New computer but win 7 or 8

On 4/16/13 2:06 PM, Paul wrote:
Ken Springer wrote:
On 4/16/13 7:08 AM, Zaphod Beeblebrox wrote:
On Tue, 16 Apr 2013 12:59:18 +0000 (UTC), "stones" stoneyroost14
@gmail.invalid wrote in article ...

On Mon, 15 Apr 2013 17:46:34 +0200, Laszlo Lebrun wrote:

And -from time to time- I even go for the modern view e.g. to have a
look at the newspaper sites, which are refreshingly clean, compared to
their ad-cluttered IE or Chrome counterpart.

Use Firefox. Use AdBlock Plus.


And NoScript. And DoNotTrack.


And check those LSO cookies, too. Just another safety precaution.


I've been using the Flash control panel, and it has some kinda
delete for that. I haven't checked how good a job it does though.

I used to clean them out manually, before the Flash control panel
came along. But not daily or anything. It was part of my manual
disk cleanup procedure. (Like, clear Adobe Reader cache, Google Earth
cache, just to release some disk space.)

I use Firefox, and it has the Better Privacy add-on that does this too.
I've actually set both Better Privacy and the Flash Settings Manager
to keep everything off. I don't care which one actually does the job, I
want them all gone.

The Better Privacy add-on is available for a couple other browsers, I think.


--
Ken

Mac OS X 10.8.3
Firefox 20.0
Thunderbird 17.0.5
LibreOffice 4.0.1.2

On Mon, 15 Apr 2013 07:16:40 -0700, Mellowed wrote:

On 4/14/2013 8:01 PM, Char Jackson wrote:
On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 16:25:05 -0700, Ken Blake wrote:

I use Windows 8, almost exclusively with the traditional desktop
interface, and with Start 8 installed. If you were to look at and use
my computer, you would have a hard time realizing that it's not
Windows 7.

Did you manage to kill the 'hot zone' in the upper left corner and the other
W8 zone along the right edge of the screen that pops out the multiple icons?
Also, were you able to kill the capability to switch UI's when pressing the
Windows key by itself?

Until I can completely hide the new UI, I'm still recommending Win7 to the
people who ask me, so it would be nice to address these last few items.

I seem to recall when using Start8 that in the setup options there is
the option to kill the hot zones. I can't verify that since I no longer
use Win8 and have reverted back to Win7.

I don't have Start8 and have no plans to get it, so I can't immediately
confirm that.

--

Char Jackson

On Mon, 15 Apr 2013 13:02:31 -0700, Ken Blake wrote:

On Sun, 14 Apr 2013 22:01:56 -0500, Char Jackson
wrote:

On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 16:25:05 -0700, Ken Blake wrote:

I use Windows 8, almost exclusively with the traditional desktop
interface, and with Start 8 installed. If you were to look at and use
my computer, you would have a hard time realizing that it's not
Windows 7.

Did you manage to kill the 'hot zone' in the upper left corner and the other
W8 zone along the right edge of the screen that pops out the multiple icons?


Yes, easily.

I suppose I should have asked that differently. I used to get answers like
that from my teenager, back in the day.

Also, were you able to kill the capability to switch UI's when pressing the
Windows key by itself?


No.

Bummer.

Until I can completely hide the new UI, I'm still recommending Win7 to the
people who ask me, so it would be nice to address these last few items.


Your choice of course, but I don't see any need to completely hide it,
and I even use it once in a while.

Likewise, I see no need to ever use the Modern UI. Therefore, completely
hiding it has obvious merit for me.

--

Char Jackson

On Mon, 15 Apr 2013 13:04:38 -0700, Ken Blake wrote:

On Sun, 14 Apr 2013 22:16:34 -0500, Char Jackson
wrote:

On Fri, 12 Apr 2013 08:19:25 -0700, Ken Blake wrote:

On Fri, 12 Apr 2013 07:42:50 -0700, Tecknomage
wrote:


The thing to remember about Win8 is that it is primarily optimized for
*touch-screen* hardware. Desktop PC with touch-screen monitor or
tablet PC. It has a smart-phone like GUI.


As far as I'm concerned, the most important thing to remember is that
it has *two* interfaces. The one you are talking about (the
"smart-phone like GUI") is only the default one, and one that doesn't
have to ever be used.

Consider this an open invitation to explain how the new UI "doesn't
have to ever be used". I've got it down to a minimum, but so far I can't
avoid it entirely, although I would like to.


You don't ever have to go there on purpose (although you might
occasionally get there accidentally, to me that's no big deal).

To me, it's a slightly bigger deal, especially when I'm presenting to a
large-ish audience and accidentally click in a hot zone or perform an action
that Windows thinks is best handled by the Modern interface. Like I said
above, I got some or even most of it tamed, but not all of it.

And going there is very different from using it. Looking at it isn't
using it, Clicking on a tile there and running an application there is
using it.

For me, the damage is done when I "go there". I quickly get back, but if
it's a harsh crowd, the twitters and giggles start and ripple through.

--

Char Jackson

On Tue, 16 Apr 2013 07:18:17 -0600, Ken Springer wrote:

On 4/16/13 7:08 AM, Zaphod Beeblebrox wrote:
On Tue, 16 Apr 2013 12:59:18 +0000 (UTC), "stones" stoneyroost14
@gmail.invalid wrote in article ...

On Mon, 15 Apr 2013 17:46:34 +0200, Laszlo Lebrun wrote:

And -from time to time- I even go for the modern view e.g. to have a
look at the newspaper sites, which are refreshingly clean, compared
to their ad-cluttered IE or Chrome counterpart.

Use Firefox. Use AdBlock Plus.

And NoScript. And DoNotTrack.

And check those LSO cookies, too. Just another safety precaution.

Disabling scripting seems to break nearly all sites nowadays. And what
are "LSO cookies"?

On Tue, 16 Apr 2013 23:52:39 -0500, Char Jackson wrote:

On Mon, 15 Apr 2013 13:02:31 -0700, Ken Blake wrote:

On Sun, 14 Apr 2013 22:01:56 -0500, Char Jackson
wrote:

Also, were you able to kill the capability to switch UI's when
pressing the Windows key by itself?


No.

Bummer.

Your choice of course, but I don't see any need to completely hide it,
and I even use it once in a while.

Likewise, I see no need to ever use the Modern UI. Therefore, completely
hiding it has obvious merit for me.

Fortunately, there *is* actually a readily available piece of software
that will hide it completely: the setup.exe on a Windows 7 disc.

On 4/17/13 8:23 AM, stones wrote:
On Tue, 16 Apr 2013 07:18:17 -0600, Ken Springer wrote:

On 4/16/13 7:08 AM, Zaphod Beeblebrox wrote:
On Tue, 16 Apr 2013 12:59:18 +0000 (UTC), "stones" stoneyroost14
@gmail.invalid wrote in article ...

On Mon, 15 Apr 2013 17:46:34 +0200, Laszlo Lebrun wrote:

And -from time to time- I even go for the modern view e.g. to have a
look at the newspaper sites, which are refreshingly clean, compared
to their ad-cluttered IE or Chrome counterpart.

Use Firefox. Use AdBlock Plus.

And NoScript. And DoNotTrack.

And check those LSO cookies, too. Just another safety precaution.

Disabling scripting seems to break nearly all sites nowadays. And what
are "LSO cookies"?

Locally Shared Objects. A different kind of cookie that the normal
cookie cleaning doesn't affect.

They can be used to track you on the web, even emulating a keylogger.

http://www.popularmechanics.com/tech...-you-stop-them
--- Don't be put off by the tasty looking real cookie when the page
loads.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Local_shared_object

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_privacy

LSO cookies, aka Flash cookies, affect all OS's. And the settings that
affect what these cookies can do is set from a Macromedia (Adobe) web page.

http://www.macromedia.com/support/do...s_manager.html

Since It's a Macromedia/Adobe product that uses these, I will never put
100% faith they will always be "honest and above board" this settings
manager will work. So, since I use Firefox, I install the Better
Privacy add-on that also deals with LSO cookies.

I don't know if any of the current utilities that remove cookies have
added options for LSO cookies or not.


--
Ken

Mac OS X 10.8.3
Firefox 20.0
Thunderbird 17.0.5
LibreOffice 4.0.1.2

On Tue, 16 Apr 2013 23:48:35 -0500, Char Jackson
wrote:

On Mon, 15 Apr 2013 07:16:40 -0700, Mellowed wrote:

On 4/14/2013 8:01 PM, Char Jackson wrote:
On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 16:25:05 -0700, Ken Blake wrote:

I use Windows 8, almost exclusively with the traditional desktop
interface, and with Start 8 installed. If you were to look at and use
my computer, you would have a hard time realizing that it's not
Windows 7.

Did you manage to kill the 'hot zone' in the upper left corner and the other
W8 zone along the right edge of the screen that pops out the multiple icons?
Also, were you able to kill the capability to switch UI's when pressing the
Windows key by itself?

Until I can completely hide the new UI, I'm still recommending Win7 to the
people who ask me, so it would be nice to address these last few items.

I seem to recall when using Start8 that in the setup options there is
the option to kill the hot zones. I can't verify that since I no longer
use Win8 and have reverted back to Win7.

I don't have Start8 and have no plans to get it, so I can't immediately
confirm that.


I can confirm it. It's not just a setup option, but a configuration
option after setting up.

And I recommend Start8.

On 4/16/2013 9:48 PM, Char Jackson wrote:
On Mon, 15 Apr 2013 07:16:40 -0700, Mellowed wrote:

On 4/14/2013 8:01 PM, Char Jackson wrote:
On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 16:25:05 -0700, Ken Blake wrote:

I use Windows 8, almost exclusively with the traditional desktop
interface, and with Start 8 installed. If you were to look at and use
my computer, you would have a hard time realizing that it's not
Windows 7.

Did you manage to kill the 'hot zone' in the upper left corner and the other
W8 zone along the right edge of the screen that pops out the multiple icons?
Also, were you able to kill the capability to switch UI's when pressing the
Windows key by itself?

Until I can completely hide the new UI, I'm still recommending Win7 to the
people who ask me, so it would be nice to address these last few items.

I seem to recall when using Start8 that in the setup options there is
the option to kill the hot zones. I can't verify that since I no longer
use Win8 and have reverted back to Win7.

I don't have Start8 and have no plans to get it, so I can't immediately
confirm that.

Well your premise was 'Until I can completely hide the new UI'. Well it
looks like your can for $5.

On 17.04.2013 18:38, Mellowed wrote:
On 4/16/2013 9:48 PM, Char Jackson wrote:
On Mon, 15 Apr 2013 07:16:40 -0700, Mellowed wrote:

On 4/14/2013 8:01 PM, Char Jackson wrote:
On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 16:25:05 -0700, Ken Blake
wrote:

I use Windows 8, almost exclusively with the traditional desktop
interface, and with Start 8 installed. If you were to look at and use
my computer, you would have a hard time realizing that it's not
Windows 7.

Did you manage to kill the 'hot zone' in the upper left corner and
the other
W8 zone along the right edge of the screen that pops out the
multiple icons?
Also, were you able to kill the capability to switch UI's when
pressing the
Windows key by itself?

Until I can completely hide the new UI, I'm still recommending Win7
to the
people who ask me, so it would be nice to address these last few items.

I seem to recall when using Start8 that in the setup options there is
the option to kill the hot zones. I can't verify that since I no longer
use Win8 and have reverted back to Win7.

I don't have Start8 and have no plans to get it, so I can't immediately
confirm that.

Well your premise was 'Until I can completely hide the new UI'. Well it
looks like your can for $5.
You can even for free: classic shell


--
One computer and three operating systems, not the other way round.
One wife and many hotels, not the other way round ! ;-)

On Wed, 17 Apr 2013 18:53:04 +0200, Laszlo Lebrun
wrote:

On 17.04.2013 18:38, Mellowed wrote:
On 4/16/2013 9:48 PM, Char Jackson wrote:
On Mon, 15 Apr 2013 07:16:40 -0700, Mellowed wrote:

On 4/14/2013 8:01 PM, Char Jackson wrote:
On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 16:25:05 -0700, Ken Blake
wrote:

I use Windows 8, almost exclusively with the traditional desktop
interface, and with Start 8 installed. If you were to look at and use
my computer, you would have a hard time realizing that it's not
Windows 7.

Did you manage to kill the 'hot zone' in the upper left corner and
the other
W8 zone along the right edge of the screen that pops out the
multiple icons?
Also, were you able to kill the capability to switch UI's when
pressing the
Windows key by itself?

Until I can completely hide the new UI, I'm still recommending Win7
to the
people who ask me, so it would be nice to address these last few items.

I seem to recall when using Start8 that in the setup options there is
the option to kill the hot zones. I can't verify that since I no longer
use Win8 and have reverted back to Win7.

I don't have Start8 and have no plans to get it, so I can't immediately
confirm that.

Well your premise was 'Until I can completely hide the new UI'. Well it
looks like your can for $5.
You can even for free: classic shell


You are both missing Char's point. Yes, both Classic Shell and Start8
lets you use the traditional desktop interface instead of the modern
interface. But neither one lets you hide it *completely*, which is
what Char wants: letting you kill the capability to switch UI's when
pressing the Windows key by itself.

In my view, what Char wants is a very minor point, and it's not worth
avoiding Windows 8 for just that reason. But that's his view, and he
has a right to it.

And both Classic Shell and Start8 are very good, but I think Start8
is considerably better, and for the very low price of $5, it's worth
getting and using instead of Classic Shell.

On 4/17/2013 12:27 PM, Ken Blake wrote:
And both Classic Shell and Start8 are very good, but I think Start8
is considerably better, and for the very low price of $5, it's worth
getting and using instead of Classic Shell.


The owner of Start8, Stardock, makes good software.
I have used their Fences product for several years.

http://www.stardock.com/products/?from=nav

On Wed, 17 Apr 2013 14:23:11 +0000 (UTC), "stones" stoneyroost14
@gmail.invalid wrote in article ...

On Tue, 16 Apr 2013 07:18:17 -0600, Ken Springer wrote:

On 4/16/13 7:08 AM, Zaphod Beeblebrox wrote:
On Tue, 16 Apr 2013 12:59:18 +0000 (UTC), "stones" stoneyroost14
@gmail.invalid wrote in article ...

On Mon, 15 Apr 2013 17:46:34 +0200, Laszlo Lebrun wrote:

And -from time to time- I even go for the modern view e.g. to have a
look at the newspaper sites, which are refreshingly clean, compared
to their ad-cluttered IE or Chrome counterpart.

Use Firefox. Use AdBlock Plus.

And NoScript. And DoNotTrack.

And check those LSO cookies, too. Just another safety precaution.

Disabling scripting seems to break nearly all sites nowadays.

True, but I disable it globally and only enable it for sites I trust.
Guilty until proven innocent - that way, if I manage to land on an evil
site, I'm not compromised as easily.

Also, many sites are usable, if not completely, without scripting. I
can often get the info or content I want without enabling scripts.

And I can selectively enable scripts on a given website so that I don't
get the Google analytics stuff tracking me even after I enable scripts
for the site itself if needed for the information I'm after.

And what are "LSO cookies"?

Since this was answered elsethread, I'll demur.

--
Zaphod

Voted "Worst Dressed Sentient Being in the Known Universe" for seven
years in a row.

Try Skip Metro Suite

http://skip-metro-suite.en.softonic.com/

On Wed, 17 Apr 2013 10:27:49 -0700, Ken Blake
wrote:

On Wed, 17 Apr 2013 18:53:04 +0200, Laszlo Lebrun
wrote:

On 17.04.2013 18:38, Mellowed wrote:
On 4/16/2013 9:48 PM, Char Jackson wrote:
On Mon, 15 Apr 2013 07:16:40 -0700, Mellowed wrote:

On 4/14/2013 8:01 PM, Char Jackson wrote:
On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 16:25:05 -0700, Ken Blake
wrote:

I use Windows 8, almost exclusively with the traditional desktop
interface, and with Start 8 installed. If you were to look at and use
my computer, you would have a hard time realizing that it's not
Windows 7.

Did you manage to kill the 'hot zone' in the upper left corner and
the other
W8 zone along the right edge of the screen that pops out the
multiple icons?
Also, were you able to kill the capability to switch UI's when
pressing the
Windows key by itself?

Until I can completely hide the new UI, I'm still recommending Win7
to the
people who ask me, so it would be nice to address these last few items.

I seem to recall when using Start8 that in the setup options there is
the option to kill the hot zones. I can't verify that since I no longer
use Win8 and have reverted back to Win7.

I don't have Start8 and have no plans to get it, so I can't immediately
confirm that.

Well your premise was 'Until I can completely hide the new UI'. Well it
looks like your can for $5.
You can even for free: classic shell


You are both missing Char's point. Yes, both Classic Shell and Start8
lets you use the traditional desktop interface instead of the modern
interface. But neither one lets you hide it *completely*, which is
what Char wants: letting you kill the capability to switch UI's when
pressing the Windows key by itself.

In my view, what Char wants is a very minor point, and it's not worth
avoiding Windows 8 for just that reason. But that's his view, and he
has a right to it.

And both Classic Shell and Start8 are very good, but I think Start8
is considerably better, and for the very low price of $5, it's worth
getting and using instead of Classic Shell.


Has anyone tried just uninstalling all the apps in ""Modern
Interface".
What happens if you do

DJT