C:\Windows\Installer not showing in WE

Hi All,

Windows 10-2004, x64

I have Windows Explorer (WE) set to show everything.
Strangely, C:\Windows\Installer is still hidden.

Something I should know about?

-T

On 2020-08-10 9:22 p.m., T wrote:
Hi All,

Windows 10-2004, x64

I have Windows Explorer (WE) set to show everything.
Strangely, C:\Windows\Installer is still hidden.

Something I should know about?

-T

In control panelfile explorer options.view tab
Have you checked, show hidden files folders and drives.
and uncheck hide protected operating system files
two separate items. And yes, showing fine here.

Rene

On 2020-08-10 20:00, Rene Lamontagne wrote:
On 2020-08-10 9:22 p.m., T wrote:
Hi All,

Windows 10-2004, x64

I have Windows Explorer (WE) set to show everything.
Strangely, C:\Windows\Installer is still hidden.

Something I should know about?

-T

In control panelfile explorer options.view tab
Have you checked, show hidden files folders and drives.
and uncheck hide protected operating system files
two separate items. And yes, showing fine here.

Rene



yes, yes, yes, and mumble, mumble ...

This machine I am working is weird. Lately I have noticed
a lot of one off Windows 10 installations were they
have issues found no where else.

T wrote:
On 2020-08-10 20:00, Rene Lamontagne wrote:
On 2020-08-10 9:22 p.m., T wrote:
Hi All,

Windows 10-2004, x64

I have Windows Explorer (WE) set to show everything.
Strangely, C:\Windows\Installer is still hidden.

Something I should know about?

-T

In control panelfile explorer options.view tab
Have you checked, show hidden files folders and drives.
and uncheck hide protected operating system files
two separate items. And yes, showing fine here.

Rene

yes, yes, yes, and mumble, mumble ...

This machine I am working is weird. Lately I have noticed
a lot of one off Windows 10 installations were they
have issues found no where else.

The Windows defaults are a normal part of clean installs at least.
The hidden extension value and so on. Customers would not appreciate
all the settings we use, as exposing system files might show
two desktop.ini files. But many of the useful ones can be turned
on and make better computing citizens out of the customers.
For example, if talking to a customer by phone, I would really
like it if they could navigate to AppData for me and tell me
what they see, instead of torturing them with some other recipe.

That means you're likely to be in View:Options on a daily basis,
and with pretty well all the Windows currently needing maintenance.

From a "messing with customers heads" perspective, you should
be doing these settings and making changes, on the day of the
install. It's not fair to show up two years after an install,
and start flipping View:Options and Apply to all folders,
and then have a customer scratching their head as to where
the two desktop.ini came from. If you're going to mess with
people, it should be while you're there on the fresh install.

There are those individuals, who have arranged their folders
like doilies on coffee tables, and if you smoosh around the
doilies there will be hell to pay. Even though we can warn
people that Windows doesn't preserve appearances all that well
at the best of times, and to spend time pushing doilies around,
is time wasted in the greater scheme of things. Use a
desktop recorder and record every file/folder position,
if needing to avoid a showdown with a doily freak.

Paul

T wrote:

yes, yes, yes, and mumble, mumble ...

all visible here and icacls says the entire tree has these perms

C:\Windows\Installer\ NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEMOI)(CI)(F)
EveryoneOI)(CI)(RX)
BUILTIN\AdministratorsOI)(CI)(F)

Lately I have noticed
a lot of one off Windows 10 installations were they
have issues found no where else.

Have you done installed them and left them alone, or installed them and
then done "whatever tweaks you consider necessary"?

On 2020-08-11 00:02, Paul wrote:
T wrote:
On 2020-08-10 20:00, Rene Lamontagne wrote:
On 2020-08-10 9:22 p.m., T wrote:
Hi All,

Windows 10-2004, x64

I have Windows Explorer (WE) set to show everything.
Strangely, C:\Windows\Installer is still hidden.

Something I should know about?

-T

In control panelfile explorer options.view tab
Have you checked, show hidden files folders and drives.
and uncheck hide protected operating system files
two separate items. And yes, showing fine here.

Rene

yes, yes, yes, and mumble, mumble ...

This machine I am working is weird.Â* Lately I have noticed
a lot of one off Windows 10 installations were they
have issues found no where else.

The Windows defaults are a normal part of clean installs at least.
The hidden extension value and so on. Customers would not appreciate
all the settings we use, as exposing system files might show
two desktop.ini files. But many of the useful ones can be turned
on and make better computing citizens out of the customers.
For example, if talking to a customer by phone, I would really
like it if they could navigate to AppData for me and tell me
what they see, instead of torturing them with some other recipe.

That means you're likely to be in View:Options on a daily basis,
and with pretty well all the Windows currently needing maintenance.

From a "messing with customers heads" perspective, you should
be doing these settings and making changes, on the day of the
install. It's not fair to show up two years after an install,
and start flipping View:Options and Apply to all folders,
and then have a customer scratching their head as to where
the two desktop.ini came from. If you're going to mess with
people, it should be while you're there on the fresh install.

There are those individuals, who have arranged their folders
like doilies on coffee tables, and if you smoosh around the
doilies there will be hell to pay. Even though we can warn
people that Windows doesn't preserve appearances all that well
at the best of times, and to spend time pushing doilies around,
is time wasted in the greater scheme of things. Use a
desktop recorder and record every file/folder position,
if needing to avoid a showdown with a doily freak.

Â*Â* Paul

I always go into view on a new install. Old ones
too. The customer(s) can't tell the difference.

Chuckle. I also add C: to their favorites. They
don't notice that one either.

This one machine though ...

On 2020-08-11 00:07, Andy Burns wrote:
T wrote:

yes, yes, yes, and mumble, mumble ...

all visible here and icacls says the entire tree has these perms

C:\Windows\Installer\ NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEMOI)(CI)(F)
Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* EveryoneOI)(CI)(RX)
Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* BUILTIN\AdministratorsOI)(CI)(F)

Lately I have noticed
a lot of one off Windows 10 installations were they
have issues found no where else.

Have you done installed them and left them alone, or installed them and
then done "whatever tweaks you consider necessary"?

What ever tweaks.

It is just this one machine. Grrrrrrr

On 2020-08-10 19:22, T wrote:
Hi All,

Windows 10-2004, x64

I have Windows Explorer (WE) set to show everything.
Strangely, C:\Windows\Installer is still hidden.

Something I should know about?

-T

My Virtual Machine of 10:

https://ibb.co/LYzw5Mz

It is just this one stinking machine!

T wrote:

Windows 10-2004, x64

I have Windows Explorer (WE) set to show everything. Strangely,
C:\Windows\Installer is still hidden. Something I should know about?

Microsoft still has Windows/File Explorer coded to hide some system
folders. If you know the folder's name, just enter it in the address
bar, like C:\Windows\Installer, and Explorer will open to there provided
your current Windows account under which you logged in has permissions.
In fact, with permissions, you could be able to enter c:\win, hit tab to
auto-complete to c:\windows, and enter inst and hit tab to auto-complete
to add Installer.

Presumably you have BOTH following configured for Explorer's view
options:
- Hidden files and folders = Show hidden files, folders, or drives
- Hide protected operating system files = DISABLED

Are you logging in under a Windows account that is in the Administrators
security group, or are you logged in under a normal/restricted account?

As you are typing in a path, File Explorer will pre-fill the destination
with matching folders, but not for hidden system folders (regardless of
what view settings you configure in Explorer). However, auto-complete
still works in the command shell.

If you cannot view the Installer subfolder in Explorer using the above
trick of entering the path into the address bar, use the command shell.
Go to C:\Windows and run:

icacls Installer

Check what permission you have under whatever Windows account you are
currently logged into. You'll likely see permissions are inherited. At
the end of "icacls /?", you'll see the permission acronyms.

You can also use Powershell. In the command shell, navigate to
C:\Windows\Installer to make it the current/working directory. In
Powershell, use Get-Acl for a more verbose listing of permissions.

cd c:\windows\installer
powershell
get-acl

Alas, the list is likely too long to show in the default tabular format,
so instead use in Powershell:

Get-Acl | Format-List

You can also use SysInternals' AccessChk, as in:

accesschk64 -d c:\windows\installer

You'll need, at least, read permission on the folder for the security
group in which is your Windows account. The Administrators SID should
have RW (read-write) permissions, and the Everyone SID should have R.
Powershell should show you have ReadAndExecute permissions, so you could
run the files under there to uninstall programs.

If you cannot get to the Installer folder at all, maybe you or the user
installed security software that further restricts access. Try booting
Windows in its safe mode, and retry access to that folder.

Andy Burns wrote:
T wrote:

yes, yes, yes, and mumble, mumble ...

all visible here and icacls says the entire tree has these perms

C:\Windows\Installer\ NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEMOI)(CI)(F)
EveryoneOI)(CI)(RX)
BUILTIN\AdministratorsOI)(CI)(F)

Lately I have noticed
a lot of one off Windows 10 installations were they
have issues found no where else.

Have you done installed them and left them alone, or installed them and
then done "whatever tweaks you consider necessary"?

FILE_ATTRIBUTE_READONLY = 1 (0x1)
FILE_ATTRIBUTE_HIDDEN = 2 (0x2)
FILE_ATTRIBUTE_SYSTEM = 4 (0x4)
FILE_ATTRIBUTE_DIRECTORY = 16 (0x10)
FILE_ATTRIBUTE_ARCHIVE = 32 (0x20)
FILE_ATTRIBUTE_NORMAL = 128 (0x80)
FILE_ATTRIBUTE_TEMPORARY = 256 (0x100)
FILE_ATTRIBUTE_SPARSE_FILE = 512 (0x200)
FILE_ATTRIBUTE_REPARSE_POINT = 1024 (0x400)
FILE_ATTRIBUTE_COMPRESSED = 2048 (0x800)
FILE_ATTRIBUTE_OFFLINE = 4096 (0x1000)
FILE_ATTRIBUTE_NOT_CONTENT_INDEXED = 8192 (0x2000)
FILE_ATTRIBUTE_ENCRYPTED = 16384 (0x4000)

https://i.postimg.cc/DfH621t3/attributes.gif

fsutil usn readdata C:\Windows\Installer

File Attributes 0x16 = Hidden+System+Directory

Hidden makes it hidden :-)

It's possible there's an Appdata like that too.
Salted with too much attributes.

And I love the goofiness of where this info is hiding.

Paul

On 2020-08-11 07:13, VanguardLH wrote:
just enter it in the address
bar, like C:\Windows\Installer

That is what I did.

T wrote:

On 2020-08-11 07:13, VanguardLH wrote:
just enter it in the address
bar, like C:\Windows\Installer

That is what I did.

There's what you said, and then there's what you meant to say. You
said, "C:\Windows\Installer" is still hidden. That does NOT say that it
was hidden while viewing the C:\Windows folder, or you could not enter
C:\Windows\Installer into the address bar to get *into* that folder.

Pretty much others have reinforced why you don't see the Installer
folder from C:\Windows. You've yet to declare that you can or cannot
/enter/ that folder.

Hidden just mean not visible, not inaccessible or not exist. I can wear
a blindfold but that won't make a wall disappear that I walk into.

So, did you try any of my other suggestions or those of others?

On 2020-08-11 13:39, VanguardLH wrote:
T wrote:

On 2020-08-11 07:13, VanguardLH wrote:
just enter it in the address
bar, like C:\Windows\Installer

That is what I did.

There's what you said, and then there's what you meant to say. You
said, "C:\Windows\Installer" is still hidden. That does NOT say that it
was hidden while viewing the C:\Windows folder, or you could not enter
C:\Windows\Installer into the address bar to get *into* that folder.

Pretty much others have reinforced why you don't see the Installer
folder from C:\Windows. You've yet to declare that you can or cannot
/enter/ that folder.

Hidden just mean not visible, not inaccessible or not exist. I can wear
a blindfold but that won't make a wall disappear that I walk into.

So, did you try any of my other suggestions or those of others?


By still hidden, I meant in the directory tree of
Windows Explorer. I did not mean I could not get into
it manually

T wrote:

By still hidden, I meant in the directory tree of Windows Explorer. I
did not mean I could not get into it manually

Even with "Show hidden files ..." selected and "Hide protected ..."
deselected for view options in Explorer, the normally hidden folders
still do not appear in the tree pane (aka navigation pane) of Explorer.
They only appear in the files pane (aka files and folders list pane).

This is what I see:
https://imgur.com/a/xlpDH25

On 2020-08-11 21:34, VanguardLH wrote:
T wrote:

By still hidden, I meant in the directory tree of Windows Explorer. I
did not mean I could not get into it manually

Even with "Show hidden files ..." selected and "Hide protected ..."
deselected for view options in Explorer, the normally hidden folders
still do not appear in the tree pane (aka navigation pane) of Explorer.
They only appear in the files pane (aka files and folders list pane).

This is what I see:
https://imgur.com/a/xlpDH25


Same with every other computer but this one. It
is another one of those "one off" computers. I
will give up on it as can be worked around.
That and I no longer have access to the computer

Thank you for all the help