Tip: Heads up on M$ Office

In message , Chris
writes:
J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
[]
It'd be interesting to know both numbers and proportions. I _suspect_ 7
is now where XP was - actually some time after XP officially ended; 7's
take-up was gradual, possibly even actually accelerated by the
appearance of 8.0.

https://www.w3schools.com/browsers/browsers_os.asp

Win 10 54% and win 7 14%

Thanks for that. (Bit disappointing, but I suppose the
non-_availability_ of anything other than 10 explains it.)

It'd be interesting to see similar figures for 7/XP at similar points in
their relative lifecycles, and perhaps slightly later.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

By most scientific estimates sustained, useful fusion is ten years in
the future - and will be ten years in the future for the next fifty
years or more. - "Hamadryad", ~2016-4-4

On 11/6/19 8:22 AM, Frank Slootweg wrote:
(From this and earlier threads,) It looks to me (us?) that it's not so
much your customers who are unwilling to change, but you.

You are mistaking my anger over M$ artificially forcing
customers into a bug riddled, inferior OS and
caused tons of damage and lost productivity (crashed
updates, etc.) as me not willing to change.

That being said, there are ways to calm the Windows 10
beast.

As far as change goes, I will work on any OS you are
willing to pay me for. I currently support Windows
(all versions), Linux (mostly Fedora, which I adore),
and Mac (which I find rather "weird").

I am currently negotiating with this particular customer
to upgrade the computer in question to Windows 10
so they can have both computers in their office on
the same OS and same M$O.

By the way, it is no fun being on the other end of the
customer anger over M$'s business practices. Can't get
mad at M$, so I am their stand in.

On 11/6/19 8:22 AM, Frank Slootweg wrote:
If it's really your customers who can't handle change, they should get
out of whatever business they're in.

How would you like it if someone threw an arbitrary switch
on your perfectly functioning car such that it would no
longer run and the reason was that they wanted to sell
you a new car?

Your point would be valid if your car was not running properly.

I really, really do not like selling my customers crap.

In the non-software world, the legal term for such
business practices is "extortion". Guess M$
is immune for "racketeering" charges too. Oh please!

In message , Dan Purgert
writes:
["Followup-To:" header set to alt.comp.os.windows-10.]
Ken Blake wrote:
On 11/6/2019 11:36 AM, VanguardLH wrote:
[]
Ever played Zork I?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PWQDccL0aXM

I was going to look at that, but at over an hour ... (-:

Wasn't until 1993 with the release of Return to Zork that added
graphics. The "Web" showed up a year or two later starting with Mosaic.
Ah, nostalgia. The good old days of PCs thankfully since far surpassed.


I have hardly ever played any computer games, with three exceptions:
Zork I, Zork II, and Zork III, around 1985.

It's very dark in here. You are liable to be eaten by a Grue.


I started with Adventure, on the university UNIX mainframe around 1980.
(Later released for various machines as Colossal Adventure, or Colossal
Cave.) The first time, I fed the bird to the snake ...

You are in a maze of twisty passages, all alike.
Which became a meme, e. g.:
You are in a maze of twisty standards, all different.

(As for Chess: I think it was Chess on my Oric - or Atmos - which
startled me by speaking, as it was a machine that didn't have speech.
[OK, the quality was awful, but novel!])
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

By most scientific estimates sustained, useful fusion is ten years in
the future - and will be ten years in the future for the next fifty
years or more. - "Hamadryad", ~2016-4-4

In message , pyotr
filipivich writes:
VanguardLH on Wed, 6 Nov 2019 12:36:06 -0600 typed in
alt.windows7.general the following:
[]
(maybe 13", or less), a 5.25" floppy drive, and a 101-key keyboard that
lasted far longer than anything afterward (think it was a Northgate).

Noisy, weren't they?

You may like http://leeos.tripod.com/ - third and second offerings. Work
fine on W7-32. I initially tried them just for fun, but now find things
strangely quiet if I turn them off (and the feedback is useful).
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

By most scientific estimates sustained, useful fusion is ten years in
the future - and will be ten years in the future for the next fifty
years or more. - "Hamadryad", ~2016-4-4

On 11/7/19 7:06 AM, Chris wrote:
wrote:
On 6 Nov 2019 16:22:19 GMT, Frank Slootweg
wrote:

T wrote:

[About having to switch to Windows 10 because of Office 2019:]

They have tons of specialty software that runs Windows. They
are going to eventually have to bit the bullet. There are
things I can do to calm 10 down. 10's updates are
a nightmare too. (I can turn them off.)

They just are not looking forward to running an inferior
version of Windows.

And NVMe drive goes a long way to calming 10 down. And
there is Open Shell and Shut Up 10

(From this and earlier threads,) It looks to me (us?) that it's not so
much your customers who are unwilling to change, but you.

You've had over four years to prepare migration plans from Windows
whatever to Windows 10. Should be more than enough.

Don't get me wrong, for my *personal* (non-business) use, I don't like
Windows 10 very much either and hence still use 8.1, but holding on to
Windows 7 past its use-by date for (small) *business* purposes is just
plain unprofessional.

If it's really your customers who can't handle change, they should get
out of whatever business they're in.

(N.B. This obviously does not apply to any 'old farts' which use their
systems for private (non-business) use.)

There are still plenty of people in mega corporations using XP for
their POS and other industrial applications., If the job didn't
change, why change the software?
M$ has convinced a generation or two of customers that software just
wears out.

If nothing changed on a computer or to a computer from the day it was
bought, then yes there's no reason to update anything. However, software
and use cases continuously evolve such that you need upgrade.

For example hardware can fail so you replace it with new, but you can't
simply copy the existing install over as the chipset drivers aren't
compatible with the old OS so you upgrade the OS, but then the app isn't
compatible with OS and so on.


Agreed. And the artificial block installed to keep
software from running older perfectly functional
machines to force folks to purchase new stuff is what
****es me off.

Just sell the current product and give downgrade rights.
If you don't want to support it, sell the downgrade
without support.

With Open Source, you can get every stinking version ever
made. Firefox and the Linux kernel are examples.

On 11/6/19 6:48 AM, Rene Lamontagne wrote:
On 2019-11-06 1:06 a.m., T wrote:
On 11/5/19 10:58 PM, Ant wrote:
Anyone older than me.
How old is that? :P

63


85.Â*Â* and counting.Â* :-)

Rene



You are still a young thing! :-)

What do you think, should I be a toothless
old fart or a curmudgeon?

J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
In message , Chris
writes:
J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
[]
It'd be interesting to know both numbers and proportions. I _suspect_ 7
is now where XP was - actually some time after XP officially ended; 7's
take-up was gradual, possibly even actually accelerated by the
appearance of 8.0.

https://www.w3schools.com/browsers/browsers_os.asp

Win 10 54% and win 7 14%

Thanks for that. (Bit disappointing, but I suppose the
non-_availability_ of anything other than 10 explains it.)

It'd be interesting to see similar figures for 7/XP at similar points in
their relative lifecycles, and perhaps slightly later.

Here is another curve.

https://gs.statcounter.com/os-versio...-201205-201910

You can adjust the dates on the end of the URL.

Paul

On 11/7/2019 12:13 PM, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
In message , Ken Blake
writes:
[]
And regarding you statement "7 got broken into more than XP," yes, I
agree, but that should be no surprise. It's not so much that XP was
more resistant to malware; rather 7 was newer than XP, and as time
passes, malware writers get better at doing what they do.

And/or concentrated more on what was the commoner system.



Yes. That's also true.


--
Ken

On 11/6/19 6:45 AM, Rene Lamontagne wrote:
On 2019-11-05 9:42 p.m., T wrote:
On 11/5/19 7:14 PM, VanguardLH wrote:
How old are these customers of yours?

These three are in their forties.

Old farts are a challenge to configure for, but
fortunately, they are need are rather minor:
web and eMail and something to jot down a note on.
Oh and Solitaire.

Hearts.Â* :-)

Rene


Your are disqualified as an old fart. Everyone
knows old farts only play Freecell.

:-)

-T

On 11/7/19 7:41 AM, Ken Blake wrote:
O,Â*contraryÂ*toÂ*urbanÂ*legenÂ*/Â*FUD,Â*8.1Â*isn'tÂ*allÂ*thatÂ*bad.


It'sÂ*allÂ*aÂ*matterÂ*ofÂ*opinion.Â*InÂ*myÂ*opinio n,Â*10Â*isÂ*muchÂ*betterÂ*thanÂ*8.1

8.0 was trash.

The 8.1 systems I see, after all its updates,
does seem pretty solid. And no spying.

But the hoodlums at M$ have artificially
blocked M$O 2019 from running on the too

On 11/7/19 10:51 AM, Frank Slootweg wrote:
For me, and I think many (most?) others, 10's gigantic update mess/
disaster is the big show-stopper.

That is the one thing I find customer are not
willing to put up with. They swallow all the
other problems.

On 11/7/19 11:08 AM, Ken Blake wrote:
Why have I not had any problems with updates? I don't know for sure, but
IÂ*suspectÂ*itÂ*hasÂ*toÂ*doÂ*whatÂ*theÂ*hardwareÂ* is.

The problem is that M$ fired their QC department and is
relying on telemetry to find issues.

On 11/7/19 11:46 AM, Paul wrote:
J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
In message , Chris
writes:
J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
[]
It'd be interesting to know both numbers and proportions. I _suspect_ 7
is now where XP was - actually some time after XP officially ended; 7's
take-up was gradual, possibly even actually accelerated by the
appearance of 8.0.

https://www.w3schools.com/browsers/browsers_os.asp

Win 10 54% and win 7 14%

Thanks for that. (Bit disappointing, but I suppose the
non-_availability_ of anything other than 10 explains it.)

It'd be interesting to see similar figures for 7/XP at similar points
in their relative lifecycles, and perhaps slightly later.

Here is another curve.

https://gs.statcounter.com/os-versio...-201205-201910


You can adjust the dates on the end of the URL.

Â*Â* Paul

"Win7 27.98%".

I am seeing more like 50-50

Some customers are really angry about downgrading to 10.
("up" for a better system not a higher revision number.)

In message , Paul
writes:
J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
[]
Thanks for that. (Bit disappointing, but I suppose the
non-_availability_ of anything other than 10 explains it.)
It'd be interesting to see similar figures for 7/XP at similar
points in their relative lifecycles, and perhaps slightly later.

Here is another curve.

https://gs.statcounter.com/os-versio.../desktop/world
wide#monthly-201205-201910

You can adjust the dates on the end of the URL.

[Or clicking the "adjust" button (-:!]

Paul

Thanks for that. As I suspected, XP/7 went much the same as 7/10, though
there is a noticeable drop in the changeover rate of the latter at some
point.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

[What's your guilty pleasure?] Why should you feel guilty about pleasure? -
Michel Roux Jr in Radio Times 2-8 February 2013