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(OT) "Windows 7 enters its final year of free support"



 
 
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  #16  
Old January 16th 19, 12:33 AM posted to alt.comp.freeware,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.windows7.general
Mayayana
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,438
Default (OT) "Windows 7 enters its final year of free support"

"Paul" wrote

|
| Win2K uses to support multiple hardware profiles,
| and if you requested to start a new profile, the
| profile "started empty".
|
| On WinXP, a second profile would start life as a
| "duplicate" of the first profile. That means, if
| you had a dock that your laptop plugged into, the
| second profile would have all the usual drivers, plus
| the NIC driver for the dock. WinXP didn't have the
| convenient feature of making an "empty" ENUM, because
| that would promote the idea of moving the OS between
| machines. Having these ENUM capabilities says nothing
| about bypassing activation, and activation is an
| ever-present threat.
|
| I have deleted ENUM on Windows 10 and then rebooted,
| and the OS quite nicely survives the loss of drivers

Interesting. I stopped deleting ENUM after Win98 and
never create hardware profiles. I just image without IDE
drivers, copy it over, then start installing the new drivers.
That's on XP. So far I only have disk images for Win7 boxes
and haven't needed to use them yet. I've prepped those
by removing the boot partition, so that it's a 1-partition
image.



Ads
  #17  
Old January 16th 19, 12:47 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
J. P. Gilliver (John)[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,679
Default (OT) "Windows 7 enters its final year of free support"

In message , Paul
writes:
[]
However, this tool will bypass the key requirement. If you
needed a "Windows 7 Home Premium" for your Dell, you could get
it this way. And as long as you have the license key from the
COA sticker, do a reinstall with your new disc. No key need
be entered, to get an ISO download using this too.


I presume you mean you _do_ need the sticker key to do the actual
(re)install, just not to get the ISO - right?

https://www.heidoc.net/joomla/techno.../67-microsoft-
windows-iso-download-tool

The Digital River era (where there were URLs pointing to direct
downloads), that stopped some time ago.

Paul

--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

The modern world so often thinks that the way to relax is by doing absolutely
nothing, and I've never really understood that.
Nigella Lawson in RT 2015/10/31-11/6
  #18  
Old January 16th 19, 12:52 AM posted to alt.comp.freeware,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.windows7.general
Java Jive
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 391
Default (OT) "Windows 7 enters its final year of free support"

On 15/01/2019 23:28, Mayayana wrote:
"Java Jive" wrote

| In 2000/XP, if these were fairly bog-standard, you could copy a build
| from one PC to another and there was a reasonable chance it would work,
| but if you imaged a build onto new hardware requiring different boot
| drivers, booting would stall with a famous 0x0000007b BSOD which means
| that the boot hardware it was expecting could not be found.

I don't know what you mean by boot hardware. In my
experience only IDE drivers have been a problem. The
rest is mainly standard and Windows will use defaults until
drivers can be installed for motherboard, audio, graphics,
etc.


Read the link I gave. Usually the cause of the BSOD is different chip
drivers for disk access, but also I've had at least one motherboard that
needed a particular driver for the graphics port (ie not the graphics
card itself but the interface it plugged into). And don't forget IDE
was not the only way of accessing a HD, there was also SCSI & SATA, the
first of which would need a driver for the SCSI card, and the second of
which might have needed a driver if it couldn't mimic IDE/PATA.

| Next the boot files did and still do make the same mistake, and instead
| of looking for a Windows system in the same partition as themselves,
| they need to be told where to find it. So, as I discovered yesterday as
| it happens, if I transfer the CD-ROM/HardDrive adaptor containing the
| Windows XP partition disk from the CD-bay of my laptop to that of its
| docking station, and try to boot XP, I get the f*king BSOD mentioned
above!

You need to edit boot.ini, as you probably figured out.


Of course, but I only wanted to do it temporarily, and it wasn't worth
the fag.

But I agree that MS have done their best to thwart things.
They keep changing boot config. They did that monstrous mess
with Vista/7 where there can be a separate, small boot partition
if you don't know enough to remove it. Lots of little gotchas.
I assume Win8/10 is similar to Vista/7, and that 6/8/10 are
all basically variations on Windows 6, with or without Metro
tacked on.


That's pretty much the case.
  #19  
Old January 16th 19, 12:54 AM posted to alt.comp.freeware,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.windows7.general
Java Jive
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 391
Default (OT) "Windows 7 enters its final year of free support"

On 15/01/2019 23:23, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
In message , Java Jive
writes:
[]
Just now I'm trying to downgrade a W7 build from Ultimate to Home


Why? (Just curious; not saying you shouldn't!)


Licensing reasons, I only have one Ultimate Licence, but now want to use
the same build on a PC that only has a Home Premium licence.
  #20  
Old January 16th 19, 01:13 AM posted to alt.comp.freeware,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.windows7.general
J. P. Gilliver (John)[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,679
Default (OT) "Windows 7 enters its final year of free support"

In message , Java Jive
writes:
On 15/01/2019 23:23, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
In message , Java Jive
writes:
[]
Just now I'm trying to downgrade a W7 build from Ultimate to Home

Why? (Just curious; not saying you shouldn't!)


Licensing reasons, I only have one Ultimate Licence, but now want to
use the same build on a PC that only has a Home Premium licence.


Why did you not start from HP?
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

"On the whole, I'm in favour of the state getting out of people's lives, but I
would not have a problem with voting being made compulsory. But if you did
that, you'd have to have a box for 'None of the above'."
Jeremy Paxman, quoted in RT 2015/5/2-8
  #21  
Old January 16th 19, 01:18 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
Paul[_32_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 11,873
Default (OT) "Windows 7 enters its final year of free support"

J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
In message , Paul
writes:
[]
However, this tool will bypass the key requirement. If you
needed a "Windows 7 Home Premium" for your Dell, you could get
it this way. And as long as you have the license key from the
COA sticker, do a reinstall with your new disc. No key need
be entered, to get an ISO download using this tool.


I presume you mean you _do_ need the sticker key to do the actual
(re)install, just not to get the ISO - right?


Yes.

Need the key for install.

Don't need the key for the download.

Paul
  #22  
Old January 16th 19, 01:47 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
J. P. Gilliver (John)[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,679
Default (OT) "Windows 7 enters its final year of free support"

In message , Paul
writes:
J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
In message , Paul
writes:
[]
However, this tool will bypass the key requirement. If you
needed a "Windows 7 Home Premium" for your Dell, you could get
it this way. And as long as you have the license key from the
COA sticker, do a reinstall with your new disc. No key need
be entered, to get an ISO download using this tool.

I presume you mean you _do_ need the sticker key to do the actual
(re)install, just not to get the ISO - right?


Yes.

Need the key for install.

Don't need the key for the download.

Paul


Thanks.

I've just downloaded
https://www.heidoc.net/joomla/techno...67-microsoft-w
indows-iso-download-tool and run it, and downloaded a .iso as you
recommended. Two observations:

1. It asked me to choose - all options were 7 SP1, but Home Premium
etc., and plain or OEM (which it called COEM). Since the 7 HP I have
came with the machine, I chose the latter - was that right? The sticker
(which I took the opportunity to copy - it's not inside the battery
compartment or anything, so was in danger of rubbing off) has five
groups of five characters, rather than one group being "OEM", but I
think they stopped doing that a while ago - is that right? (I. e. are
even OEM keys from stickers now 5 groups of 5 characters?) If not,
should I download the non-OEM .iso instead - how would I tell? (Although
the Windows came with the machine, the machine came from a reseller, not
new.)

2. I clicked the relevant Download button, but nothing happened. (The
cursor _did_ change from an arrow to a hand when over it.) [I have an
audible and visible traffic indicator, bitmeter2, so I knew it wasn't.]
I clicked the Copy Link button, and pasted it into my browser of
preference (an old Firefox), and a download did start. (And finish.) Not
a problem, but I thought I'd mention it.

Thanks again for the pointer to the tool.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

"On the whole, I'm in favour of the state getting out of people's lives, but I
would not have a problem with voting being made compulsory. But if you did
that, you'd have to have a box for 'None of the above'."
Jeremy Paxman, quoted in RT 2015/5/2-8
  #23  
Old January 16th 19, 02:09 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
Paul[_32_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 11,873
Default (OT) "Windows 7 enters its final year of free support"

J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
In message , Paul
writes:
J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
In message , Paul
writes:
[]
However, this tool will bypass the key requirement. If you
needed a "Windows 7 Home Premium" for your Dell, you could get
it this way. And as long as you have the license key from the
COA sticker, do a reinstall with your new disc. No key need
be entered, to get an ISO download using this tool.
I presume you mean you _do_ need the sticker key to do the actual
(re)install, just not to get the ISO - right?


Yes.

Need the key for install.

Don't need the key for the download.

Paul


Thanks.

I've just downloaded
https://www.heidoc.net/joomla/techno...67-microsoft-w
indows-iso-download-tool and run it, and downloaded a .iso as you
recommended. Two observations:

1. It asked me to choose - all options were 7 SP1, but Home Premium
etc., and plain or OEM (which it called COEM). Since the 7 HP I have
came with the machine, I chose the latter - was that right? The sticker
(which I took the opportunity to copy - it's not inside the battery
compartment or anything, so was in danger of rubbing off) has five
groups of five characters, rather than one group being "OEM", but I
think they stopped doing that a while ago - is that right? (I. e. are
even OEM keys from stickers now 5 groups of 5 characters?) If not,
should I download the non-OEM .iso instead - how would I tell? (Although
the Windows came with the machine, the machine came from a reseller, not
new.)

2. I clicked the relevant Download button, but nothing happened. (The
cursor _did_ change from an arrow to a hand when over it.) [I have an
audible and visible traffic indicator, bitmeter2, so I knew it wasn't.]
I clicked the Copy Link button, and pasted it into my browser of
preference (an old Firefox), and a download did start. (And finish.) Not
a problem, but I thought I'd mention it.

Thanks again for the pointer to the tool.


The COEM could be "System Builder OEM". That's a non-retail SKU that
doesn't allow moving between PCs. I don't know if the license key
would activate that or not.

When I tried the experiment, I reinstalled Windows 7 Home Premium, probably
a Retail version, onto my laptop, and I still had to use phone activation
with the 56 digit numbers, to complete the activation step. I doubt any
OS "precisely matches" the intention of that COA sticker key, and maybe that's
why I had to use phone activation.

The thing is, your original machine purchase had Home Premium, and
the feature set of *any* Home Premium should be the same, whether
it's Retail (movable), System Builder OEM (unmovable), or Royalty
OEM (Dell/HP/Acer unmovable). But the first two should be installable
using media you can download, and as long as the phone activation
step works, you probably don't care. Every time you reinstall,
you will be facing the same phone activation step (no humans).

If you do something out of the ordinary, it's always possible
a human will pick up the line, instead of the machine. It hasn't
happened to me, because I've done so few of these things. If you
"use" your copy too many times (regardless of type), that's when
the key gets locked. If you move a Retail copy 50 times, they
don't like that. And if they tell you to **** off, you'll be
****ing off :-) :-) This is based on their suspicion (without
proof) of license abuse. I could for example, install the
same Retail copy on 50 machines, disconnect the network cable,
and then feed them monthly .msu files and keep them
up to date. And they would not know, except for the 50 activations
on the server. It's assumed that a useful machine needs an
internet connection (which they can see). Machines which connect
to do Windows Update, likely leave a footprint, and then they'd
probably have evidence something fishy is going on,
before the counter gets to a preferably high number.

Like everything about licensing/activation, don't expect the
details to be documented with precision. Details are left out
to put miscreants at a disadvantage. When I did my reinstall,
all I knew was I *should* be able to do it, without any
assurance I could complete the whole process.

Paul
  #24  
Old January 16th 19, 03:11 AM posted to alt.comp.freeware,alt.windows7.general
😉 Good Guy 😉
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,483
Default (OT) "Windows 7 enters its final year of free support"

On 15/01/2019 14:55, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
Why? Images are so much better.


And you thought this would be very useful for Windows 10 users!! are you
some idiot cross-posting anything useless stuff? Have you got a proper
job or are you living in some geriatric ward?

Why should windows 10 users worry about what happens to Windows 7?





--
With over 950 million devices now running Windows 10, customer
satisfaction is higher than any previous version of windows.

  #25  
Old January 16th 19, 04:53 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
Paul[_32_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 11,873
Default (OT) "Windows 7 enters its final year of free support"

Wolf K wrote:
On 2019-01-15 18:03, Paul wrote:


https://www.heidoc.net/joomla/techno...-download-tool


There are also other sites that offer W7 ISOs, but I'm leery of those.

Best,


All that Heidoc does, is trick the Microsoft server into preparing
a folder on the server with the ISO in it.

The user downloads the file from Microsoft, using that URL.
The file itself, doesn't come from the Heidoc site.

Microsoft stomps on sites which host materials themselves.
But there's not much Microsoft can do about torrents (which
are distributed over a lot of equipment). For anything hosted
on third-party sites, you'd need SHA1 as a bare minimum, and
some people no longer trust SHA1. Even though I've not seen
any confirmed cases in print that it's cracked. MD5 on the other
hand, is easily circumvented, and doesn't require much horsepower
at all to construct a counterfeit file (mod the file so that the
MD5 value doesn't change). If SHA256 falls, then all your
Bitcoins are worthless.

Paul
  #26  
Old January 16th 19, 11:39 AM posted to alt.comp.freeware,alt.windows7.general
Shadow
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,638
Default (OT) "Windows 7 enters its final year of free support"

On Wed, 16 Jan 2019 02:11:42 +0000, ? Good Guy ?
wrote:

On 15/01/2019 14:55, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
Why? Images are so much better.


And you thought this would be very useful for Windows 10 users!! are you
some idiot cross-posting anything useless stuff? Have you got a proper
job or are you living in some geriatric ward?

Why should windows 10 users worry about what happens to Windows 7?


I agree, they should have much greater concerns.
[]'s
--
Don't be evil - Google 2004
We have a new policy - Google 2012
  #27  
Old January 16th 19, 12:07 PM posted to alt.comp.freeware,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.windows7.general
Java Jive
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 391
Default (OT) "Windows 7 enters its final year of free support"

On 16/01/2019 00:13, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
In message , Java Jive
writes:
On 15/01/2019 23:23, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
In message , Java Jive
writes:
[]
Just now I'm trying to downgrade a W7 build from Ultimate to Home
Â*Why? (Just curious; not saying you shouldn't!)


Licensing reasons, I only have one Ultimate Licence, but now want to
use the same build on a PC that only has a Home Premium licence.


Why did you not start from HP?


Because I had to do the build on a secondary less powerful PC while
still being able to use the old, not very good build on the primary one.

  #28  
Old January 16th 19, 04:59 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
J. P. Gilliver (John)[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,679
Default (OT) "Windows 7 enters its final year of free support"

In message , Paul
writes:
J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:

[]
1. It asked me to choose - all options were 7 SP1, but Home Premium
etc., and plain or OEM (which it called COEM). Since the 7 HP I have
came with the machine, I chose the latter - was that right? The
sticker (which I took the opportunity to copy - it's not inside the
battery compartment or anything, so was in danger of rubbing off) has
five groups of five characters, rather than one group being "OEM",
but I think they stopped doing that a while ago - is that right? (I.
e. are even OEM keys from stickers now 5 groups of 5 characters?) If
not, should I download the non-OEM .iso instead - how would I tell?
(Although the Windows came with the machine, the machine came from a
reseller, not new.)

[]
The COEM could be "System Builder OEM". That's a non-retail SKU that
doesn't allow moving between PCs. I don't know if the license key
would activate that or not.

[]
Do you think I should download the other one, or is mine likely to be
the (C)OEM one I've downloaded? (I guess the other one is "Retail"?)
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

User Error: Replace user, hit any key to continue.
  #29  
Old January 16th 19, 08:41 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Paul[_32_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 11,873
Default (OT) "Windows 7 enters its final year of free support"

J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
In message , Paul
writes:
J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:

[]
1. It asked me to choose - all options were 7 SP1, but Home Premium
etc., and plain or OEM (which it called COEM). Since the 7 HP I have
came with the machine, I chose the latter - was that right? The
sticker (which I took the opportunity to copy - it's not inside the
battery compartment or anything, so was in danger of rubbing off)
has five groups of five characters, rather than one group being
"OEM", but I think they stopped doing that a while ago - is that
right? (I. e. are even OEM keys from stickers now 5 groups of 5
characters?) If not, should I download the non-OEM .iso instead -
how would I tell? (Although the Windows came with the machine, the
machine came from a reseller, not new.)

[]
The COEM could be "System Builder OEM". That's a non-retail SKU that
doesn't allow moving between PCs. I don't know if the license key
would activate that or not.

[]
Do you think I should download the other one, or is mine likely to be
the (C)OEM one I've downloaded? (I guess the other one is "Retail"?)


The Heidoc tool isn't likely to stop you.

When you have the discs, you can compare them for us, and
tell us how they differ.

https://web.archive.org/web/20070915...ver-retail.htm

Find your setupp.ini file in the i386 directory on your XP CD.
Open it with Notepad of similar.

Pid=55034000

Retail = 51882 335
Volume License = 51883 270
OEM = 82503 OEM

https://wiki.lunarsoft.net/wiki/Product_IDs

So basically the idea is, an unbranded disc (not a Dell), the
only difference might be found in a single file. In the example
above, it's the setupp.ini file. But that's from the WinXP era.
The Vista+ era is likely to do something similar.

The disc images might be *almost* identical for all I know.

if the tables of values were reliable, you could likely
"make any disc from any other disc".

It would be harder to make an HP disc from a Dell disc,
because each has "custom cruft".

Also, clearing one of those files (ei.cfg???) will make
a disc generic and a menu should appear listing all the
overlaid images available on the disc. Maybe a Win10 disc
has eight OS images (which are very similar and only
slightly different from one another). So you can take
discs that don't have a menu, and bring the menu back.
All what you need, is an "ISO editor" for adding or
removing files.

Paul
  #30  
Old January 17th 19, 03:48 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
J. P. Gilliver (John)[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,679
Default (OT) "Windows 7 enters its final year of free support"

In message , Paul
writes:
J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
In message , Paul
writes:
J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:

[]
1. It asked me to choose - all options were 7 SP1, but Home
Premium etc., and plain or OEM (which it called COEM). Since the 7
HP I have came with the machine, I chose the latter - was that
right? The sticker (which I took the opportunity to copy - it's
not inside the battery compartment or anything, so was in danger
of rubbing off) has five groups of five characters, rather than
one group being "OEM", but I think they stopped doing that a while
ago - is that right? (I. e. are even OEM keys from stickers now 5
groups of 5 characters?) If not, should I download the non-OEM
.iso instead - how would I tell? (Although the Windows came with
the machine, the machine came from a reseller, not new.)

[]
The COEM could be "System Builder OEM". That's a non-retail SKU that
doesn't allow moving between PCs. I don't know if the license key
would activate that or not.

[]
Do you think I should download the other one, or is mine likely to be
the (C)OEM one I've downloaded? (I guess the other one is "Retail"?)


The Heidoc tool isn't likely to stop you.


No, I didn't think it would; I just meant I have no great desire to
download both, so which one should I get for my Toshiba laptop - the
(C)OEM one I've got, or the other one?

I'm _unlikely_ to use either, as I image from time to time, and can't
really see me ever using other than the image; there was just a slight
"get it while it's still available" feel that made me get it at all.
[]
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

There's not an app for that.
 




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