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Tip: blowing out fans



 
 
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  #16  
Old November 12th 19, 05:12 AM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
default[_2_]
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Posts: 201
Default Tip: blowing out fans

On Mon, 11 Nov 2019 14:11:12 -0800, T wrote:

Hi All,

Tip: If your fans are noisy, blowing them out won't help
things. It is time to replace them.


I agree. Ball bearing fans are usually a lot noisier than sleeve
bearings.

If your fan is clogged, DO NOT USE a shop air gun
to blow it out! Use a can of compressed air
that states it is for electronic equipment and
capture the fan blades so they do not rotate
when you hit them with air. Shop air guns
have oils and other stuff yo do not want all over
your circuit boards and their air flows can cause
static electricity build ups.


Many air compressors do not use oil lubricated pistons, so oil in the
air depends on the compressor. Old garage type shop compressors did
use oil. Diaphragm compressors don't, or Teflon ring piston
compressors don't use oil.

Water in air systems is common enough it humid conditions and that
could cause some problems. Air or propane or refrigerant type cans
are just as capable of causing static, but that is seldom a problem.

Fans, when ran backwards with external air, become
generators and send current back down their wires,
which can damage your motherboards. And certainly
damage any PWM circuitry on the fan. So do not
let the blades spin when blowing them out. Yes,
it is fun to watch them whirl -- don't do it anyway.

Have you actually measured the voltage? I just did with a few fans I
have and they don't produce voltage - at least they don't at the fan
leads. That may be because they use brushless motors and the
electronics in the fan doesn't pass the AC the magnets and coils
produce to the outside world.

Brush type fans are very rare and have been for a couple of decades.
-T







Ads
  #17  
Old November 12th 19, 10:15 AM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
T
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Posts: 4,600
Default Tip: blowing out fans

On 11/11/19 6:18 PM, Rene Lamontagne wrote:
NO,Â*NO,Â*NO,Â*NeverÂ*everÂ*playÂ*withÂ*aÂ*blowÂ*g un!!!!!!!!!!

Blowing air from a nozzle can penetrate the skin and cause an air
embolism bubble in your veins which will go to your heart and kill
you as surely as a gun, I have known it to happen to a mechanic here
in WinnipegÂ*someÂ*yearsÂ*back.

Rene


Yikes!!!!

HowÂ*aboutÂ*theÂ*cat?




IÂ*knowÂ*youÂ*wereÂ*jokingÂ*soÂ*noÂ*problems.Â*Jus tÂ*aÂ*reminderÂ*aboutÂ*airÂ*nozzles.
I dunno about the cat never had one since 1952, I'm a dog lover,
ParticularlyÂ*GoldenÂ*Retrievers. :-)

Rene


If you have ever experienced someone you love's lips turning
blue, gasping in terror trying to breath from being exposed
to the same environment as a cat, you will understand my
attitude towards cats. Although, I have to admit, they
make great clay pigeons.

Dogs on the other hand ... Goldens are the most loving
spirits.

Every so often, my customer get a line item, on their bill
"Play with dog. No Charge." When they get their bill,
they call us up laughing.

-T

  #18  
Old November 12th 19, 10:16 AM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
T
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Posts: 4,600
Default Tip: blowing out fans

On 11/11/19 7:33 PM, Jonathan N. Little wrote:
Electric leaf blower...


You know, computer are very vindictive and have
LONG memories.

:-)

  #19  
Old November 12th 19, 10:19 AM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
T
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Posts: 4,600
Default Tip: blowing out fans

On 11/11/19 8:12 PM, default wrote:
Have you actually measured the voltage?


Yes, I don't remember how high it was. Depended on how
fat I spun the blades

I just did with a few fans I
have and they don't produce voltage - at least they don't at the fan
leads. That may be because they use brushless motors and the
electronics in the fan doesn't pass the AC the magnets and coils
produce to the outside world.


I blew out a PWD fan on for weird processor mount once.
Took me forever to find a fan that would replace it.
That is when I learned my lesson.
  #20  
Old November 12th 19, 10:19 AM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
T
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Posts: 4,600
Default Tip: blowing out fans

On 11/11/19 8:12 PM, default wrote:
Brush type fans are very rare and have been for a couple of decades.



Good riddance!
  #21  
Old November 12th 19, 12:16 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Paul[_32_]
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Posts: 11,873
Default Tip: blowing out fans

T wrote:
On 11/11/19 8:12 PM, default wrote:
Have you actually measured the voltage?


Yes, I don't remember how high it was. Depended on how
fat I spun the blades

I just did with a few fans I
have and they don't produce voltage - at least they don't at the fan
leads. That may be because they use brushless motors and the
electronics in the fan doesn't pass the AC the magnets and coils
produce to the outside world.


I blew out a PWD fan on for weird processor mount once.
Took me forever to find a fan that would replace it.
That is when I learned my lesson.


The analysis of what happens when a BLDC fan freewheels
is complicated. The coil output doesn't go to the terminals
directly.

http://www.pcbheaven.com/wikipages/i...1269881543.png

There are actually many different schematics for those fans,
as each manufacturer tries to shave nickels off the price.
As a result, the behaviors of the fans may not all be
uniformly the same.

When the PC power drops (at shutdown), the fan is still
doing 2000RPM for a couple of seconds, so the controller
circuit has to withstand that much insult. And the person
who designed that controller, takes that into account.

If you wanted to simulate that, you could always build
up a model for it in LTSpice. In your simulation, the coils
are an *AC* voltage source. Because that's what comes out
of them when they freewheel.

Paul
  #22  
Old November 12th 19, 12:43 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
T
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Posts: 4,600
Default Tip: blowing out fans

On 11/12/19 3:16 AM, Paul wrote:
T wrote:
On 11/11/19 8:12 PM, default wrote:
Have you actually measured the voltage?


Yes, I don't remember how high it was.Â* Depended on how
fat I spun the blades

I just did with a few fans I
have and they don't produce voltage - at least they don't at the fan
leads.Â* That may be because they use brushless motors and the
electronics in the fan doesn't pass the AC the magnets and coils
produce to the outside world.


I blew out a PWD fan on for weird processor mount once.
Took me forever to find a fan that would replace it.
That is when I learned my lesson.


The analysis of what happens when a BLDC fan freewheels
is complicated. The coil output doesn't go to the terminals
directly.

http://www.pcbheaven.com/wikipages/i...1269881543.png

There are actually many different schematics for those fans,
as each manufacturer tries to shave nickels off the price.
As a result, the behaviors of the fans may not all be
uniformly the same.

When the PC power drops (at shutdown), the fan is still
doing 2000RPM for a couple of seconds, so the controller
circuit has to withstand that much insult. And the person
who designed that controller, takes that into account.

If you wanted to simulate that, you could always build
up a model for it in LTSpice. In your simulation, the coils
are an *AC* voltage source. Because that's what comes out
of them when they freewheel.


That would definitely be part of the design.

It is okay to spin the fan a little, just don't exceed
by much what it is designed to spin at. Some Air
Compressors can make that fan spin so faat, the
computer is about to take off!

And yes, it is fun. Resist the urge!

I finally found 60, 92 and 120 mm PWM fans I like.


  #23  
Old November 12th 19, 01:16 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
s|b
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Posts: 1,496
Default Tip: blowing out fans

On Mon, 11 Nov 2019 16:41:01 -0600, VanguardLH wrote:

I don't remember hearing of anyone using an air compressor to dust out a
computer. They sell compressed air cans for that.


I've used an air compressor, several times. Everything still works. I do
keep a finger on the fans to prevent them from turning otherwise the
bearings may break. Outside, as Rene suggests, is also a good idea. And
I use short bursts.

--
s|b
  #24  
Old November 12th 19, 01:19 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
s|b
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Posts: 1,496
Default Tip: blowing out fans

On Mon, 11 Nov 2019 15:32:08 -0800, T wrote:

I had a customer spray his computer with WD 40
years ago. Oh Boy!


I bet it made a lot less noise after that!

--
s|b
  #25  
Old November 12th 19, 01:31 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
s|b
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Posts: 1,496
Default Tip: blowing out fans

On Mon, 11 Nov 2019 22:33:32 -0500, Jonathan N. Little wrote:

Electric leaf blower...


I knew a guy who used his vacuum cleaner.

--
s|b
  #26  
Old November 12th 19, 01:50 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
T
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Posts: 4,600
Default Tip: blowing out fans

On 11/12/19 4:19 AM, s|b wrote:
On Mon, 11 Nov 2019 15:32:08 -0800, T wrote:

I had a customer spray his computer with WD 40
years ago. Oh Boy!


I bet it made a lot less noise after that!


If was just a small 80 mm fan spinning at full speed.
What a mess he made (WD 40)!

I moved the 12V plug to the 5V jack.

That was before PWM fans
  #27  
Old November 12th 19, 11:53 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
T
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,600
Default Tip: blowing out fans

On 11/12/19 7:15 AM, Rene Lamontagne wrote:
Last winter we were walking down the sidewalk and we met a a Lady with a
beautiful Golden, maturely I stopped to pet it and then it came and sat
down beside me Looked up at me like a new friend and didn't want me
toÂ*leave.


I had (he died on me) a customer with three of them.
One would gently pen me in so I could not leave.
And yes, the big eyes are something to behold.
If I had those eyes, my wife would be dead meat.

  #28  
Old November 12th 19, 11:54 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
T
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,600
Default Tip: blowing out fans

On 11/12/19 5:50 AM, Jonathan N. Little wrote:
T wrote:
On 11/11/19 7:33 PM, Jonathan N. Little wrote:
Electric leaf blower...


You know, computer are very vindictive and have
LONG memories.

:-)


Nope, works great just be sure to do it outside. Cheap too I think mine
was a $35 Wally-Mart special.


I am a married man. If I used a leaf blower inside,
this group would need a new Todd.

:'(

  #29  
Old November 12th 19, 11:55 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
T
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,600
Default Tip: blowing out fans

On 11/12/19 5:55 AM, Jonathan N. Little wrote:
T wrote:


That would definitely be part of the design.

It is okay to spin the fan a little, just don't exceed
by much what it is designed to spin at.Â* Some Air
Compressors can make that fan spin so faat, the
computer is about to take off!

And yes, it is fun.Â* Resist the urge!

I finally found 60, 92 and 120 mm PWM fans I like.


A simple solution when blasting to remove stubborn crud on blades is a
finger on the fan BEFORE blasting away.


With canned air, that can get pretty cold! I put my
plastic ball point pen in them.

And it is so, so much fun to see the blades whirl.
Damn that self control thing!

  #30  
Old November 13th 19, 01:23 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
default[_2_]
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Posts: 201
Default Tip: blowing out fans

On Tue, 12 Nov 2019 14:55:44 -0800, T wrote:

On 11/12/19 5:55 AM, Jonathan N. Little wrote:
T wrote:


That would definitely be part of the design.

It is okay to spin the fan a little, just don't exceed
by much what it is designed to spin at.* Some Air
Compressors can make that fan spin so faat, the
computer is about to take off!

And yes, it is fun.* Resist the urge!

I finally found 60, 92 and 120 mm PWM fans I like.


A simple solution when blasting to remove stubborn crud on blades is a
finger on the fan BEFORE blasting away.


With canned air, that can get pretty cold! I put my
plastic ball point pen in them.


The stuff is cold because they use refrigerants. In fact there's
several DIY Utoobe vids of shade tree mechanics using "Dust Off"
products to recharge auto AC units because it can cost less. (and
they sell a side-piercing aerosol can tap for the purpose)

The danger to a computer might be from the cold - particularly if it
condesnses water from the air, causes thermal stress on connections,
or is powered up at temperatures it was not designed for.

And it is so, so much fun to see the blades whirl.
Damn that self control thing!


Well, there is that. Entertainment value.
 




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