windows 10 newsgroups ?

are there any windows 10 newsgroups with substantial traffic, apart
from alt.comp.os.windows-10 ?

ty

lid wrote:

are there any windows 10 newsgroups with substantial traffic, apart
from alt.comp.os.windows-10 ?

ty

Microsoft used to provide servers and peer with the worldwide mesh
network of NNTP servers known as Usenet (aka newsgroup). They used to
host the microsoft.public.* newsgroups (and the microsoft.private.*
newsgroups for which you had to register). They abandoned Usenet
several years ago; however, Usenet providers continued providing the
microsoft.public.* newsgroups despite Microsoft's departure. Now
Microsoft relies solely on their web-for-boobs Answers forums. That
means you will lose threading of posts since web-based forums don't do
that, or do it so poorly that it is still difficult to tell who says
what to whom. It also means Microsoft, well their moderators, can apply
an iron-hand in moderating their own private web-based forums.

Microsoft did not create the alt newsgroup for Windows 10. Someone else
did that. Usenet is not and never was under Microsoft's control. They
didn't like that and why they prefer to wrest control over their own
non-peered web-based forums. When the alt.comp.os.windows-10 newsgroup
was first created, it was first carried by a single Usenet provider,
eventually peered to more of them, and then became peered to most but
not all NNTP server. You might find an NNTP server that does not carry
that newsgroup - alt is not one of the Big-8 hierarchies; see
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_8_(Usenet). Someone nymed President
Obola submitted a control message requesting the addition of the
alt.comp.windows-10 newsgroup; see

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!or...0/Kif43FrNo6wJ

That was not Microsoft requesting a new newsgroup, and especially one in
the alt hierarchy. Microsoft doesn't embrace Usenet. Oh my God, it
isn't Microsoft proprietary nor can they control the RFCs that define
the protocols for Usenet. If you're willing to endure the failings of a
web-based forum, go visit Microsoft's at:

http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/
(click on "Windows 10")

Yep, you'll have to register if you want to post there. If you already
have a Microsoft account then you can already login there; however, you
might get queried for a nym under which you want to post if it is your
first time there. Many of the MVPs that used to inhabit Usenet left to
go only into Microsoft's web-based forums. Some stayed here and some
visit both but many left Usenet along with Microsoft to inhabit only
Microsoft's web-based forums.

I think those rats (Microsoft and some MVPs) scurried away around 2010.
The Usenet community continued carrying the microsoft.public.* newsgroup
but cannot create new ones since it would be considered impolite against
Microsoft; i.e., Microsoft won't be granting permission to add more
newsgroups under microsoft.public.*, and microsoft.* is still considered
their hierarchy.

On 4/10/16 02:06, lid wrote:
are there any windows 10 newsgroups with substantial traffic, apart
from alt.comp.os.windows-10 ?

Go to Micro$oft's own web-based community forums!

--
@~@ Remain silent! Drink, Blink, Stretch! Live long and prosper!!
/ v \ Simplicity is Beauty!
/( _ )\ May the Force and farces be with you!
^ ^ (x86_64 Ubuntu 9.10) Linux 2.6.39.3
�借貸! ��騙! ��交! �打交! �打劫! �自殺! 請考慮綜� (CSSA):
http://www.swd.gov.hk/tc/index/site_...sub_addressesa

On 10/03/16 12:25, VanguardLH so wittily quipped:
Microsoft used to provide servers and peer with the worldwide mesh
network of NNTP servers known as Usenet (aka newsgroup). They used to
host the microsoft.public.* newsgroups (and the microsoft.private.*
newsgroups for which you had to register). They abandoned Usenet
several years ago; however, Usenet providers continued providing the
microsoft.public.* newsgroups despite Microsoft's departure. Now
Microsoft relies solely on their web-for-boobs Answers forums. That
means you will lose threading of posts since web-based forums don't do
that, or do it so poorly that it is still difficult to tell who says
what to whom. It also means Microsoft, well their moderators, can apply
an iron-hand in moderating their own private web-based forums.

and they DO! (they like 'Iron Hand' over on answers.microsoft - it
makes them FEEL all warm and squishy - either that, or they need a
diaper change)

snip for brevity, though it's highly informative info about USENET

'web-for-boobs' - a BOOB is a TERRIBLE thing to waste! (support 'the
cure' - heh)

On 03-Oct-16 8:25 PM, VanguardLH wrote:
lid wrote:

are there any windows 10 newsgroups with substantial traffic, apart
from alt.comp.os.windows-10 ?

ty

Microsoft used to provide servers and peer with the worldwide mesh
network of NNTP servers known as Usenet (aka newsgroup). They used to
host the microsoft.public.* newsgroups (and the microsoft.private.*
newsgroups for which you had to register). They abandoned Usenet
several years ago; however, Usenet providers continued providing the
microsoft.public.* newsgroups despite Microsoft's departure. Now
Microsoft relies solely on their web-for-boobs Answers forums. That
means you will lose threading of posts since web-based forums don't do
that, or do it so poorly that it is still difficult to tell who says
what to whom. It also means Microsoft, well their moderators, can apply
an iron-hand in moderating their own private web-based forums.

Microsoft did not create the alt newsgroup for Windows 10. Someone else
did that. Usenet is not and never was under Microsoft's control. They
didn't like that and why they prefer to wrest control over their own
non-peered web-based forums. When the alt.comp.os.windows-10 newsgroup
was first created, it was first carried by a single Usenet provider,
eventually peered to more of them, and then became peered to most but
not all NNTP server. You might find an NNTP server that does not carry
that newsgroup - alt is not one of the Big-8 hierarchies; see
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_8_(Usenet). Someone nymed President
Obola submitted a control message requesting the addition of the
alt.comp.windows-10 newsgroup; see

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!or...0/Kif43FrNo6wJ

That was not Microsoft requesting a new newsgroup, and especially one in
the alt hierarchy. Microsoft doesn't embrace Usenet. Oh my God, it
isn't Microsoft proprietary nor can they control the RFCs that define
the protocols for Usenet. If you're willing to endure the failings of a
web-based forum, go visit Microsoft's at:

http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/
(click on "Windows 10")

Yep, you'll have to register if you want to post there. If you already
have a Microsoft account then you can already login there; however, you
might get queried for a nym under which you want to post if it is your
first time there. Many of the MVPs that used to inhabit Usenet left to
go only into Microsoft's web-based forums. Some stayed here and some
visit both but many left Usenet along with Microsoft to inhabit only
Microsoft's web-based forums.

I think those rats (Microsoft and some MVPs) scurried away around 2010.
The Usenet community continued carrying the microsoft.public.* newsgroup
but cannot create new ones since it would be considered impolite against
Microsoft; i.e., Microsoft won't be granting permission to add more
newsgroups under microsoft.public.*, and microsoft.* is still considered
their hierarchy.

My congratulations on an excellent summary of matters! :-)

Can you answer THIS question?

https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/...c-a654282e6f2c

--
David B.
"The truth begins in your heart".

Big Bad Bob wrote:

VanguardLH:

Now Microsoft relies solely on their web-for-boobs Answers forums.
That means you will lose threading of posts since web-based forums
don't do that, or do it so poorly that it is still difficult to tell
who says what to whom. It also means Microsoft, well their
moderators, can apply an iron-hand in moderating their own private
web-based forums.

and they DO! (they like 'Iron Hand' over on answers.microsoft - it
makes them FEEL all warm and squishy - either that, or they need a
diaper change)

The microsoft.public.* (and microsoft.private.*) newsgroups were
moderated when Microsoft managed them but the moderators were light on
their touch so I rarely noticed any [negative] moderation. In contrast,
Ilias over on the mozilla.* newsgroups either doesn't do his job often
enough (the submits pending for approval end up expiring before he gets
to approving them), won't read long posts (someone else's suggestion) to
know if he should approve them, or I'm on his **** list, plus it seems
those using the mailing list (e-mail) are more likely to get their posts
approved than those using the NNTP interface (I won't use the antiquated
e-mail gateway scheme to post to Usenet).

Even if I keep my posts terse (yeah, tough for me to do) and stay
strictly on topic (far more than other posters that do get their posts
approved) and never mention anything negative about Mozilla's products
(which makes it damn tough to explain a solution without pointing out
the problem - I prefer not to give a solution in a void), I only get
about half, if that, of my submissions approved by Ilias. It is
disappointing and souring to waste the time and effort to do some
research and come up with a possible solution only to have Ilias not
approve my reply. If you're a newbie asking for help or one of his old
cronies on his whitelist (their posts show up immediately so obviously
their posts are not pending approval) then participation there is
smooth. Ilias doesn't even follow Mozilla's own rules on moderation
(which took a lot of hunting for me to discover).

Whether moderation works well or badly depends on who are the
moderators. A single moderator ends up being dictator: his way or no
way. Multiple moderators are really needed to overlap their bias on
moderating a newsgroup, and they have to be collectively present enough
to handle all the submissions and actually read the posts to determine
if they should be approved or not. Moderation can kill off good replies
whether the communications venue is Usenet or a web-based forum. It can
help eliminate the spam and trolls but the moderators must actually be
present often enough to do that chore. Ilias has a lot of other things
to do for his job plus he has a life outside of Usenet. I don't know
that there are moderators other than Ilias (in the newsgroups that I
visit). I have experienced far less (so rare that I cannot remember it
happening) interference to help others by moderators in non-Mozilla
newsgroups or in moderated web-based forums than I have encountered in
the mozilla.* newsgroups.

I have visited Microsoft's web-based forums a couple times only long
enough to realize they truly suck. Microsoft's Answers forums just
seems more clumsy than I've experienced with other web-based forums.
Probably worse is trying to read through the threads for bug reports
over at bugzilla.mozilla.org. That ticket system sucks; however, I'm
used to enterprise-level ticketing systems so it's like being used to
playing on a grand piano versus getting stuck with a child's piano toy.

On 07-Oct-16 1:16 AM, VanguardLH wrote:
Big Bad Bob wrote:

VanguardLH:

Now Microsoft relies solely on their web-for-boobs Answers forums.
That means you will lose threading of posts since web-based forums
don't do that, or do it so poorly that it is still difficult to tell
who says what to whom. It also means Microsoft, well their
moderators, can apply an iron-hand in moderating their own private
web-based forums.

and they DO! (they like 'Iron Hand' over on answers.microsoft - it
makes them FEEL all warm and squishy - either that, or they need a
diaper change)

The microsoft.public.* (and microsoft.private.*) newsgroups were
moderated when Microsoft managed them but the moderators were light on
their touch so I rarely noticed any [negative] moderation. In contrast,
Ilias over on the mozilla.* newsgroups either doesn't do his job often
enough (the submits pending for approval end up expiring before he gets
to approving them), won't read long posts (someone else's suggestion) to
know if he should approve them, or I'm on his **** list, plus it seems
those using the mailing list (e-mail) are more likely to get their posts
approved than those using the NNTP interface (I won't use the antiquated
e-mail gateway scheme to post to Usenet).

Even if I keep my posts terse (yeah, tough for me to do) and stay
strictly on topic (far more than other posters that do get their posts
approved) and never mention anything negative about Mozilla's products
(which makes it damn tough to explain a solution without pointing out
the problem - I prefer not to give a solution in a void), I only get
about half, if that, of my submissions approved by Ilias. It is
disappointing and souring to waste the time and effort to do some
research and come up with a possible solution only to have Ilias not
approve my reply. If you're a newbie asking for help or one of his old
cronies on his whitelist (their posts show up immediately so obviously
their posts are not pending approval) then participation there is
smooth. Ilias doesn't even follow Mozilla's own rules on moderation
(which took a lot of hunting for me to discover).

Whether moderation works well or badly depends on who are the
moderators. A single moderator ends up being dictator: his way or no
way. Multiple moderators are really needed to overlap their bias on
moderating a newsgroup, and they have to be collectively present enough
to handle all the submissions and actually read the posts to determine
if they should be approved or not. Moderation can kill off good replies
whether the communications venue is Usenet or a web-based forum. It can
help eliminate the spam and trolls but the moderators must actually be
present often enough to do that chore. Ilias has a lot of other things
to do for his job plus he has a life outside of Usenet. I don't know
that there are moderators other than Ilias (in the newsgroups that I
visit). I have experienced far less (so rare that I cannot remember it
happening) interference to help others by moderators in non-Mozilla
newsgroups or in moderated web-based forums than I have encountered in
the mozilla.* newsgroups.

I have visited Microsoft's web-based forums a couple times only long
enough to realize they truly suck. Microsoft's Answers forums just
seems more clumsy than I've experienced with other web-based forums.
Probably worse is trying to read through the threads for bug reports
over at bugzilla.mozilla.org. That ticket system sucks; however, I'm
used to enterprise-level ticketing systems so it's like being used to
playing on a grand piano versus getting stuck with a child's piano toy.

Wow! ANOTHER good post! :-)

Can you answer THIS question?

https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/...c-a654282e6f2c

--
David B.
"The truth begins in your heart".

David B wrote:


Wow!

Your headers say you're actually using Windows 10.
How is that possible ? Mac Parallels ? Something
else ?

Vortex is a well known site. You will find
Vortex mentioned on the same page as the
word Telemetry. There is some sort of interface
for CEIP, that developers can bind into their
programs, and have statistics about the program
stored on a Microsoft server. The developer then
logs into the Microsoft server, and datamines
only the data collected for their particular app.
For example, if Firefox used that system, and
Firefox used too much RAM, the CEIP thing could
be used to log details. Firefox instead chose
to invent their own CEIP scheme, and Firefox can
report directly to Mozilla, with details of memory
usage. MS CEIP allows less motivated developers to
collect information, without writing a lot of code.

https://support.microsoft.com/en-ca/kb/3068708

The CEIP design, really doesn't have to stage on
a Microsoft server. They could have designed CEIP
to report directly to the (small) developer (the
developer could compile an IP address into the App).
As long as a small developer could afford a website,
they could probably do their own data collection.
Putting Microsoft into the loop, doesn't add value
particularly.

If you're not used to being tracked, Win10 is
not the OS for you... I expect that's why you
installed it, for the thrills and spills.

Paul

On 04-Oct-16 1:14 PM, Mr. Man-wai Chang wrote:
On 4/10/16 02:06, lid wrote:
are there any windows 10 newsgroups with substantial traffic, apart
from alt.comp.os.windows-10 ?

Go to Micro$oft's own web-based community forums!

How to get answers at the Microsoft Community site​​

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cZ0sou3GHBQ
--
David B.
"The truth begins in your heart".

On 7/10/16 15:41, David B wrote:

How to get answers at the Microsoft Community site​​

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cZ0sou3GHBQ

Do you need a video for that?

For some time travelers from the ancient time?

--
@~@ Remain silent! Drink, Blink, Stretch! Live long and prosper!!
/ v \ Simplicity is Beauty!
/( _ )\ May the Force and farces be with you!
^ ^ (x86_64 Ubuntu 9.10) Linux 2.6.39.3
�借貸! ��騙! ��交! �打交! �打劫! �自殺! 請考慮綜� (CSSA):
http://www.swd.gov.hk/tc/index/site_...sub_addressesa

On 07-Oct-16 9:15 AM, Mr. Man-wai Chang wrote:
On 7/10/16 15:41, David B wrote:

How to get answers at the Microsoft Community site​​

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cZ0sou3GHBQ

Do you need a video for that?

For some time travelers from the ancient time?

Did you read my 'comments' under the video?!!!

--
David B.
"The truth begins in your heart".

On 07-Oct-16 8:24 AM, Paul wrote:
David B wrote:


Wow!

Your headers say you're actually using Windows 10.
How is that possible ? Mac Parallels ? Something
else ?

Hi Paul :-)

I *AM* using Windows 10 - on my Toshiba laptop.

Vortex is a well known site. You will find
Vortex mentioned on the same page as the
word Telemetry. There is some sort of interface
for CEIP, that developers can bind into their
programs, and have statistics about the program
stored on a Microsoft server. The developer then
logs into the Microsoft server, and datamines
only the data collected for their particular app.
For example, if Firefox used that system, and
Firefox used too much RAM, the CEIP thing could
be used to log details. Firefox instead chose
to invent their own CEIP scheme, and Firefox can
report directly to Mozilla, with details of memory
usage. MS CEIP allows less motivated developers to
collect information, without writing a lot of code.

https://support.microsoft.com/en-ca/kb/3068708

The CEIP design, really doesn't have to stage on
a Microsoft server. They could have designed CEIP
to report directly to the (small) developer (the
developer could compile an IP address into the App).
As long as a small developer could afford a website,
they could probably do their own data collection.
Putting Microsoft into the loop, doesn't add value
particularly.

If you're not used to being tracked, Win10 is
not the OS for you... I expect that's why you
installed it, for the thrills and spills.

Paul

I'll revisited what you've said later.

I *KNOW* that I am being 'tracked' - I'm glad about that! :-)

--
David B.
"The truth begins in your heart".