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Google tracked his bike ride past a burglarized home. That made him a suspect.
The email arrived on a Tuesday afternoon in January, startling Zachary McCoy as he prepared to leave for his job at a restaurant in Gainesville, Florida. It was from Googles legal investigations support team, writing to let him know that local police had demanded information related to his Google account. The company said it would release the data unless he went to court and tried to block it. He had just seven days. I was hit with a really deep fear, McCoy, 30, recalled, even though he couldnt think of anything hed done wrong. He had an Android phone, which was linked to his Google account, and, like millions of other Americans, he used an assortment of Google products, including Gmail and YouTube. Now police seemingly wanted access to all of it. I didnt know what it was about, but I knew the police wanted to get something from me, McCoy said in a recent interview. I was afraid I was going to get charged with something, I dont know what. There was one clue. In the notice from Google was a case number. McCoy searched for it on the Gainesville Police Departments website, and found a one-page investigation report on the burglary of an elderly womans home 10 months earlier. The crime had occurred less than a mile from the home that McCoy, who had recently earned an associate degree in computer programming, shared with two others. Now McCoy was even more panicked and confused. He knew he had nothing to do with the break-in - hed never even been to the victims house - and didnt know anyone who might have. And he didnt have much time to prove it. McCoy worried that going straight to police would lead to his arrest. So he went to his parents home in St. Augustine, where, over dinner, he told them what was happening. They agreed to dip into their savings to pay for a lawyer. The lawyer, Caleb Kenyon, dug around and learned that the notice had been prompted by a geofence warrant, a police surveillance tool that casts a virtual dragnet over crime scenes, sweeping up Google location data drawn from users GPS, Bluetooth, Wi-Fi and cellular connections from everyone nearby. The warrants, which have increased dramatically in the past two years, can help police find potential suspects when they have no leads. They also scoop up data from people who have nothing to do with the crime, often without their knowing - which Google itself has described as a significant incursion on privacy. Still confused - and very worried - McCoy examined his phone. An avid biker, he used an exercise-tracking app, RunKeeper, to record his rides. The app relied on his phones location services, which fed his movements to Google. He looked up his route on the day of the March 29, 2019, burglary and saw that he had passed the victims house three times within an hour, part of his frequent loops through his neighborhood, he said. It was a nightmare scenario, McCoy recalled. I was using an app to see how many miles I rode my bike and now it was putting me at the scene of the crime. And I was the lead suspect. A powerful new tool The victim was a 97-year-old woman who told police she was missing several pieces of jewelry, including an engagement ring, worth more than $2,000. Four days after she reported the crime, Gainesville police, looking for leads, went to an Alachua County judge with the warrant for Google. In it, they demanded records of all devices using Google services that had been near the womans home when the burglary was thought to have taken place. The first batch of data would not include any identifying information. Police would sift through it for devices that seemed suspicious and ask Google for the names of their users. Kenyon said police told him that they became particularly interested in McCoys device after reviewing the first batch of anonymized data. They didnt know the identity of the devices owner, so they returned to Google to ask for more information. That request triggered the Jan. 14 notice the technology giant sent to McCoy, part of its general policy on notifying users about government requests for their information. The notice was McCoys only indication that police wanted his data. Gainesville police declined to comment. While privacy and civil liberties advocates have been concerned that geofence warrants violate constitutional protections from unreasonable searches, law enforcement authorities say those worries are overblown. They say police dont obtain any identifying information about a Google user until they find a device that draws their suspicion. And the information alone is not enough to justify charging someone with a crime, they say. Google geofence warrants have been used by police agencies around the country, including the FBI. Google said in a court filing last year that the requests from state and federal law enforcement authorities were increasing rapidly: by more than 1,500 percent from 2017 to 2018, and by 500 percent from 2018 to 2019. Its a great tool and a great technology, said Kevin Armbruster, a retired lieutenant with the Milwaukee Police Department, where he oversaw the use of high-tech investigative work, including geofence warrants. Milwaukee police have used Google geofence warrants to solve an array of crimes, including homicides, shootings, a string of robberies and kidnappings and a sexual assault involving an abduction, he said. I would think the majority of citizens in the world would love the fact that we are putting violent offenders in jail, Armbruster said. There have been very few court challenges to Google geofence warrants, mainly because the warrants are done in secret and defense lawyers may not realize the tool was used to identify their clients. One exception is an accused bank robber in Midlothian, Virginia, who is fighting the charge by arguing the geofence warrant used against him was illegal. That case is pending. Youre looking at the wrong guy Once McCoy realized his bike ride had placed him near the scene of the crime, he had a strong theory of why police had picked his device out of all the others swept up by the warrant. He and Kenyon set out to keep them from getting any more information about him - and persuade them that he was innocent. Kenyon said he got on the phone with the detective on the case and told him, Youre looking at the wrong guy. For most of his life, McCoy said, he had tried to live online anonymously, a habit that dated to the early days of the internet when there was less expectation that people would use their real names. He used pseudonyms on his social media accounts and the email account that Google used to notify him about the police investigation. But until then, he hadnt thought much about Google collecting information about him. I didnt realize that by having location services on that Google was also keeping a log of where I was going, McCoy said. Im sure its in their terms of service but I never read through those walls of text, and I dont think most people do either. Just before the start of his ordeal, hed listened to a call-in radio debate about the Department of Justices fight with Apple over access to an iPhone left by a Saudi national whod gunned down several people at an air base in Pensacola, Florida, in December. He remembered some callers saying they had no problem with law enforcement having access to phone data, arguing that people had nothing to worry about as long as they didnt break the law. Now McCoy thought the callers werent considering predicaments like his. If youre innocent, that doesnt mean you cant be in the wrong place at the wrong time, like going on a bike ride in which your GPS puts you in a position where police suspect you of a crime you didnt commit, McCoy said. On Jan. 31, Kenyon filed a motion in Alachua County civil court to render the warrant null and void and to block the release of any further information about McCoy, identifying him only as John Doe. At that point, Google had not turned over any data that identified McCoy but would have done so if Kenyon hadnt intervened. Kenyon argued that the warrant was unconstitutional because it allowed police to conduct sweeping searches of phone data from untold numbers of people in order to find a single suspect. That approach, Kenyon said, flipped on its head the traditional method of seeking a search warrant, in which police target a person they already suspect. This geofence warrant effectively blindly casts a net backwards in time hoping to ensnare a burglar, Kenyon wrote. This concept is akin to the plotline in many a science fiction film featuring a dystopian, fascist government. Cleared by the same data The filing seemed to give law enforcement authorities second thoughts about the warrant. Not long afterward, Kenyon said, a lawyer in the state attorneys office assigned to represent the Gainesville Police Department told him there were details in the motion that led them to believe that Kenyons client was not the burglar. The state attorneys office withdrew the warrant, asserting in a court filing that it was no longer necessary. The office did not respond to a request for comment. Kenyon said that in a visit to his office, the detective acknowledged that police no longer considered his client a suspect. On Feb. 24, Kenyon dropped his legal challenge. The case ended well for McCoy, Kenyon said, but the larger privacy fight will go unanswered. Even then, Kenyon wanted to make sure police didnt have lingering doubts about McCoy, whom they still knew only as John Doe. So he met with the detective again and showed him screenshots of his clients Google location history, including data recorded by RunKeeper. The maps showed months of bike rides past the burglarized home. In the end, the same location data that raised police suspicions of McCoy also helped to vindicate him, Kenyon said. But there was no knowing what law enforcement was going to do with that data when they got it behind closed doors. Not that I distrust them, but I wouldnt trust them not to arrest someone. He pointed to an Arizona case in which a man was mistakenly arrested and jailed for murder largely based on Google data received from a geofence warrant. McCoy said he may have ended up in a similar spot if his parents hadnt given him several thousand dollars to hire Kenyon. He regrets having to spend that money. He also thinks about the elderly burglary victim. Police said they have not made any arrests. Im definitely sorry that happened to her, and Im glad police were trying to solve it, McCoy said. But it just seems like a really broad net for them to cast. Whats the cost-benefit? How many innocent people do we have to harass? https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news...cked-his-bike- ride-past-burglarized-home-made-him-n1151761 |
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#2
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Google tracked his bike ride past a burglarized home. That madehim suspect.
Excellent article. This is why my phone is always in airplane mode. If someone needs to get hold of me, it is by landline only. If I need to use my cell phone, I turn it on just for the call. I try to have all my communications by email only, and that over wifi only through a vpn connection.
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#3
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Google tracked his bike ride past a burglarized home. That made him a suspect.
On 3/7/20 5:59 PM, Anonymous Remailer (austria) wrote:
The email arrived on a Tuesday afternoon in January, startling Zachary McCoy as he prepared to leave for his job at a restaurant in Gainesville, Florida. It was from Googleâs legal investigations support team, writing to let him know that local police had demanded information related to his Google account. The company said it would release the data unless he went to court and tried to block it. He had just seven days. âI was hit with a really deep fear,â McCoy, 30, recalled, even though he couldnât think of anything heâd done wrong. He had an Android phone, which was linked to his Google account, and, like millions of other Americans, he used an assortment of Google products, including Gmail and YouTube. Now police seemingly wanted access to all of it. âI didnât know what it was about, but I knew the police wanted to get something from me,â McCoy said in a recent interview. âI was afraid I was going to get charged with something, I donât know what.â There was one clue. In the notice from Google was a case number. McCoy searched for it on the Gainesville Police Departmentâs website, and found a one-page investigation report on the burglary of an elderly womanâs home 10 months earlier. The crime had occurred less than a mile from the home that McCoy, who had recently earned an associate degree in computer programming, shared with two others. Now McCoy was even more panicked and confused. He knew he had nothing to do with the break-in - heâd never even been to the victimâs house - and didnât know anyone who might have. And he didnât have much time to prove it. McCoy worried that going straight to police would lead to his arrest. So he went to his parentsâ home in St. Augustine, where, over dinner, he told them what was happening. They agreed to dip into their savings to pay for a lawyer. The lawyer, Caleb Kenyon, dug around and learned that the notice had been prompted by a âgeofence warrant,â a police surveillance tool that casts a virtual dragnet over crime scenes, sweeping up Google location data â drawn from usersâ GPS, Bluetooth, Wi-Fi and cellular connections â from everyone nearby. The warrants, which have increased dramatically in the past two years, can help police find potential suspects when they have no leads. They also scoop up data from people who have nothing to do with the crime, often without their knowing - which Google itself has described as âa significant incursion on privacy.â Still confused - and very worried - McCoy examined his phone. An avid biker, he used an exercise-tracking app, RunKeeper, to record his rides. The app relied on his phoneâs location services, which fed his movements to Google. He looked up his route on the day of the March 29, 2019, burglary and saw that he had passed the victimâs house three times within an hour, part of his frequent loops through his neighborhood, he said. âIt was a nightmare scenario,â McCoy recalled. âI was using an app to see how many miles I rode my bike and now it was putting me at the scene of the crime. And I was the lead suspect.â A powerful new tool The victim was a 97-year-old woman who told police she was missing several pieces of jewelry, including an engagement ring, worth more than $2,000. Four days after she reported the crime, Gainesville police, looking for leads, went to an Alachua County judge with the warrant for Google. In it, they demanded records of all devices using Google services that had been near the womanâs home when the burglary was thought to have taken place. The first batch of data would not include any identifying information. Police would sift through it for devices that seemed suspicious and ask Google for the names of their users. Kenyon said police told him that they became particularly interested in McCoyâs device after reviewing the first batch of anonymized data. They didnât know the identity of the deviceâs owner, so they returned to Google to ask for more information. That request triggered the Jan. 14 notice the technology giant sent to McCoy, part of its general policy on notifying users about government requests for their information. The notice was McCoyâs only indication that police wanted his data. Gainesville police declined to comment. While privacy and civil liberties advocates have been concerned that geofence warrants violate constitutional protections from unreasonable searches, law enforcement authorities say those worries are overblown. They say police donât obtain any identifying information about a Google user until they find a device that draws their suspicion. And the information alone is not enough to justify charging someone with a crime, they say. Google geofence warrants have been used by police agencies around the country, including the FBI. Google said in a court filing last year that the requests from state and federal law enforcement authorities were increasing rapidly: by more than 1,500 percent from 2017 to 2018, and by 500 percent from 2018 to 2019. âItâs a great tool and a great technology,â said Kevin Armbruster, a retired lieutenant with the Milwaukee Police Department, where he oversaw the use of high-tech investigative work, including geofence warrants. Milwaukee police have used Google geofence warrants to solve an array of crimes, including homicides, shootings, a string of robberies and kidnappings and a sexual assault involving an abduction, he said. âI would think the majority of citizens in the world would love the fact that we are putting violent offenders in jail,â Armbruster said. There have been very few court challenges to Google geofence warrants, mainly because the warrants are done in secret and defense lawyers may not realize the tool was used to identify their clients. One exception is an accused bank robber in Midlothian, Virginia, who is fighting the charge by arguing the geofence warrant used against him was illegal. That case is pending. âYouâre looking at the wrong guyâ Once McCoy realized his bike ride had placed him near the scene of the crime, he had a strong theory of why police had picked his device out of all the others swept up by the warrant. He and Kenyon set out to keep them from getting any more information about him - and persuade them that he was innocent. Kenyon said he got on the phone with the detective on the case and told him, âYouâre looking at the wrong guy.â For most of his life, McCoy said, he had tried to live online anonymously, a habit that dated to the early days of the internet when there was less expectation that people would use their real names. He used pseudonyms on his social media accounts and the email account that Google used to notify him about the police investigation. But until then, he hadnât thought much about Google collecting information about him. âI didnât realize that by having location services on that Google was also keeping a log of where I was going,â McCoy said. âIâm sure itâs in their terms of service but I never read through those walls of text, and I donât think most people do either.â Just before the start of his ordeal, heâd listened to a call-in radio debate about the Department of Justiceâs fight with Apple over access to an iPhone left by a Saudi national whoâd gunned down several people at an air base in Pensacola, Florida, in December. He remembered some callers saying they had no problem with law enforcement having access to phone data, arguing that people had nothing to worry about as long as they didnât break the law. Now McCoy thought the callers werenât considering predicaments like his. âIf youâre innocent, that doesnât mean you canât be in the wrong place at the wrong time, like going on a bike ride in which your GPS puts you in a position where police suspect you of a crime you didnât commit,â McCoy said. On Jan. 31, Kenyon filed a motion in Alachua County civil court to render the warrant ânull and voidâ and to block the release of any further information about McCoy, identifying him only as âJohn Doe.â At that point, Google had not turned over any data that identified McCoy but would have done so if Kenyon hadnât intervened. Kenyon argued that the warrant was unconstitutional because it allowed police to conduct sweeping searches of phone data from untold numbers of people in order to find a single suspect. That approach, Kenyon said, flipped on its head the traditional method of seeking a search warrant, in which police target a person they already suspect. âThis geofence warrant effectively blindly casts a net backwards in time hoping to ensnare a burglar,â Kenyon wrote. âThis concept is akin to the plotline in many a science fiction film featuring a dystopian, fascist government.â Cleared by the same data The filing seemed to give law enforcement authorities second thoughts about the warrant. Not long afterward, Kenyon said, a lawyer in the state attorneyâs office assigned to represent the Gainesville Police Department told him there were details in the motion that led them to believe that Kenyonâs client was not the burglar. The state attorneyâs office withdrew the warrant, asserting in a court filing that it was no longer necessary. The office did not respond to a request for comment. Kenyon said that in a visit to his office, the detective acknowledged that police no longer considered his client a suspect. On Feb. 24, Kenyon dropped his legal challenge. The case ended well for McCoy, Kenyon said, but âthe larger privacy fight will go unanswered.â Even then, Kenyon wanted to make sure police didnât have lingering doubts about McCoy, whom they still knew only as âJohn Doe.â So he met with the detective again and showed him screenshots of his clientâs Google location history, including data recorded by RunKeeper. The maps showed months of bike rides past the burglarized home. In the end, the same location data that raised police suspicions of McCoy also helped to vindicate him, Kenyon said. âBut there was no knowing what law enforcement was going to do with that data when they got it behind closed doors. Not that I distrust them, but I wouldnât trust them not to arrest someone.â He pointed to an Arizona case in which a man was mistakenly arrested and jailed for murder largely based on Google data received from a geofence warrant. McCoy said he may have ended up in a similar spot if his parents hadnât given him several thousand dollars to hire Kenyon. He regrets having to spend that money. He also thinks about the elderly burglary victim. Police said they have not made any arrests. âIâm definitely sorry that happened to her, and Iâm glad police were trying to solve it,â McCoy said. âBut it just seems like a really broad net for them to cast. Whatâs the cost-benefit? How many innocent people do we have to harass?â https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news...cked-his-bike- ride-past-burglarized-home-made-him-n1151761 An interesting read. Didn't that stupid detective ever consider that this 97 year old woman just might have dementia or alzheimers? In these situations, older people start throwing things into the waste basket, like rings, glasses, etc. I was involved in a care group for nursing homes that had theft problems, and this type of thing happens often and then the elderly claim that someone stole them. In another issue also is someone stealing over the ear type hearing aids. They aren't custom fitted so are easy targets of theft in nursing homes. So if anyone that has their loved one in a nursing home that needs hearing aids, get the custom fitted ones... those aren't stolen. |
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Google tracked his bike ride past a burglarized home. That made him a suspect.
On Sun, 8 Mar 2020 13:19:32 -0600, anonlinuxuser wrote:
It was from Google˘s legal investigations support team We covered this topic previously, over he o Interesting story about geofence warrants increasingly being used on innocent people https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/bqITN_pClYA -- Together we can learn far more than anyone of us can by learning alone. |
#5
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Google tracked his bike ride past a burglarized home. That made him suspect.
I have put this instruction sheet out many times for Americans. Several times people have criticized it as an avenue to further police suspicions. These people do not know how the police operate and how dangerous it is to not take a firm stand against them. They do not know the lack of honesty and integrity that exist among most police officers. They do not recognize that most police officers do not have college educations and have been promoted into the higher positions of lieutenants, captains, and detectives out of experience and longevity, and not due to higher education in criminology and/or psycology. Their main motivation for solving crimes is to prove they are doing their job and most certainly for personal promotion. This goes for prosecutors also, if not more so, with the exception that they have a higher education. Police and prosecutor use bully, tyrannical tactics on people in order to scare them into cooperation, even unto making false confessions, if fo!
r no other reason, to give a confession to a reduced false charge in order to stay out of prison or to have a shorter prison stay. Police and prosecutors are a vicious and nasty group of people and must be dealt with sternly. The person in this case was seemingly under the delusion that he had to prove his innocence and had to spend thousands of his parents savings for a lawyer to stop the ravenous cops from pursuing him. All it would have taken was to hand any cop or prosecutor the below letter to stop them in their tracks. Say this to any questions: If driving - Officer, my lawyer has informed me that the only information you need from me is on my drivers license. Officer, my lawyer has informed me to not answer any questions from the police. Carry this lawyer instruction and present it if arrested or detained: Letter to the Authorities I, your name, being a law abiding citizen, having never knowingly participated in any unlawful activities, therefore refuse to be interrogated or otherwise answer any questions asked by the police and/or prosecutors, not having any knowledge of or being able to be of any help or assistance to them concerning any crime. If I am arrested or detained by the police for any reason, I do hereby through this written statement exercising my right to remain silent. If I am arrested or detained at a police station, I wish to see a lawyer as soon as possible. If I cannot afford a lawyer, I wish for one to be provided. If questioned by a prosecutor, I will invoke my 5th amendment right after each question. I am familiar with the vicious Reid Interrogation Method, a system so brutal that Great Britain has outlawed its use, its use being the cause of many innocent people falsely confessing to crimes that they did not commit. I also refuse to cooperate with a request to come to any police agency or a police station, recognize that the purpose of such a request is to isolate a person in order to viciously attacking them for hours with accusations and threats. Having seen that the authorities are habitual and incessant liars and deceivers, I therfore, will never be able to trust the authorities. I have read the book The Lie Behind the Lie Detector found at antipolygraph.org, as well as read the Charlatanry in forensic speech science by Anders Eriksson and Francisco Lacerda, and thereby know that lie detectors and forensic speech science are junk science and a complete fraud. Therefore, I refuse to submit to a request to be examined by either. I also have read the article by the 'Oklahoma Department of Mental Health and Substance Abuse Services' entitled Oklahoma Study Finds Voice Stress Analysis âTestingâ No Better Than Random Chance, and therefore refuse to submit to a Voice Stress Analysis request. I likewise refuse to take a 'Guilt Detection Test'. I recognize and know the fact that all police, prosecutors, and government employees will attempt to elicit statements from people through deceptive lies, and therefore the authorities can never be trusted to be telling the truth. I recognize that any and all questions asked by the authorities are for the purpose of trapping people in their words. I recognize that the authorities purposely ask the same or similar question multiple times, endangering the innocent of innocently forgetting a fact, misspeaking concerning a fact, or remembering a fact more clearly at a later time, and as a result, honestly answering a question truthfully, the authorities then using such innocent discrepancies to charge that innocent person with the crime of lying to the authorities (Scooter Libby, Martha Stewart). I, knowing that law enforcement always demands a written and signed statement, will not make a written or sign a statements of any kind. You do not have my consent to take my picture, take my fingerprints, take my DNA, take a blood sample, or take my urine sample. Signed: |
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Google tracked his bike ride past a burglarized home. That made him a suspect.
On 3/8/20 3:02 PM, Arlen Holder wrote:
On Sun, 8 Mar 2020 13:19:32 -0600, anonlinuxuser wrote: It was from Google¢s legal investigations support team We covered this topic previously, over he o Interesting story about geofence warrants increasingly being used on innocent people https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/bqITN_pClYA Hopefully, and someday, that will be made illegal. |
#7
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Google tracked his bike ride past a burglarized home. That made him a suspect.
"anonlinuxuser" wrote
| o Interesting story about geofence warrants increasingly being used on innocent people | https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/bqITN_pClYA | | Hopefully, and someday, that will be made illegal. | Yes. On the other hand, the man is using an Android phone and leaving it turned on, so he already doesn't care about privacy. To top it off, he was using an app to count the miles he rode on his bike and Google was tracking that. So if he had the hassle of being considered a suspect I'd call that an idiocy tax. It's hard to have sympathy for such sheer ninny-headedness. I suppose people tracking their steps [inaccurately] on their iPhone are more stupid and wasting even more money, but feeling a need to record your bicycle riding, and signing up for spyware to do it, is pretty darn dumb. |
#8
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Google tracked his bike ride past a burglarized home. That made him a suspect.
On Sun, 8 Mar 2020 23:02:07 -0400, Mayayana wrote:
Yes. On the other hand, the man is using an Android phone and leaving it turned on, so he already doesn't care about privacy. Unfortunately, as usual, Mayayana's post is filled with MARKETING BS. o Intelligent people don't believe only in what MARKETING feeds them. Mobile device security researches discuss frank factual results on hacking iOS & Android devices (i.e., not marketing bull****) https://groups.google.com/d/msg/comp.mobile.android/w3aEX2L4x8U/54qxrmbJCwAJ *FACTS*! o Not Marketing bull****. Despite loud Apple's marketing of the mere _illusion_ of privacy... o The fact is that privacy on Android is no different than on iOS. What is the factual truth about PRIVACY differences or similarities between the Android & iOS mobile phone ecosystems? https://groups.google.com/d/msg/comp.mobile.android/FCKRA_3i9CY/Bm40liKdEQAJ Privacy is a long chain of links, where Apple MARKETING is brilliant at touting the very few links where it's stronger, while completely ignoring the very many links where it's far weaker than Android privacy. See also: The FBI was easily able to penetrate Apple's most secure iPhones https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/fe_26eulOaw/1tig2D-KAAAJ To top it off, he was using an app to count the miles he rode on his bike and Google was tracking that. He was stupid; he didn't read comp.mobile.android for privacy solutions! o http://tinyurl.com/comp-mobile-android o http://comp.mobile.android.narkive.com For example, there are plenty of offline privacy-based track saving apps: https://i.postimg.cc/3R45GgNv/map02.jpg See also: Tutorial for saving & viewing tracks on USGS topographic maps in real time on mobile devices https://groups.google.com/d/msg/comp.mobile.android/zNKD3jyeye4/njtP-yzoAgAJ So if he had the hassle of being considered a suspect I'd call that an idiocy tax. Anyone who claims iOS is more private than Android o Is merely proving they're ignorant of the facts around privacy on phones. Either they are ignorant of the facts - or they believe only in MARKETING What is the most brilliant marketing move Apple ever made? https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/wW-fu0jsvAU/iUMbvDSxAwAJ It's hard to have sympathy for such sheer ninny-headedness. It's hard to have sympathy for people who only believe in MARKETING. On Android, you can just skip pointing the OS to a Google Account. o And you'd still have full functionality of that Android phone! FACT: On iOS, you _must_ have an iCloud tracking account for full functionality! o On Android, you still have _full_ functionality without an account setup! Why would anyone NEED to set up the Android OS to a Google Account? https://groups.google.com/d/msg/comp.mobile.android/0O0GLU0bFmw/DD095dJ3AQAJ See also: iCloud backups are NOT encrypted https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/-EA9TYUeVhk/gutU2V0sDQAJ I suppose people tracking their steps [inaccurately] on their iPhone are more stupid and wasting even more money... He was an idiot for sure...but on Android... privacy is free! o It's likely he didn't know about privacy tracking discussions on c.m.a https://i.postimg.cc/J0fVWCmw/pedometertest01.jpg https://i.postimg.cc/D0NcGbBH/pedometertest02.jpg See also: Do you use a pedometer app that is free, no login, no ads, & no reporting back to the home ship? https://groups.google.com/d/msg/comp.mobile.android/fUdyQkxxRow/-ahiJJA2AQAJ but feeling a need to record your bicycle riding, and signing up for spyware to do it, is pretty darn dumb. The guy _was_ dumb for not setting his phone up for privacy. o What irks me is people who don't set up the Android phone intelligently. a. They upload _your_ SSID details to Google constantly b. They sync _your_ contact information to Google constantly c. They store _your_ meeting information with them on the cloud etc. While the number of exploits on iOS is the same as on Android o Apple is officially upset Google exposed the imaginary security Apple widely promotes (blaming Google for the iOS diarrhea) https://groups.google.com/d/msg/comp.mobile.android/C54BNBxZKN8/QMb9aKL_AQAJ The fact is that a pentest of up-to-date Android is far more expensive than the same for iOS simply because _all_ iPhones appear to be fatally compromised. Why zero day Android exploits cost far more than zero day iOS exploits (because iOS is far easier to hack) https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/9koS-SuRqgw *FACTS*! o Not Marketing bull****. -- Those who disagree with facts get their news from MARKETING brochures. |
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Google tracked his bike ride past a burglarized home. That madehim a suspect.
"anonlinuxuser" wrote o Interesting story about geofence warrants increasingly being used on innocent people https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/bqITN_pClYA Hopefully, and someday, that will be made illegal. Yes. On the other hand, the man is using an Android phone and leaving it turned on, so he already doesn't care about privacy. To top it off, he was using an app to count the miles he rode on his bike and Google was tracking that. So if he had the hassle of being considered a suspect I'd call that an idiocy tax. It's hard to have sympathy for such sheer ninny-headedness. I suppose people tracking their steps inaccurately on their iPhone are more stupid and wasting even more money, but feeling a need to record your bicycle riding, and signing up for spyware to do it, is pretty darn dumb. A good way to handle this is something I do. 1. Get a burner flipphone for calls/calling. No google/fasebook tracking on it. Set it up as described below. 2. Get a burner smartphone at a department store (Walmart) with/using a monthly charge card. In the states, you will have to go to the burner phone's local store to initiate the phone. I just did this at AT&T. They asked for my name, address, etc, all of which I gave false information. Now your smartphone is untraceable to you and you can run all you foolish, baby phone toys on it. The cops can get all the google/facebook tracking information they want, but will not be able to trace it to your name. You probably shouldn't have your flip phone on while your smartphone is being used because they might correlate the two being linked, always being at the same place. Do not fall for AT&T's attempt to get you to recharge your phone time using a credit card over the phone. Always purchase a new charge card (I use the $35 for 3 months card). 3. Something else I did. I purchased the burner phone at Walmart one year before I began to use it. Walmart takes pictures of everyone now and it is believed that they keep them one year. This is probably a much shorter retention time when purchased at a convenience store. |
#10
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Google tracked his bike ride past a burglarized home. That made him a suspect.
"anonymous" wrote
| 2. Get a burner smartphone at a department store (Walmart) with/using a monthly charge card. In the states, you will have to go to the burner phone's local store to initiate the phone. I just did this at AT&T. They asked for my name, address, etc, all of which I gave false information. Now your smartphone is untraceable to you and you can run all you foolish, baby phone toys on it. The cops can get all the google/facebook tracking information they want, but will not be able to trace it to your name. You probably shouldn't have your flip phone on while your smartphone is being used because they might correlate the two being linked, always being at the same place. Do not fall for AT&T's attempt to get you to recharge your phone time using a credit card over the phone. Always purchase a new charge card (I use the $35 for 3 months card). | You can't hide your identity from me. I can tell by your phone buying habits that you're Jason Bourne. I don't get the point of buying an anon phone and still using a computer phone. If it's on, you're trackable. As with browsers, you might be technically anonymous, but if a dozen companies have a record of your location and activities, it would be naive to think they're not connecting the dots. I find it interesting that you assume everyone would still need a computer phone, anyway. I have a Tracphone. $20 every 3 months. I leave it turned off but have it in case I need to make or receive a call. The nice thing with leaving it off is that it rarely needs charging. Maybe once every couple of months. I actually find that I don't use it much. I've got about 3,000 minutes saved up. If someone needs to reach me they can call my landline or send an email or send a letter. (But I do find that an increasing number of people find it difficult to grasp that they won't be able to reach me with an LOL at any time, day or night. Texting has become a kind of epidemic.) | 3. Something else I did. I purchased the burner phone at Walmart one year before I began to use it. Walmart takes pictures of everyone now and it is believed that they keep them one year. This is probably a much shorter retention time when purchased at a convenience store. | This is all great if you're robbing banks, but I don't see the point otherwise. You've apparently got a computer phone that's tracking you everywhere, anyway. And that means Apple/Google and dozens of app makers and their datamining partners have that information. To my mind the whole system is a problem. We'd complain if the phone company recorded our calls and sold the data, so why should we allow Apple/Google to do the same. Why are the phones not controlled by the FCC to prevent eavesdropping? Why isn't Google heavily fined for allowing it? Why aren't they fined for tricking people into giving them data? Why aren't app makers and their partners jailed? We've developed a culture where TVs and cars spy on you, and that's become normal. It's nuts. But it's also not all their fault. The average person is using GPS, Waze, Uber, Facebook, Instagram, and so on. Many young people don't see anything as spying. They think of it as service. Even when Facebook decides what they'll see on their feed, they comply with it like a happy infant with a nipple in its mouth. It's bad enough that people are too lazy to read a map, but so many of these toys are just idiotic. Things like pedometers and heart meters? They've already acknowledged the things are not even accurate. I had a pedometer that I wore on my belt when I was about 10 years old. Was it accurate? I don't know. But by the time I reached 11 I could see that it was silly. Now we have 60-year-olds who congratulate themselves for taking charge of their fitness because they ask their iPhone how many steps they've walked. I find it interesting when I visit my millennial neice. She's got the works: Several audible notifications for various incoming communiques that buzz or beep regularly. Three Echos that interrupt our conversation with inane comments. She's surprisingly tolerant of the old uncle with no phone or texting. But she does see it as an issue of being old. For her there simply isn't any other way to live. To not be constantly tracked... to not buy back her social life from Facebook... would be like turning off your frig. It just makes no sense to her. |
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Google tracked his bike ride past a burglarized home. That madehim a suspect.
On 09/03/2020 04.45, Arlen Holder wrote:
On Sun, 8 Mar 2020 23:02:07 -0400, Mayayana wrote: Yes. On the other hand, the man is using an Android phone and leaving it turned on, so he already doesn't care about privacy. Unfortunately, as usual, Mayayana's post is filled with MARKETING BS. o Intelligent people don't believe only in what MARKETING feeds them. Mobile device security researches discuss frank factual results on hacking iOS & Android devices (i.e., not marketing bull****) https://groups.google.com/d/msg/comp.mobile.android/w3aEX2L4x8U/54qxrmbJCwAJ *FACTS*! o Not Marketing bull****. Despite loud Apple's marketing of the mere _illusion_ of privacy... o The fact is that privacy on Android is no different than on iOS. There you go again with your monotheme. He said nothing about Apple, so don't mix you hatred of Apple in this. (it does not matter what mobile phone type you use: you can be tracked in all cases). What Mayayana said is basically true. -- Cheers, Carlos E.R. |
#12
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Google tracked his bike ride past a burglarized home. That made him a suspect.
On Mon, 9 Mar 2020 08:56:01 -0400, Mayayana wrote:
I don't get the point of buying an anon phone and still using a computer phone. Mayayana is correct on this point. o If you're using a smartphone, you're using a computer. Unless you're a tech whiz (none of us are), you're trackable. Even if you do manage to steal a burner phone unseen, at night, with no cameras around, and then you use it to make your nefarious one call, you'd better tape it to the bottom of a greyhound bus and get out of Dodge if you don't want to be further tracked using it. Since none of us are committing high crimes while using the phone, we don't need that level of protection; where all we need is some intelligence. It's rather easy to kill google on an unrooted Android phone, it turns out: https://i.postimg.cc/d0Q1xWvp/killgoogle02.jpg But there are a _lot_ of steps, unfortunately... o But each of the steps is logical, sane, sensible, and, get this: easy. For example, it's _stupid_ to own an Android phone and then upload your neighbors' SSID information to Google every day. Turn that **** off. It's also just as rude to upload your contacts to Google every day via sync every time you use Gmail. Turn that **** off. It's also just plain stupid to upload your calendar events to Google every day. Turn that **** off. I admit you need intelligence to set up a phone to be as private as we can make it, but the steps, albeit myriad, are simple, e.g., permissions. https://i.postimg.cc/q7m1Lf6y/permission13.jpg But even real-time traffic can be obtained, with routing, with privacy! https://i.postimg.cc/fRbSDSkj/traffic02.jpg You just have to be intelligent about the Android phone setup steps. For one, when it asks you to set up an account on the phone, skip that step altogether; the Android phone has full functionality without the Google account (unlike an iOS phone which requires the iCloud account for full functionality). o Why would anyone NEED to set up the Android OS to a Google Account? https://groups.google.com/d/msg/comp.mobile.android/0O0GLU0bFmw/DD095dJ3AQAJ If you're on the Android/iOS newsgroups, you're aware of the privacy steps: Just search for "privacy" in these public permanent web-searchable archives o http://tinyurl.com/comp-mobile-android o http://tinyurl.com/misc-phone-mobile-iphone o http://misc.phone.mobile.iphone.narkive.com o http://comp.mobile.android.narkive.com -- Intelligent people make their decisions based on facts & not on Marketing. |
#13
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Google tracked his bike ride past a burglarized home. That made him a suspect.
On Mon, 9 Mar 2020 14:28:45 +0100, Carlos E. R. wrote:
What Mayayana said is basically true. Hi Carlos, You have to be intelligent and realize what Mayayana actually said: "On the other hand, the man is using an Android phone and leaving it turned on, so he already doesn't care about privacy. " What on earth do you _think_ Mayayana was implying as the alternative? o A Windows phone? It's clear Mayayana fell for the MARKETING bull****... o People who think iOS is more private fall for MARKETING bull****, Carlos. Bull****, Carlos. o I'm allergic to bull**** - particularly parroted MARKETING bull****. You, and Mayayana, both know when you bull**** - I come down hard on you. o Just as _you_ should come down hard on me if I ever bull**** you. Deal? o If I ever bull**** you, Carlos, I would _expect_ you to hit me hard. Because I strive for 100% credibility Carlos. o That means I know the facts - and I look askance at MARKETING bull****. My peeve is too many morons _believe_ the Apple MARKETING bull****, Carlos. o It's easily been proved iOS is no more private than Android. Period. Facts. I come down hard on FACTS - and on people who spout bull****. o Most people seem to _believe_ the Apple MARKETING bull****. And yet, I'm eminently logical, reasonable, and sensible. o When it comes to ASSESSMENT of the facts, Carlos. For example, Mayayana claimed the guy was an idiot, which I agreed was basically true from the standpoint of what he did before he realized using anything from Google is fraught with privacy holes. My two-part message to folks is very simple: a. Setting up (unrooted) Android for privacy merely takes intelligence b. Believing iOS is (magically?) more private is not supported by facts But as you're well aware, it's trivial to remove Google from an Android phone, such that Google does _not_ get your tracking data, and yet, you still have full functionality of the phone (which is privacy that is impossible on iOS). As nospam noted, it's far more difficult to remove your tracking data from your cellular carrier, although it's trivial also (airplane mode) but then you lose basic functionality of the phone. But anyone who claims that iOS is somehow (magically?) more private than Android is simply proving they fall prey to mere MARKETING bull****. Let's be adults here and stick to the _facts_... o Apple MARKETING is bull**** - and easily proven to be bull****, Carlos. With facts. -- Adults comprehend the difference between facts & mere MARKETING illusions. |
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Google tracked his bike ride past a burglarized home. That madehim a suspect.
On 3/8/20 9:02 PM, Mayayana wrote:
"anonlinuxuser" wrote | o Interesting story about geofence warrants increasingly being used on innocent people | https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/bqITN_pClYA | | Hopefully, and someday, that will be made illegal. | Yes. On the other hand, the man is using an Android phone and leaving it turned on, so he already doesn't care about privacy. To top it off, he was using an app to count the miles he rode on his bike and Google was tracking that. So if he had the hassle of being considered a suspect I'd call that an idiocy tax. It's hard to have sympathy for such sheer ninny-headedness. I suppose people tracking their steps [inaccurately] on their iPhone are more stupid and wasting even more money, but feeling a need to record your bicycle riding, and signing up for spyware to do it, is pretty darn dumb. I don't own any Google devices or software. And who's idea was it to fund in the beginning of Google? One of the three letter agencies. What a better way to spy on the public. Hook n' Crook. |
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Google tracked his bike ride past a burglarized home. That madehim a suspect.
On 3/9/20 6:04 AM, anonymous wrote:
"anonlinuxuser" wrote o Interesting story about geofence warrants increasingly being used on innocent people https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/bqITN_pClYA Hopefully, and someday, that will be made illegal. Yes. On the other hand, the man is using an Android phone and leaving it turned on, so he already doesn't care about privacy. To top it off, he was using an app to count the miles he rode on his bike and Google was tracking that. So if he had the hassle of being considered a suspect I'd call that an idiocy tax. It's hard to have sympathy for such sheer ninny-headedness. I suppose people tracking their steps inaccurately on their iPhone are more stupid and wasting even more money, but feeling a need to record your bicycle riding, and signing up for spyware to do it, is pretty darn dumb. A good way to handle this is something I do. 1. Get a burner flipphone for calls/calling. No google/fasebook tracking on it. Set it up as described below. 2. Get a burner smartphone at a department store (Walmart) with/using a monthly charge card. In the states, you will have to go to the burner phone's local store to initiate the phone. I just did this at AT&T. They asked for my name, address, etc, all of which I gave false information. Now your smartphone is untraceable to you and you can run all you foolish, baby phone toys on it. The cops can get all the google/facebook tracking information they want, but will not be able to trace it to your name. You probably shouldn't have your flip phone on while your smartphone is being used because they might correlate the two being linked, always being at the same place. Do not fall for AT&T's attempt to get you to recharge your phone time using a credit card over the phone. Always purchase a new charge card (I use the $35 for 3 months card). 3. Something else I did. I purchased the burner phone at Walmart one year before I began to use it. Walmart takes pictures of everyone now and it is believed that they keep them one year. This is probably a much shorter retention time when purchased at a convenience store. I don't own any cell phones of any kind. |
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