Simple backup option non-techy person

Mike Easter wrote:
Paul wrote:
If the recipient had more modern amenities at hand,
like a broadband service, these concerns would be
a non issue.

For myself, as a person who has had broadband since '95 and 'computers'
since '86 but NOT a mobile phone data user and barely a mobile phone
user at all (rarely using an old clamshell 'feature' phone), it is hard
for me to put myself in the position of someone who 'isn't a computer
user' and thinks she doesn't want to (or /can't/) be connected to the
internet and whose only 'connectivity' is a cellphone w/ a modest data
cap and access to a library computer when the library is available.

I strongly suspect that library computer gives her not only access to a
computer but also broadband internet connectivity.

So, the picture of her as someone who doesn't use a computer and doesn't
access the internet by computer may not be an accurate one unless that
library situation is clarified differently than I think.

In the case which I assume, if she wants to have at home what she has at
the library, it involves broadband connectivity somehow.

So, to me, the real issue is the issue of broadband, not the assumption
of a windows 10 laptop in need of some kind of simplified backup.

As Chris has pointed out as well, don't assume that mobile Internet
connectivity isn't 'broadband'. It *is* broadband, just - in many/most
cases - with a cap, but in many countries 'real' (i.e. fixed) broadband
is *also* capped. And in many/most cases, speed also isn't an/the issue.

Anyway, just to give some perspective:

- My Aussie rellies [1] do just fine with their 40GB per year. (I hope
you don't mind that their provider calls it 'Mobile Broadband'. :-))
Chris' friend has three times that much.

- I have fixed (cable) uncapped Internet. My actual use is 493GB over
the last 11 years, i.e. 45GB per year.

I'm not even agreeing w/ the win10 idea yet.

[1] Translation from Strine to English: My Australian relatives.

On 5/3/20 7:16 AM, Mike Easter wrote:
For years I've followed online Ken Starks activities recycling old
computers for youths.

Would you post a link to this guys stuff, or email it to me, please?

This interests me. :-)

--
Ken
MacOS 10.14.6
Firefox 70.0.1
Thunderbird 60.9
"My brain is like lightning, a quick flash
and it's gone!"

On 5/3/20 8:23 AM, Mike Easter wrote:
Ken Springer wrote:
It might be worth checking out the current plans for Hughesnet,

Hughesnet gen5 25 Mbps down, 3 Mbps up w/ their newest gen sats.
Unlimited data (in some sense). You can also include voice VoIP.

This is heads and tails above what I was getting from Dish Network/Wild
Blue Communications years ago.

I have friend with just this plan, including VoIP, and he's having no
problems at the moment.

But
it costs $60/mo -- they say there are no 'hard' data limits, but I
suppose your costs go up if you go over 10G/mo at $60, because they have
a 20G for $70 etc. Naturally there is the latency issue for some
interactions.

That's what I'm paying for internet over phone lines. :-)

But like rural Texas, I'm not in a city. Rocky Mountains of Colorado,
9,000' altitude. You pay to be out of all he city crap. LOL

Presumably one's data usage would go up if they had the convenience of a
home computer which had the accessibility of the internet compared to
how much data they have been using if they only used their cell phone
for 'small stuff' and/but the library computer for everything else,
which everything else might be really important.



--
Ken
MacOS 10.14.6
Firefox 70.0.1
Thunderbird 60.9
"My brain is like lightning, a quick flash
and it's gone!"

Ken Springer wrote:
Order the laptop online, drop ship it to you. Install TV, make the data
usage settings, mail it to her.

But we have to get Chris up to speed on using and supporting linux first
:-) But that should go pretty quickly. He can dl a few distro/s to
write to USB/s, boot them up live, mess w/ them long enough to see they
can do 'everything' just fine. Then his mind will be more open about
choosing the OS for her and the economics of it.

One can also get a taste of ChromeOS w/o having a chromebook in the same
way by dl/ing Google's chromium builds for your architecture (arm,
amd64, i386), write it to USB, boot it up live w/o any changes to your
computer. That isn't quite the same as the newest ChromeOS devices..
Personally I would prefer a linux over ChromeOS, but I was genuinely
impressed w/ the conversion of a senior friend from Windows to a
Chromebook. She went from frustrations and often needing help either
from afar on the 'phone or from her local paythegeek to complete
self-sufficiency.


--
Mike Easter

Mike Easter wrote:
Ken Springer wrote:
Order the laptop online, drop ship it to you. Install TV, make the data
usage settings, mail it to her.

But we have to get Chris up to speed on using and supporting linux first
:-) But that should go pretty quickly. He can dl a few distro/s to
write to USB/s, boot them up live, mess w/ them long enough to see they
can do 'everything' just fine. Then his mind will be more open about
choosing the OS for her and the economics of it.

One can also get a taste of ChromeOS w/o having a chromebook in the same
way by dl/ing Google's chromium builds for your architecture (arm,
amd64, i386), write it to USB, boot it up live w/o any changes to your
computer. That isn't quite the same as the newest ChromeOS devices..
Personally I would prefer a linux over ChromeOS, but I was genuinely
impressed w/ the conversion of a senior friend from Windows to a
Chromebook. She went from frustrations and often needing help either
from afar on the 'phone or from her local paythegeek to complete
self-sufficiency.

Supporting someone - especially remotely - with an OS which is not
your main OS is IMNSHO [1] A Very Bad Idea (TM).

That's why I'm using Windows instead of Linux, which would be logical
given my professional experience with UNIX.

[1] I've been in remote support for a very large part of my professional
life. Been there, done that, got all the T-shirts.

On 5/3/20 8:48 AM, Mike Easter wrote:
Ken Springer wrote:
Order the laptop online, drop ship it to you. Install TV, make the data
usage settings, mail it to her.

But we have to get Chris up to speed on using and supporting linux first
:-) But that should go pretty quickly. He can dl a few distro/s to
write to USB/s, boot them up live, mess w/ them long enough to see they
can do 'everything' just fine. Then his mind will be more open about
choosing the OS for her and the economics of it.

I doubt we'll get him to look at Linux. If the laptop was for him,
maybe, but it's a family friend's laptop.

I've got Linux Mint 19.x with xfce desktop on an old computer, but Mint
has outgrown the abilities of the hardware. I really wish I had the
time to play with it but newer hardware is needed for that. I *think* I
have the hardware, just not the time.

For both Linux and computer beginners, I think the Cinnamon desktop is
the best out there. And remember, I use a Mac! LOL

Current "fun/play" computer project is the Haiku OS. I've got it
installed on a Dell N4010 laptop. It's the old BeOS. Interesting ideas
as far as the GUI is concerned, but again, no time. And, I'm stuck at
how to install software. Haven't even had the time to ask in the Haiku
forums. Heck, I had to go there just to figure out how to install it! LOL

One can also get a taste of ChromeOS w/o having a chromebook in the same
way by dl/ing Google's chromium builds for your architecture (arm,
amd64, i386), write it to USB, boot it up live w/o any changes to your
computer. That isn't quite the same as the newest ChromeOS devices..
Personally I would prefer a linux over ChromeOS, but I was genuinely
impressed w/ the conversion of a senior friend from Windows to a
Chromebook. She went from frustrations and often needing help either
from afar on the 'phone or from her local paythegeek to complete
self-sufficiency.

I think I'd just drop by the pawn shops and get a Chromebook.



--
Ken
MacOS 10.14.6
Firefox 70.0.1
Thunderbird 60.9
"My brain is like lightning, a quick flash
and it's gone!"

A little earlier, I wrote:
Mike Easter wrote:
Ken Springer wrote:
Order the laptop online, drop ship it to you. Install TV, make the data
usage settings, mail it to her.

But we have to get Chris up to speed on using and supporting linux first
:-) But that should go pretty quickly. He can dl a few distro/s to
write to USB/s, boot them up live, mess w/ them long enough to see they
can do 'everything' just fine. Then his mind will be more open about
choosing the OS for her and the economics of it.

One can also get a taste of ChromeOS w/o having a chromebook in the same
way by dl/ing Google's chromium builds for your architecture (arm,
amd64, i386), write it to USB, boot it up live w/o any changes to your
computer. That isn't quite the same as the newest ChromeOS devices..
Personally I would prefer a linux over ChromeOS, but I was genuinely
impressed w/ the conversion of a senior friend from Windows to a
Chromebook. She went from frustrations and often needing help either
from afar on the 'phone or from her local paythegeek to complete
self-sufficiency.

Supporting someone - especially remotely - with an OS which is not
your main OS is IMNSHO [1] A Very Bad Idea (TM).

Oops! Case of foot-in-mouth! I didn't realize that Chris is using
MacOS, so probably/possibly Windows, Linux and ChromeOS are all more or
less 'alien' to him.

That's why I'm using Windows instead of Linux, which would be logical
given my professional experience with UNIX.

[1] I've been in remote support for a very large part of my professional
life. Been there, done that, got all the T-shirts.

Ken Springer wrote:
[...]

I doubt we'll get him [Chris] to look at Linux. If the laptop was for
him, maybe, but it's a family friend's laptop.

Like you, he already has *real* UNIX, so why would he want to look at
some pretend Unix-like thingy!? :-)

[...]

On 5/3/20 9:15 AM, Frank Slootweg wrote:
Mike Easter wrote:
Ken Springer wrote:
Order the laptop online, drop ship it to you. Install TV, make the data
usage settings, mail it to her.

But we have to get Chris up to speed on using and supporting linux first
:-) But that should go pretty quickly. He can dl a few distro/s to
write to USB/s, boot them up live, mess w/ them long enough to see they
can do 'everything' just fine. Then his mind will be more open about
choosing the OS for her and the economics of it.

One can also get a taste of ChromeOS w/o having a chromebook in the same
way by dl/ing Google's chromium builds for your architecture (arm,
amd64, i386), write it to USB, boot it up live w/o any changes to your
computer. That isn't quite the same as the newest ChromeOS devices..
Personally I would prefer a linux over ChromeOS, but I was genuinely
impressed w/ the conversion of a senior friend from Windows to a
Chromebook. She went from frustrations and often needing help either
from afar on the 'phone or from her local paythegeek to complete
self-sufficiency.

Supporting someone - especially remotely - with an OS which is not
your main OS is IMNSHO [1] A Very Bad Idea (TM).

To some extent, doesn't this depend on what type of support you are
providing?

I try to teach the basic computer skills, the things I think Mike Easter
was referring to. Those core things that apply to all computers.
Proper file management, what a word processor is and does, not how to
use MS Word. Etc., etc., etc.

It is both surprising and disappointing how many people don't know these
things. Even how to minimize, maximize, resize windows. :-(

That's why I'm using Windows instead of Linux, which would be logical
given my professional experience with UNIX.

[1] I've been in remote support for a very large part of my professional
life. Been there, done that, got all the T-shirts.



--
Ken
MacOS 10.14.6
Firefox 70.0.1
Thunderbird 60.9
"My brain is like lightning, a quick flash
and it's gone!"

Ken Springer wrote:
I've got Linux Mint 19.x with xfce desktop on an old computer, but Mint
has outgrown the abilities of the hardware.

Modern XFCE is more demanding of resources than the past because of gtk3
and other factors.

Give MX Linux a shot. Altho' it is also XFCE, it is lighter. But if
the hardware is older than MX Linux needs, then try its lighter sibling
AntiX.

The lightweight distro/s can do just fine w/ combinations of parts of
LXDE and some window manager as opposed to a conventional desktop.

Surprisingly, modern XFCE is now heavier than KDE. Gnome is the worst
in that regard, and Cinnamon which I like needs some resources.
Something like XFCE but slightly lighter is Mate.

I have an old 32bit 1G laptop that previously did fine w/ Mint 17 XFCE,
but now is antix or mx which both come in 32bit arch.

--
Mike Easter

On 5/3/20 9:25 AM, Frank Slootweg wrote:
Oops! Case of foot-in-mouth! I didn't realize that Chris is using
MacOS, so probably/possibly Windows, Linux and ChromeOS are all more or
less 'alien' to him.

I don't remember Chris saying what he uses.

But, I obviously use MacOS. VBG I also have TOS 4.x on a computer.
Mike Easter will know what I'm referring to! LOL

--
Ken
MacOS 10.14.6
Firefox 70.0.1
Thunderbird 60.9
"My brain is like lightning, a quick flash
and it's gone!"

Frank Slootweg wrote:
Chris is using MacOS, so probably/possibly Windows, Linux and
ChromeOS are all more or less 'alien' to him.
Chris may be able to put his hands on a 'hand-me-down' Mac. I see
people doing all kinds of good things on such as old 2008 iMac/s, like
running 10.11 El Capitan or a current linux.



--
Mike Easter

Ken Springer wrote:
I don't remember Chris saying what he uses.

Chris posts here using an iOS phone newstap (of all things :-) or Mac Tb.

Phone person vs (rare) un-phone person :-)

But, I obviously use MacOS.Â* VBGÂ* I also have TOS 4.x on a computer.
Mike Easter will know what I'm referring to!Â* LOL

Well, I know TOS, but I never got to 4 which was for Falcons which were
68030 as was the TT. Motorola heyday.


--
Mike Easter

On 5/3/20 9:48 AM, Mike Easter wrote:
Frank Slootweg wrote:
Chris is using MacOS, so probably/possibly Windows, Linux and
ChromeOS are all more or less 'alien' to him.
Chris may be able to put his hands on a 'hand-me-down' Mac. I see
people doing all kinds of good things on such as old 2008 iMac/s, like
running 10.11 El Capitan or a current linux.

A 2008 iMac does run El Capitan, I've got one. I had a 2009 iMac that I
replaced with this Mac Mini.

--
Ken
MacOS 10.14.6
Firefox 70.0.1
Thunderbird 60.9
"My brain is like lightning, a quick flash
and it's gone!"

On 5/3/20 9:59 AM, Mike Easter wrote:
Ken Springer wrote:
I don't remember Chris saying what he uses.

Chris posts here using an iOS phone newstap (of all things :-) or Mac Tb.

Phone person vs (rare) un-phone person :-)

But, I obviously use MacOS.Â* VBGÂ* I also have TOS 4.x on a computer.
Mike Easter will know what I'm referring to!Â* LOL

Well, I know TOS, but I never got to 4 which was for Falcons which were
68030 as was the TT. Motorola heyday.

I still have my Hades O60 w/ HP 9500 19" color CRT.

Sadly, gave my TT away, along with the 19" mono monitor. I've regretted
that for years.


--
Ken
MacOS 10.14.6
Firefox 70.0.1
Thunderbird 60.9
"My brain is like lightning, a quick flash
and it's gone!"