Some Windows File History questions

Hi All,

I have been reading up on Windows File History. I does
should like a nice application.

References:
https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/...8-file-history
https://www.lifewire.com/use-file-hi...ows-10-3891070

https://www.howtogeek.com/74623/how-...-in-windows-8/


Some questions:

1) are the files stored in native format or in incremental
fragments?

2) are the files readable with a standard file manager? In
other words, must it require Windows to read them. And does
it have to be THAT version of Windows that created them
to read them?

3) how far backwards will File History keep older revisions?

4) will File history use the entire backup drive and prune
as it gets full? Or will is complain when the drive fill up?

5) is there any performance hit that the user will recognize?

6) what will happen if the user disconnects the backup drive?

7) if you move the backup drive to a fresh install of Windows,
will the fresh install be able to recover them?

Many thanks,
-T

In article , lid says...

Hi All,

I have been reading up on Windows File History. I does
should like a nice application.

References:
https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/...8-file-history
https://www.lifewire.com/use-file-hi...ows-10-3891070

https://www.howtogeek.com/74623/how-...-in-windows-8/


Some questions:

1) are the files stored in native format or in incremental
fragments?

2) are the files readable with a standard file manager? In
other words, must it require Windows to read them. And does
it have to be THAT version of Windows that created them
to read them?

3) how far backwards will File History keep older revisions?

4) will File history use the entire backup drive and prune
as it gets full? Or will is complain when the drive fill up?

5) is there any performance hit that the user will recognize?

6) what will happen if the user disconnects the backup drive?

7) if you move the backup drive to a fresh install of Windows,
will the fresh install be able to recover them?

Many thanks,
-T

Yes, it's excellent, and very easy to use - especially at the point you
find you need an older version of some file. It's just there within a
few seconds. Be aware MS have been rumbing about discontinuing it, but
I'm staying with it until I have to find something else (or use what MS
replace it with).

1) native format
2) native format! (So anything that can read NTFS). I just drilled
down into my Archive drive in File Explorer, and the files are visible
as normal, and in the expected folder hierarchy.
3) As configured, but that includes "forever"
4) No pruning. You'll get warnings when the disk is getting full. I
have a (third, actually) 4TB disk within my PC case, so I have a way to
go.
5) None that I've seen.
6) It backs up everthing new/changed since the last time it was
connected.
7) Don't know. But I'd guess that if you move the backed-up data and
the File History archive in parallel, you could well find that the
"previous versions" option works seamlessly in the new installation.
But the files are all there, and easily found, anyway.

It's worth keeping your critical files in OneDrive (the OneDrive folder
gets backed up too on my system) just in case you lose the originals and
backup through fire, theft, whatever. But File History is just right,
as far as I'm concerned.

--

Phil, London

T wrote:

I have been reading up on Windows File History. I does
should like a nice application.

References:
https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/...8-file-history
https://www.lifewire.com/use-file-hi...ows-10-3891070

https://www.howtogeek.com/74623/how-...-in-windows-8/

Some questions:

1) are the files stored in native format or in incremental
fragments?

2) are the files readable with a standard file manager? In
other words, must it require Windows to read them. And does
it have to be THAT version of Windows that created them
to read them?

3) how far backwards will File History keep older revisions?

4) will File history use the entire backup drive and prune
as it gets full? Or will is complain when the drive fill up?

5) is there any performance hit that the user will recognize?

6) what will happen if the user disconnects the backup drive?

7) if you move the backup drive to a fresh install of Windows,
will the fresh install be able to recover them?

See my thread here titled "File History (Backup) - Not including
Documents folder".

I tried File History. There were problems, so it got discarded. When I
managed to get it working at its best, it still missed a file which, if
a critical file, you would not have a history backup from which to
restore. An issue to which no one responded was:

I'm still trying to figure out how File History can show you prior
versions after deleting a file. After all, normally you right-click
on an *existing* file to use Properties - Prior Versions to get at
the prior versions. So, how can you right-click on a non-existing
file, one that existed but got deleted?

The ease-of-use using a property sheet on file (which is not possible)
is lost after deleting a file. The user has to dig into the File
History cache to find saved copies of a deleted file.

I found a workaround using my current backup sofware. I use Macrium
Reflect Home. It does not allow searching for a file across its image
backups. Having to mount an image, search for the file, unmount the
image, and repeat until you find the file at the version you want is way
too clumsy. However, for file backups using Reflect, I can have it
search on a file across all backups, and the search results show in
which backup (with a date) the file exists, so I can pick one based on
date.

I'd still want something that is similar to File History. SyncBack
(which I've already discussed in another of your threads) does have file
versioning but not in their free version, only in their payware versions
(SE and Pro editions). FreeFileSync (yep, free, like it says) lists
file versioning as a feature; however, I find it clumsier (i.e., less
intuitive) than SyncBack, and my trial of FreeFileSync ended quick.
I've gotten quick support from 2BrightSparks (SyncBack). For
FreeFileSync, you rely on peer support in their forums. I have Zenju
(site admin) replying in their forums, he registered back in 2007
(FreeFileSync showed up in 2008), but he's posted only 4939 times there.
There is no members list to see how many are site admins, techs, reps,
moderators, employees, etc. Might be you have to register and login to
see that. 2BrightSparks has no forums, so forget about peer support on
their free version. For their payware versions, you get support from
them. If I trial FreeFileSync again, I'll wander through their forums
to see if peers (and any techs) provide a decent level of support.

Can you ensure that everywhere you want to use File History has 2, or
more, drives? File History requires a 2nd drive for where its saves or
caches the versioned files. If the C: drive (with OS, apps, and data)
is all there is, you cannot use File History. If there is only one disk
(HDD or SSD), you'll have to reparition it to create a new 2nd drive.
File History will not save the versioned files in the same source drive
as from where they are getting backed up. It does use dynamic storage
space, though, so you could plug in a USB drive to start a cache for
File History, and later plug in another USB drive to increase its cache
size. File History can use networked drives. However, there is nothing
like RAID-3, so removing one of the drives means losing the old
versioned files that were there. I did not test if removing a drive
(from File History before physically removing it) would offer an option
to copy the old versioned files from one drive to another.

https://www.tenforums.com/tutorials/...dows-10-a.html

File History showed up in Windows 8. Microsoft dropped it in Windows 10
Fall Creators update (insider edition), but decided to keep it. I
wouldn't trust that Microsoft intends to keep it, so you could be
wasting your time to implement File History. See:

https://www.windowscentral.com/micro...reators-update

I suspect Microsoft has been scurrying to fix other more major problems,
and simply hasn't gotten around to disabling the feature. Microsoft is
pushing cloud backups hence their push to OneDrive. Used to be
something you added to Windows. Now, in Windows 10, it is embedded in
Windows. Oh, goody, cloud backups. Those are barely usable for data
backups, not for image backups to restore an entire partition to revert
to a prior state of a drive. They could roll file versioning into
OneDrive since there are local and cloud copies of files in the local
OneDrive folder (and in the special folders, like Documents, Pictures,
Movies, Music, if you config Onedrive to include them) -- but I wouldn't
bet on them incorporating file versioning into OneDrive. OneDrive for
Business (ODFB) has similar features: differential sync, files on
demand, and sync to Sharepoint which has file versionsing
(https://support.office.com/en-us/art...a-bcab618c7a37)
but Sharepoint isn't free, so users would have to subscribe (ka-ching
ka-ching) to get some new file versioning feature in OneDrive that uses
cloud document storage via Sharepoint. ODFB is for using Sharepoint.
Of course, the push to use OneDrive means more revenue to Microsoft
since users/companies have to subscribe (purchase) to get more than the
15GB initial disk quota. Subscriptions are more effective at generating
revenue. Anti-virus vendors found this out a long time ago.

Philip Herlihy wrote:
In article , lid says...
Hi All,

I have been reading up on Windows File History. I does
should like a nice application.

References:
https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/...8-file-history
https://www.lifewire.com/use-file-hi...ows-10-3891070

https://www.howtogeek.com/74623/how-...-in-windows-8/


Some questions:

1) are the files stored in native format or in incremental
fragments?

2) are the files readable with a standard file manager? In
other words, must it require Windows to read them. And does
it have to be THAT version of Windows that created them
to read them?

3) how far backwards will File History keep older revisions?

4) will File history use the entire backup drive and prune
as it gets full? Or will is complain when the drive fill up?

5) is there any performance hit that the user will recognize?

6) what will happen if the user disconnects the backup drive?

7) if you move the backup drive to a fresh install of Windows,
will the fresh install be able to recover them?

Many thanks,
-T

Yes, it's excellent, and very easy to use - especially at the point you
find you need an older version of some file. It's just there within a
few seconds. Be aware MS have been rumbing about discontinuing it, but
I'm staying with it until I have to find something else (or use what MS
replace it with).

1) native format
2) native format! (So anything that can read NTFS). I just drilled
down into my Archive drive in File Explorer, and the files are visible
as normal, and in the expected folder hierarchy.
3) As configured, but that includes "forever"
4) No pruning. You'll get warnings when the disk is getting full. I
have a (third, actually) 4TB disk within my PC case, so I have a way to
go.
5) None that I've seen.
6) It backs up everthing new/changed since the last time it was
connected.
7) Don't know. But I'd guess that if you move the backed-up data and
the File History archive in parallel, you could well find that the
"previous versions" option works seamlessly in the new installation.
But the files are all there, and easily found, anyway.

It's worth keeping your critical files in OneDrive (the OneDrive folder
gets backed up too on my system) just in case you lose the originals and
backup through fire, theft, whatever. But File History is just right,
as far as I'm concerned.


I don't know about (7). From a design perspective, there
are a couple ways to track files. You could use a Shadow Copy
VSS method (which might have been tried in one of the other
Microsoft "backup" methods). This one might use the USN
Change Journal (works for NTFS, not for FAT32). Since the
method is mainly for C: drive "personal folders", the
normal NTFS use case is likely a high runner and works OK.
I don't know if a Junction could be used to "move" parts of
an install to a FAT32 D: drive for example, and then depending on
method, the changes to D: couldn't be tracked.

It's possible to erase the USN Change Journal with "fsutil".
I did it a couple times, in the belief "the USN is taking
15GB of space". It wasn't. The USN uses around 16MB, with
old entries presumably being purged. It's the "size" which
is bogus. The "size" only measures some kind of pointer.
But the displacement between the two ends of the USN,
is only 16MB or so. Things that consume Journal, have
to keep at it, as the Journal likely doesn't go back
to T=0. If a customer were to erase the USN change journal
after seeing it "taking 15GB of space" like I did, they
could end up with an extra File History backup being
run. And it wouldn't be de-duped as well as it could be.

I really wish Microsoft wrote "Arch Linux" quality pages
concerning tech like this. It would save people like
Todd from basically having to dump a set of questions,
that should have been documented methodically in the first place.

Popular websites mainly concentrate on "what buttons to push".
Occasionally, there aren't enough breadcrumbs about the
implementation, to make sound judgments about stuff like
this.

Some things are not backed up on purpose, by programs
like Macrium. The windows.edb of the Search Indexer is
not backed up (or should not be). I saw a blurb once
that warned "there would be slow Copy On Write if you
back up Windows.edb", and so an exclusion may be included
in backups. While this is not a disaster (it means the
CPU is going to grind for three hours regenerating
the file, after you do a restore), it's an example
of the "silent decisions" made by backup designers.
I always wondered why the damn thing was Indexing again
after a restore, and finally I got a breadcrumb about
a possible root cause.

I don't even know whether a commercial backup program,
can back up the contents of System Volume Information.
The folder (if you mount it and turn off permissions
while doing so), always seems to have the teeny-tiny
log files in it, but it never seems to have a gigabyte
sized shadow showing.

So again, the people at Arch Linux have us beat,
because a ton of stuff they use, is documented in
that level of detail. And you just know the poor
******* who writes such articles, has to beg and
plead for details (unless they actually wrote the
subsystem, and developers hardly ever write their
own documents like that :-/ ).

*******

Something else I saw while Googling File History,
was the notion that File History was "deprecated",
in favor of OneDrive ?

When I tested File History here, it seemed to be alive
and well, as near as I could determine. The notion that
"everyone approves of OneDrive", is of course, so much
hogwash. If I have the plans for the new
fusion interstellar spacecraft engine on my C: drive,
you can be damn sure I don't want the plans
stored in some "hackable" Cloud Storage. Not
everyone wants OneDrive.

I actually on purpose, selected an asymmetric ADSL
plan, so that it would be harder for software to
exfiltrate anything in a bulk manner. When Microsoft
hoovers up stuff from my Win10 setups, it is done
at low data rates, making it easier for me to notice
that such is going on. I am oh so sad, that my ADSL
setup is inconvenient for OneDrive or Skype video usage.
For only $2 a month more, I could have had close to
a symmetric VDSL setup instead. But I chose not
to do that, not for the $2, but for the exfiltration
issue. If we were back in the WinXP era, I would have
taken the VDSL offer instead, back in the era when
you could trust people.

Paul

VanguardLH wrote:
T wrote:

I have been reading up on Windows File History. I does
should like a nice application.

References:
https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/...8-file-history
https://www.lifewire.com/use-file-hi...ows-10-3891070

https://www.howtogeek.com/74623/how-...-in-windows-8/

Some questions:

1) are the files stored in native format or in incremental
fragments?

2) are the files readable with a standard file manager? In
other words, must it require Windows to read them. And does
it have to be THAT version of Windows that created them
to read them?

3) how far backwards will File History keep older revisions?

4) will File history use the entire backup drive and prune
as it gets full? Or will is complain when the drive fill up?

5) is there any performance hit that the user will recognize?

6) what will happen if the user disconnects the backup drive?

7) if you move the backup drive to a fresh install of Windows,
will the fresh install be able to recover them?

See my thread here titled "File History (Backup) - Not including
Documents folder".

I tried File History. There were problems, so it got discarded. When I
managed to get it working at its best, it still missed a file which, if
a critical file, you would not have a history backup from which to
restore. An issue to which no one responded was:

I'm still trying to figure out how File History can show you prior
versions after deleting a file. After all, normally you right-click
on an *existing* file to use Properties - Prior Versions to get at
the prior versions. So, how can you right-click on a non-existing
file, one that existed but got deleted?

There's a webpage that told me to work on the "folder"
that holds the deleted file. Restore the "folder"
to a previous date, and the file will come back.

That's their claim.

As to how practical that is ? ... How good is your memory
concerning the position of files ?

If "everything is on the backup drive", wouldn't
a search find it ? That might allow associating
a certain file with a containing folder, then go
over to the File History dialog and restore the
folder (if you do it through the interface, it'll
fix up the filename for you).

Paul

T wrote:
Hi All,

I have been reading up on Windows File History.

You're welcome to my pointer! :-(

I does
should like a nice application.

References:
https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/...8-file-history
https://www.lifewire.com/use-file-hi...ows-10-3891070

https://www.howtogeek.com/74623/how-...-in-windows-8/


Some questions:

1) are the files stored in native format or in incremental
fragments?

They are copies of the originals, with a time-stamp added in their
name, i.e 'file_name (2019_06_29 19_14_22 UTC).extension'.

2) are the files readable with a standard file manager? In
other words, must it require Windows to read them. And does
it have to be THAT version of Windows that created them
to read them?

Yes. Anything which can read the *filesystem* can read the files, so
if you have a Linux box with NTFS support, you can read the files
(assuming the filesystem is NTFS). No.

3) how far backwards will File History keep older revisions?

The default is 'Forever'. I hope that's long enough for you! :-)

4) will File history use the entire backup drive and prune
as it gets full? Or will is complain when the drive fill up?

Don't know. There's no setting for that and it hasn't happened to me.

5) is there any performance hit that the user will recognize?

I never noticed anything. You can adjust the interval (from 10 minutes
to daily), so if you've many changes in a short time, you may want to
select a short interval.

6) what will happen if the user disconnects the backup drive?

File History will be using its offline cache (default 5% of disk
space). As soon as the backup disk is re-connected, the cache will be written to it.

7) if you move the backup drive to a fresh install of Windows,
will the fresh install be able to recover them?

Maybe/probably not via File History's normal restore mechanism
('Restore personal files'), but since they're normal files, you can
always restore them, albeit perhaps with a little more effort. At worst
it will be as easy/difficult as restoring a Cobian Backup backup.

N.B. You could have found out nearly all - if not all - of this, by
just trying it. After all, this is part of Windows 8/10, so you don't
have to download or install anything.

Many thanks,
-T

You're welcome.

VanguardLH wrote:
[...]

I'm still trying to figure out how File History can show you prior
versions after deleting a file. After all, normally you right-click
on an *existing* file to use Properties - Prior Versions to get at
the prior versions. So, how can you right-click on a non-existing
file, one that existed but got deleted?

(At least in Windows 8.1,) File History also has a user interface in
the Control Panel. Its 'Restore personal files' part gives you a kind of
file manager which shows you what's available for restore. I assume
there you will see the prior versions of a deleted file.

The ease-of-use using a property sheet on file (which is not possible)
is lost after deleting a file. The user has to dig into the File
History cache to find saved copies of a deleted file.

No that's not needed. See above.

[...]

I did not test if removing a drive
(from File History before physically removing it) would offer an option
to copy the old versioned files from one drive to another.

AFAIR, it does offer that option, but it's too long ago to be a 100%
sure.

https://www.tenforums.com/tutorials/...dows-10-a.html

File History showed up in Windows 8. Microsoft dropped it in Windows 10
Fall Creators update (insider edition), but decided to keep it. I
wouldn't trust that Microsoft intends to keep it, so you could be
wasting your time to implement File History. See:

https://www.windowscentral.com/micro...reators-update

I suspect Microsoft has been scurrying to fix other more major problems,
and simply hasn't gotten around to disabling the feature.

I realize that we're talking about Microsoft here, so anything could
happen, but I think if they disable File History, they will add some
other kind of backup mechanism. Otherwise it would be the first Windows
version since XP (or earlier?) that does not have some kind of backup
mechanism. But heh, I'm gullible! :-)

Paul wrote:

VanguardLH wrote:
T wrote:

I have been reading up on Windows File History. I does
should like a nice application.

References:
https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/...8-file-history
https://www.lifewire.com/use-file-hi...ows-10-3891070

https://www.howtogeek.com/74623/how-...-in-windows-8/

Some questions:

1) are the files stored in native format or in incremental
fragments?

2) are the files readable with a standard file manager? In
other words, must it require Windows to read them. And does
it have to be THAT version of Windows that created them
to read them?

3) how far backwards will File History keep older revisions?

4) will File history use the entire backup drive and prune
as it gets full? Or will is complain when the drive fill up?

5) is there any performance hit that the user will recognize?

6) what will happen if the user disconnects the backup drive?

7) if you move the backup drive to a fresh install of Windows,
will the fresh install be able to recover them?

See my thread here titled "File History (Backup) - Not including
Documents folder".

I tried File History. There were problems, so it got discarded. When I
managed to get it working at its best, it still missed a file which, if
a critical file, you would not have a history backup from which to
restore. An issue to which no one responded was:

I'm still trying to figure out how File History can show you prior
versions after deleting a file. After all, normally you right-click
on an *existing* file to use Properties - Prior Versions to get at
the prior versions. So, how can you right-click on a non-existing
file, one that existed but got deleted?

There's a webpage that told me to work on the "folder"
that holds the deleted file. Restore the "folder"
to a previous date, and the file will come back.

And if you deleted the folder (to delete the file)? If the folder still
existed, I would think restoring it would revert all files back to the
folder's versioned backup. Something you just worked on would get
obliterated. File History is a scheduled backup, not an on-access or
real-time file versioning system that catches files immediately after
change. Just doesn't seem File History is geared to restoring deleted
files, only restoring (copying back) over an existing file.

As to how practical that is ? ... How good is your memory
concerning the position of files ?

Yeah, I delete a file and then have to remember where it was when I
deleted it. What did you have for lunch 3 days ago?

If "everything is on the backup drive", wouldn't
a search find it?

Might work if Windows' search didn't exclude the location. Same for
Search Everything: you'd need to ensure it was scanning the File
History's cache folder. If those are scanning that folder, and you
remember the filename, yep, searching would work. The old files are not
compressed to put into a database, but are copied as just copies of the
source file.

Alas, even with using searching on the File History cache folder(s)
(note the plural hint because you can extend File History's cache across
multiple drives, so you'd have multiple locations to search), I ran into
File History not copying all the source files into its cache folder.
The missing file wasn't hidden, a system file, nor anything special and
it was not inuse at the time (not locked). It was in the Documents
folder that File History was configured to scan. Out of 294 files in
the Documents folder (many in subfolders), 1 was missed by File History
(a .pdf file). Doesn't sound like a big miss, but it would be if that
file were very important or critical. 2 image files were missed by File
History in the Pictures folder. What if those were copies of a deceased
relative's driver license and social security card (that you scanned but
someone else is holding) when the executor of someone's estate? I
suppose I could use File History to capture a version of most files (but
mostly backing up is not reliably backing up) and continue using my
Macrium backups to make sure ALL files got saved (in each file backup
job, so I'd have versioning that way). I decided it wasn't worth the
headaches when restoring to bother using File History. Every backup
program I've used (Easeus, Macrium, Paragon, Acronis, Aomei) have been
reliable (well, I've never found missing files in their backups or
restores). 3 files missing in my first trial of File History. How much
worse after using it for awhile?

Frank Slootweg wrote:

I realize that we're talking about Microsoft here, so anything could
happen, but I think if they disable File History, they will add some
other kind of backup mechanism.

That's why I mentioned OneDrive which Microsoft is pushing for personal
use and business use (mostly to use Sharepoint). They can sell
additional storage space on OneDrive. Only 15 GB comes with a new
OneDrive account, and that's not very big considering how much data
users want to backup. They know that and depend on that, so they can
sell more storage space. You get a lot more (1 TB) with an Office 365
subscription, but then Microsoft is making money on the subscription.
The client is a giveaway. They're making no money with their local
backup clients. OneDrive is a lu try it, rely on it, run out of
space, buy more space.

https://techcommunity.microsoft.com/...19/ba-p/616047
05-21-2019
"OneDrive is the files app for Microsoft 365"

https://mspoweruser.com/latest-micro...push-onedrive/
Jan 25, 2019
"A coming update to the Office 365 suite of applications will make it
pretty _difficult to *avoid* storing your documents_ into [OneDrive]."

Microsoft is shifting to cloud storage for backups. They can money from
that. That's how lureware works: put out the bait and wait for a bite
to get more, and then bite back.



That's one subscription-ware pushing another subscription-service.

Frank Slootweg wrote:

T wrote:
Hi All,

I have been reading up on Windows File History.

You're welcome to my pointer! :-(

I does
should like a nice application.

References:
https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/...8-file-history
https://www.lifewire.com/use-file-hi...ows-10-3891070

https://www.howtogeek.com/74623/how-...-in-windows-8/

Some questions:

1) are the files stored in native format or in incremental
fragments?

They are copies of the originals, with a time-stamp added in their
name, i.e 'file_name (2019_06_29 19_14_22 UTC).extension'.

2) are the files readable with a standard file manager? In
other words, must it require Windows to read them. And does
it have to be THAT version of Windows that created them
to read them?

Yes. Anything which can read the *filesystem* can read the files, so
if you have a Linux box with NTFS support, you can read the files
(assuming the filesystem is NTFS). No.

3) how far backwards will File History keep older revisions?

The default is 'Forever'. I hope that's long enough for you! :-)

4) will File history use the entire backup drive and prune
as it gets full? Or will is complain when the drive fill up?

Don't know. There's no setting for that and it hasn't happened to me.

5) is there any performance hit that the user will recognize?

I never noticed anything. You can adjust the interval (from 10 minutes
to daily), so if you've many changes in a short time, you may want to
select a short interval.

6) what will happen if the user disconnects the backup drive?

File History will be using its offline cache (default 5% of disk
space). As soon as the backup disk is re-connected, the cache will be written to it.

7) if you move the backup drive to a fresh install of Windows,
will the fresh install be able to recover them?

Maybe/probably not via File History's normal restore mechanism
('Restore personal files'), but since they're normal files, you can
always restore them, albeit perhaps with a little more effort. At worst
it will be as easy/difficult as restoring a Cobian Backup backup.

N.B. You could have found out nearly all - if not all - of this, by
just trying it. After all, this is part of Windows 8/10, so you don't
have to download or install anything.

I just had a thought: will restoring a file also include its NTFS
permissions. If anyone can restore from File History, other users in
different Windows accounts could read files created under other Windows
accounts.

I would think if NTFS was used on the source that NTFS would must used
on the File History drive. When you configure File History to add a
drive, I would expect it to convert the drive to NTFS. Alas, that
doesn't seem to be the case. A search on "windows file history fat32"
shows users are using FAT32 drives, like USB flash drives, as part of
the File History cache. Forget about NTFS permissions if the File
History drive uses FAT32. It's not just permissions that are carried in
the NTFS file attributes (http://www.ntfs.com/ntfs-files-types.htm).

On 6/29/19 2:15 PM, Frank Slootweg wrote:
VanguardLH wrote:
[...]

snip

I realize that we're talking about Microsoft here, so anything could
happen, but I think if they disable File History, they will add some
other kind of backup mechanism. Otherwise it would be the first Windows
version since XP (or earlier?) that does not have some kind of backup
mechanism. But heh, I'm gullible! :-)

My install of 1903... Open the Control Panel, the good old Windows 7
Backup and Restore is still there.

FYI, if you click search icon in W10, for Backup and Restore, W10 will
not find it. This works in Windows 7.



--
Ken
MacOS 10.14.5
Firefox 67.0.4
Thunderbird 60.7
"My brain is like lightning, a quick flash
and it's gone!"

As a general rule... All Microsoft utilities are useless.

John Doe wrote:
As a general rule... All Microsoft utilities are useless.

They're designed so that they do not "eat the lunch"
of Microsoft Partners.

Notice, that when Disk Management gained "shrink and expand"
functions, all the Partition Manager products started
"giving away for free, shrink and expand". And that's
the nature of competing with Microsoft.

Paul

VanguardLH wrote:
[...]
And if you deleted the folder (to delete the file)? If the folder still
existed, I would think restoring it would revert all files back to the
folder's versioned backup. Something you just worked on would get
obliterated. File History is a scheduled backup, not an on-access or
real-time file versioning system that catches files immediately after
change. Just doesn't seem File History is geared to restoring deleted
files, only restoring (copying back) over an existing file.

I just did a test and the Control Panel's 'Restore personal files'
file manager UI, *does* show the deleted file.

As to how practical that is ? ... How good is your memory
concerning the position of files ?

Yeah, I delete a file and then have to remember where it was when I
deleted it. What did you have for lunch 3 days ago?

That is indeed still a concern.

[...]

Alas, even with using searching on the File History cache folder(s)
(note the plural hint because you can extend File History's cache across
multiple drives, so you'd have multiple locations to search), I ran into
File History not copying all the source files into its cache folder.
The missing file wasn't hidden, a system file, nor anything special and
it was not inuse at the time (not locked). It was in the Documents
folder that File History was configured to scan. Out of 294 files in
the Documents folder (many in subfolders), 1 was missed by File History
(a .pdf file). Doesn't sound like a big miss, but it would be if that
file were very important or critical. 2 image files were missed by File
History in the Pictures folder. What if those were copies of a deceased
relative's driver license and social security card (that you scanned but
someone else is holding) when the executor of someone's estate? I
suppose I could use File History to capture a version of most files (but
mostly backing up is not reliably backing up) and continue using my
Macrium backups to make sure ALL files got saved (in each file backup
job, so I'd have versioning that way). I decided it wasn't worth the
headaches when restoring to bother using File History. Every backup
program I've used (Easeus, Macrium, Paragon, Acronis, Aomei) have been
reliable (well, I've never found missing files in their backups or
restores). 3 files missing in my first trial of File History. How much
worse after using it for awhile?

Fully agreed. I would never use File History as a 'real'/only backup
mechanism. I only use it in addition to other mechanisms (Cobian Backup
for file level backup and Macrium Reflect for image backup), because
it's there, is easy to setup and works behind the curtains (to my NAS).

Ken Springer wrote:
On 6/29/19 2:15 PM, Frank Slootweg wrote:
VanguardLH wrote:
[...]

snip

I realize that we're talking about Microsoft here, so anything could
happen, but I think if they disable File History, they will add some
other kind of backup mechanism. Otherwise it would be the first Windows
version since XP (or earlier?) that does not have some kind of backup
mechanism. But heh, I'm gullible! :-)

My install of 1903... Open the Control Panel, the good old Windows 7
Backup and Restore is still there.

My Windows 8.1 only has File History, no other kind of backup
mechanism. That maybe because it's just 'Windows 8.1', i.e. no Premium
or whatever.

FYI, if you click search icon in W10, for Backup and Restore, W10 will
not find it. This works in Windows 7.