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#31
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USB thumb drives.
Paul wrote:
Doomsdrzej wrote: On Thu, 17 May 2018 07:49:55 +1000, Peter Jason wrote: I have many USB2 & USB3 going back 10+ years, and now some are "socket specific" on my 10 YO computer motherboard (some USB3s will work on some sockets; even USB2 sockets) and not others. Do these thumb drives last forever, or should their contents be transferred to the latest USB drives? Theoretically, they should last a long time but a lot can destroy them like moisture and a seemingly miniscule amount of bending. I'd transfer their contents to more recent, faster USB keys. They make USB devices for every occasion. https://www.everythingusb.com/rugged-drives.html "403 Forbidden nginx" https://www.amazon.com/Corsair-Flash.../dp/B0136H5YUE That reminds me of these https://www.amazon.com/Clocky-Origin.../dp/B000TAS9XQ ... -- Quote of the Week: "The fact that we can't easily foresee clues that would betray an intelligence a million millennia farther down the road suggests that we're like ants trying to discover humans. Ask yourself: Would ants ever recognize houses, cars, or fire hydrants as the work of advanced biology?" --Seth Shostak Note: A fixed width font (Courier, Monospace, etc.) is required to see this signature correctly. /\___/\ Ant(Dude) @ http://antfarm.home.dhs.org / /\ /\ \ Please nuke ANT if replying by e-mail privately. If credit- | |o o| | ing, then please kindly use Ant nickname and URL/link. \ _ / ( ) |
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#32
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USB thumb drives.
Frank Slootweg wrote:
...w¡ñ§±¤ñ wrote: "Peter Jason" wrote in message ... Do these thumb drives last forever, or should their contents be transferred to the latest USB drives? I've replaced a grand total of '1' since USB thumb drives became available. - the failure rate wasn't age...fell out of my shirt pocket into a can of paint. 0 failures here. Same for memory cards, mostly (Micro)SD, but also some SmartMedia ones. I must have bad luck. I have had SanDisk 1 GB, tiny PNY, and a SP USB flash drives died on me. The last two were killed when I was trying to install Mac OS into them. They got very hot. I was told that was a very bad idea. However, my very old USB flash drives (no brand 64 MB and 128 MB) and SanDisk 256 MB still work though! -- Quote of the Week: "The fact that we can't easily foresee clues that would betray an intelligence a million millennia farther down the road suggests that we're like ants trying to discover humans. Ask yourself: Would ants ever recognize houses, cars, or fire hydrants as the work of advanced biology?" --Seth Shostak Note: A fixed width font (Courier, Monospace, etc.) is required to see this signature correctly. /\___/\ Ant(Dude) @ http://antfarm.home.dhs.org / /\ /\ \ Please nuke ANT if replying by e-mail privately. If credit- | |o o| | ing, then please kindly use Ant nickname and URL/link. \ _ / ( ) |
#34
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USB thumb drives.
Ant wrote:
Paul wrote: Doomsdrzej wrote: On Thu, 17 May 2018 07:49:55 +1000, Peter Jason wrote: I have many USB2 & USB3 going back 10+ years, and now some are "socket specific" on my 10 YO computer motherboard (some USB3s will work on some sockets; even USB2 sockets) and not others. Do these thumb drives last forever, or should their contents be transferred to the latest USB drives? Theoretically, they should last a long time but a lot can destroy them like moisture and a seemingly miniscule amount of bending. I'd transfer their contents to more recent, faster USB keys. They make USB devices for every occasion. https://www.everythingusb.com/rugged-drives.html "403 Forbidden nginx" https://www.amazon.com/Corsair-Flash.../dp/B0136H5YUE That reminds me of these https://www.amazon.com/Clocky-Origin.../dp/B000TAS9XQ ... Nginx does that, when a client isn't capable of completing https protocol properly. A poster boy for this, is dslreports, which should throw a 403 for you as well. Some sites, if you attempt to use http, they switch to https and try and reload the page. http://www.dslreports.com/faq/15439 ******* If you use a slightly better browser, this will work. https://www.everythingusb.com/rugged-drives.html And a part of this behavior, is ensuring your web browser is modern enough, to play all the advertising flawlessly. Profit. Paul |
#35
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USB thumb drives.
"Paul" wrote in message
news wasbit wrote: "Jason" wrote in message ... In article , lid says... nothing lasts forever, but the good ones should last a very long time. unfortunately, some are not particularly good, possibly counterfeit. A friend and former colleague is a very experienced EE who works independently as a software and circuit designer and also writes technical articles on computer topics for magazines that you and I probably read (and journal articles we probably don't...). I have asked him the same questions about these gadgets. His response: "To a first approximation ALL such devices on eBay are counterfeit." Be careful. Buy them from places like Newegg or Frys. I have a 1TB thumb drive, bought me as a present at a cost of £10 (13.5$). Considering its price, I was dubious as to its capacity. Windows shows it as 917GB with 489GB used & 428GB free space. The 489GB was the most I could scrape together & took nearly a day to write to the drive. You can use fsutil to make a test file on your source drive for testing. Now, watch in amazement, how (assuming this fits on the remaining space on C: ), the file takes no time at all to create. If you use the 7ZIP right-click CRC32 hash calculator, you'll be able to read this file off your C: drive at 800MB/sec (even though the storage device might be capable of much less). fsutil file createnew C:\users\wasbit\Downloads\big.bin 900000000000 The source drive should be NTFS for this. Once the file is created on the source drive, *now*, use File Explorer to copy it to the target device, and then the real testing will begin. This allows crafting precisely sized test files. The source file (big.bin) is likely "sparse" and the file is technically filled with zeros. This doesn't matter to the destination drive though, which will have to do the usual amount of work (as Windows isn't smart enough to preserve a sparse file during copy, and expands the fake contents as needed). Sparse files can be made very quickly. Sparse files take the normal amount of time to copy (copy will be limited by the destination write rate). ******* I would be interested in the brand and model number of this mythically large (13.5$) storage devices. Was the brand Godzilla or Mothra ? Did it come from the ocean ? Was it angry ? I've requested info on the flash drive. Its similar to this one - https://www.ebay.com/itm/2TB-1TB-Swi....c100009.m1982 Device Manager shows: Generic Flash Disk USB Device USBSTOR\DiskGeneric_Flash_Disk______8.00 USBSTOR\DiskGeneric_Flash_Disk______ USBSTOR\DiskGeneric_ USBSTOR\Generic_Flash_Disk______8 Generic_Flash_Disk______8 USBSTOR\GenDisk GenDisk Event Info 2017.03.20 Device USBSTOR\Disk&Ven_Generic&Prod_Flash_Disk&Rev_8.00\ EB541BB0&0 was configured. Driver Name: disk.inf Class Guid: {4D36E967-E325-11CE-BFC1-08002BE10318} Driver Date: 06/21/2006 Driver Version: 6.3.9600.18203 Driver Provider: Microsoft Driver Section: disk_install.NT Driver Rank: 0xFF0006 Matching Device Id: GenDisk Outranked Drivers: disk.inf:GenDisk:00FF2002 Device Updated: false Could only create a 37GB bin file on C:\ but managed to create a 372GB bin file on D:\ 37GB bin file would take an estimated 90 minutes to copy so at that rate it should take 15 hours for the larger file. 7Zip calculated checksum at 1373-1379 MB/sec. Thanks Paul. Don't know what I've done but enjoyed playing. -- Regards wasbit |
#36
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USB thumb drives.
wasbit wrote:
"Paul" wrote in message news wasbit wrote: "Jason" wrote in message ... In article , lid says... nothing lasts forever, but the good ones should last a very long time. unfortunately, some are not particularly good, possibly counterfeit. A friend and former colleague is a very experienced EE who works independently as a software and circuit designer and also writes technical articles on computer topics for magazines that you and I probably read (and journal articles we probably don't...). I have asked him the same questions about these gadgets. His response: "To a first approximation ALL such devices on eBay are counterfeit." Be careful. Buy them from places like Newegg or Frys. I have a 1TB thumb drive, bought me as a present at a cost of £10 (13.5$). Considering its price, I was dubious as to its capacity. Windows shows it as 917GB with 489GB used & 428GB free space. The 489GB was the most I could scrape together & took nearly a day to write to the drive. You can use fsutil to make a test file on your source drive for testing. Now, watch in amazement, how (assuming this fits on the remaining space on C: ), the file takes no time at all to create. If you use the 7ZIP right-click CRC32 hash calculator, you'll be able to read this file off your C: drive at 800MB/sec (even though the storage device might be capable of much less). fsutil file createnew C:\users\wasbit\Downloads\big.bin 900000000000 The source drive should be NTFS for this. Once the file is created on the source drive, *now*, use File Explorer to copy it to the target device, and then the real testing will begin. This allows crafting precisely sized test files. The source file (big.bin) is likely "sparse" and the file is technically filled with zeros. This doesn't matter to the destination drive though, which will have to do the usual amount of work (as Windows isn't smart enough to preserve a sparse file during copy, and expands the fake contents as needed). Sparse files can be made very quickly. Sparse files take the normal amount of time to copy (copy will be limited by the destination write rate). ******* I would be interested in the brand and model number of this mythically large (13.5$) storage devices. Was the brand Godzilla or Mothra ? Did it come from the ocean ? Was it angry ? I've requested info on the flash drive. Its similar to this one - https://www.ebay.com/itm/2TB-1TB-Swi....c100009.m1982 Device Manager shows: Generic Flash Disk USB Device USBSTOR\DiskGeneric_Flash_Disk______8.00 USBSTOR\DiskGeneric_Flash_Disk______ USBSTOR\DiskGeneric_ USBSTOR\Generic_Flash_Disk______8 Generic_Flash_Disk______8 USBSTOR\GenDisk GenDisk Event Info 2017.03.20 Device USBSTOR\Disk&Ven_Generic&Prod_Flash_Disk&Rev_8.00\ EB541BB0&0 was configured. Driver Name: disk.inf Class Guid: {4D36E967-E325-11CE-BFC1-08002BE10318} Driver Date: 06/21/2006 Driver Version: 6.3.9600.18203 Driver Provider: Microsoft Driver Section: disk_install.NT Driver Rank: 0xFF0006 Matching Device Id: GenDisk Outranked Drivers: disk.inf:GenDisk:00FF2002 Device Updated: false Could only create a 37GB bin file on C:\ but managed to create a 372GB bin file on D:\ 37GB bin file would take an estimated 90 minutes to copy so at that rate it should take 15 hours for the larger file. 7Zip calculated checksum at 1373-1379 MB/sec. Thanks Paul. Don't know what I've done but enjoyed playing. Check out the reviews here. Quite variable results. https://www.amazon.ca/Flash-Drive-Me...ews/B01KOFOUCO The seller might be selling "two terabit" sticks, but so far, nobody has demonstrated operation at that size either (i.e. it's a 256GB stick). Time to collect some of these. The objective of these, is to detect aliasing automatically, without wasting a lot of your time. One tool actually tries to read the flash chip ID, which I think is pretty cool. https://www.raymond.cc/blog/test-and...-with-h2testw/ Paul |
#37
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USB thumb drives.
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#38
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USB thumb drives.
"wasbit" wrote:
I have a 1TB thumb drive, bought me as a present at a cost of £10 (13.5$). Considering its price, I was dubious as to its capacity. Windows shows it as 917GB Geez, I didn't know they came that big! 1TB would be in decimal figures (10**12), 917GB would be in binary (2** 30 is one GB (1,073,741,824), times 917 is somewhere around 1 trillion. Just like hard drives. -- Tim Slattery tim at risingdove dot com |
#39
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USB thumb drives.
Ken Blake wrote:
On Fri, 18 May 2018 14:45:42 -0700, wrote: I have several HP 8gb devices, metal cases, and NO keyring hole at all. I also have a Lexar 128 GB USB3 device that is the size of a USB Mouse receiver, so clearly also NO keyring hole. Hell, IT is barely big enough to grab hold of when trying to remove it! I have one even smaller. It's completely flat, perhaps 1/16 of an inch thick, and about the size of a small postage stamp. If I remember correctly, it's 64KB. I got it as a distribution of a piece of software. 64 KB?!?! -- Quote of the Week: "The fact that we can't easily foresee clues that would betray an intelligence a million millennia farther down the road suggests that we're like ants trying to discover humans. Ask yourself: Would ants ever recognize houses, cars, or fire hydrants as the work of advanced biology?" --Seth Shostak Note: A fixed width font (Courier, Monospace, etc.) is required to see this signature correctly. /\___/\ Ant(Dude) @ http://antfarm.home.dhs.org / /\ /\ \ Please nuke ANT if replying by e-mail privately. If credit- | |o o| | ing, then please kindly use Ant nickname and URL/link. \ _ / ( ) |
#40
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USB thumb drives.
Tim Slattery wrote:
"wasbit" wrote: I have a 1TB thumb drive, bought me as a present at a cost of £10 (13.5$). Considering its price, I was dubious as to its capacity. Windows shows it as 917GB Geez, I didn't know they came that big! 1TB would be in decimal figures (10**12), 917GB would be in binary (2** 30 is one GB (1,073,741,824), times 917 is somewhere around 1 trillion. Just like hard drives. It's not the big, it's the cheap that matters. A 2TB drive here, is $650.00, versus the $13 for the proposed USB stick. A factor of fifty in price. And according to the article text, these chips only go into vertically oriented designs, with the Samsung name on the packaging (not in third-party USB sticks). https://www.anandtech.com/show/12408...2tb-ssd-review In that example, strings of bits are arranged in vertical strings defined by the layer count. The die is full of holes, plated up, to make a three-dimensional storage device. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flash_...#Vertical_NAND That Samsung chip uses 64 layer dies (512gbit total), with 16 dies stacked on top of one another to give a 1TByte chip. Those chips would not fit inside a USB stick, neither would there be room for much else in there. And the stick would likely overheat on read/write :-) (The power on one of the write tests, was up around 10-11W.) That 2TB M.2 is actually single sided. I couldn't believe it. The 4TB one is probably a double-sided design. Paul |
#41
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USB thumb drives.
Ant wrote:
Ken Blake wrote: On Fri, 18 May 2018 14:45:42 -0700, wrote: I have several HP 8gb devices, metal cases, and NO keyring hole at all. I also have a Lexar 128 GB USB3 device that is the size of a USB Mouse receiver, so clearly also NO keyring hole. Hell, IT is barely big enough to grab hold of when trying to remove it! I have one even smaller. It's completely flat, perhaps 1/16 of an inch thick, and about the size of a small postage stamp. If I remember correctly, it's 64KB. I got it as a distribution of a piece of software. 64 KB?!?! http://www.eweek.com/storage/1987-to...hes-nand-flash 1991: Toshiba Launches First NAND-Type EEPROM Toshiba announced in 1991 that it had developed the world's first 4M bit NAND-type electrically erasable programmable read-only memory (EEPROM). This moves along the development of NAND flash substantially. [So that's 512KB right there, at the start] Then, the Wikipedia USB article says: (USB) Designed January 1996; 22 years ago Finally, back to the Eweek 2000: First USB Flash Drive Goes to Market Trek Technology and IBM began selling the first USB flash drives commercially in 2000. https://www.newyorker.com/tech/eleme...he-flash-drive Trek 2000 International, a Singaporean company, was the first to actually sell a USB flash drive, which it called the ThumbDrive, in early 2000. (It won the trademark for ThumbDrive, which has come to be a generic term for the devices, only a few years ago.) Apparently that's in the 8MB era. But I cannot find a single English sentence confirming that. You'd think there would at least be one picture of the Trek Stick, if it was the first. ******* The value might be 64MB. They did make some crappy USB devices where the contacts were printed on a piece of cardboard. The ones of those I've received, I wouldn't *dare* shove those into a computer connector :-) Think of the smoke and such :-) Paul |
#42
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USB thumb drives.
On Sat, 19 May 2018 14:17:44 -0500, (Ant) wrote:
Ken Blake wrote: On Fri, 18 May 2018 14:45:42 -0700, wrote: I have several HP 8gb devices, metal cases, and NO keyring hole at all. I also have a Lexar 128 GB USB3 device that is the size of a USB Mouse receiver, so clearly also NO keyring hole. Hell, IT is barely big enough to grab hold of when trying to remove it! I have one even smaller. It's completely flat, perhaps 1/16 of an inch thick, and about the size of a small postage stamp. If I remember correctly, it's 64KB. I got it as a distribution of a piece of software. 64 KB?!?! As I said, If I remember correctly. It was very small, but perhaps not that small. 16MB? 32MB? I probably got the number right and the unit wrong--64MB. I wish I could find it and check. When it's so physically small, it's easy to get lost. |
#43
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USB thumb drives.
On Thu, 17 May 2018 10:11:25 +0100, default wrote:
On Thu, 17 May 2018 07:49:55 +1000, Peter Jason wrote: I have many USB2 & USB3 going back 10+ years, and now some are "socket specific" on my 10 YO computer motherboard (some USB3s will work on some sockets; even USB2 sockets) and not others. Do these thumb drives last forever, or should their contents be transferred to the latest USB drives? The number of write cycles determines the life. Many manufacturers specify 10,000. If that's true, the life expectancy is not likely to be exceeded in normal use, like storing files or using it to transfer files from one device to another. That said, the use to which flash memory is put can also determine it's life expectancy. If, for instance, it is used in a data-logger, back-ups, or recording system where the data is re-written or written-over in the course of normal usage. Microsoft allow you to use them to expand your system RAM. I guess that would wear them out ****ing quickly. -- Peter is listening to "Motley Crue - Chicks = Trouble" |
#44
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USB thumb drives.
On Thu, 17 May 2018 14:12:54 +0100, Doomsdrzej wrote:
On Thu, 17 May 2018 07:49:55 +1000, Peter Jason wrote: I have many USB2 & USB3 going back 10+ years, and now some are "socket specific" on my 10 YO computer motherboard (some USB3s will work on some sockets; even USB2 sockets) and not others. Do these thumb drives last forever, or should their contents be transferred to the latest USB drives? Theoretically, they should last a long time but a lot can destroy them like moisture and a seemingly miniscule amount of bending. I'd transfer their contents to more recent, faster USB keys. I was given one that was stood upon by a 15 stone man. The data was not recoverable. -- You can't convince a believer of anything; for their belief is not based on evidence, it's based on a deep-seated need to believe. -- Carl Sagan |
#45
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USB thumb drives.
On Thu, 17 May 2018 20:22:14 +0100, ...w¡ñ§±¤ñ wrote:
"Peter Jason" wrote in message ... Do these thumb drives last forever, or should their contents be transferred to the latest USB drives? I've replaced a grand total of '1' since USB thumb drives became available. - the failure rate wasn't age...fell out of my shirt pocket into a can of paint. Did have another one, an ancient Memorex 1GB drive where the drive assembly detached from the plastic casing - a few tiny drops of Gorilla glue applied with a toothpick and tiny C-clamp for a few hours fixed(it). *Still working as a USB for Acronis True Image 2017 Boot Media I was recently given a 256MB (Megabytes!!!) drive by my neighbour and asked to download the entire Harry Potter series onto it. I burst out laughing when they said they'd just bought it brand new from a local shop. The shop is run by Pakis, so that's why.... -- "Have you read The Three Musketeers?" "No, only one of them." |
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