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#31
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FIOS or win10 changes.
In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Wed, 13 Nov 2019 12:27:48 -0600, Rene
Lamontagne wrote: On 2019-11-13 12:09 p.m., Chris wrote: micky wrote: I finally got FIOS today, and by coincidence, or not, there have been several windows 10 changes just afterwards. If you explained what FIOS was then it might be possible to ascertain whether it has affected your issues or not. Probably not, given the seemingly random and wide variety of issues. Sorry. I coudln't remember the words "fiber optic", and I thought FIOS was discussed here once with most people knowing what it was, but maybe it was the home.repair ng. I had to google it also, It is Verizons stupid abbreviation for Fiber Optics System. Posters who use obscure abbreviations should include the full name at least once. You're right. Rene |
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#32
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FIOS or win10 changes.
In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on 14 Nov 2019 14:16:16 GMT, Frank Slootweg
wrote: And, AFAICT, it's actually 'Fios' (Verizon) or 'FiOS' (Frontier), not 'FIOS'. I think FIOS Frontier is only use on the frontier. Wyoming, Montana, the Yukon Territory, places like that. It's wood-fire-powered. |
#33
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Acronyms... (Was: FIOS or win10 changes.)
In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Fri, 15 Nov 2019 19:35:34 -0000 (UTC),
Chris wrote: Ken Blake wrote: On 11/15/2019 10:35 AM, Chris wrote: On 15/11/2019 16:17, 123456789 wrote: Paul wrote: *** "Relax with our Stay Fast Guarantee... **** below 100Mbps for Ultrafast Fibre Plus or 150Mbps **** for Ultrafast Fibre Plus 2." My ISP* also advertises using big fancy names like Gigablast. I wonder how many people actually need it? Almost none. Anything above ~25Mbps for downloads is superfluous IMO. What people need is better uploads. Maybe some people do, but most people upload very little. You forget the millions on snapchat, WhatsApp, tiktok, FaceTime, Skype, etc. Etc. Uploading content is huge. The two main things people upload are e-mail and telephone conversations. Most e-mail message are small enough that it hardly matters, but as VoIP becomes more popular, upload speed will become more important. People email all sorts of crap. From documents, to photos and videos. True, but with uploading, I just send it and forget it. Unless it's a chat, I don't care how long it takes to get sent . With some downloads, especially video, I'm sitting there waiting. Asymmetric broadband makes little sense nowadays. I don't know why it's asymmetric. Can you or some else here shed some light on it? I've wondered about that too. It's from the times that the Internet was mostly for consuming, not generating, content. It made sense then when bandwidth was limited. Not anymore. Aha. But does that mean they used smaller transistors in the upload part of the circuit? |
#34
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Acronyms... (Was: FIOS or win10 changes.)
In article , Chris
wrote: My ISP* also advertises using big fancy names like Gigablast. I wonder how many people actually need it? Almost none. Anything above ~25Mbps for downloads is superfluous IMO. What people need is better uploads. Maybe some people do, but most people upload very little. You forget the millions on snapchat, WhatsApp, tiktok, FaceTime, Skype, etc. Etc. Uploading content is huge. those don't use much bandwidth, nowhere near what is used downstream. The two main things people upload are e-mail and telephone conversations. Most e-mail message are small enough that it hardly matters, but as VoIP becomes more popular, upload speed will become more important. People email all sorts of crap. From documents, to photos and videos. that doesn't use much upstream bandwidth either. Asymmetric broadband makes little sense nowadays. I don't know why it's asymmetric. Can you or some else here shed some light on it? It's from the times that the Internet was mostly for consuming, not generating, content. It made sense then when bandwidth was limited. Not anymore. no, it's because cable systems were designed for sending hundreds of tv channels *to* customers, with upstream being the occasional pay per view request or similar. internet is still mostly consumption, with netflix and other video streaming services using a substantial percentage of overall bandwidth. the number of people who upload videos beyond a few second insta clip are few and far between. |
#35
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FIOS or win10 changes.
In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Fri, 15 Nov 2019 15:10:14 -0500, micky
wrote: In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Wed, 13 Nov 2019 11:56:37 -0600, Rene Lamontagne wrote: ...... Micky, When you are updated you should see in Winver, Version 1909 (build 18363.476) Rene I have that now. I had to install those things that were pending and restart, and then it came up with more things to install and restart, and finally I'm there, but so far, all of the same problems above are also still there. I thought the problem might be Classic Shell, which gave a dire warning when starting, so I uninstalled that but it didn't work any better. Then I installed Open Shell, its successor (working from the source code the original author left behind) and it doesn't work any better. I have a spare computer and a copy of win7 and I'm seriously thinking of going back to win7. What would I lose if I did that. Voice to text? I plan to use that a lot this month. I even bought a fancy microphone. Can I install it separately? Or a competitor? I found a couple voice to text programs that run on win7, but if they don't work well enough, I'll just go back to the win10 computer when I need to do this. I really don't want to set up a 2nd computer just for this, but it amazes me no one has been reporting the same problems I have. Quite a coincidence that an hour after I get fibre optic cable, I get all these problems. It's worse than before the FIOS. Cortana? I never use that. Anything else I will miss. |
#36
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Acronyms... (Was: FIOS or win10 changes.)
On 11/15/2019 12:35 PM, Chris wrote:
Ken Blake wrote: I don't know why it's asymmetric. Can you or some else here shed some light on it? It's from the times that the Internet was mostly for consuming, not generating, content. It made sense then when bandwidth was limited. Not anymore. Yes, of course That's obvious. But that doesn't help me understand why ISPs provide two different speeds. -- Ken |
#37
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Acronyms... (Was: FIOS or win10 changes.)
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256 Paul wrote: Dan Purgert wrote: Heh, I always thought it was just a product name, akin to "$provider extreme internet", having not lived in a FiOS service area (we only have Spectrum (nee TWC) and AT&T here). FTTH is an industry acronym. Yeah, I know that one, just never put effort into actually learning if "FiOS" was a product or what (given the afore-mentioned "non-Verizon territory" I live in). -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCAAdFiEEBcqaUD8uEzVNxUrujhHd8xJ5ooEFAl3PNq sACgkQjhHd8xJ5 ooGGigf/TJcNflLPbgb+2B02/v4/Lnv7jRcZmFWMDZAZxXgIhFXU772jssC6BTTm h40nXNClOxBQXwu9aAMtK3apq6EyesTHiz3twEfncIpNunFYry 5zBs9rbxkbubcC i10bnwIuPbCY0y8IJ7j5QTZowWuTW5UcApZRd4zYArBPtBetG8 wQWriy4rXuHfZh XSRGqSDFW4pB8FdKnfsYt/eka/QzTrrQvlgWR668h+HU3s/LmAv74F1Wn6OIucls WZYlC/6jxSt9t43+qaZi/kujWnoilpEfl4ATY4rxq/r4xScL6AWNYXFGfFbd2lWx MKRIJnZh5XMz6zN1/BPczyYBuT3U1g== =NPW1 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- |_|O|_| |_|_|O| Github: https://github.com/dpurgert |O|O|O| PGP: 05CA 9A50 3F2E 1335 4DC5 4AEE 8E11 DDF3 1279 A281 |
#38
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Acronyms... (Was: FIOS or win10 changes.)
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256 Ken Blake wrote: On 11/15/2019 12:35 PM, Chris wrote: Ken Blake wrote: I don't know why it's asymmetric. Can you or some else here shed some light on it? It's from the times that the Internet was mostly for consuming, not generating, content. It made sense then when bandwidth was limited. Not anymore. Yes, of course That's obvious. But that doesn't help me understand why ISPs provide two different speeds. Symmetric connections (e.g. 50/50) take more resources, and require more dedicated spectrum in your already crowded lines (especially for cable companies, when they had to carry analog TV). Since "residential" customers will more heavily favor the "downstream" path (i.e. to their household) rather than the "upstream", it made economic sense to weight it toward what they preferred. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCAAdFiEEBcqaUD8uEzVNxUrujhHd8xJ5ooEFAl3PN3 IACgkQjhHd8xJ5 ooHUUQf7BxYfPOXa4mFVwXs1CXWa3fKsA3LhWGQAZrGH/oLDv6iiJmKs/yqkNdHd 34QsEAKYGGTNUQRwCGuq3ciO1Gvjhq/3HR+j0iPCSgcuGRo7PB2KOlpU3B9HaQor suI7jpRacvNL1wV7SGtbX2xf9bfs23hpebqabK0nHQTC1wu/kPZvydqYEWKPaTa+ ZoH32qcaCeriBAlgHeuM9bMKTeAUwRguvAyY8MJBdjBfYfYuuM 46iBs3ZiQzongy y1V9xHUcdbItMeNJnBxOGq32wTHgEf1c4UWjoYPkr3WUCiJowA OtzcV6OmpdbP0b J3c493F/pb7eXk9WOPXXb3gECelYOw== =jvQZ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- |_|O|_| |_|_|O| Github: https://github.com/dpurgert |O|O|O| PGP: 05CA 9A50 3F2E 1335 4DC5 4AEE 8E11 DDF3 1279 A281 |
#39
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Acronyms... (Was: FIOS or win10 changes.)
Dan Purgert wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256 Ken Blake wrote: On 11/15/2019 12:35 PM, Chris wrote: Ken Blake wrote: I don't know why it's asymmetric. Can you or some else here shed some light on it? It's from the times that the Internet was mostly for consuming, not generating, content. It made sense then when bandwidth was limited. Not anymore. Yes, of course That's obvious. But that doesn't help me understand why ISPs provide two different speeds. Symmetric connections (e.g. 50/50) take more resources, and require more dedicated spectrum in your already crowded lines (especially for cable companies, when they had to carry analog TV). Since "residential" customers will more heavily favor the "downstream" path (i.e. to their household) rather than the "upstream", it made economic sense to weight it toward what they preferred. I'm seeing articles, where some of the higher rate services, as seen in Wikipedia, list the frequency range as "Upstream *and* downstream". Implying that stuff like 300Mbit/sec service could actually be partitioned differently for consumer accounts versus business accounts. Whereas that probably wasn't the case for the original DSL, which had defined upstream and downstream bands of buckets. There was a symmetric version (SDSL), but nobody has ever heard of it, and it doesn't particularly mesh nicely with the rest of the service offerings. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Symmet...ubscriber_line ******* Both dialup modems and DSL, use buckets, so your broadband modem is little better than a dialup platform :-) "VDSL2 permits the transmission of asymmetric and symmetric === aggregate data rates up to 300+ Mbit/s downstream and upstream on twisted pairs using a bandwidth up to 35 MHz. It deteriorates quickly from a theoretical maximum of 350 Mbit/s at source to 100 Mbit/s at 500 m (550 yd) and 50 Mbit/s at 1,000 m (1,100 yd), but degrades at a much slower rate from there, and outperforms VDSL. Starting from 1,600 m (1 mi) its performance is equal to ADSL2+." And that's why VDSL2 is used as the "last 500 feet" for fiber concentrator access, as it suffers from the same issues as ADSL would. And the 35MHz band it uses, must wipe out a lot of ham radio choices. Original DSL used a much smaller frequency band. The offerings on the Bell Canada site have changed since the last time I looked, and the 150/150 entry looks "suspicious". Could be fiber, but could also be VDSL2 with equal frequency bands (even split). The fiber to the concentrator, could be relatively close to symmetric (but might not be exactly equal as you might have expected). Translation: "We give people what they want" Packages are based on demand. The current Bell Canada page has more symmetric offerings than asymmetric, but that's because a lot of asymmetric plans got zorched (the price differential not being worth keeping track of). The ISP I use has more asymmetric plans, using the same wires that Bell uses. It could be that Bell is using this as a "tactic", because they are forever plotting and scheming to overturn the CRTC. There is one individual, that's his job title ("chief plotter and schemer"). "Regulatory trasher". And this is why there are private citizens who keep an eye on Bell, and push the regulator to act (when the regulator would rather "back-pedal"). Bell is currently complaining that resellers are "getting too good of a deal", and Bell hates when it can't gouge people. It wants the wireline business to be as lucrative as the cellphone business. Paul |
#40
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FIOS or win10 changes.
micky wrote:
In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Wed, 13 Nov 2019 11:56:37 -0600, Rene Lamontagne wrote: On 2019-11-13 11:22 a.m., micky wrote: In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Wed, 13 Nov 2019 03:38:30 -0500, Paul wrote: micky wrote: I finally got FIOS today, and by coincidence, or not, there have been several windows 10 changes just afterwards. Another problem 10), probably related to 7) above is that when I right click on the blank desktop, no menu comes up. Nothing happens. I installed 1909 from a DVD (in a VM), then installed Open Shell, and no problems noted. Some of your issues sound a lot like "Tablet Mode". And Tablet Mode auto-switches by default, but, the software needs to see critical hardware items such as a touchscreen. Is this machine touchscreen enabled ? There should be a setting to disable Tablet Mode, and while Settings wheel is running, you can type Tablet Mode into the search. Paul |
#41
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Acronyms... (Was: FIOS or win10 changes.)
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256 Paul wrote: Dan Purgert wrote: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256 Ken Blake wrote: On 11/15/2019 12:35 PM, Chris wrote: Ken Blake wrote: I don't know why it's asymmetric. Can you or some else here shed some light on it? It's from the times that the Internet was mostly for consuming, not generating, content. It made sense then when bandwidth was limited. Not anymore. Yes, of course That's obvious. But that doesn't help me understand why ISPs provide two different speeds. Symmetric connections (e.g. 50/50) take more resources, and require more dedicated spectrum in your already crowded lines (especially for cable companies, when they had to carry analog TV). Since "residential" customers will more heavily favor the "downstream" path (i.e. to their household) rather than the "upstream", it made economic sense to weight it toward what they preferred. I'm seeing articles, where some of the higher rate services, as seen in Wikipedia, list the frequency range as "Upstream *and* downstream". Implying that stuff like 300Mbit/sec service could actually be partitioned differently for consumer accounts versus business accounts. Whereas that probably wasn't the case for the original DSL, which had defined upstream and downstream bands of buckets. Yes, business accounts can be provisioned a lot closer to "symmetric" -- and since businesses (historically) were the creators of stuff, they paid for the extra speed (as well as SLAs). That being said, the "low end" business accounts (e.g. 50 mbit down, and slower) tend to still by asymmetric; at least around here. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCAAdFiEEBcqaUD8uEzVNxUrujhHd8xJ5ooEFAl3QBv YACgkQjhHd8xJ5 ooFXkgf/dbuRpiWne9nemd7kc4vZQDH7A7RcuRdzzLgxg/TAOD4/+6H/kbVZ91bp OvlpHOWoWGzQyAshSu1DxduqmvIbFtpq7i7sANBjHpyxRfoqaU 8LWquCnG1Vrp9/ 9bcGmCNtY/M4BVDlzBkeHAvOiQpOvfez6a2eY6NBqBugHAVKZ3rahO4oMW3t 0tRl xFd4ayPzDImLvLq9XqXqPN4cGFd6nnpRm0J9VombOVAO2+7bZ6 5XMIYu/IVGWIWy FWnvKvIcX2fNmVGYTQUGe8Ki8vg6lgZFG39KyCQASaZzX/fwom6yx+S/OanxRPWX slss+m0IYCUNcmQXeLA59cR8dZGe1w== =AHB7 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- |_|O|_| |_|_|O| Github: https://github.com/dpurgert |O|O|O| PGP: 05CA 9A50 3F2E 1335 4DC5 4AEE 8E11 DDF3 1279 A281 |
#42
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FIOS or win10 changes.
In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Sat, 16 Nov 2019 07:20:08 -0500, Paul
wrote: micky wrote: In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Wed, 13 Nov 2019 11:56:37 -0600, Rene Lamontagne wrote: On 2019-11-13 11:22 a.m., micky wrote: In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Wed, 13 Nov 2019 03:38:30 -0500, Paul wrote: micky wrote: I finally got FIOS today, and by coincidence, or not, there have been several windows 10 changes just afterwards. Another problem 10), probably related to 7) above is that when I right click on the blank desktop, no menu comes up. Nothing happens. I installed 1909 from a DVD (in a VM), then installed Open Shell, and no problems noted. Some of your issues sound a lot like "Tablet Mode". And Tablet Mode auto-switches by default, but, the software needs to see critical hardware items such as a touchscreen. Is this machine touchscreen enabled ? Well the machine might?? be, but I have no touchscreen. There should be a setting to disable Tablet Mode, and while Settings wheel is running, you can type Tablet Mode into the search. Paul Okay, I did that and then I set it to Use Desktop Mode, instead of Use the appropriate mode for my hardware. We'll see what happens on restart. BTW, I'm in safe mode now and, except for the notifications problem, which I solved earlier, all the problems are still here. I'll go over this point by point when I get back to regular mode. Worth noting that Task Manager, which could not have screen size adjusted in non-Safe mode (only had maximized and minimized) works in Safe Mode, but the original Solitaire, sol.exe, still doesn't. It only has maximized and minimized. Also, Forte Agent 1.9 works fine in Safe Mode but Eudora 7, latest version works only partially. |
#43
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Acronyms... (Was: FIOS or win10 changes.)
On 11/15/19 12:47 PM, Ken Blake wrote:
[snip] Asymmetric broadband makes little sense nowadays. I don't know why it's asymmetric. Can you or some else here shed some light on it? Could it have something to do with cable being originally designed for one-to-many communication? -- 39 days until the winter celebration (Wed, Dec 25, 2019 12:00:00 AM for 1 day). Mark Lloyd http://notstupid.us/ "As long as people believe in absurdities they will continue to commit atrocities." [Voltaire] |
#44
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FIOS or win10 changes. SOLVED!
In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Sat, 16 Nov 2019 11:24:23 -0500, micky
wrote: In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Sat, 16 Nov 2019 07:20:08 -0500, Paul wrote: micky wrote: In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Wed, 13 Nov 2019 11:56:37 -0600, Rene Lamontagne wrote: On 2019-11-13 11:22 a.m., micky wrote: In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Wed, 13 Nov 2019 03:38:30 -0500, Paul wrote: micky wrote: I finally got FIOS today, and by coincidence, or not, there have been several windows 10 changes just afterwards. Another problem 10), probably related to 7) above is that when I right click on the blank desktop, no menu comes up. Nothing happens. I installed 1909 from a DVD (in a VM), then installed Open Shell, and no problems noted. Some of your issues sound a lot like "Tablet Mode". And Tablet Mode auto-switches by default, but, the software needs to see critical hardware items such as a touchscreen. Is this machine touchscreen enabled ? Well the machine might?? be, but I have no touchscreen. There should be a setting to disable Tablet Mode, and while Settings wheel is running, you can type Tablet Mode into the search. Paul Okay, I did that and then I set it to Use Desktop Mode, instead of Use the appropriate mode for my hardware. We'll see what happens on restart. BTW, I'm in safe mode now and, except for the notifications problem, which I solved earlier, all the problems are still here. I'll go over this point by point when I get back to regular mode. YOU WERE RIGHT. THAT SOLVED IT! Thank you so much. What would I have done without you. What do other people do who don't know about Usenet? I googled many of the symptoms and found nothing. And why is MS changing my mode a) for no good reason, b) without telling me? If mode is subject to change, why isn't it displayed prominently all the time? I guess it mistakenly thought it had tablet-style hardware. That's bad too. Everything works again. To set up the win7 computer, I'd have to clean the pile of papers from next to the spare computer, remove and wipe its hard drive, install 7, and reinstall or copy over everything. I wasn't looking forward to that. Worth noting that Task Manager, which could not have screen size adjusted in non-Safe mode (only had maximized and minimized) works in Safe Mode, but the original Solitaire, sol.exe, still doesn't. It only has maximized and minimized. Also, Forte Agent 1.9 works fine in Safe Mode but Eudora 7, latest version works only partially. |
#45
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Acronyms... (Was: FIOS or win10 changes.)
In article , Mark Lloyd
wrote: Asymmetric broadband makes little sense nowadays. I don't know why it's asymmetric. Can you or some else here shed some light on it? Could it have something to do with cable being originally designed for one-to-many communication? yes. |
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