Strange new drive

In article , Lucifer
wrote:


Enterprise does not use SSD because they are unreliable.

nonsense. enterprise uses ssds because not only are they more reliable
but they're also much, much faster.

On Sun, 16 Jun 2019 01:47:48 -0500, VanguardLH wrote:

Lucifer wrote:

VanguardLH wrote:

Consumer-grade SSDs have a small overprovisioning than do SSDs in an
enterprise configuration. Longevity and reliability are more
important for enterprise usage.

Enterprise does not use SSD because they are unreliable.

Wrong again. While the SSD already has some overprovisioning, it gets
or should get increased in an enterprise scenario.

SSDs wear out quickly with high usage. For speed use SAS hard drives.

In article , Lucifer
wrote:



Enterprise does not use SSD because they are unreliable.

Wrong again. While the SSD already has some overprovisioning, it gets
or should get increased in an enterprise scenario.

SSDs wear out quickly with high usage.

hard drives wear out more quickly, nor matter what usage.

For speed use SAS hard drives.

nope. for speed, use ssd. for the most capacity per dollar, use sata
drives.

Lucifer wrote:

On Sun, 16 Jun 2019 01:47:48 -0500, VanguardLH wrote:

Lucifer wrote:

VanguardLH wrote:

Consumer-grade SSDs have a small overprovisioning than do SSDs in an
enterprise configuration. Longevity and reliability are more
important for enterprise usage.

Enterprise does not use SSD because they are unreliable.

Wrong again. While the SSD already has some overprovisioning, it gets
or should get increased in an enterprise scenario.

SSDs wear out quickly with high usage. For speed use SAS hard drives.

Yep, deny what the experts say.

On Sun, 16 Jun 2019 14:51:37 -0500, VanguardLH wrote:

Lucifer wrote:

On Sun, 16 Jun 2019 01:47:48 -0500, VanguardLH wrote:

Lucifer wrote:

VanguardLH wrote:

Consumer-grade SSDs have a small overprovisioning than do SSDs in an
enterprise configuration. Longevity and reliability are more
important for enterprise usage.

Enterprise does not use SSD because they are unreliable.

Wrong again. While the SSD already has some overprovisioning, it gets
or should get increased in an enterprise scenario.

SSDs wear out quickly with high usage. For speed use SAS hard drives.

Yep, deny what the experts say.

I read where somebody is using very high temperatures to recover
worn out SSDS.

Lucifer wrote:

I read where somebody is using very high temperatures to recover
worn out SSDS.

Yes, I remember hearing about that, too. Something to do with healing
the oxide stress of the junctions. Probably not something that end
users could do without the expertise of silicon doping and the proper
equipment. High temperatures encountered in application (i.e., in a
computer setup) are harmful but the healing temperatures have to be much
higher, highly localized and, I suspect, require popping apart the
casing to expose the wafer and probably incorporate an scope to monitor
the process of reflow. I haven't seen anything about this lately, but
then I haven't been looking (I wasn't looking before and just ran across
such reports of high-temperature healing). Seemed more like an
experiment to prove capability than of economical restoration.

There have been some studies of incorporating high-temperature healing
within the chip itself; i.e., to produce self-healing SSDs. This would
be far more economically feasible than having labs do the work.
Recovery is possible in labs for HDDs, but that is an expensive repair
that most end users are unwilling to pay, but companies may employ the
service for business-critical data (but implies the company didn't
employ sufficient and multiple backup strategies).

Exploiting Heat-Accelerated Flash Memory Wear-Out Recovery to Enable
Self-Healing SSDs
https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/66f...3cbba017c8.pdf
(not dated but the latest cited reference is 2009)

That seems an old article, and I've not heard of any self-healing SSDs
at all. The additional circuitry would likely raise the cost of the
flash modules by a huge increase putting it outside the consumer market
until something like 6-10 years have lapsed to lower the manufacturing
cost to an effective price point acceptable to the consumer market. It
would have to be the near the same cost, perhaps a bit more expensive,
to buy a self-healing SSD than to buy a new one. Basically the added
cost would be like buying insurance on the part.

End users often don't monitor temperatures of their drives whether HDDs
or SSDs. While the BIOS/UEFI has temperature thresholds for the CPU,
they don't for the GPU or drives. I've also found drive monitoring
software that relies on SMART attributes (all of them do) to be guessing
at the longevity of HDDs. For example, they may see a big jump of 200
sectors getting remapped in one event (between their SMART polls) and
assume the drive just must be going bad. Yet SMART does not report the
size of the G-list: the spare sector pool. 200 remapped sectors looks
bad by itself but only if the G-list were, say, 500 sectors. Not as bad
if the G-list were 2000 sectors, and trivial with a G-list of 10,000
spare spectors. A one-time jump of 200 sectors isn't catastrophic, but
repeated such jumps would indicate accelerated progressive failures.
The drive monitors just go by the size of the remapped sectors per event
without any knowledge of what is the G-list size which they cannot
determine from the SMART attributes. SSDs, on the other had, do have a
SMART attribute to indicate remaining lifespan based on the write
volume. High temperatures (not those for doping or reflow of SSDs, but
just higher than the operating temperature range for the device) can be
encountered in the devices used by end users. Users expect data to be
permanent yet they mistreat their devices, like leaving them inside a
car with the windows rolled up on a hot summer day. It's illegal to
leave babies in that scenario, but users do it to their devices. They
shorten the life of their recordable discs (that use dye sublimation
instead of burned in pits) as the data fades in heat. SSDs can lose
their data, too, when exposed to higher temperature than their operating
range when not powered on.

https://www.extremetech.com/computin...-without-power

The chart in the above article claims a powered off SSD has about a
1-week retention at 55C (131F). Yeah, users won't be working in
scalding temperatures, but they might store their devices with SSDs that
end up encountering those temperatures. A car in direct sunlight on a
hot summer day with temperatures of 70 to 100 F can reach inside
temperatures of 130 to 172 F. If a data center should lose its air
conditioning, wonder what the temperatures inside will rise to.
Enterprise-class SSDs have a higher sized G-list but that's for
remapping the bad sectors, not to offset data loss due to storage at
high temperatures.

Is There Really a Difference Between Enterprise and Consumer Solid State
Drives?
https://www.itprotoday.com/high-spee...d-state-drives

Enterprise versus Client SSD
https://www.kingston.com/us/ssd/ente...sus_client_ssd

For the above mentioned self-healing SSDs to work, they may have to be
SLC types, like the enterprise-class SSDs. Rare few end users buy SLC
SSDs. Too pricey for their pockets. Price is already and still a
deciding factor of where to deploy SSDs in an enterprise setup, like a
data center, and self-healing SSDs, if ever available, would up the
price curve again.

In article , Lucifer
wrote:

Enterprise does not use SSD because they are unreliable.

Wrong again. While the SSD already has some overprovisioning, it gets
or should get increased in an enterprise scenario.

SSDs wear out quickly with high usage. For speed use SAS hard drives.

Yep, deny what the experts say.

I read where somebody is using very high temperatures to recover
worn out SSDS.

so what? there are people who recover worn out hard drives too. lots of
them.

nospam posted this via
:

In article , Lucifer
wrote:

Enterprise does not use SSD because they are unreliable.

Wrong again. While the SSD already has some overprovisioning, it
gets or should get increased in an enterprise scenario.

SSDs wear out quickly with high usage. For speed use SAS hard
drives.

Yep, deny what the experts say.

I read where somebody is using very high temperatures to recover
worn out SSDS.

[Dogma and tripe snipped. Nothing left.]

You're such a ****y little girl.

--

I AM Bucky Breeder, (*(^;

Resolve conflicts the American way :

Rock - Paper - Scissors - Aircraft Carrier Battle Group

.... and I approve this message!