Windows 10 Pro Insider Preview version 17692.1000 Breaks ClassicShell

Once again Microsoft has found a way to break the Classic Shell program
that many people use as a replacement for Microsoft's much hated "Start"
button at least on my two W10 Pro Insider machines.


The Classic Shell program worked just fine with Windows 10 Insider
version 17686.1003. Unfortunately I have just completed upgrading two
machines running in virtual space on VMWare's Workstation to 17692.1000.
The Windows Insider versions of W10 were run on two different AMD
based computers with it making no difference. On both W10 Insider
machines the Classic Shell program works just fine the first time you
try to use it but subsequent uses of the start button act strange until
after 3 attempts to use the "Start" button and it no longer functions
until you reboot the machine.


Perhaps someone else will take up the gauntlet and continue working with
the Classic Start menu program.

If not, all is not lost, there are at least 6 other programs that may be
able to take over the lead replacement start program.

Here is a link to an article by Ben Stegner discussing the subject which
also includes links to some of the possible replacements for Classic Shell.

https://www.makeuseof.com/tag/window...u-alternative/


Unfortunately the author of the Classic Shell program has abandoned the
software and moved on to other things so unless someone else steps in to
adjust or fix that program it looks like Microsoft will finally be able
to stop people from using it.


Then again, who knows if the current problems Classic Shell has with the
latest Windows 10 Insider edition will continue to exist when they
actually release the next version or two to the public masses.

On 06/21/2018 04:52 AM, GlowingBlueMist wrote:
Once again Microsoft has found a way to break the Classic Shell program
that many people use as a replacement for Microsoft's much hated "Start"
button at least on my two W10 Pro Insider machines.


The Classic Shell program worked just fine with Windows 10 Insider
version 17686.1003.Â* Unfortunately I have just completed upgrading two
machines running in virtual space on VMWare's Workstation to 17692.1000.
Â*The Windows Insider versions of W10 were run on two different AMD
based computers with it making no difference.Â* On both W10 Insider
machines the Classic Shell program works just fine the first time you
try to use it but subsequent uses of the start button act strange until
after 3 attempts to use the "Start" button and it no longer functions
until you reboot the machine.


Perhaps someone else will take up the gauntlet and continue working with
the Classic Start menu program.

If not, all is not lost, there are at least 6 other programs that may be
able to take over the lead replacement start program.

Here is a link to an article by Ben Stegner discussing the subject which
also includes links to some of the possible replacements for Classic Shell.

https://www.makeuseof.com/tag/window...u-alternative/


Unfortunately the author of the Classic Shell program has abandoned the
software and moved on to other things so unless someone else steps in to
adjust or fix that program it looks like Microsoft will finally be able
to stop people from using it.


Then again, who knows if the current problems Classic Shell has with the
latest Windows 10 Insider edition will continue to exist when they
actually release the next version or two to the public masses.

In windows 8.1 that menu was a real bummer till they at least allowed
you to boot to the desktop. (I bought 8.0 on day one). I found
start8 to be very good and I hear now there is a start10. I would vote
for that.

But I've now been using Win10's own start menu and find it isn't that
bad. Sure it's nowhere near 7's but if you clean off the crap and
organize your stuff in nice groups and widen the menu so you can get
more icons, it's not bad, even usable. I mean how many programs does
the average non-power user use?

On 6/21/2018 7:15 AM, Big Al wrote:
On 06/21/2018 04:52 AM, GlowingBlueMist wrote:
Once again Microsoft has found a way to break the Classic Shell
program that many people use as a replacement for Microsoft's much
hated "Start" button at least on my two W10 Pro Insider machines.


The Classic Shell program worked just fine with Windows 10 Insider
version 17686.1003.Â* Unfortunately I have just completed upgrading two
machines running in virtual space on VMWare's Workstation to
17692.1000. Â*Â*The Windows Insider versions of W10 were run on two
different AMD based computers with it making no difference.Â* On both
W10 Insider machines the Classic Shell program works just fine the
first time you try to use it but subsequent uses of the start button
act strange until after 3 attempts to use the "Start" button and it no
longer functions until you reboot the machine.


Perhaps someone else will take up the gauntlet and continue working
with the Classic Start menu program.

If not, all is not lost, there are at least 6 other programs that may
be able to take over the lead replacement start program.

Here is a link to an article by Ben Stegner discussing the subject
which also includes links to some of the possible replacements for
Classic Shell.

https://www.makeuseof.com/tag/window...u-alternative/


Unfortunately the author of the Classic Shell program has abandoned
the software and moved on to other things so unless someone else steps
in to adjust or fix that program it looks like Microsoft will finally
be able to stop people from using it.


Then again, who knows if the current problems Classic Shell has with
the latest Windows 10 Insider edition will continue to exist when they
actually release the next version or two to the public masses.

In windows 8.1 that menu was a real bummer till they at least allowed
you to boot to the desktop.Â* (I bought 8.0 on day one).Â*Â*Â* I found
start8 to be very good and I hear now there is a start10.Â*Â* I would vote
for that.

But I've now been using Win10's own start menu and find it isn't that
bad.Â* Sure it's nowhere near 7's but if you clean off the crap and
organize your stuff in nice groups and widen the menu so you can get
more icons, it's not bad, even usable.Â*Â* I mean how many programs does
the average non-power user use?
I find I can access items in the native Windows 10 start, much faster
that I ever could in Older version of Windows start menus.

One of the best things about Windows 10 Start is the absence of the old
collapsing folder system. That was one of the hardest thing ever
developed by Microsoft. For deep folders I always took two or more
tries to get where I wanted to go.

--
2018: The year we learn to play the great game of Euchre

On Thu, 21 Jun 2018 07:49:06 -0400, Keith Nuttle
wrote:

On 6/21/2018 7:15 AM, Big Al wrote:
On 06/21/2018 04:52 AM, GlowingBlueMist wrote:
Once again Microsoft has found a way to break the Classic Shell
program that many people use as a replacement for Microsoft's much
hated "Start" button at least on my two W10 Pro Insider machines.


The Classic Shell program worked just fine with Windows 10 Insider
version 17686.1003.* Unfortunately I have just completed upgrading two
machines running in virtual space on VMWare's Workstation to
17692.1000. **The Windows Insider versions of W10 were run on two
different AMD based computers with it making no difference.* On both
W10 Insider machines the Classic Shell program works just fine the
first time you try to use it but subsequent uses of the start button
act strange until after 3 attempts to use the "Start" button and it no
longer functions until you reboot the machine.


Perhaps someone else will take up the gauntlet and continue working
with the Classic Start menu program.

If not, all is not lost, there are at least 6 other programs that may
be able to take over the lead replacement start program.

Here is a link to an article by Ben Stegner discussing the subject
which also includes links to some of the possible replacements for
Classic Shell.

https://www.makeuseof.com/tag/window...u-alternative/


Unfortunately the author of the Classic Shell program has abandoned
the software and moved on to other things so unless someone else steps
in to adjust or fix that program it looks like Microsoft will finally
be able to stop people from using it.


Then again, who knows if the current problems Classic Shell has with
the latest Windows 10 Insider edition will continue to exist when they
actually release the next version or two to the public masses.

In windows 8.1 that menu was a real bummer till they at least allowed
you to boot to the desktop.* (I bought 8.0 on day one).*** I found
start8 to be very good and I hear now there is a start10.** I would vote
for that.

But I've now been using Win10's own start menu and find it isn't that
bad.* Sure it's nowhere near 7's but if you clean off the crap and
organize your stuff in nice groups and widen the menu so you can get
more icons, it's not bad, even usable.** I mean how many programs does
the average non-power user use?
I find I can access items in the native Windows 10 start, much faster
that I ever could in Older version of Windows start menus.

One of the best things about Windows 10 Start is the absence of the old
collapsing folder system. That was one of the hardest thing ever
developed by Microsoft. For deep folders I always took two or more
tries to get where I wanted to go.

I honestly have to wonder why so many people are so attached to
Windows 7 over 10. The start menu, as you say, is much better in 10
than it ever was and in terms of performance, there is little to no
difference between 7 and 10. The new anti-malware system is also quite
stellar, what with the controlled folders in particular. People need
to let go of the past and embrace the future.

On 06/21/2018 09:27 AM, SilverSlimer wrote:
On Thu, 21 Jun 2018 07:49:06 -0400, Keith Nuttle
wrote:

On 6/21/2018 7:15 AM, Big Al wrote:
On 06/21/2018 04:52 AM, GlowingBlueMist wrote:
Once again Microsoft has found a way to break the Classic Shell
program that many people use as a replacement for Microsoft's much
hated "Start" button at least on my two W10 Pro Insider machines.


The Classic Shell program worked just fine with Windows 10 Insider
version 17686.1003.Â* Unfortunately I have just completed upgrading two
machines running in virtual space on VMWare's Workstation to
17692.1000. Â*Â*The Windows Insider versions of W10 were run on two
different AMD based computers with it making no difference.Â* On both
W10 Insider machines the Classic Shell program works just fine the
first time you try to use it but subsequent uses of the start button
act strange until after 3 attempts to use the "Start" button and it no
longer functions until you reboot the machine.


Perhaps someone else will take up the gauntlet and continue working
with the Classic Start menu program.

If not, all is not lost, there are at least 6 other programs that may
be able to take over the lead replacement start program.

Here is a link to an article by Ben Stegner discussing the subject
which also includes links to some of the possible replacements for
Classic Shell.

https://www.makeuseof.com/tag/window...u-alternative/


Unfortunately the author of the Classic Shell program has abandoned
the software and moved on to other things so unless someone else steps
in to adjust or fix that program it looks like Microsoft will finally
be able to stop people from using it.


Then again, who knows if the current problems Classic Shell has with
the latest Windows 10 Insider edition will continue to exist when they
actually release the next version or two to the public masses.

In windows 8.1 that menu was a real bummer till they at least allowed
you to boot to the desktop.Â* (I bought 8.0 on day one).Â*Â*Â* I found
start8 to be very good and I hear now there is a start10.Â*Â* I would vote
for that.

But I've now been using Win10's own start menu and find it isn't that
bad.Â* Sure it's nowhere near 7's but if you clean off the crap and
organize your stuff in nice groups and widen the menu so you can get
more icons, it's not bad, even usable.Â*Â* I mean how many programs does
the average non-power user use?
I find I can access items in the native Windows 10 start, much faster
that I ever could in Older version of Windows start menus.

One of the best things about Windows 10 Start is the absence of the old
collapsing folder system. That was one of the hardest thing ever
developed by Microsoft. For deep folders I always took two or more
tries to get where I wanted to go.

I honestly have to wonder why so many people are so attached to
Windows 7 over 10. The start menu, as you say, is much better in 10
than it ever was and in terms of performance, there is little to no
difference between 7 and 10. The new anti-malware system is also quite
stellar, what with the controlled folders in particular. People need
to let go of the past and embrace the future.

I think the process of change is the issue. People in general, even me,
don't like change. I saw some previews of Win10 before it's release.
Buggy but still usable and I thought it was hell on wheels. I told
every one of my friends that they and I should never use it. Now I'm
quite satisfied that it works and have learned to use it with ease. Of
course there's the disclaimer he "I use linux for everyday use and
turn win 10 on about 3 hours a month."

On 6/21/2018 9:32 AM, Big Al wrote:
On 06/21/2018 09:27 AM, SilverSlimer wrote:
On Thu, 21 Jun 2018 07:49:06 -0400, Keith Nuttle
wrote:

On 6/21/2018 7:15 AM, Big Al wrote:
On 06/21/2018 04:52 AM, GlowingBlueMist wrote:
Once again Microsoft has found a way to break the Classic Shell
program that many people use as a replacement for Microsoft's much
hated "Start" button at least on my two W10 Pro Insider machines.


The Classic Shell program worked just fine with Windows 10 Insider
version 17686.1003.Â* Unfortunately I have just completed upgrading two
machines running in virtual space on VMWare's Workstation to
17692.1000. Â*Â*The Windows Insider versions of W10 were run on two
different AMD based computers with it making no difference.Â* On both
W10 Insider machines the Classic Shell program works just fine the
first time you try to use it but subsequent uses of the start button
act strange until after 3 attempts to use the "Start" button and it no
longer functions until you reboot the machine.


Perhaps someone else will take up the gauntlet and continue working
with the Classic Start menu program.

If not, all is not lost, there are at least 6 other programs that may
be able to take over the lead replacement start program.

Here is a link to an article by Ben Stegner discussing the subject
which also includes links to some of the possible replacements for
Classic Shell.

https://www.makeuseof.com/tag/window...u-alternative/


Unfortunately the author of the Classic Shell program has abandoned
the software and moved on to other things so unless someone else steps
in to adjust or fix that program it looks like Microsoft will finally
be able to stop people from using it.


Then again, who knows if the current problems Classic Shell has with
the latest Windows 10 Insider edition will continue to exist when they
actually release the next version or two to the public masses.

In windows 8.1 that menu was a real bummer till they at least allowed
you to boot to the desktop.Â* (I bought 8.0 on day one).Â*Â*Â* I found
start8 to be very good and I hear now there is a start10.Â*Â* I would
vote
for that.

But I've now been using Win10's own start menu and find it isn't that
bad.Â* Sure it's nowhere near 7's but if you clean off the crap and
organize your stuff in nice groups and widen the menu so you can get
more icons, it's not bad, even usable.Â*Â* I mean how many programs does
the average non-power user use?
I find I can access items in the native Windows 10 start, much faster
that I ever could in Older version of Windows start menus.

One of the best things about Windows 10 Start is the absence of the old
collapsing folder system.Â* That was one of the hardest thing ever
developed by Microsoft.Â* For deep folders I always took two or more
tries to get where I wanted to go.

I honestly have to wonder why so many people are so attached to
Windows 7 over 10. The start menu, as you say, is much better in 10
than it ever was and in terms of performance, there is little to no
difference between 7 and 10. The new anti-malware system is also quite
stellar, what with the controlled folders in particular. People need
to let go of the past and embrace the future.

I think the process of change is the issue.Â* People in general, even me,
don't like change.Â*Â* I saw some previews of Win10 before it's release.
Buggy but still usable and I thought it was hell on wheels.Â* I told
every one of my friends that they and I should never use it.Â*Â* Now I'm
quite satisfied that it works and have learned to use it with ease.Â* Of
course there's the disclaimer he "I use linux for everyday use and
turn win 10 on about 3 hours a month."

Addendum to my previous post: My observations on the usability of the
new Windows 10 start menu have been made from several years of 6 to 8
hours per day use of Windows 10. Prior to the release of Window 10 I
was putting the same amount of time on the prior version.

I would not consider returning to the previous version of the Start menu.

--
2018: The year we learn to play the great game of Euchre

On Thu, 21 Jun 2018 09:32:46 -0400, Big Al wrote:

On 06/21/2018 09:27 AM, SilverSlimer wrote:
On Thu, 21 Jun 2018 07:49:06 -0400, Keith Nuttle
wrote:

On 6/21/2018 7:15 AM, Big Al wrote:
On 06/21/2018 04:52 AM, GlowingBlueMist wrote:
Once again Microsoft has found a way to break the Classic Shell
program that many people use as a replacement for Microsoft's much
hated "Start" button at least on my two W10 Pro Insider machines.


The Classic Shell program worked just fine with Windows 10 Insider
version 17686.1003.* Unfortunately I have just completed upgrading two
machines running in virtual space on VMWare's Workstation to
17692.1000. **The Windows Insider versions of W10 were run on two
different AMD based computers with it making no difference.* On both
W10 Insider machines the Classic Shell program works just fine the
first time you try to use it but subsequent uses of the start button
act strange until after 3 attempts to use the "Start" button and it no
longer functions until you reboot the machine.


Perhaps someone else will take up the gauntlet and continue working
with the Classic Start menu program.

If not, all is not lost, there are at least 6 other programs that may
be able to take over the lead replacement start program.

Here is a link to an article by Ben Stegner discussing the subject
which also includes links to some of the possible replacements for
Classic Shell.

https://www.makeuseof.com/tag/window...u-alternative/


Unfortunately the author of the Classic Shell program has abandoned
the software and moved on to other things so unless someone else steps
in to adjust or fix that program it looks like Microsoft will finally
be able to stop people from using it.


Then again, who knows if the current problems Classic Shell has with
the latest Windows 10 Insider edition will continue to exist when they
actually release the next version or two to the public masses.

In windows 8.1 that menu was a real bummer till they at least allowed
you to boot to the desktop.* (I bought 8.0 on day one).*** I found
start8 to be very good and I hear now there is a start10.** I would vote
for that.

But I've now been using Win10's own start menu and find it isn't that
bad.* Sure it's nowhere near 7's but if you clean off the crap and
organize your stuff in nice groups and widen the menu so you can get
more icons, it's not bad, even usable.** I mean how many programs does
the average non-power user use?
I find I can access items in the native Windows 10 start, much faster
that I ever could in Older version of Windows start menus.

One of the best things about Windows 10 Start is the absence of the old
collapsing folder system. That was one of the hardest thing ever
developed by Microsoft. For deep folders I always took two or more
tries to get where I wanted to go.

I honestly have to wonder why so many people are so attached to
Windows 7 over 10. The start menu, as you say, is much better in 10
than it ever was and in terms of performance, there is little to no
difference between 7 and 10. The new anti-malware system is also quite
stellar, what with the controlled folders in particular. People need
to let go of the past and embrace the future.

I think the process of change is the issue. People in general, even me,
don't like change. I saw some previews of Win10 before it's release.
Buggy but still usable and I thought it was hell on wheels. I told
every one of my friends that they and I should never use it. Now I'm
quite satisfied that it works and have learned to use it with ease. Of
course there's the disclaimer he "I use linux for everyday use and
turn win 10 on about 3 hours a month."

What do you need Windows for, exactly?

On Thu, 21 Jun 2018 09:32:46 -0400, Big Al wrote:

I think the process of change is the issue.

While change certainly is a factor, it's LOST FUNCTIONALITY if you don't
know how to get Windows 10 do have a Cascade Menu like Windows XP had.

So that's MORE than just change... it's less functionality (and we all know
there's almost nothing you can do on Windows 10 that you can't do on the
earlier operating systems, as we have an entire thread on that topic
alone).

So it's not change. It's lost functionality that causes people to want to
use the Classic Shell (IMHO).

Luckily, nowadays anyway, Windows 10 has the *same* cascade menu that
Windows XP had, so, if that's all anyone wants from the Classic Shell, then
there's absolutely no reason for the classic shell (IMHO).

In the end, the only change between the Windows XP style cascade menu and
the Windows 10 style cascade menu is that you just have to know how to
create the Windows 10 one, whereas in Windows XP, it sort of created
itself.

Other than that, what's the difference between the native Windows 10
cascade menu and the native Windows XP cascade menu?
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?image=18_win10menu808.jpg

On Thu, 21 Jun 2018 09:27:21 -0400, SilverSlimer wrote:

On Thu, 21 Jun 2018 07:49:06 -0400, Keith Nuttle
wrote:

On 6/21/2018 7:15 AM, Big Al wrote:
On 06/21/2018 04:52 AM, GlowingBlueMist wrote:
Once again Microsoft has found a way to break the Classic Shell
program that many people use as a replacement for Microsoft's much
hated "Start" button at least on my two W10 Pro Insider machines.


The Classic Shell program worked just fine with Windows 10 Insider
version 17686.1003.Â* Unfortunately I have just completed upgrading
two machines running in virtual space on VMWare's Workstation to
17692.1000. Â*Â*The Windows Insider versions of W10 were run on two
different AMD based computers with it making no difference.Â* On both
W10 Insider machines the Classic Shell program works just fine the
first time you try to use it but subsequent uses of the start button
act strange until after 3 attempts to use the "Start" button and it
no longer functions until you reboot the machine.


Perhaps someone else will take up the gauntlet and continue working
with the Classic Start menu program.

If not, all is not lost, there are at least 6 other programs that may
be able to take over the lead replacement start program.

Here is a link to an article by Ben Stegner discussing the subject
which also includes links to some of the possible replacements for
Classic Shell.

https://www.makeuseof.com/tag/window...u-alternative/


Unfortunately the author of the Classic Shell program has abandoned
the software and moved on to other things so unless someone else
steps in to adjust or fix that program it looks like Microsoft will
finally be able to stop people from using it.


Then again, who knows if the current problems Classic Shell has with
the latest Windows 10 Insider edition will continue to exist when
they actually release the next version or two to the public masses.

In windows 8.1 that menu was a real bummer till they at least allowed
you to boot to the desktop.Â* (I bought 8.0 on day one).Â*Â*Â* I found
start8 to be very good and I hear now there is a start10.Â*Â* I would
vote for that.

But I've now been using Win10's own start menu and find it isn't that
bad.Â* Sure it's nowhere near 7's but if you clean off the crap and
organize your stuff in nice groups and widen the menu so you can get
more icons, it's not bad, even usable.Â*Â* I mean how many programs does
the average non-power user use?
I find I can access items in the native Windows 10 start, much faster
that I ever could in Older version of Windows start menus.

One of the best things about Windows 10 Start is the absence of the old
collapsing folder system. That was one of the hardest thing ever
developed by Microsoft. For deep folders I always took two or more
tries to get where I wanted to go.

I honestly have to wonder why so many people are so attached to Windows
7 over 10. The start menu, as you say, is much better in 10 than it ever
was and in terms of performance, there is little to no difference
between 7 and 10. The new anti-malware system is also quite stellar,
what with the controlled folders in particular. People need to let go of
the past and embrace the future.

I'm not using windows 10. Occasionally I am asked to help a windows 10
user. I've had instances when a simple reboot would take forever to
shutdown while the system collected updates. Then to add insult to
injury, there can be another lengthy wait while updates are being
installed, so yes, use windows 10 and you will embrace the future quite
literally. Personally, I much prefer Linux Mint and use a virtual machine
for a couple of windows only apps. I realize some people are stuck with
windows due to their work situation and the vast majority of folks are
stuck with windows because it came pre-loaded on their system.

On Thu, 21 Jun 2018 15:45:17 -0000 (UTC), Dave wrote:

I realize some people are stuck with windows due to their work
situation and the vast majority of folks are stuck with windows
because it came pre-loaded on their system.

Just as well it's a great operating system then.

On 6/21/2018 8:45 AM, Dave wrote:
On Thu, 21 Jun 2018 09:27:21 -0400, SilverSlimer wrote:

On Thu, 21 Jun 2018 07:49:06 -0400, Keith Nuttle
wrote:

On 6/21/2018 7:15 AM, Big Al wrote:
On 06/21/2018 04:52 AM, GlowingBlueMist wrote:
Once again Microsoft has found a way to break the Classic Shell
program that many people use as a replacement for Microsoft's much
hated "Start" button at least on my two W10 Pro Insider machines.


The Classic Shell program worked just fine with Windows 10 Insider
version 17686.1003. Unfortunately I have just completed upgrading
two machines running in virtual space on VMWare's Workstation to
17692.1000. The Windows Insider versions of W10 were run on two
different AMD based computers with it making no difference. On both
W10 Insider machines the Classic Shell program works just fine the
first time you try to use it but subsequent uses of the start button
act strange until after 3 attempts to use the "Start" button and it
no longer functions until you reboot the machine.


Perhaps someone else will take up the gauntlet and continue working
with the Classic Start menu program.

If not, all is not lost, there are at least 6 other programs that may
be able to take over the lead replacement start program.

Here is a link to an article by Ben Stegner discussing the subject
which also includes links to some of the possible replacements for
Classic Shell.

https://www.makeuseof.com/tag/window...u-alternative/


Unfortunately the author of the Classic Shell program has abandoned
the software and moved on to other things so unless someone else
steps in to adjust or fix that program it looks like Microsoft will
finally be able to stop people from using it.


Then again, who knows if the current problems Classic Shell has with
the latest Windows 10 Insider edition will continue to exist when
they actually release the next version or two to the public masses.

In windows 8.1 that menu was a real bummer till they at least allowed
you to boot to the desktop. (I bought 8.0 on day one). I found
start8 to be very good and I hear now there is a start10. I would
vote for that.

But I've now been using Win10's own start menu and find it isn't that
bad. Sure it's nowhere near 7's but if you clean off the crap and
organize your stuff in nice groups and widen the menu so you can get
more icons, it's not bad, even usable. I mean how many programs does
the average non-power user use?
I find I can access items in the native Windows 10 start, much faster
that I ever could in Older version of Windows start menus.

One of the best things about Windows 10 Start is the absence of the old
collapsing folder system. That was one of the hardest thing ever
developed by Microsoft. For deep folders I always took two or more
tries to get where I wanted to go.

I honestly have to wonder why so many people are so attached to Windows
7 over 10. The start menu, as you say, is much better in 10 than it ever
was and in terms of performance, there is little to no difference
between 7 and 10. The new anti-malware system is also quite stellar,
what with the controlled folders in particular. People need to let go of
the past and embrace the future.

I'm not using windows 10. Occasionally I am asked to help a windows 10
user. I've had instances when a simple reboot would take forever to
shutdown while the system collected updates. Then to add insult to
injury, there can be another lengthy wait while updates are being
installed, so yes, use windows 10 and you will embrace the future quite
literally. Personally, I much prefer Linux Mint and use a virtual machine
for a couple of windows only apps. I realize some people are stuck with
windows due to their work situation and the vast majority of folks are
stuck with windows because it came pre-loaded on their system.

I don't understand why people get their panties in a twist over
the start menu.

Delete everything on it and drag program launcher links to it.
I take it a step further and create a separate page that loads at boot
and has all my program launchers on it. I use MS software only when
freeware doesn't exist...and that's rarely.
I almost never use the start menu. The separate page also insulates
you from the incessant additions that MS makes to their start page.
Just ignore 'em, maybe delete ones that show up to consume resources.

Forced updates are the real deal breaker. Having to wait an indeterminate
amount of time when you simply want a reboot is unconscionable.
Having your system out of commission because an unwanted update
trashed something can really ruin your day if you're in a hurry.
Could really be a problem if you need to put your laptop in its bag
and get to your next meeting. Of course, your most recent backup
is likely missing important recent stuff.

Windows update minitool has solved most of that problem.
But there's a bug. If you wait too long to do updates, WUMT can
error out if you have too little "free space"...whatever that is.
I've got more free partition space than
the sum of the sizes of the updates, so I have no idea why increasing
the partition size fixes it. It errors out before it actually downloads
anything, so it won't let you update a few at a time.

I like to keep my C: small, but had to waste about 50GB of disk space
just to keep WUMT from failing with infrequent updates.

Current strategy is to let WUMT search for updates monthly, but hide them.
That seems to be working...

On Thu, 21 Jun 2018 15:45:17 -0000 (UTC), Dave wrote:

I realize some people are stuck with
windows due to their work situation and the vast majority of folks are
stuck with windows because it came pre-loaded on their system.

IMHO, Windows and Linux do the same things nowadays, except ...

Except Microsoft Office.

(Yes, I know about all those other "office" clones.)

On Thu, 21 Jun 2018 09:27:21 -0400, SilverSlimer wrote:

The start menu, as you say, is much better in 10
than it ever was

I consider myself a menu expert, at least at the user level, where my
assessment is that the Windows 10 orthodox start menu is an utter
abomination, but, it certainly "can" be made to work reasonably well, as I
show in this screenshot below...
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?image=18_win10menu808.jpg

There are a few tricks, which I have written into the menu tutorial, which,
once you know, it's pretty easy to manage that orthodox start menu.

In addition, if you know the tricks, it's just as easy to manage the
Windows 10 heterodox start menu (i.e., the alphabetical Start Menu).

And, if you know a couple more tricks, it's very easy to manage the Windows
10 native Cascade menu such that it works exactly like the WinXP Cascade
Menu worked (point and click edits and all that easy stuff).
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?image=18_my_win10_cascade_menu.jpg

Given what I just said, can someone explain to me why anyone would use the
Classic Shell today (and yes, I used Classic Shell in the past so I know it
does more than just a Cascade Menu).

On Thu, 21 Jun 2018 07:49:06 -0400, Keith Nuttle wrote:

I find I can access items in the native Windows 10 start, much faster
that I ever could in Older version of Windows start menus.

One of the best things about Windows 10 Start is the absence of the old
collapsing folder system. That was one of the hardest thing ever
developed by Microsoft. For deep folders I always took two or more
tries to get where I wanted to go.

There are inherently three menu systems native in Windows 10.
1. The heterodox (alphabetical) Start Menu
2. The orthodox (tiled) Start Menu
3. The Cascade Menu (which works just like it did in WinXP days)

All three work just fine, only differently.

Here's an example of the Windows 10 native orthodox & cascade menu:
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?image=18_win10menu808.jpg

Both are point-and-click setup operations, once you learn the tricks.

Given that Windows 10 has the Cascade Menu native, I don't see any need for
Classic Shell nowadays, if ... if all we want from Classic Shell is the
cascade menu.

Can someone tell me why people use the Classic Shell when Windows 10
already has Cascade Menus that work exactly like WinXP cascade menus
worked?

On Thu, 21 Jun 2018 07:15:20 -0400, Big Al wrote:

But I've now been using Win10's own start menu and find it isn't that
bad. Sure it's nowhere near 7's but if you clean off the crap and
organize your stuff in nice groups and widen the menu so you can get
more icons, it's not bad, even usable. I mean how many programs does
the average non-power user use?

Why do we even need Classic Shell anymore?

I also only recently decided to ditch Classic Shell and WinAero in order to
learn how to wrestle Windows 10 native menus into doing what I want them to
do.

For example, here's my (currently unfinished) Windows 10 Start Menu:
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?image=18_win10menu808.jpg

It has the exact same hierarchy as my (just as unfinished) Windows 10
Cascade Menu - which works exactly as the Windows XP Cascade Menu worked:
http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?image=18_my_win10_cascade_menu.jpg

Notice there is absolutely no meaningful difference between the setup and
operation of the native Windows 10 cascade menu from the native Windows XP
cascade menu.

Given that there is no difference, and assuming all we want from the
Classic Shell software is that Cascade Menu, why bother with Classic Shell?