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Why doesn't Apple just let you manage your iOS file system natively on Windows?



 
 
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  #1  
Old August 14th 18, 02:21 AM posted to misc.phone.mobile.iphone,comp.mobile.ipad,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Arlen Holder
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 466
Default Why doesn't Apple just let you manage your iOS file system natively on Windows?

Here's my Android file system as seen by Windows which I manage from
Windows without adding *any* software whatsoever to Android or Windows.
http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=2102080android_trash01.jpg

Why doesn't Apple just let you manage your iOS file system natively on
Windows?
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  #2  
Old August 14th 18, 03:45 AM posted to misc.phone.mobile.iphone,comp.mobile.ipad,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Bob_S[_3_]
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Posts: 33
Default Why doesn't Apple just let you manage your iOS file system natively on Windows?

"Arlen Holder" wrote in message news

Here's my Android file system as seen by Windows which I manage from
Windows without adding *any* software whatsoever to Android or Windows.
http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=2102080android_trash01.jpg

Why doesn't Apple just let you manage your iOS file system natively on
Windows?


You're asking the group to comment on why Apple wants to keep their users
trapped inside the Apple (prison) ecosystem? This is gonna be one long
thread....;-)

As you probably know, there are 3rd party iPad file managers but natively,
I'm only aware of iTunes and iCloud allowing access to contents of folders
from other systems as I recently learned - the hard way. There are
limitations on the file types but not being an Apple guru - I'll leave that
to others for commenting on. As for managing the Apple IOS file system from
Windows, nothing I've read allows the same management level you are used to
on a Windows system.

I needed a new tablet this past week so I bought the new 9.7 iPad with 128GB
storage. Gorgeous screen and it's fast. Great tablet - but I live in a
Windows world and after finding out the limitations and kludges I would have
to use to transfer files/folders between the systems, I gave up. Not worth
the effort. Got the new MS Surface Go (8GB 128GB) and upgraded it to Win10
Pro - problem solved. Be glad to answer any questions about it if others
are interested.

--


Bob S.

  #3  
Old August 14th 18, 03:50 AM posted to misc.phone.mobile.iphone,comp.mobile.ipad,alt.comp.os.windows-10
nospam
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Posts: 4,718
Default Why doesn't Apple just let you manage your iOS file system natively on Windows?

In article , Bob_S wrote:

I needed a new tablet this past week so I bought the new 9.7 iPad with 128GB
storage. Gorgeous screen and it's fast. Great tablet - but I live in a
Windows world and after finding out the limitations and kludges I would have
to use to transfer files/folders between the systems, I gave up. Not worth
the effort.


it's very easy to move content to/from an ipad, regardless of operating
system.

the limitation is with you, not the device.
  #4  
Old August 14th 18, 04:24 AM posted to misc.phone.mobile.iphone,comp.mobile.ipad,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Bob_S[_3_]
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Posts: 33
Default Why doesn't Apple just let you manage your iOS file system natively on Windows?

"nospam" wrote in message ...

In article , Bob_S wrote:

I needed a new tablet this past week so I bought the new 9.7 iPad with
128GB
storage. Gorgeous screen and it's fast. Great tablet - but I live in a
Windows world and after finding out the limitations and kludges I would
have
to use to transfer files/folders between the systems, I gave up. Not
worth
the effort.


it's very easy to move content to/from an ipad, regardless of operating
system.

the limitation is with you, not the device.



Great remark - now would you read the the OP's question which I addressed.
Manage being the operative word. You can copy certain file types natively
(iTunes, iCloud) which they specify. Managing the file system is a whole
other matter.

So genius - enlighten us by addressing the original question asked and not
what you think it said.

--


Bob S.

  #5  
Old August 14th 18, 04:48 AM posted to misc.phone.mobile.iphone,comp.mobile.ipad,alt.comp.os.windows-10
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,718
Default Why doesn't Apple just let you manage your iOS file system natively on Windows?

In article , Bob_S wrote:

I needed a new tablet this past week so I bought the new 9.7 iPad with
128GB
storage. Gorgeous screen and it's fast. Great tablet - but I live in a
Windows world and after finding out the limitations and kludges I would
have
to use to transfer files/folders between the systems, I gave up. Not
worth the effort.


it's very easy to move content to/from an ipad, regardless of operating
system.

the limitation is with you, not the device.


Great remark - now would you read the the OP's question which I addressed.


actually, you didn't, and the original poster is a well known troll.

Manage being the operative word. You can copy certain file types natively
(iTunes, iCloud) which they specify. Managing the file system is a whole
other matter.


that is of course, absolutely false.

you said you gave up. that means you chose not to learn something new.

that's *your* decision, not a limitation of the device.

as i said, it's very easy to move content to/from an ipad, regardless
of operating system. i do it daily between mac, windows, linux and
*bsd. itunes or the cloud is *not* required. it's simply an *option*
among many.
  #6  
Old August 14th 18, 05:32 AM posted to misc.phone.mobile.iphone,comp.mobile.ipad,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Arlen Holder
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Posts: 466
Default Why doesn't Apple just let you manage your iOS file system natively on Windows?

On 13 Aug 2018 19:45:14 GMT, Bob_S wrote:

I needed a new tablet this past week so I bought the new 9.7 iPad with 128GB
storage. Gorgeous screen and it's fast. Great tablet - but I live in a
Windows world and after finding out the limitations and kludges I would have
to use to transfer files/folders between the systems, I gave up.


While nospam calls everyone who speaks facts a troll, I back up what I say
with facts (nospam has zero credibility - he makes everything up).
Why do the iOS trolls like nospam always FABRICATE everything?
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/GExRc1qrFGo/JBzdCKSSAwAJ

The fact is I have bought plenty of iOS & Android devices over the years,
where it just astounds me how severely restricted the iOS operating system
is compared to Android. https://u.cubeupload.com/WNbbxt.jpg

Like you, I also have the $300 Costco 9.7-inch 2017 WiFi-only iPad with
128GB storage. https://u.cubeupload.com/5IUrm6.jpg

For Android, I can just connect to either Windows or Linux to access the
entire Android visible file system, *read & write*, all without a single
bit of additional software on either the mobile device or the desktop that
isn't part of the initial setup.

For iOS, I can do that on Linux with no problems whatsoever, for read and
write access sans a single bit of additional softwa
https://cubeupload.com/im/BOLdzU.jpg.

NOTE: Booting to Linux works *perfectly* to access three (3) file systems
simultaneously! (Yes, all three - with only two devices!)
a. Windows
b. Linux
c. Mobile device (either iOS or Android)

But, when booting to Windows, you only get a single read-only mount point:
https://u.cubeupload.com/jIUogJ.jpg

With Android - you get power; with iOS - you get restrictions.

Most iOS users "just give up" when it comes to doing what we do all day
every day without even batting an eye on Android.
  #7  
Old August 14th 18, 05:52 AM posted to misc.phone.mobile.iphone,comp.mobile.ipad,alt.comp.os.windows-10
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,718
Default Why doesn't Apple just let you manage your iOS file system natively on Windows?

In article , Arlen Holder
wrote:

For iOS, I can do that on Linux with no problems whatsoever, for read and
write access sans a single bit of additional softwa


....

But, when booting to Windows, you only get a single read-only mount point:


that would be a limitation of windows, and in this case, user error.
  #8  
Old August 14th 18, 07:50 AM posted to misc.phone.mobile.iphone,comp.mobile.ipad,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Arlen Holder
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Posts: 466
Default Why doesn't Apple just let you manage your iOS file system natively on Windows?

On 13 Aug 2018 21:52:49 GMT, nospam wrote:

But, when booting to Windows, you only get a single read-only mount point:


that would be a limitation of windows, and in this case, user error.


It's extremely rare for you, nopsam, to ever guess correctly, but in this
case, you're actually closer to the truth than you can possibly imagine.

When dual booting to Linux, with both a typical unrooted iOS and Android
device connected by USB to the typical desktop, Linux has no problem seeing
the entire visible file system of all four devices (only 3 of which are
booted):
1. Linux entire visible file system (no limits)
2. Windows entire visible file system (no limits)
3. Android entire visible file system (only limited slightly)
4. iOS entire visible file system (which is severely limited even so)

When dual booted to Windows 10, under those same circumstances, Windows
sees far less.

Windows doesn't see the Linux file system.
And Windows sees even less of the highly restricted iOS file system.

As is always the case - anyone on iOS is extremely limited in what they can
do compared to what they can do on Android - since the entire visible file
system on Android is read/write available to both Linux and Windows.

The iOS file system is for people who clearly give up a lot to have it.

Not the least of what iOS users have to give up is their hard-earned money,
where it's been proven that a comparable hardware Android device like the
$130 8-core LG Stylo 3 Plus is FIVE TIMES LESS EXPENSIVE than a far-less
functional five-times-more expensive iOS device such as the overpriced
4-core Apple iPhone 7 Plus (actually only 3 cores which will be
automatically halved in speed in about 1 year).

In addition, as you're aware, it's been proven many times that the app
functionality alone on any modern Android device is so vastly
overwhelmingly more powerful than that of iOS that it's not funny.

*To own iOS, is to give up ... a lot.*
  #9  
Old August 14th 18, 02:41 PM posted to misc.phone.mobile.iphone,comp.mobile.ipad,alt.comp.os.windows-10
NY
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Posts: 586
Default Why doesn't Apple just let you manage your iOS file system natively on Windows?

"Arlen Holder" wrote in message
news
If you want similar read/write access to the entire file system over WiFi,
you only need to add any free FTP server and then, on Windows, you just go
to the network neighborhood and enter in the URI, e.g.,
ftp://192.168.1.2:2121
This will ask for your login & password (if you've set one up in FTP) and
then you will see the entire visible file system, read/write (if you set
that up in FTP) to Windows, over the Wi-Fi LAN.


Does anyone know of Android software that makes a phone act as a true SMB
client or server, so

1) Android can access \\Windows-PC\share\folder\filename exactly as if it
were local card/phone storage - Android SMB client

2) a folder on Android can be shared so a Windows PC can access it as
\\Android\sharename\folder\filename - Android SMB server

I've come across apps like AndSMB which allow Android to see an SMB server
and allow you to navigate the shared tree structure, but then you must
transfer a *copy* of the file to local Android storage, modify it and then
transfer it back again - like using FTP, not with true file *access* where
(in Unix terms) you mount remote storage to look like an extension to local
storage, or (in Windows terms) the remote storage looks like an additional
drive letter, with files being read/written as if to local storage.

Is there some fundamental design problem with making this happen on Android.
I can imagine that an Android SMB server *might* need root access, but at
least I'd expect that making Android behave as a client ought to be
possible.


By the way, going back to the instructions you have for enabling Windows
access over USB to part of Android's filesystem, are there any equivalent
instructions for allowing Windows to access files on an iOS device (eg
iPad). My wife took loads of photos on her iPad and we can't find any way of
copying them onto a Windows device to archive them - apart from by attaching
photos to emails and sending them that way, which isn't practical for a
large number of photos.

Out of the box, an Android device connected by USB to Windows shows up the
card and internal storage, allowing you to navigate to DCIM and then select
and copy files (photos). The iPad shows up but no folders are displayed.
It's things like that which I *hate* about Apple - too bloody clever and
proprietary. There probably is a way, but it will be very obscure and
require you to do it "the Apple way", probably with special software
installed on Windows.

I tried using iTunes on Windows, with the iPad connected by USB, but the
device didn't show up in iTunes at all, in the way that an iPod would do. If
it had shown up, I think iTunes would allowed me manual control over which
files I copied.

  #10  
Old August 14th 18, 05:08 PM posted to misc.phone.mobile.iphone,comp.mobile.ipad,alt.comp.os.windows-10
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,718
Default Why doesn't Apple just let you manage your iOS file system natively on Windows?

In article , Wolf K
wrote:

I needed a new tablet this past week so I bought the new 9.7 iPad with
128GB
storage. Gorgeous screen and it's fast. Great tablet - but I live in a
Windows world and after finding out the limitations and kludges I would
have
to use to transfer files/folders between the systems, I gave up. Not worth
the effort.


it's very easy to move content to/from an ipad, regardless of operating
system.


Typical utterly useless "You're wrong" post.

It's time you gave real world examples so that the poor sods who lack
your brilliance and knowledge can learn how to dfo it themselves.


that's been done numerous times, but trollboi doesn't care. he simply
denies everything and goes off on another ignorant rant.

the limitation is with you, not the device.


Yech.


nothing yech about it. when someone claims something is impossible that
others do without issue every day, then the issue is with that someone.

one more time:
it's very easy to move content to/from an ipad, regardless of operating
system.

  #11  
Old August 14th 18, 06:29 PM posted to misc.phone.mobile.iphone,comp.mobile.ipad,microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,comp.sys.mac.system,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Arlen Holder
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Posts: 466
Default Why doesn't Apple just let you manage your iOS file system natively on Windows?

On 14 Aug 2018 06:41:08 GMT, NY wrote:

By the way, going back to the instructions you have for enabling Windows
access over USB to part of Android's filesystem, are there any equivalent
instructions for allowing Windows to access files on an iOS device (eg
iPad).


While it's not the method you expected, look at these three screenshots to
see how you can get far more power than you ask for, if you want.

This is a screenshot of iOS 11.2.6 connected to Linux over USB where you
will note that there is access to three parts of the iOS file system:
a. read-only access to the iOS DCIM folder
b. read/write access to "some" of the better apps (mostly not Apple)
c. a mount point on Linux of most of the above & more
http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=9181755linuxios_1.jpg

Note that the third mount point provides read & write access to the iOS
DCIM directory - so you can copy & delete your data easily:
http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=9234281linuxios_2.jpg

In the older Linux, you had to manually mount to get this feature, but in
the newer Linux, it's all now completely automatic and native:
http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=9819846linuxios_3.jpg

Note those screenshots were with Ubuntu 17.10 where Ubuntu 18.04 makes it
even easier, completely native, and more powerful.

As you know, I currently own all the major consumer operating systems
(except Mac, which I've used and hated), where I always simply expect them
each individually and all combined to work well together, and where only
the iOS devices are so restrictive as to be relegated almost to the "toy"
category (due to iOS' extreme lack of basic functionality in the real
world).

Apple simply states that the real word is "not supported", nor ever tested.

Nonetheless, I've found, from experience, that the *best* way to access iOS
on Windows for both *read and write* is to dual boot to Linux,
paradoxically - where the beauty of Linux is that it allows *simultaneous*
read and write access to the entire Windows system (even though Windows
isn't even booted!) and iOS file system.

Notice, there are only 2 devices but this method gives *simultaneous* read
& write access to all 3 file systems!
1. Windows (most recently tested on Windows 10)
2. iOS (most recently tested on iOS 11.2.6)
3. Linux (most recently tested on Ubuntu 18.04)

There's an entire July 3rd, 2018 thread with the detail & screenshots.
How to read/write access iOS file systems on Ubuntu/Windows over USB cable
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/IFC52JXBQ1c/siiB7o49CgAJ

My wife took loads of photos on her iPad and we can't find any way of
copying them onto a Windows device to archive them - apart from by attaching
photos to emails and sending them that way, which isn't practical for a
large number of photos.


You should *already* have all that - if that's all you really want.

If all you want is "read" only access of an iPad to Windows, and especially
if all you want is read-only access to the DCIM folder, that should be
trivial, even with iOS.

Just plugging in the iOS device to Windows should, at the very least, show
up insatntly like this - which I just did moments ago using my iPad for
you. http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=5944873storage00.jpg

Maybe she installed the iTunes abomination by mistake?

Out of the box, an Android device connected by USB to Windows shows up the
card and internal storage, allowing you to navigate to DCIM and then select
and copy files (photos). The iPad shows up but no folders are displayed.


I don't ever install the iTunes abomination so if that's installed, maybe
things work differently - but here's a sequence I've published in the past
which should work if all you want is "read only" USB access to the iOS DCIM
folder without installing *anything* on Windows.

When you plug in the iOS device into Windows' USB port, you get an "Allow
this device" query every time (you only get a query once with Linux, thank
God):
http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=9396078storage01.jpg

Assuming you do not have the iTunes abomination installed in Windows, when
you plug in the iOS device the very first time, Windows will automatically
install the necessary drivers and then ask you to choose how you want the
iOS device "Internal Storage" to show up on Windows.
http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=1075420storage02.jpg

Windows will then show the iOS device in your native Windows file explorer
as just another disc drive, just like Android & USB drives show up.
http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=1874111storage03.jpg

You'll get a bar showing how much storage is available on that iOS device:
http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=9652440storage04.jpg

And then you'll get read-only access to the DCIM directory:
http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=5630845storage05.jpg

Under that DCIM directory are the idiotically named iOS folders and files
and screenshots where you can copy them at will to your Windows disks.
http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=6394866storage06.jpg

In summary, as long as you do not have the iTunes abomination installed,
you should be able to have read-only access on Windows to all your iOS
camera pictures, videos, and screenshots simply by plugging the iOS device
into your Windows USB port.
http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=8762004storage07.jpg

It's things like that which I *hate* about Apple - too bloody clever and
proprietary. There probably is a way, but it will be very obscure and
require you to do it "the Apple way", probably with special software
installed on Windows.


I have used the iTunes abomination in the past where I learned long ago to
stay away from it like you would powdered cyanide. Since I gain all my
cross platform functionality using the *native* operrating system software,
I don't test with the iTunes abomination installed.

So your results may be different if you installed the iTunes abomination.

But, without the iTunes abomination, I have no problem with *read-only*
access to *just* the iOS DCIM folder on Windows 10 over USB.

I tried using iTunes on Windows, with the iPad connected by USB, but the
device didn't show up in iTunes at all, in the way that an iPod would do. If
it had shown up, I think iTunes would allowed me manual control over which
files I copied.


Yuck. I pity anyone who uses the iTunes abomination, where, many years ago
(when nospam was still insisting QuickTime was a necessary component, if
that gives you an idea of how long ago it was) I too tried the damn
abomination where it was so restrictive in use model that I concluded it
was an abomination - and I've been calling it that ever since.

When I switched to SharePod freeware (before they went to the dark side), I
was soooooooooo happy to be rid of the iTunes abomination that you can't
imagine my joy of being able to do anything I wanted again.

Back to your question, it's my humble opinion that your wife "should" be
able to do what you're asking - without installing *anything* overtly on
Windows (Windows will automatically install the necessary drivers).
  #12  
Old August 14th 18, 07:04 PM posted to misc.phone.mobile.iphone,comp.mobile.ipad,microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,comp.sys.mac.system,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Arlen Holder
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Posts: 466
Default Why doesn't Apple just let you manage your iOS file system natively on Windows?

On 14 Aug 2018 17:29:54 GMT, Arlen Holder wrote:

When I switched to SharePod freeware (before they went to the dark side), I
was soooooooooo happy to be rid of the iTunes abomination that you can't
imagine my joy of being able to do anything I wanted again.


BTW, on avoiding the iTunes abomination even for iPods, if you can still
find the *older* 5MB versions of the sharepod freeware, save them forever!
(mine are all long ago saved *on* the iPods!)

I tested my old version of SharePod just last week when I plugged in a
friend's iPod and a few of mine where I was able to seamlessly slide any
MP3 file I wanted to across the handful of devices and Windows operating
system (and over the network if I wanted to).

All without any iTunes abomination "library" restrictions whatsoever.
It doesn't matter the id is of any of the iPods - they all work the same.

Absolutely nothing needs to be installed on Windows as the older SharePod
freeware is stored on the iPod (which basically acts as a USB disk).

The use model is so different from the Orwellian punishment meted out by
the iTunes abomination that you would be amazed that you have complete and
total freedom of your files on the iPods.

With absolutely nothing additional installed on Windows, you can plug in
any iPod and slide any MP3 file you want to any location you want any time
you want, sans restrictions.

NOTE: The version of SharePod freeware we used was version 2.x but you can
use up to version 3.9.6 based on our tests. (I read somewhere that Apple
paid the SharePod freeware developers a tremendous amount of money to
require iTunes in their post 3.9.6 product - which - if true - makes sense
to Apple because the SharePod developers had no need of the iTunes
abomination up until their version 4.x payware product came out - and that
made the payware product useless to me instantly ... however I haven't
looked that issue up in years (simply because the older SharePod works
fine)... so ... if anyone has more information on why SharePod added the
iTunes abomination as a requirement when SharePod worked just fine for many
years without the iTunes abomination - it would be interesting to hear what
actually happened).
  #13  
Old August 14th 18, 07:08 PM posted to misc.phone.mobile.iphone,comp.mobile.ipad,microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,comp.sys.mac.system,alt.comp.os.windows-10
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,718
Default Why doesn't Apple just let you manage your iOS file system natively on Windows?

In article , Arlen Holder
wrote:

NOTE: The version of SharePod freeware we used was version 2.x but you can
use up to version 3.9.6 based on our tests.


you mean *your* tests.

(I read somewhere that Apple
paid the SharePod freeware developers a tremendous amount of money to
require iTunes in their post 3.9.6 product - which - if true -


it isn't true.

apple does not pay nor tell third party developers what to do.
  #14  
Old August 14th 18, 07:18 PM posted to misc.phone.mobile.iphone,comp.mobile.ipad,alt.comp.os.windows-10,comp.sys.mac.apps
Arlen Holder
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Posts: 466
Default Why doesn't Apple just let you manage your iOS file system natively on Windows?

On 14 Aug 2018 09:08:00 GMT, nospam wrote:

that's been done numerous times, but trollboi doesn't care. he simply
denies everything and goes off on another ignorant rant.


The Windows users will notice that, in every post by the Apple Apologist
nospam, he proves (once again, and for the umpteenth time), he exhibits one
or more of these traits common to all the Apple Apologists:

What are the common well-verified psychological traits of the Apple Apologists on this newsgroup?
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/comp.mobile.ipad/2BJ0i7LtngQ/xprHCzp4CAAJ

Specifically, nospam's post above exhibits the highlighted trait below.

================================================== =========================
.. *He brazenly & repeatedly fabricates wholly imaginary app functionality*
.. *He then exclaims that it's been told to us many times how to do it!*
....
.. He almost never backs up statements with actual referenced facts
.. He incessantly plays childish semantic games when faced with those facts
....
.. He consistently fabricates quoted content that never happened
.. He then wittily responds to that imaginary quoted content as if it did!
....
.. He is never purposefully helpful by helping the OP answer the question
.. He posts worthless retorts, all of which lack any added technical value
....
.. He consistently blames Android for most of Apple's app & hardware faults
.. He consistently finds the absolute worst priceerformance comparisons
....
.. He actually believes that a well-documented process is too complex!
.. He literally believes elapsed time is proof of actual resolution time.
================================================== =========================
  #15  
Old August 14th 18, 09:35 PM posted to misc.phone.mobile.iphone,comp.mobile.ipad,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Bob_S[_3_]
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Posts: 33
Default Why doesn't Apple just let you manage your iOS file system natively on Windows?


You're the troll - asshole.

Always a snide remark and no substance - just like now.
 




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