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#31
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How to add a "Shutdown" folder (the opposite of the "startup"folder) ?
On 11/16/2020 9:25 AM, R.Wieser wrote:
JJ, Keep in mind that Shutdown is not same as Log-off, or vice versa. I know. I've been fighting with myself about what I should name the new directory : "shutdown" or "OnLogoff". The first matches the "startup" one better*, the second is /way/ closer to the truth. *if you have a good, opposite name to "startup" than please do mention it. The opposite of "start" is "end". So it seems that one of "endup" or "enddown" are to be considered and of course the ever popular "startdown". In truth, I don't like any of these. In my case its a bit moot though as I never logoff but /always/ power the machine down. Or... use the Fast User Switching to logon another user. Thus triggers the Logon scripts without triggering Logoff script for any user. Logoff scripts will be triggered only when a user actually logs off. -- Jeff Barnett |
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#32
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How to add a "Shutdown" folder (the opposite of the "startup" folder) ?
Jeff,
The opposite of "start" is "end". So it seems that one of "endup" or "enddown" are to be considered and of course the ever popular "startdown". In truth, I don't like any of these. Same here. But while reading the "xxxdown" names the name "winddown" popped into my mind. I'll have to think about that one (trying to figure out how long it will be before I forget what its supposed to mean ...). Regards, Rudy Wieser "Jeff Barnett" wrote in message ... On 11/16/2020 9:25 AM, R.Wieser wrote: JJ, Keep in mind that Shutdown is not same as Log-off, or vice versa. I know. I've been fighting with myself about what I should name the new directory : "shutdown" or "OnLogoff". The first matches the "startup" one better*, the second is /way/ closer to the truth. *if you have a good, opposite name to "startup" than please do mention it. The opposite of "start" is "end". So it seems that one of "endup" or "enddown" are to be considered and of course the ever popular "startdown". In truth, I don't like any of these. In my case its a bit moot though as I never logoff but /always/ power the machine down. Or... use the Fast User Switching to logon another user. Thus triggers the Logon scripts without triggering Logoff script for any user. Logoff scripts will be triggered only when a user actually logs off. -- Jeff Barnett |
#33
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How to add a "Shutdown" folder (the opposite of the "startup" folder) ?
On Mon, 16 Nov 2020 17:25:29 +0100, R.Wieser wrote:
I know. I've been fighting with myself about what I should name the new directory : "shutdown" or "OnLogoff". The first matches the "startup" one better*, the second is /way/ closer to the truth. *if you have a good, opposite name to "startup" than please do mention it. In my case its a bit moot though as I never logoff but /always/ power the machine down. Well, the term "Shutdown" is more appropriate for a computer shutdown rather than a user log off. But if you never log on with different user and use multiple user sessions at the same time, it shouldn't matter. Though if you need to have multiple folders, one for computer shutdown, and one for user log off, I'd suggest using "Shutdown" for computer shutdown, and "Logoff" for user log off. Or... "System Shutdown" for computer shutdown, and "Shutdown" for user log off - so that if you ever need a folder for the actual computer startup event, it can be "System Startup". |
#34
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How to add a "Shutdown" folder (the opposite of the "startup" folder) ?
JJ,
Well, the term "Shutdown" is more appropriate for a computer shutdown rather than a user log off. But if you never log on with different user and use multiple user sessions at the same time, it shouldn't matter. Indeed on both. The name still irks me though. Luckily Jeff Barnett bumped me enough to come up with a different name: winddown. Though if you need to have multiple folders, one for computer shutdown, and one for user log off, I'd suggest using "Shutdown" for computer shutdown, and "Logoff" for user log off. Absolutily. I've been mulling that latter name too, but it simply did not match the already existing "startup" name. Damn, I just realised : the "startup" folder has got nothing to do with a user. IOW, I might just go for the full monty, and create folders for both the "logon" as well as the "logoff" events (and leave the "startup" folder alone). Feels odd though, abandoning that "startup" folder (I've got a few things in it). Regards, Rudy Wieser |
#35
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How to add a "Shutdown" folder (the opposite of the "startup" folder) ?
On Wed, 18 Nov 2020 19:03:25 +0100, R.Wieser wrote:
Feels odd though, abandoning that "startup" folder (I've got a few things in it). You don't have to. If you accept that the term "startup" alone in the Start Menu refers to the user log-on (and thus keep Microsoft's inaccurate folder naming), then logically the term "shutdown" alone would refer to the user log-off. Then for the actual computer/system shutdown folders, use the "system" or "computer" prefix. Keep in mind though, the Logon scripts are run by USERINIT.EXE, while the programs in the Start Menu's Startup folder are run by the desktop/shell process (EXPLORER.EXE). So, if the shell happens to be replaced with e.g. CMD.EXE or something else which is not aware of Start Menu's Startup folder, the programs in the Start Menu's Startup folder won't be run. |
#36
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How to add a "Shutdown" folder (the opposite of the "startup" folder) ?
JJ,
If you accept that the term "startup" alone in the Start Menu refers to the user log-on (and thus keep Microsoft's inaccurate folder naming) Wait, what ? I somehow got the idea that the "startup" folder was connected to the system boot process, but here you seem to indicate that its actually connected to the users logon process. If thats so, are the (gpedit) "logon" scripts and "startup" folder essentially not doing the same thing ? Then for the actual computer/system shutdown folders, use the "system" or "computer" prefix. Yeah, you mentioned that before, and it does sound workable. I'll have to keep it in mind. Keep in mind though, the Logon scripts are run by USERINIT.EXE, while the programs in the Start Menu's Startup folder are run by the desktop/shell process (EXPLORER.EXE). I don't think that that will ever be something I have to take into consideration, but thanks for mentioning it. Regards, Rudy Wieser P.s. I did some testing on the ShellExecuteEx function with the SEE_MASK_NOCLOSEPROCESS flag, and it is what is actually not returning a process handle when a shortcut is run - regardless of what the target is. |
#37
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How to add a "Shutdown" folder (the opposite of the "startup" folder) ?
JJ,
the Start Menu's Startup folder are run by the desktop/shell process (EXPLORER.EXE). Something about that : while playing around with an iconoverlay I've several times killed the explorer.exe process and restarted it (both to release the just unregistered iconoverlay dll as well as to refresh the icons). I've got programs in the startup folder creating an icon in the systray (at the right, next to the clock). Those do not re-appear after restarting the explorer.exe process, though your above sounds like they should. Any idea why ? Or, said otherwise : are you sure that running the startup folders contents is part of the explorer.exe process. Regards, Rudy Wieser |
#38
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How to add a "Shutdown" folder (the opposite of the "startup" folder) ?
On Fri, 20 Nov 2020 08:10:17 +0100, R.Wieser wrote:
JJ, the Start Menu's Startup folder are run by the desktop/shell process (EXPLORER.EXE). Something about that : while playing around with an iconoverlay I've several times killed the explorer.exe process and restarted it (both to release the just unregistered iconoverlay dll as well as to refresh the icons). I've got programs in the startup folder creating an icon in the systray (at the right, next to the clock). Those do not re-appear after restarting the explorer.exe process, though your above sounds like they should. Any idea why ? I could only guess that EXPLORER.EXE can know when it should execute the programs in the Start Menu's Startup folder, not not. e.g. if it's executed by USERINIT.EXE or not. It may not be the actual case, but it's one of the many possibilities. Or, said otherwise : are you sure that running the startup folders contents is part of the explorer.exe process. Yes, I'm sure of it. It applies to all Windows version. The Start Menu's Startup folder is a conversion of the old Win3.x/NT3.x Program Manager (PROGMAN.EXE) "Startup" group - which is not a directory in the file system. That too, if the shell is changed to other than PROGMAN.EXE, none of the programs listed in the Startup group will be executed. In XP, you can test it yourself by changing the shell to CMD.EXE. Note: don't use anything else which doesn't have the capability to run any other program (e.g. Calculator). This is to make sure that you can change the shell back to EXPLORER.EXE. Also... I'd suggest disabling the Welcome Screen feature from the Users control panel. Otherwise, it'll stuck in the system startup screen with the big "welcome" text on it, and have to press CTRL+ALT+DEL to get to the normal screen where it shows the CMD window (as the shell) and no taskbar. |
#39
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How to add a "Shutdown" folder (the opposite of the "startup" folder) ?
On Thu, 19 Nov 2020 19:00:20 +0100, R.Wieser wrote:
JJ, If you accept that the term "startup" alone in the Start Menu refers to the user log-on (and thus keep Microsoft's inaccurate folder naming) Wait, what ? I somehow got the idea that the "startup" folder was connected to the system boot process, but here you seem to indicate that its actually connected to the users logon process. If thats so, are the (gpedit) "logon" scripts and "startup" folder essentially not doing the same thing ? No. They are entirely separate. P.s. I did some testing on the ShellExecuteEx function with the SEE_MASK_NOCLOSEPROCESS flag, and it is what is actually not returning a process handle when a shortcut is run - regardless of what the target is. As I mentioned in microsoft.public.scripting.vbscript, I could only say that it's a bug in NT5.x. |
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