If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below. |
|
|
Thread Tools | Rate Thread | Display Modes |
#16
|
|||
|
|||
Atlantis Word Processor
On Wed, 05 Feb 2014 08:56:00 -0500, Silver Slimer wrote:
The biggest gripe I have with Atlantis is that it saves to .RTF by default. I can understand that they would avoid .DOC or .DOCX due to their proprietary nature and the high potential for them to screw up the format due to lack of compatibility but there's no reason for them to ignore a format like .ODT which is open to everyone and superior to .RTF. If they were to follow your suggestion, my biggest gripe would be that the default file type is .ODT. |
Ads |
#17
|
|||
|
|||
Atlantis Word Processor
On 05/02/2014 10:36 AM, Char Jackson wrote:
On Wed, 05 Feb 2014 08:56:00 -0500, Silver Slimer wrote: The biggest gripe I have with Atlantis is that it saves to .RTF by default. I can understand that they would avoid .DOC or .DOCX due to their proprietary nature and the high potential for them to screw up the format due to lack of compatibility but there's no reason for them to ignore a format like .ODT which is open to everyone and superior to .RTF. If they were to follow your suggestion, my biggest gripe would be that the default file type is .ODT. And what exactly is the issue with .ODT? -- Silver Slimer GNU/Linux is Communism |
#18
|
|||
|
|||
Atlantis Word Processor
On 2/5/14 7:03 AM, Silver Slimer wrote:
snip I only use Thunderbird because it allows me to send encrypted mail through GnuPG. In the case of Firefox, I use it because it supports plug-ins and isn't as insecure as Internet Explorer is. LibreOffice is my suite of choice because I like the classic interface and believe in open formats (not necessarily open-source). I will never be dumb enough to tell you that any of the aforementioned products is devoid of bugs though. Overall, LO is pretty good. The problems occur when the features you tend to use a lot have issues. That's what happened to me. I tried to support LO by filing bugs. I actually thought, since it was an issue, they would fix it. But no-o-o, it wasn't used by many (that they know of, obviously), so they never fixed any of them. The zealots kept telling me those issues weren't important. But they never had an answer when I said they were important to me, and why should I use and recommend a program that doesn't work. I actually had a list of problems here I was going to file, but since that was their attitude, I never bothered. After the last go around in this area, I posted I was done with LO, and stopped reading their mailing list/newsgroup/Nabble. LO is still installed for the occasional Word file that I get, but that's it. -- Ken Mac OS X 10.8.5 Firefox 24.0 Thunderbird 24.0 |
#19
|
|||
|
|||
Atlantis Word Processor
On 2/5/14 6:56 AM, Silver Slimer wrote:
On 05/02/2014 4:59 AM, mechanic wrote: The 'they' in the quoted post refers to the developers of the app. How do they expect to compete with MS-Office on features, or Libre/Open Office on price? The biggest gripe I have with Atlantis is that it saves to .RTF by default. I can understand that they would avoid .DOC or .DOCX due to their proprietary nature and the high potential for them to screw up the format due to lack of compatibility but there's no reason for them to ignore a format like .ODT which is open to everyone and superior to .RTF. Maybe they don't default to .ODT because few commercial packages support it, AFAIK. And making a Word format as the default may be seen by some as tacitly saying Word is what you should be using. -- Ken Mac OS X 10.8.5 Firefox 24.0 Thunderbird 24.0 |
#20
|
|||
|
|||
Atlantis Word Processor
On 05/02/2014 11:15 AM, Ken Springer wrote:
On 2/5/14 7:03 AM, Silver Slimer wrote: snip I only use Thunderbird because it allows me to send encrypted mail through GnuPG. In the case of Firefox, I use it because it supports plug-ins and isn't as insecure as Internet Explorer is. LibreOffice is my suite of choice because I like the classic interface and believe in open formats (not necessarily open-source). I will never be dumb enough to tell you that any of the aforementioned products is devoid of bugs though. Overall, LO is pretty good. The problems occur when the features you tend to use a lot have issues. That's what happened to me. I tried to support LO by filing bugs. I actually thought, since it was an issue, they would fix it. But no-o-o, it wasn't used by many (that they know of, obviously), so they never fixed any of them. The zealots kept telling me those issues weren't important. But they never had an answer when I said they were important to me, and why should I use and recommend a program that doesn't work. I have to admit that I would be very upset with that kind of lack of collaboration. I've financially supported LibreOffice and Firefox in the past. If they ever decided that one of my issues was not important, they would never see money from me again. As it is, I find both of Mozilla's products to be memory hogs. I don't mind since I have 8 gigs of RAM on this particular machine, but I also find that they tend to go into a non-responsive mode from time to time. If I knew what issue caused that, I would file a bug but expect it to be resolved. I actually had a list of problems here I was going to file, but since that was their attitude, I never bothered. It makes sense. You tried to collaborate with them but they didn't collaborate back. After the last go around in this area, I posted I was done with LO, and stopped reading their mailing list/newsgroup/Nabble. LO is still installed for the occasional Word file that I get, but that's it. I write a few .ODT documents so the suite is necessary for me. Technically, I could work just as well with WordPad since my texts are usually very simple but I liked knowing that the advanced features are there if ever I need them. -- Silver Slimer GNU/Linux is Communism |
#21
|
|||
|
|||
Atlantis Word Processor
On 05/02/2014 11:19 AM, Ken Springer wrote:
On 2/5/14 6:56 AM, Silver Slimer wrote: On 05/02/2014 4:59 AM, mechanic wrote: The 'they' in the quoted post refers to the developers of the app. How do they expect to compete with MS-Office on features, or Libre/Open Office on price? The biggest gripe I have with Atlantis is that it saves to .RTF by default. I can understand that they would avoid .DOC or .DOCX due to their proprietary nature and the high potential for them to screw up the format due to lack of compatibility but there's no reason for them to ignore a format like .ODT which is open to everyone and superior to .RTF. Maybe they don't default to .ODT because few commercial packages support it, AFAIK. And making a Word format as the default may be seen by some as tacitly saying Word is what you should be using. I believe that is their objective to be honest. Companies shouldn't be so easily handing the monopoly to Microsoft. -- Silver Slimer GNU/Linux is Communism |
#22
|
|||
|
|||
Atlantis Word Processor
On Wed, 05 Feb 2014 10:42:15 -0500, Silver Slimer wrote:
On 05/02/2014 10:36 AM, Char Jackson wrote: On Wed, 05 Feb 2014 08:56:00 -0500, Silver Slimer wrote: The biggest gripe I have with Atlantis is that it saves to .RTF by default. I can understand that they would avoid .DOC or .DOCX due to their proprietary nature and the high potential for them to screw up the format due to lack of compatibility but there's no reason for them to ignore a format like .ODT which is open to everyone and superior to .RTF. If they were to follow your suggestion, my biggest gripe would be that the default file type is .ODT. And what exactly is the issue with .ODT? My gripe would be that they've selected an obscure filetype as the default rather than a common filetype. It's academic, though, because I'm happy with MS Word. |
#23
|
|||
|
|||
Atlantis Word Processor
On 05/02/2014 12:39 PM, Char Jackson wrote:
And what exactly is the issue with .ODT? My gripe would be that they've selected an obscure filetype as the default rather than a common filetype. It's academic, though, because I'm happy with MS Word. ..ODT isn't that obscure anymore. .OGG might be as an audio type but .ODT support is included in Wordpad so you know that it's become common enough. The advantage of open formats in general is that you never have to worry about support for that format disappearing. As was stated earlier in this forum, people used certain products in the 1980's and saved in that product's default format, only to see the program die and support for the format disappear. By using an open format, you ensure that support for your document type will never die. .OGG is probably the only exception to that rule as virtually nothing supports it without plug-ins. -- Silver Slimer GNU/Linux is Communism |
#24
|
|||
|
|||
Atlantis Word Processor
On Tue, 04 Feb 2014 09:22:13 -0600, BillW50 wrote:
I often don't get very excited about the daily offering on Giveawayoftheday.com. And today was just another word processor which I tried dozens of them in the past and almost none of them impress me at all. But I must say just using this Atlantis Word Processor for a few hours has really impressed me. If you are frustrated over non MS Word word processors like me, this one is definitely worth a look. And it can be portable too. ;-) It's not really portable in the sense of OS portability. I generally use LibreOffice for heavy duty work and Abiword when I just need to dash off a quick note - works a treat! |
#25
|
|||
|
|||
Atlantis Word Processor
"Char Jackson" wrote in message ... On Wed, 05 Feb 2014 10:42:15 -0500, Silver Slimer wrote: On 05/02/2014 10:36 AM, Char Jackson wrote: On Wed, 05 Feb 2014 08:56:00 -0500, Silver Slimer wrote: The biggest gripe I have with Atlantis is that it saves to .RTF by default. I can understand that they would avoid .DOC or .DOCX due to their proprietary nature and the high potential for them to screw up the format due to lack of compatibility but there's no reason for them to ignore a format like .ODT which is open to everyone and superior to .RTF. If they were to follow your suggestion, my biggest gripe would be that the default file type is .ODT. And what exactly is the issue with .ODT? My gripe would be that they've selected an obscure filetype as the default rather than a common filetype. It's academic, though, because I'm happy with MS Word. What difference does it make? You can always change the default. Heck I didn't like the defaults of MS Word either. -- Bill Gateway M465e ('06 era) - Windows Live Mail 2009 v14 Centrino Core2 Duo T7400 2.16 GHz - 4GB - Windows 7 Home SP1 |
#26
|
|||
|
|||
Atlantis Word Processor
"VanguardLH" wrote in message
... BillW50 wrote: I often don't get very excited about the daily offering on Giveawayoftheday.com. And today was just another word processor which I tried dozens of them in the past and almost none of them impress me at all. But I must say just using this Atlantis Word Processor for a few hours has really impressed me. If you are frustrated over non MS Word word processors like me, this one is definitely worth a look. And it can be portable too. ;-) [...] Then I found "This "Giveaway-of-the-day" offer has expired." inside the setup.exe file so, yep, this is the GOTD wrapper but is it a web-only wrapper or does it contain the full Atlantis product? I downloaded it a few minutes after it was up on the website. Mine had no GAOTD wrapper, just a setup.exe and a readme.txt. Although it doesn't make a lot of difference, since once installed you can create a copy on a flash drive. And running it on the flash, has the ability to install on the computer you are running it on. [...] No table or frames support. Really, no table support? Why are people creating tables on a word processor? Why not use a spreadsheet? I guess if you like this word processor (and only want a word processor) but miss out on the GOTD offer, you could buy it for only $10 with a 70% discount offer at softpedia.com. http://www.softpedia.com/get/Office-...rocessor.shtml As of version 1.6.5.8, this product dropped support for Windows 9x and Windows NT4. It's been awhile since I've seen anyone using NT4 but I still see plenty of users of Windows 9x. Hmm... I wonder if it gets you future updates for free? -- Bill Gateway M465e ('06 era) - Windows Live Mail 2009 v14 Centrino Core2 Duo T7400 2.16 GHz - 4GB - Windows 7 Home SP1 |
#27
|
|||
|
|||
Atlantis Word Processor
On 2/5/14 2:47 PM, BillW50 wrote:
"VanguardLH" wrote in message ... BillW50 wrote: snip Why are people creating tables on a word processor? Why not use a spreadsheet? It depends on what your goal is with the table. I think people tend to lose sight of the purpose of a spreadsheet. It's for the purpose manipulating numbers, doing math operations of some type. It's not for manipulating text. In your preferred spreadsheet, can you insert a graphic/image into a cell? In a Libre Office spreadsheet, you can insert a graphic/image, but it's free floating, it's not inserted into the cell itself. Which you might want if you were using LO Writer to create a table for a basic HTML page. In Writer and Word, the image is inserted into the table cell. Change the size, shape, location of the table and/or cell, and the image moves with it. Doing the same in an LO spreadsheet, the image stays put. You have to manually reposition that image. I'm sure there are other differences, but this one comes to mind. And doing something like this that doesn't require a math component is simply extra steps you have to do to get that table into the text document, plus the extra time to edit that table info. -- Ken Mac OS X 10.8.5 Firefox 24.0 Thunderbird 24.0 |
#28
|
|||
|
|||
Atlantis Word Processor
BillW50 wrote:
VanguardLH wrote ... Then I found "This "Giveaway-of-the-day" offer has expired." inside the setup.exe file so, yep, this is the GOTD wrapper but is it a web-only wrapper or does it contain the full Atlantis product? I downloaded it a few minutes after it was up on the website. Mine had no GAOTD wrapper, just a setup.exe and a readme.txt. Perhaps we got different downloads from the GOTD site. I severely doubt the true installer for JUST the word processor product distributed by the author would contain a string saying "Giveaway-of-the-day". The GOTD download that I got also had only the setup.exe and .txt files. It was what was INSIDE the .exe file that identified it from GOTD. Did you try running the setup.exe with NO network access so the wrapper couldn't phone home? If not, did you install significantly outside the window of the giveaway day, like 4 hours after you could no longer download it from the GOTD site (to accomodate any timezone difference between your locale and for their validation server)? No table or frames support. Really, no table support? Why are people creating tables on a word processor? Why not use a spreadsheet? So you're going to make someone bounce between a word processor and spreadsheet program just to, for example, see a list of ingredients in a recipe? Ever read a newspaper or even a small one-page flyer? Really, that's your argument for not supporting tables in a word processor, that you don't need columnar formatting ever? Uh huh, and I suppose you never used the tab key to align text either in a single or multiple columns. Tables in documents aren't necessarily and most times are not a spreadsheet with cells containing formulae. They are just a means of providing easy columnar *formatting*. So why bother with bolding, italics, spacing between paragraphs, justification, bullet lists, or any of that other unnecessary formatting fluff? Just with a plain text editor, like Notepad, if you think formatting is unimportant. That you don't need to use tables for columnar formatting is hardly an excuse for a word *processor* to omit the feature. I didn't even mention embedding a spreadsheet or range of cells from one into a document. I only mentioned tables which is a formatting feature. if you like this word processor (and only want a word processor) but miss out on the GOTD offer, you could buy it for only $10 with a 70% discount offer at softpedia.com. Hmm... I wonder if it gets you future updates for free? Well, with the purchase of any software, some updates might be available but not usually after the next major update (which many companies now disconnect after the next minor update so you only get the sub-minor versions for free). For example, 1.6.5 would be major version 1, minor version 6, and sub-minor version 5. In the long past, you got the updates until version 2.x.x came out. Now they've pushed it so you typically only get updates until 1.7.x comes out. Some software has lifetime free updates. I lost interest in the product soon after investigating it. It'll be up to you to find out from the author how they handle updates, or ask the folks here that mentioned using it for years. The 70% offer is you buying a license from the author for the software. You would have to find out from author how they handle licensing regarding later releases. http://www.atlantiswordprocessor.com/en/register.htm http://www.atlantiswordprocessor.com.../upgrading.htm Those don't describe the longevity of their update process; i.e., to what point in the versioning chain you cease to get further updates. There is no mention of lifetime updates. You could ask in their forums (http://www.atlantiswordprocessor.com/en/forum.htm) or other respondents here that mentioned they've used this product for years and on how often there have been major version releases remembering that this product is still at version 1 since first released in 2003. It was at 1.6.6.1 back in Dec 2009. 4 years later and it's STILL at 1.6.6.1. Not much movement there and from what I've read they don't focus on RFEs (requests for enhancement) from their customers. I have to wonder over such a long time with no changes, especially to accomodate customer requests, if the product is dead. It is not uncommon for a company to cease development but continue milking a revenue stream from it. Look how many years Delrina Fax (aka WinFax) was dead before and after Symantec acquired the product all the time still being sold. |
#29
|
|||
|
|||
Atlantis Word Processor
On Tue, 04 Feb 2014 09:22:13 -0600, BillW50 wrote:
I often don't get very excited about the daily offering on Giveawayoftheday.com. And today was just another word processor which I tried dozens of them in the past and almost none of them impress me at all. But I must say just using this Atlantis Word Processor for a few hours has really impressed me. If you are frustrated over non MS Word word processors like me, this one is definitely worth a look. And it can be portable too. ;-) I downloaded it, and since I'd missed the GAOTD offer, I had to make my own serial. They owe me five minutes. Nice = The clickerty sound. It does not phone home. It saves in RTF. Most companies use ODT and RTF as the others are not universal. Bad for business to lose a customer because some clueless salesman sent the letter in a proprietary format. Bad = It does not use open source dictionaries, and the author is not willing to add any new ones. See discussions in Forum. For me , not having a Brazilian-Portuguese dictionary is a no-no. Last thoughts = is there a clickerty-click extension for LibreOffice ? []'s -- Don't be evil - Google 2004 We have a new policy - Google 2012 |
#30
|
|||
|
|||
Atlantis Word Processor
"VanguardLH" wrote in message ... BillW50 wrote: VanguardLH wrote ... Then I found "This "Giveaway-of-the-day" offer has expired." inside the setup.exe file so, yep, this is the GOTD wrapper but is it a web-only wrapper or does it contain the full Atlantis product? I downloaded it a few minutes after it was up on the website. Mine had no GAOTD wrapper, just a setup.exe and a readme.txt. Perhaps we got different downloads from the GOTD site. I severely doubt the true installer for JUST the word processor product distributed by the author would contain a string saying "Giveaway-of-the-day". The GOTD download that I got also had only the setup.exe and .txt files. It was what was INSIDE the .exe file that identified it from GOTD. Did you try running the setup.exe with NO network access so the wrapper couldn't phone home? If not, did you install significantly outside the window of the giveaway day, like 4 hours after you could no longer download it from the GOTD site (to accomodate any timezone difference between your locale and for their validation server)? Absolutely! For example, I haven't fired up Windows 7 on this machine for like 6 months. I just fired it up yesterday (a day after that GAOTD), and ran setup.exe and it installed Atlantis just fine. Others commented in the comment section that theirs didn't have the wrapper either. No table or frames support. Really, no table support? Why are people creating tables on a word processor? Why not use a spreadsheet? So you're going to make someone bounce between a word processor and spreadsheet program just to, for example, see a list of ingredients in a recipe? Naw, MS Word can read Excel tables right inside of a Word document. This is called integration. Ever read a newspaper or even a small one-page flyer? Really, that's your argument for not supporting tables in a word processor, that you don't need columnar formatting ever? I don't think of columns as tables per se. By the way, Atlantis does support columns. Uh huh, and I suppose you never used the tab key to align text either in a single or multiple columns. I've been using word processors and text editors since the early 80's. And back in the CP/M-DOS days I have created a few tables by using tab characters. But since then, I can't think of a single time I wanted to create a table (outside of a spreadsheet). And since I save lots of computer articles (I use plain text if I can get away with it). And tables just makes the task of converting to plain text a bit harder. Too many people are creating tables and using them for things that are totally unnecessary. Tables in documents aren't necessarily and most times are not a spreadsheet with cells containing formulae. They are just a means of providing easy columnar *formatting*. So why bother with bolding, italics, spacing between paragraphs, justification, bullet lists, or any of that other unnecessary formatting fluff? Just with a plain text editor, like Notepad, if you think formatting is unimportant. I don't know, we do pretty well in plain text newsgroups without all of that stuff. Some experts claim that plain text doesn't contain formatting. But I disagree. Plain text can be formatted to contain many of the features you listed above. Heck, this WLM has a formatting error and creates quoted lines with a mix of long and short line lengths. Thank goodness for formatting controls in word processors. As I can fix it in a few seconds. That you don't need to use tables for columnar formatting is hardly an excuse for a word *processor* to omit the feature. I didn't even mention embedding a spreadsheet or range of cells from one into a document. I only mentioned tables which is a formatting feature. I dunno, I don't miss it a bit. And Atlantis is only 3MB in size. And for all it does, it is truly amazing! And it has features I like which is rare among other word processors. Like it tells me how long I have been composing this reply and how many characters per minute I am typing them out. ;-) if you like this word processor (and only want a word processor) but miss out on the GOTD offer, you could buy it for only $10 with a 70% discount offer at softpedia.com. Hmm... I wonder if it gets you future updates for free? Well, with the purchase of any software, some updates might be available but not usually after the next major update (which many companies now disconnect after the next minor update so you only get the sub-minor versions for free). For example, 1.6.5 would be major version 1, minor version 6, and sub-minor version 5. In the long past, you got the updates until version 2.x.x came out. Now they've pushed it so you typically only get updates until 1.7.x comes out. Some software has lifetime free updates. I lost interest in the product soon after investigating it. It'll be up to you to find out from the author how they handle updates, or ask the folks here that mentioned using it for years. The 70% offer is you buying a license from the author for the software. You would have to find out from author how they handle licensing regarding later releases. http://www.atlantiswordprocessor.com/en/register.htm http://www.atlantiswordprocessor.com.../upgrading.htm Those don't describe the longevity of their update process; i.e., to what point in the versioning chain you cease to get further updates. There is no mention of lifetime updates. You could ask in their forums (http://www.atlantiswordprocessor.com/en/forum.htm) or other respondents here that mentioned they've used this product for years and on how often there have been major version releases remembering that this product is still at version 1 since first released in 2003. It was at 1.6.6.1 back in Dec 2009. 4 years later and it's STILL at 1.6.6.1. Not much movement there and from what I've read they don't focus on RFEs (requests for enhancement) from their customers. Everything I have read so far, registrating gets you all future 1.xx versions. I have to wonder over such a long time with no changes, especially to accomodate customer requests, if the product is dead. It is not uncommon for a company to cease development but continue milking a revenue stream from it. Look how many years Delrina Fax (aka WinFax) was dead before and after Symantec acquired the product all the time still being sold. I have a ton of such software. Although I have a different take about viewing such software. Most of these products virtually had been all ironed out. And they are far from the early buggy versions. And I think most software should be like this. Take a look at Mozilla for example. I view their products as always under construction and will never be completed. You can't develop good software using this model. What you always end up with is bloated spaghetti code. -- Bill Gateway M465e ('06 era) - Windows Live Mail 2009 v14 Centrino Core2 Duo T7400 2.16 GHz - 4GB - Windows 7 Home SP1 |
Thread Tools | |
Display Modes | Rate This Thread |
|
|