A Windows XP help forum. PCbanter

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Home » PCbanter forum » Microsoft Windows 7 » Windows 7 Forum
Site Map Home Register Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

Unicomp Model-M a disaster --RESOLVED--



 
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old May 23rd 18, 04:39 AM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.periphs.keyboard
B00ze
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 472
Default Unicomp Model-M a disaster --RESOLVED--

On 2018-05-04 01:18, B00ze wrote:

On 2018-05-01 22:44, B00ze wrote:

For those who can still access the rest of this thread (for context):

I have finally taken the time to replace the v6.x controller boards for
my USB Unicomps with the v7.x controllers they sent me. The problem with
the keyboard totally freezing-up if I dared to touch it while the BIOS
was booting-up is resolved (Hurray!) The strange behaviour when waking
the computer from sleep is still the Windows re-detects the keyboard,
as tho I had unplugged it while asleep, and sometimes it does not detect
it correctly so you're stuck on the logon screen. I tested with a cheap
Logitech keyboard, and it is definitively a Unicomp thing, there is no
re-detecting the keyboard on wake with the Logitech.

The bad news is that my older 101 keys Unicomp uses a different locking
mechanism for holding the controller board than my newer 103 keys, and I
am totally unable to make the controller connect to all of the
keyboard's signal lines, so some keys are always not working. I guess I
will have to buy some foam-tape and try to make the foam push the
flexible membrane harder against the PCB. I have asked Unicomp if they
can do anything for me but had not heard back in a week - I might have
to open a new ticket rather than open my old one. Will update this
thread.

Regards,


Unicomp is sending me a new foam pad. I will try to remove the old one
and place this one a little lower, so that contact is better with the
PCB. Will report back. Pretty happy with the new version 7 controller;
if this foam pad works, I will mark this thread as resolved and give a
hearty two thumbs up for Unicomp keyboards.


Well, there is good and bad news. The new v7 controllers are much better
than previous versions, even tho they still do that weird thing when
coming out of sleep mode. And the new foam pad Unicomp sent worked
great, all the keys that were ever going to work were now working.
Unfortunately, I had used 100% alcohol to clean the traces on the
transparent plastic "membrane" earlier, trying to get better contact to
the controller board. This weekend, flipping the membrane over, I
discovered that I had totally removed some of the traces when I used the
alcohol; so some of the traces were "cut" and will never again make
contact with the controller board. So this keyboard is toast; my fault.
I offered to send it back to Unicomp instead of throwing it away but
have not heard back.

I'll just buy another one if I need a gaming keyboard with no Windows
keys. I don't expect my current Unicomp WITH Windows keys to ever stop
working, these keyboard are like tanks. Sorry it took me so long to
update this thread. Conclusion is: If you have some issues with your
current Unicomp, especially during boot or sleep, get a new controller
board.

Best Regards,

--
! _\|/_ Sylvain /
! (o o) Memberavid-Suzuki-Fdn/EFF/Red+Cross/SPCA/Planetary-Society
oO-( )-Oo GOLFER: One who yells "fore!" takes 5 & writes down 3.

Ads
  #2  
Old May 23rd 18, 04:53 AM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.periphs.keyboard
Paul[_32_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,279
Default Unicomp Model-M a disaster --RESOLVED--

B00ze wrote:
On 2018-05-04 01:18, B00ze wrote:

On 2018-05-01 22:44, B00ze wrote:

For those who can still access the rest of this thread (for context):

I have finally taken the time to replace the v6.x controller boards for
my USB Unicomps with the v7.x controllers they sent me. The problem with
the keyboard totally freezing-up if I dared to touch it while the BIOS
was booting-up is resolved (Hurray!) The strange behaviour when waking
the computer from sleep is still the Windows re-detects the keyboard,
as tho I had unplugged it while asleep, and sometimes it does not detect
it correctly so you're stuck on the logon screen. I tested with a cheap
Logitech keyboard, and it is definitively a Unicomp thing, there is no
re-detecting the keyboard on wake with the Logitech.

The bad news is that my older 101 keys Unicomp uses a different locking
mechanism for holding the controller board than my newer 103 keys, and I
am totally unable to make the controller connect to all of the
keyboard's signal lines, so some keys are always not working. I guess I
will have to buy some foam-tape and try to make the foam push the
flexible membrane harder against the PCB. I have asked Unicomp if they
can do anything for me but had not heard back in a week - I might have
to open a new ticket rather than open my old one. Will update this
thread.

Regards,


Unicomp is sending me a new foam pad. I will try to remove the old one
and place this one a little lower, so that contact is better with the
PCB. Will report back. Pretty happy with the new version 7 controller;
if this foam pad works, I will mark this thread as resolved and give a
hearty two thumbs up for Unicomp keyboards.


Well, there is good and bad news. The new v7 controllers are much better
than previous versions, even tho they still do that weird thing when
coming out of sleep mode. And the new foam pad Unicomp sent worked
great, all the keys that were ever going to work were now working.
Unfortunately, I had used 100% alcohol to clean the traces on the
transparent plastic "membrane" earlier, trying to get better contact to
the controller board. This weekend, flipping the membrane over, I
discovered that I had totally removed some of the traces when I used the
alcohol; so some of the traces were "cut" and will never again make
contact with the controller board. So this keyboard is toast; my fault.
I offered to send it back to Unicomp instead of throwing it away but
have not heard back.

I'll just buy another one if I need a gaming keyboard with no Windows
keys. I don't expect my current Unicomp WITH Windows keys to ever stop
working, these keyboard are like tanks. Sorry it took me so long to
update this thread. Conclusion is: If you have some issues with your
current Unicomp, especially during boot or sleep, get a new controller
board.

Best Regards,


And that suggests that perhaps washing the keyboard in water
would have (slightly) damaged it too - if it was alcohol soluble.
Water might well have done a job on it too, as might spilling
a Coke on it (followed by frantic attempts to rinse it clean).

Paul
  #3  
Old May 23rd 18, 05:16 AM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.periphs.keyboard
B00ze
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 472
Default Unicomp Model-M a disaster --RESOLVED--

On 2018-05-22 23:53, Paul wrote:

[snip]

B00ze wrote:
Well, there is good and bad news. The new v7 controllers are much
better than previous versions, even tho they still do that weird thing
when coming out of sleep mode. And the new foam pad Unicomp sent
worked great, all the keys that were ever going to work were now
working. Unfortunately, I had used 100% alcohol to clean the traces on
the transparent plastic "membrane" earlier, trying to get better
contact to the controller board. This weekend, flipping the membrane
over, I discovered that I had totally removed some of the traces when
I used the alcohol; so some of the traces were "cut" and will never
again make contact with the controller board. So this keyboard is
toast; my fault. I offered to send it back to Unicomp instead of
throwing it away but have not heard back.

I'll just buy another one if I need a gaming keyboard with no Windows
keys. I don't expect my current Unicomp WITH Windows keys to ever stop
working, these keyboard are like tanks. Sorry it took me so long to
update this thread. Conclusion is: If you have some issues with your
current Unicomp, especially during boot or sleep, get a new controller
board.

Best Regards,


And that suggests that perhaps washing the keyboard in water
would have (slightly) damaged it too - if it was alcohol soluble.
Water might well have done a job on it too, as might spilling
a Coke on it (followed by frantic attempts to rinse it clean).


Well I only tried to clean the traces that were on the plastic
"membrane" which sits under the keys but which also protrudes from the
key area, and goes touching the controller board from below. I used 100%
alcohol from MG Chemicals, not rubbing alcohol. But the stuff is strong,
way too strong. Usually, when I clean contact points like this, I just
use a white eraser; I even have one with a deep groove in it to clean
the connector parts of expansion cards etc. On cheap "normal" keyboards,
or on remote controls, or calculators, I also use an eraser. But 3 weeks
ago, I went "Hey, I got this nice big bottle of pure alcohol" - Mistake!

I HAVE washed the keyboard part of Model M's with water in the past. So
long as you use something like a paint brush, to wash around the keyb
after having removed all the keys (which you can wash separately but let
them dry a full day before putting them back) then all is well. But
don't do like I once did, and just put the keyboard under the faucet
trying not to touch the holes where the keys go. You WILL screw-up and
/some/ water will make it into the keyboard. It's not as bad as it
sounds, but what happened, get this, is some of the buckling springs
rusted! So some keys were a bit weird after that (that particular Model
M was REALLY dirty.)

With this latest screw-up, I'm now pretty good on what NOT to do to a
Model M ;-)

Best Regards,

--
! _\|/_ Sylvain /
! (o o) Memberavid-Suzuki-Fdn/EFF/Red+Cross/SPCA/Planetary-Society
oO-( )-Oo Does it bother ya that doctors call what they do a practice?

  #4  
Old May 25th 18, 03:29 AM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.periphs.keyboard
Andy Burns[_6_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 698
Default Unicomp Model-M a disaster --RESOLVED--

B00ze wrote:

I had used 100% alcohol to clean the traces on the
transparent plastic "membrane" earlier, trying to get better contact to
the controller board. This weekend, flipping the membrane over, I
discovered that I had totally removed some of the traces when I used the
alcohol; so some of the traces were "cut" and will never again make
contact with the controller board. So this keyboard is toast;


Could you use some of the silver(?) conductive paint to re-draw the traces?
  #5  
Old May 25th 18, 04:50 AM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.periphs.keyboard
B00ze
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 472
Default Unicomp Model-M a disaster --RESOLVED--

On 2018-05-24 22:29, Andy Burns wrote:

B00ze wrote:

I had used 100% alcohol to clean the traces on the
transparent plastic "membrane" earlier, trying to get better contact to
the controller board. This weekend, flipping the membrane over, I
discovered that I had totally removed some of the traces when I used the
alcohol; so some of the traces were "cut" and will never again make
contact with the controller board. So this keyboard is toast;


Could you use some of the silver(?) conductive paint to re-draw the traces?


Ohhh, I did not know about this. Found a "pen" of conductive paint,
ironically from MG Chemicals (the 100% Alcohol is from them.) Darn, I
have already removed a bunch of parts from the keyboard; guess I'll have
to put it all back together now.

Excellent suggestion, thanks! I will try this in maybe 2 weeks? Will
come back and let you know if it works.

Best Regards,

--
! _\|/_ Sylvain /
! (o o) Memberavid-Suzuki-Fdn/EFF/Red+Cross/SPCA/Planetary-Society
oO-( )-Oo A truly wise man never plays leapfrog with a unicorn.

  #6  
Old May 25th 18, 06:19 AM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.periphs.keyboard
Paul[_32_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,279
Default Unicomp Model-M a disaster --RESOLVED--

B00ze wrote:
On 2018-05-24 22:29, Andy Burns wrote:

B00ze wrote:

I had used 100% alcohol to clean the traces on the
transparent plastic "membrane" earlier, trying to get better contact to
the controller board. This weekend, flipping the membrane over, I
discovered that I had totally removed some of the traces when I used the
alcohol; so some of the traces were "cut" and will never again make
contact with the controller board. So this keyboard is toast;


Could you use some of the silver(?) conductive paint to re-draw the
traces?


Ohhh, I did not know about this. Found a "pen" of conductive paint,
ironically from MG Chemicals (the 100% Alcohol is from them.) Darn, I
have already removed a bunch of parts from the keyboard; guess I'll have
to put it all back together now.

Excellent suggestion, thanks! I will try this in maybe 2 weeks? Will
come back and let you know if it works.

Best Regards,


http://www.pckeyboard.com/mm5/mercha...uc t_code=MEM

Membrane assembly Price: $10.00

Have a chat with them, see what they've got.

Paul
  #7  
Old May 25th 18, 06:27 AM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.periphs.keyboard
J. P. Gilliver (John)[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,031
Default Unicomp Model-M a disaster --RESOLVED--

In message , B00ze
writes:
On 2018-05-24 22:29, Andy Burns wrote:

B00ze wrote:

I had used 100% alcohol to clean the traces on the
transparent plastic "membrane" earlier, trying to get better contact to
the controller board. This weekend, flipping the membrane over, I
discovered that I had totally removed some of the traces when I used the
alcohol; so some of the traces were "cut" and will never again make
contact with the controller board. So this keyboard is toast;


Could you use some of the silver(?) conductive paint to re-draw the traces?


Ohhh, I did not know about this. Found a "pen" of conductive paint,
ironically from MG Chemicals (the 100% Alcohol is from them.) Darn, I
have already removed a bunch of parts from the keyboard; guess I'll
have to put it all back together now.

Excellent suggestion, thanks! I will try this in maybe 2 weeks? Will
come back and let you know if it works.

Best Regards,

Don't get your hopes _too_ high: I bought some of this conductive paint
to repair the elements in my rear screen heater. It used to be widely
sold for that, but isn't now - probably because, as I found, it is very
fiddly to use and the chance of success is far from 100%. (I attempted
on two of the lines, and succeeded on one; I might try again next winter
if I find that wasn't sufficient.)
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)[email protected]+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Santa's elves are just a bunch of subordinate Clauses.
  #8  
Old May 25th 18, 07:03 AM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.periphs.keyboard
Andy Burns[_6_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 698
Default Unicomp Model-M a disaster --RESOLVED--

J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:

I bought some of this conductive paint
to repair the elements in my rear screen heater. It used to be widely
sold for that, but isn't now - probably because, as I found, it is very
fiddly to use


I do remember it being sold for that, and also as a window-break sensor
for burglar alarms, but I never tried using the stuff ...
  #9  
Old May 25th 18, 11:27 AM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.periphs.keyboard
Paul[_32_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,279
Default Unicomp Model-M a disaster --RESOLVED--

Mr. Man-wai Chang wrote:
On 5/24/2018 7:29 PM, Andy Burns wrote:

Could you use some of the silver(?) conductive paint to re-draw the
traces?


How do you "liquidate" a dried tip of a silver pen? I got one that's
unusable.


Look up the MSDS for the product.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safety_data_sheet

Paul
  #10  
Old May 25th 18, 12:07 PM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.periphs.keyboard
Paul[_32_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,279
Default Unicomp Model-M a disaster --RESOLVED--

Mr. Man-wai Chang wrote:
On 5/25/2018 3:27 AM, Paul wrote:

How do you "liquidate" a dried tip of a silver pen? I got one that's
unusable.


Look up the MSDS for the product.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safety_data_sheet


You meant I should have just thrown it away properly?


Here's an example.

Say I own "permatex rear window defogger repair kit"

I do a Google search on

permatex rear window defogger repair kit MSDS

That gives me this PDF. I read the PDF.

https://www.lemona.lt/LIUSE/TI/En/Pdf/09117.pdf

SILVER 7440-22-4 40-50% by weight
ETHYL ACETATE 141-78-6 20-30% by weight
ETHANOL 64-17-5 10-20% by weight
1-METHOXY-2-PROPANOL ACETATE 108-65-6 10-20% by weight
POLY (METHYL METHACRYLATE) 9011-14-7 1-10% by weight
PIGMENT ORANGE #13

Then you look up some of the ingredients.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Methyl_methacrylate

The principal application is the manufacture of
polymethyl methacrylate acrylic plastics (PMMA).

That means some of the components in the kit, form a polymer.
This is an irreversible chemical reaction. In other
words, when it dries, it has chemically changed into
a form of plastic.

One of the chemical is a solvent. ETHANOL.

That means you can add a little ethanol to the tip
of the pen, but because the other components have
formed some sort of acrylic plastic or acetate compound,
you would expect the ethanol to be ineffective at
rejuvenating the pen.

For some chemical compounds, they're simply solvated.
And when the solvent evaporates, you add some more
solvent and that "rejuvenates" the material and allows
you to use it.

However, if an irreversible chemical reaction happens,
you can pour all the ethanol you want on it, and it
won't be good as new.

Paul

  #11  
Old May 26th 18, 02:07 AM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.periphs.keyboard
Mr. Man-wai Chang
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,742
Default Unicomp Model-M a disaster --RESOLVED--

On 5/24/2018 7:29 PM, Andy Burns wrote:

Could you use some of the silver(?) conductive paint to re-draw the traces?


How do you "liquidate" a dried tip of a silver pen? I got one that's
unusable.

--
@[email protected] Remain silent! Drink, Blink, Stretch! Live long and prosper!!
/ v \ Simplicity is Beauty!
/( _ )\ May the Force and farces be with you!
^ ^ (x86_64 Ubuntu 9.10) Linux 2.6.39.3
不借貸! 不詐騙! 不*錢! 不援交! 不打交! 不打劫! 不自殺! 不求神! 請考慮綜援
(CSSA):
http://www.swd.gov.hk/tc/index/site_...sub_addressesa
  #12  
Old May 26th 18, 02:36 AM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.periphs.keyboard
Mr. Man-wai Chang
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,742
Default Unicomp Model-M a disaster --RESOLVED--

On 5/25/2018 3:27 AM, Paul wrote:

How do you "liquidate" a dried tip of a silver pen? I got one that's
unusable.


Look up the MSDS for the product.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safety_data_sheet


You meant I should have just thrown it away properly?

--
@[email protected] Remain silent! Drink, Blink, Stretch! Live long and prosper!!
/ v \ Simplicity is Beauty!
/( _ )\ May the Force and farces be with you!
^ ^ (x86_64 Ubuntu 9.10) Linux 2.6.39.3
不借貸! 不詐騙! 不*錢! 不援交! 不打交! 不打劫! 不自殺! 不求神! 請考慮綜援
(CSSA):
http://www.swd.gov.hk/tc/index/site_...sub_addressesa
  #13  
Old May 26th 18, 06:32 AM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.periphs.keyboard
B00ze
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 472
Default Unicomp Model-M a disaster --RESOLVED--

On 2018-05-25 01:19, Paul wrote:

B00ze wrote:
On 2018-05-24 22:29, Andy Burns wrote:

B00ze wrote:

I had used 100% alcohol to clean the traces on the
transparent plastic "membrane" earlier, trying to get better contact to
the controller board. This weekend, flipping the membrane over, I
discovered that I had totally removed some of the traces when I used
the
alcohol; so some of the traces were "cut" and will never again make
contact with the controller board. So this keyboard is toast;

Could you use some of the silver(?) conductive paint to re-draw the
traces?


Ohhh, I did not know about this. Found a "pen" of conductive paint,
ironically from MG Chemicals (the 100% Alcohol is from them.) Darn, I
have already removed a bunch of parts from the keyboard; guess I'll
have to put it all back together now.

Excellent suggestion, thanks! I will try this in maybe 2 weeks? Will
come back and let you know if it works.

Best Regards,


http://www.pckeyboard.com/mm5/mercha...uc t_code=MEM

Membrane assembly Price: $10.00


The problem is the membrane sits between the metal backplane and the
black plastic base which holds the keys. The two (metal backplane and
black plastic base) are held together by melting the black plastic
rivet-like - I cannot separate them...

Have a chat with them, see what they've got.


They have seen this thread, I am pretty sure, and are probably not
happy; they are not chatting with me anymore. But for a hundred bucks, I
expected a working USB controller; there were different bugs on two of
the controller versions I had. I expect bugs from some things, but not
from a Model M keyboard.

Regards,

--
! _\|/_ Sylvain /
! (o o) Memberavid-Suzuki-Fdn/EFF/Red+Cross/SPCA/Planetary-Society
oO-( )-Oo Error reading FAT Record. Try the skinny one (y/n)?

  #14  
Old May 26th 18, 06:48 AM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.periphs.keyboard
B00ze
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 472
Default Unicomp Model-M a disaster --RESOLVED--

On 2018-05-26 01:32, B00ze wrote:

They have seen this thread, I am pretty sure, and are probably not
happy; they are not chatting with me anymore. But for a hundred bucks, I
expected a working USB controller; there were different bugs on two of
the controller versions I had. I expect bugs from some things, but not
from a Model M keyboard.


I got the same thing over @ TeraBytes Unlimited. I complained that their
multi-boot tool was erasing my partition tables each time I rebooted the
computer. I made a very detailed bug report and got the standard Service
Desk "It must be you, just reboot" kinda response. After 2 responses
like this I got mad, explained I was not some 10 year old kid and that
they read the bug report I made explaining exactly how to reproduce.
They fixed the bug like 2 days later, but to this day, no matter my
pleas, the support person will not talk to me anymore. They are
childish; I do not recommend them anymore.

Best Regards,

--
! _\|/_ Sylvain /
! (o o) Memberavid-Suzuki-Fdn/EFF/Red+Cross/SPCA/Planetary-Society
oO-( )-Oo He's dead Jim, that's ten this week already! -Bones

  #15  
Old May 26th 18, 07:10 AM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.periphs.keyboard
Mr. Man-wai Chang
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,742
Default Unicomp Model-M a disaster --RESOLVED--

On 5/25/2018 4:07 AM, Paul wrote:

For some chemical compounds, they're simply solvated.
And when the solvent evaporates, you add some more
solvent and that "rejuvenates" the material and allows
you to use it.

However, if an irreversible chemical reaction happens,
you can pour all the ethanol you want on it, and it
won't be good as new.


Thanks. Irreversible chemical reaction ....

--
@[email protected] Remain silent! Drink, Blink, Stretch! Live long and prosper!!
/ v \ Simplicity is Beauty!
/( _ )\ May the Force and farces be with you!
^ ^ (x86_64 Ubuntu 9.10) Linux 2.6.39.3
不借貸! 不詐騙! 不*錢! 不援交! 不打交! 不打劫! 不自殺! 不求神! 請考慮綜援
(CSSA):
http://www.swd.gov.hk/tc/index/site_...sub_addressesa
 




Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off






All times are GMT +1. The time now is 02:37 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2004-2018 PCbanter.
The comments are property of their posters.