as much as you thing
that you are! But then you don't think that users should have a way of
being made aware or of stopping those outbound connections so who cares
about "being in charge" of their computers?


M/S firewall *can't* do (but they could) because it's recognised to be
waste of resources and time. And yes, PFW's are IMO of no value
whatsoever; I know because I operate without these apps.
John John, don't get blinded by all the marketing hype

Marketing hype? It appears that you are the one blinded by marketing
hype! Microsoft marketing hype! The misinformation published in one of
the Microsoft articles provided by another poster makes it clear that
Microsoft and its shills are on a mission to discredit all firewalls that
monitor outbound connections and to insist that the Microsoft firewall is
somehow or other superior to all others. Quite amusing when it's coming
from an outfit that until a few years ago didn't even know what a firewall
was! As for your comments of "waste of resources" it is laughable to say
the least. It this day and age of fast processors and large amounts of
RAM this is a non issue. Also, the firewall will be using resources just
to do its basic job of keeping intruder out, the little extra needed to
monitor outbound connections is negligible.

Lets get one thing perfectly clear here, I am not claiming, nor have I
ever claimed that outbound connection monitoring was an effective method
of dealing with all sorts of malware. I am simply saying that outbound
monitoring is a useful tool that can alert you to some not so clever
malware trying to call home and that it can alert you that something like
your printer software, or Microsoft components might be trying to access
the internet for no good reason at all. But then it appears that you
think that users shouldn't know that these things are calling home.
Neither you, nor Microsoft, nor anyone else will ever convince me that
outbound connection monitoring is not a useful feature. Period!

John

"John John" wrote in message
...
Kerry Brown wrote:

You said that this: "Myth: Host-Based Firewalls Must Filter Outbound
Traffic to be Safe." was baloney.

I never said that and don't attribute things that I have not said to me!
Reread my post!

I quoted this from the article:

"Speaking of host firewalls, why is there so much noise about outbound
filtering? Think for a moment about how ordinary users would interact with
a piece of software that bugged them every time a program on their
computer wanted to communicate with the Internet..."

And I said that (quoted material) was baloney! A firewall monitoring
outbound connections will ask you if you want to permanently allow or
disallow the connection, you will not be "...bugged them every time a
program on their computer wanted to communicate with the Internet...".
That is false information in the article, and for some reason or other and
for sometime now Microsoft has been trying to discredit *all* firewalls
except its own. What is it that Microsoft is hiding? Why are they so
adamant that users not be aware of outgoing connections on their
computers?



That may have been what you intended to say but here is the the relevant
snippet from your post:

--------------------------------------
" and scroll down to:
Myth: Host-Based Firewalls Must Filter Outbound Traffic to be Safe.

That article itself is baloney. It is true that any malware can
circumvent a firewall's outbound protection but it is also true that a
lot of malware is detected by firewall outbound monitoring. The
outbound monitoring also alerts you when otherwise legitimate software
is trying to call home. Perhaps you like it better when things like
Media player call home without your knowledge, a pesky annoyance that
you should be aware of things like that."
-----------------------------------------

It sure sounds to me like you are calling the whole article baloney.

I don't presume to speak for Microsoft but personally I'm not hiding
anything. Software firewalls are a useful part of a layered security setup.
They can't be relied upon to protect you from malicious outbound traffic.
Anybody who says they can and tries to sell this to you is deceiving you.
They are selling snake oil. Software firewalls became popular because the
current versions of Windows at the time didn't have any firewall. When XP
came out with a firewall the vendors realized that they had to give people a
reason to keep buying their product. This is when they started pushing the
outbound monitoring features. Software firewalls can, and most do, give you
a level of protection against inbound attacks from unsolicited traffic. That
is all they are good for as a defense against malware. Even that can't be
relied on if something does get inside the security perimeter. Once your
security has been breached you can no longer trust anything running on the
computer. Monitoring outbound traffic does have it's uses. One is as you say
to stop legitimate programs from making outbound connections that you don't
want. I don't know why Microsoft didn't include outbound monitoring in the
XP firewall. Personally I don't care as I believe it to be of limited use
anyway. Outbound monitoring is included in the Vista firewall and many other
Microsoft products like ISA server.

This is obviously something I'm passionate about :-) Don't take it as
personal attack. Whenever I see a post espousing the usefulness of software
firewalls I am compelled to point out the fallacy of this approach to
security.

--
Kerry Brown
Microsoft MVP - Shell/User
http://www.vistahelp.ca

dc wrote:

Andy,

What does the -b parameter do?

Here is the help description from netstat:

-b Displays the executable involved in creating each connection or
listening port. In some cases well-known executables host
multiple independent components, and in these cases the
sequence of components involved in creating the connection
or listening port is displayed. In this case the executable
name is in [] at the bottom, on top is the component it called,
and so forth until TCP/IP was reached. Note that this option
can be time-consuming and will fail unless you have sufficient

You can use an alternative method through the use of the -o switch.

-o Displays the owning process ID associated with each connection.

In order to determine the process name you can run task manger
(ctrl-alt-del), select view/select columns and add Process Identifier.
This will allow you to match the process ID output from the netstat
command with a process name.

I couldn't find it, and when I included it, I got the help legend.

Older versions of the netstat command did not include the -b switch.

After looking at the legend, I did this...
c:\netstat -na netstat.txt
Did you mean to use another pararmeter
and if so, what is the command

See the -o info above.

What is this for? c:\more netstat.txt

It is the "more" command used to read the file "netstat.txt" created
when you used the "" pipe command. Using more allows you to see the
entire file one page at a time. You could also use a text reader like
notepad or to stay in the DOS window try "edit netstat.txt".

Click on the help menu and you will find out.

John

Gary S. Terhune wrote:
Which Sysinternals apps call home?

Straight Talk wrote:

Did you know that these Sysinternal utilities
do not tell you that they call home and that they provide no inbuilt
mechanism to stop this behaviour?


Wrong.

If you know how to internally stop the Sysinternal Help utilities from
calling home please post your findings here. I would also like to hear
your advice and solutions as to port monitoring and outbound traffic
in general on Windows operating systems. Should users follow your
advice and ignore all outbound traffic? Should outbound traffic be
allowed to outside networks or should it be limited to the local network?

John

"John John" wrote in message

It's a pc, apply your own logic (utilise sensible apps.); So take
ownership, do some research, do not consult advertisement-driven
publications and be responsible - *you* are in charge! If you don't like
pc go for available alternatives.

Regardless of what you might think I am no slouch at computers and I don't
use Adware!

Never thought you were incompetent. I just provided useful information for
you kind consideration.

(Did you know that some of the new Sysinternal Microsoft) utilities call
home without your knowledge?
Really.

Did you know that these Sysinternal utilities do not tell you that they
call home and that they provide no inbuilt mechanism to stop this
behaviour?

Really.

Do you agree that those applications, amongst others, should be calling
home without the user's knowledge?
The ones I use don't call. If I'd feel comfortable with an apps. I wouldn't
mind.

Do you agree that users should have no easy method to detect and stop
these unwanted connections?
Define unwanted; Only install apps. you are comfortable with.

By the contents of your posts I would say obviously not!
Far from it, that's what you're assuming, that's it. Read on the line, not
in between.

There are many other legitimate applications that call home for no valid
reasons, when you install these application they don't always tell you
that they will be calling home and they don't always make it easy to find
that out or to disable "call home" features.
I know, but then again I don't download junk - not even legitimate junk. But
wouldn't mind a 'home call' from an apps. I am comfortable with.

I am sure you didn't know of the Sysinternal utilities calling home...

Which Sysinternals apps. call home?

...and I am sure that you are not in charge of your computer as much as
you thing that you are!
Assumptions.

But then you don't think that users should have a way of being made aware
or of stopping those outbound connections so who cares about "being in
charge" of their computers?

Naw, you don't know what I am thinking, never mind about that.

M/S firewall *can't* do (but they could) because it's recognised to be
waste of resources and time. And yes, PFW's are IMO of no value
whatsoever; I know because I operate without these apps.
John John, don't get blinded by all the marketing hype

Marketing hype? It appears that you are the one blinded by marketing
hype! Microsoft marketing hype!

If you are not comfortable with this apps. then uninstall and go for an
alternative.

The misinformation published in one of the Microsoft articles provided by
another poster makes it clear that Microsoft and its shills are on a
mission to discredit all firewalls...
It explains how things are in reality. The write-ups are educational and
non-binding. The authors have considerable credentials. Where are yours?
And where are the representatives with their credentials of PFW's refuting
the published arguments? Are you one of them?

...that monitor outbound connections and to insist that the Microsoft
firewall is somehow or other superior to all others.
They don't claim superiority, just reality.

Quite amusing when it's coming from an outfit that until a few years ago
didn't even know what a firewall was!

You do underestimate M/S. (Or is it sarcasm?).
As for your comments of "waste of resources" it is laughable to say the
least. It this day and age of fast processors and large amounts of RAM
this is a non issue.
A waste of resources in terms of manpower, spending time on an useless
(outbound filtering)feature. (Sorry for confusion).

Also, the firewall will be using resources just to do its basic job of
keeping intruder out, the little extra needed to monitor outbound
connections is negligible.
Lets get one thing perfectly clear here, I am not claiming, nor have I
ever claimed that outbound connection monitoring was an effective method
of dealing with all sorts of malware. I am simply saying that outbound
monitoring is a useful tool that can alert you to some not so clever
malware trying to call home and that it can alert you that something like
your printer software, or Microsoft components might be trying to access
the internet for no good reason at all. But then it appears that you
think that users shouldn't know that these things are calling home.
Neither you, nor Microsoft, nor anyone else will ever convince me that
outbound connection monitoring is not a useful feature. Period!

Alright then; Good luck

What "help menu"? Hey, I just asked a question and I really want to know the
answer. Which Sysinternal apps call home? I presume you know of at least
some, or you wouldn't have made that statement.

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS-MVP Shell/User
www.grystmill.com

"John John" wrote in message
...
Click on the help menu and you will find out.

John

Gary S. Terhune wrote:
Which Sysinternals apps call home?

Preocess Explorer and Autoruns are two that do.

John

Gary S. Terhune wrote:

What "help menu"? Hey, I just asked a question and I really want to know the
answer. Which Sysinternal apps call home? I presume you know of at least
some, or you wouldn't have made that statement.