Why most new PCs have USB 2.0 but not Firewire builtin?

In article ,
Bill Van Dyk wrote:

My biggest gripe is unfulfilled promises. USB was supposed to allow you to
plug in or unplug devices "on the fly".

That's how USB and firewire both work on my Mac.
--
Charlie Dilks
Newark, DE USA

In article ,
Bill Van Dyk wrote:

But Windows has a hissy fit if you turn off your digital camera, for example,
even if you don't need it and aren't accessing it anymore.

Gee, works fine here. Oh, wait! I use a Mac!

--
Enough

You and 4 other people.



"Enough" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Bill Van Dyk wrote:

But Windows has a hissy fit if you turn off your digital camera, for
example,
even if you don't need it and aren't accessing it anymore.

Gee, works fine here. Oh, wait! I use a Mac!

--
Enough

"Enough" wrote in message ...
In article ,
Bill Van Dyk wrote:

But Windows has a hissy fit if you turn off your digital camera, for example,
even if you don't need it and aren't accessing it anymore.

Gee, works fine here. Oh, wait! I use a Mac!

Hissy fit? Under Win2K I get a single warning if I don't stop
a USB device before turning it off or unplugging it, and no error
at all if I stop the device first. Smooth as silk.

Rick

Charlie Dilks wrote:
In article ,
Bill Van Dyk wrote:

My biggest gripe is unfulfilled promises. USB was supposed to allow
you to plug in or unplug devices "on the fly".

That's how USB and firewire both work on my Mac.

Funnily enough it's how they work on my Windows XP box as well, I have a mix
of USB 1.1 (on the motherboard), USB 2.0 (on a Belkin PCI card) and Firewire
(on a Creative Audigy card) and none of them have ever given me a moments
probelm with plugging or unplugging devices. The list of devices includes,
slide scanner, two different mice, two different memory sticks, Creative ZEN
jukebox, 120GB hard drive etc.


--
Nik Simpson

I plug and unplug many of my USB-2 devices at will with XP. no problems,
except hard drives. Drives can be set up to not require being stopped in
software before disconnecting, but even if they are set up normally you
just get an error (no hissy-fit here :-).

To install a USB-2 drive just plug it in. Not too hard. To uninstall drives on the fly,
you may need to "stop" them in software (depending on your set up).

I use a USB-2 external drive enclosure with a removable tray. To change drives
I "stop" them down in software, then turn off the power on the external case,
swap drives, and turn the power back on. In a few seconds, there is a new
drive available on the system.

Other items like mice, scanners, printers, etc. are just a matter of pluging them in
or unpluging them. For the most part it is pretty easy on my systems. I've found
1394 OK for cameras, but wasn't totally happy with the firewire enclosure.

David

"Bill Van Dyk" wrote in message
...
Right--

My biggest gripe is unfulfilled promises. USB was supposed to allow you to
plug
in or unplug devices "on the fly".

How odd. I have eight USB ports, both USB 1 and USB 2 implementation on my
PC, and I constantly 'plug in or unplug devices "on the fly'." Chances are
there's a problem with your computer and not a problem with the design of
the USB system. Countless thousands of "USB on PC" users plug in, unplug,
turn on, turn off, etc., on the fly with USB with perfect results. Alas, I
have no specific suggestions, but maybe somebody will.

David McCall wrote:

I plug and unplug many of my USB-2 devices at will with XP. no
problems, except hard drives. Drives can be set up to not require
being stopped in software before disconnecting

(...)

I have no less than 15 devices on my USB 2.0 port (FB scanner,
3x printers, 2x HD, memory card reader, graphic tablet, Dazzle
A/D converter, mouse, flightsim yoke, flightsim throttle, flightsim
pedals, 2x hubs) and an IEEE 1394 card to handle digital video
transfers and my Nikon 4000 ED film scanner. I plug and unplug
at will (except for the disks, for the reason David explained.)
Everything works smoothly under XP.

Never had such a rock-solid OS, even when I used a Mac.

In rec.video.desktop Charlie Dilks wrote:
That's how USB and firewire both work on my Mac.

My Mac will complain if I unplug a USB keydrive before ejecting the volume.
("Device Removal: The device you removed was not properly put away..")

My Windows 2000 box also complains if I do not "Stop Device" before
unplugging.

Windows XP does not complain at all.

True many complaints in this tread about USB are because of the poor
implementation of the USB specs by M$. Try another OS and I sure you
will love USB.

USB works just fine, and so does firewire under Linux. Thank you very
much. BSD has excellent USB support also.

Later

"Christopher" == Christopher X Candreva writes:

Christopher In rec.video.desktop Bill Van Dyk
Christopher wrote: : Firewire is
Christopher elegant and reliable. Plug in the camcorder, run
Christopher Premiere, load the : data. When you're done, disconnect
Christopher or shut off the camera.... and not a peep : from
Christopher firewire.

Christopher : It is actually quite remarkable that USB can't do
Christopher that. It is beyond

Christopher But is that USB's problem, or the Windows implementation
Christopher of it ? On my Linux machine I plug/unplug my USB scanner
Christopher and web cam with no ill effects.

Christopher --
Christopher ================================================== ========
Christopher Chris Candreva -- -- (914) 967-7816
Christopher WestNet Internet Services of Westchester
Christopher http://www.westnet.com/

Win 2000? Likes like a mac OS 7. Win XP ihas been out for a while and
longhorn is floating around now.


"Rick" wrote in message
...
"Enough" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Bill Van Dyk wrote:

But Windows has a hissy fit if you turn off your digital camera, for
example,
even if you don't need it and aren't accessing it anymore.

Gee, works fine here. Oh, wait! I use a Mac!

Hissy fit? Under Win2K I get a single warning if I don't stop
a USB device before turning it off or unplugging it, and no error
at all if I stop the device first. Smooth as silk.

Rick

I have 6 USB ports and 2 firewire on XP. No problems. However, as I said
earlier, win XP screws up if you have more than 2 firewire ports on a PCI
card.


"Don Forsling" wrote in message
...

"Bill Van Dyk" wrote in message
...
Right--

My biggest gripe is unfulfilled promises. USB was supposed to allow you
to
plug
in or unplug devices "on the fly".

How odd. I have eight USB ports, both USB 1 and USB 2 implementation on
my
PC, and I constantly 'plug in or unplug devices "on the fly'." Chances
are
there's a problem with your computer and not a problem with the design of
the USB system. Countless thousands of "USB on PC" users plug in, unplug,
turn on, turn off, etc., on the fly with USB with perfect results. Alas,
I
have no specific suggestions, but maybe somebody will.

"Bill Van Dyk" wrote in message
...
Mark M wrote:

There are comparatively few devices that utilize firewire over USB, and
since USB 2.0 is fully compatible with the zillions of existing USB 1.0
devices, it makes sense for all computers to come equipped with 2.0.

Thank you, Mr. Lemming.

There is nothing in my post about "following for no apparent reason."
The reasons for USB inclusion are clear:
-The need for compatible input devices for the vast array of devices which
require it on the market already.
This makes no claim of superiority of USB 2.0, rather the simple recognition
that USB is very much a standard connection for the majority of users.

Nearly every digital camera, new printer, MP3 player, etc. require a USB
connection.
It's not my opinion that matters here.
These are simple facts.
Personally, I like firewire over USB 2.0.

"Bill Van Dyk" wrote in message
...
Right--

My biggest gripe is unfulfilled promises. USB was supposed to allow you to
plug
in or unplug devices "on the fly".
But Windows has a hissy fit if you turn off your digital camera, for
example,
even if you don't need it and aren't accessing it anymore. And USB
doesn't
reach sustained speeds at the claimed performance levels. And it can and
will
bring your entire system down with a crash. It is, in a word, pathetic.

Firewire is elegant and reliable. Plug in the camcorder, run Premiere,
load the
data. When you're done, disconnect or shut off the camera.... and not a
peep
from firewire.

It is actually quite remarkable that USB can't do that. It is beyond
incompetent.

I plug and unplug USB devices CONSTANTLY with none of these "hissy fits" you
speak of.
Again...no flag waver for USB, but you seem to be on the fringe here.

"Supreme Enchanter" wrote in message
...
I have 6 USB ports and 2 firewire on XP. No problems. However, as I said
earlier, win XP screws up if you have more than 2 firewire ports on a PCI
card.

YOUR computer screws up with more than one firewire port.
Not MY windoze machine.