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Best Browser for WinXP?
Hi,
I currently use FF52.8 on one of my XP PCs. Also have Chrome 49 on that same PC. I was unable to log into my Lowe's account using FF, but was able to log in using Chrome. At www.pepboys.com site, I tried to search (pep boys search slot) for a specific item using FF, but no response when I clicked on the search icon. I was able to get a response using Chrome. I like FF more than Chrome because I turned off Remember History. Also, I can specify a blank page when I launch FF. I was unable to find these options with Chrome. What do you consider to be the best browser for WinXP? Thank You in advance, John |
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#2
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Best Browser for WinXP?
jaugustine wrote:
I currently use FF52.8 on one of my XP PCs. Also have Chrome 49 on that same PC. I was unable to log into my Lowe's account using FF, but was able to log in using Chrome. At www.pepboys.com site, I tried to search (pep boys search slot) for a specific item using FF, but no response when I clicked on the search icon. I was able to get a response using Chrome. Start the web browser in its safe mode. Could be you installed an add-on into the web browser, like adblocking, that is modifying the page content (adblockers are supposed to break web pages to eliminate the blocked content). |
#3
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Best Browser for WinXP?
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#4
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Best Browser for WinXP?
J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
jaugustine WROTE: I like FF more than Chrome because I turned off Remember History. Also, I can specify a blank page when I launch FF. I was unable to find these options with Chrome. Unbelievably, Chrome doesn't offer that option. There is an extension - called, perhaps unsurprisingly, "Blank New Tab Page" that gives it to you (though it actually loads a blank page rather than no page, so it [a] appears in the history [b] takes a short but non-zero time). At one time, there was a setting of what URL to load for a new tab, like using about:blank. Google took that away, so users had to resort to add-ons to programmatically control the new-tab page. For that I use the "New Tab Override" add-on. Firefox used to let you configure the new-tab page (what it would load). Then it disappeared and users had to discover the gear icon at the top right of the new-tab "top sites" page Mozilla then foisted on its users. Now they're assisting sites with tracking your most-recently-visited site (because those tiles connect back to those sites when you load a new tab). Instead of installing an add-on, I customized the content or maybe changed something in about:config. I think Mozilla gave up on trying to push users around and now has a blank new-tab page. Hard to tell because Mozilla keeps adding **** that I have to figure out how to disable or workaround. For cleaning, there is the Click&Clean add-on for Google Chrome. Google changed how add-ons can run. No longer could then run when shutting exiting Chrome - unless you configure Chrome to allow add-ons to continue running after Chrome exits (not a good idea). So, instead Click&Clean will do cleanup when it loads which is when Chrome loads. That is, instead of cleaning on exit, it cleans on load. Click&Clean is adware, so I didn't keep it. Instead I just run CCleaner using a shortcut in a toolbar in the Windows taskbar that runs "ccleaner /auto", and I schedule it to run in Task Scheduler, too. Users have been wailing ever since Google Chrome showed up to have an option to bring new tabs to the front; i.e., to give them focus when they load. Never happened, so I use the "Tabs to the Front" add-on. Google took away navigating backwards with the Backspace key. So I had to install the "Go Back With Backspace" add-on. Firefox will let me disable WebRTC (media.peerconnection.enabled = False) to avoid some site peaking inside my intranet to get at the IP address of my PC. It is a rather brute force method that will break WebRTC used anywhere. Yep, in Google, an add-on is required. I use WebRTC Leak Prevent which is more elegant as to what gets blocked. Go to ipleak.net to see if your web browser exposes your local IP address of the host on which you run the web browser. By they time you get Google Chrome to have all the inbuilt functions available in Firefox, you've installed over half a dozen add-ons into Chrome. Google really isn't interest in the security and privacy of their users. They will add features to support what web sites want. Alas, Mozilla went that way, too. |
#5
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Best Browser for WinXP?
On 29 Jun 2018, "J. P. Gilliver (John)" wrote
in microsoft.public.windowsxp.general: Unbelievably, Chrome doesn't offer that option. There is an extension - called, perhaps unsurprisingly, "Blank New Tab Page" that gives it to you (though it actually loads a blank page rather than no page, so it [a] appears in the history [b] takes a short but non-zero time). Can you not create your own local blank page and tell Chrome to make it your home page? |
#6
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Best Browser for WinXP?
Nil wrote:
J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote: Unbelievably, Chrome doesn't offer that option. There is an extension - called, perhaps unsurprisingly, "Blank New Tab Page" that gives it to you (though it actually loads a blank page rather than no page, so it [a] appears in the history [b] takes a short but non-zero time). Can you not create your own local blank page and tell Chrome to make it your home page? You're going to install a web server on one of your hosts just so you can open a blank home page? Besides, opening to a blank home page is not the problem being discussed. Google Chrome DOES let you specify about:blank as your home page. That's how I configure the home page in every web browser, including Google Chrome. It's the *new tab* page being discussed. about:blank in Google Chrome will load a blank document (web page) but also populates the address bar with "about:blank". You have to erase the address bar before you can start entering the URL to where you intend to visit. While Google Chrome already has a home page setting, its handling of about:blank becomes a nuisance regarding the address bar. An add-on that overrides all new tabs will force a blank document load while not polluting the address bar. Back to the topic of a blank *new tab*, in Google Chrome's settings there is no longer an option of where to connect a new tab. Google took that setting away. Going through all the work to setup a local web server to deliver a blank document won't work because you cannot configure Chrome to go there when a new tab is loaded. Users are now forced to use an add-on to programmatically choose to where a new tab connects. For first or initial new tab (home page), use about:blank -- and then clear the address bar to enter a URL. For subsequent new tabs, use an add-on since Google removed the setting. If the add-on also works on the initial new tab tab, you don't have to erase "about:blank" from the address bar before you enter the URL for where you want to visit. Some new tab add-ons do nothing more than direct a new tab to about:blank. In many web browsers, that is okay. In Chrome, you get a blank document and a polluted address bar. Pick a new tab add-on that loads a blank document and doesn't populate the address bar. |
#7
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Best Browser for WinXP?
VanguardLH wrote:
Nil wrote: J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote: Unbelievably, Chrome doesn't offer that option. There is an extension - called, perhaps unsurprisingly, "Blank New Tab Page" that gives it to you (though it actually loads a blank page rather than no page, so it [a] appears in the history [b] takes a short but non-zero time). Can you not create your own local blank page and tell Chrome to make it your home page? You're going to install a web server on one of your hosts just so you can open a blank home page? Would a file:/// type item work ? You might not need a web server, if it accepts a variety of URI formulations. Other example URIs (not related to this discussion) would be ftp:// and gopher:// . Your browser may or may not accept all the old URIs back to the dawn of time. If you want another formulation: chrome://flags If you type "chrome" into the chrome URL bar, the auto-hint will provide around four lines intended to bootstrap you into the chrome: URI space. So you don't have to look them up. Paul |
#8
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Best Browser for WinXP?
On 29 Jun 2018, VanguardLH wrote in
microsoft.public.windowsxp.general: You're going to install a web server on one of your hosts just so you can open a blank home page? Every browser I've ever seen will display a page on the local file system. No web server needed. "file:" is a valid protocol I believe. about:blank in Google Chrome will load a blank document (web page) but also populates the address bar with "about:blank". You have to erase the address bar before you can start entering the URL to where you intend to visit. I always go to the address bar with Ctrl-L, which selects the existing URL and disappears when you start typing. I rarely use the mouse for that, but even then the URL is selected unless you fumble. |
#9
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Best Browser for WinXP?
Paul wrote:
VanguardLH wrote: Nil wrote: J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote: Unbelievably, Chrome doesn't offer that option. There is an extension - called, perhaps unsurprisingly, "Blank New Tab Page" that gives it to you (though it actually loads a blank page rather than no page, so it [a] appears in the history [b] takes a short but non-zero time). Can you not create your own local blank page and tell Chrome to make it your home page? You're going to install a web server on one of your hosts just so you can open a blank home page? Would a file:/// type item work ? Sure -- but where are you going to configure Google Chrome to load that document when opening a new tab? Also, as noted about the problem of using about:blank polluting the address bar, using file: means that URI will be listed in the address bar and you have to erase it before you can enter the URL that you actually intended to visit. chrome://flags If you type "chrome" into the chrome URL bar, the auto-hint will provide around four lines intended to bootstrap you into the chrome: URI space. So you don't have to look them up. Usually I just enter chrome://about (or chrome:about since an internal resource doesn't require the double slashes). "chrome" wants to suggest "chrome://chrome-urls" but I get the same with chrome://about. |
#10
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Best Browser for WinXP?
Nil wrote:
VanguardLH wrote: You're going to install a web server on one of your hosts just so you can open a blank home page? Every browser I've ever seen will display a page on the local file system. No web server needed. "file:" is a valid protocol I believe. Yep, didn't think about that. Of course, you didn't say how the document was delivered. The problem with using file:// is that it will display in the address bar. The point of a blank page is to NOT load anything, so you can immediately go somewhere you specify; however, you'll have to erase the address bar of the filespec before you can enter where you really intended to go. Since Google Chrome still lets you configure what document to load for the home page (initial tab), no need to point at a file to load an empty document. Just configure home page to about:blank. Chrome will pollute the address bar with "about:blank" (as it would if you used file://) but your Ctrl+L hotkey nullifies that nuisance. In contrast, other web browsers, like Firefox, load a blank document but NOT pollute the address bar with "about:blank". No idea why Google thinks they need to show the URI of an internal resource in their address bar. Maybe they're being consistent, like chrome://flags and chrome://about showing the URI in the address bar. With file://, you are relying on an external resource to load a blank document. It works but I prefer to reduce external dependencies. You mentioned home page but you can already use about:blank for that. The OP was asking about new tabs, and Chrome no longer has a setting for what new tabs should load. That has to be done programmatically now. Chrome doesn't even have the advanced configuration (about:config) of Firefox where you can dig to find options not presented in the configuration GUI page (aboutreferences). I've found Firefox to be far more configurable than Chrome; however, Mozilla was creating such a highly moving target with their change in behaviors and technologies in Firefox that I moved to Chrome (which required several add-ons to get built-in features in Firefox). I'm leaning to going back to Firefox. I don't like having to delve into about:config to find all the settings but, at least, there are more in-depth settings available. In Firefox, I can change a setting in about:config to disable WebRTC. No such setting in Chrome (and Google removed the chrome:flag that let you disable WebRTC). Yet is it a brute force method. The WebRTC Leak Prevent add-on is a more elegant approach along with being configurable. With WebRTC disabled en masse in Firefox, I cannot use it to go to Google Voice (hangs after login because it is a WebRTC app). With the add-on in Chrome, ipleak.net still reports Chrome has not divulged my hosts intranet (local) IP address but Google Voice still works. I have WebRTC disabled in both web browsers which means I can use Google Voice in Chrome but not in Firefox. Google has its advantages, though, over Firefox and why I continue to use it. For example, Google came out with the Spectre mitigating Retpoline API to which webclients can use (after recompiling them) and incorporated it into Chrome. Mozilla's compromise was to enable further isolation between firefox.exe instances by enabling privacy.firstparty.isolate = true, and to slow down the return from functions to avoid the timing attack (which required recoding and recompiling of Firefox). I liked Google's Retpoline solution much better and dodges the performance hit. Disabling Javascript is another choice but has become no longer a viable option since way too many sites nowadays rely on dynamic web pages to determine what content gets delivered to you. Google has had time to tweak their multi-process Chrome. Mozilla is new to this and their default is conservative (and figuring out to further tweak it takes a while to test). Mozilla changed their extension support in v57 which killed a lot of old extensions. They changed their chrome. They changed their engine. I've forgotten all the other changes they've made in the last year, some of which were unwanted (by me). I grew weary of the high rate of changes and went to Chrome. I do like having more internal settings to lockdown Firefox rather than using add-ons in Chrome but you can stand a square tire for only so long. about:blank in Google Chrome will load a blank document (web page) but also populates the address bar with "about:blank". You have to erase the address bar before you can start entering the URL to where you intend to visit. I always go to the address bar with Ctrl-L, which selects the existing URL and disappears when you start typing. I rarely use the mouse for that, but even then the URL is selected unless you fumble. That's a workaround. It works as you describe. Thanks for the hotkey. It is rare when I load the web browser to a blank document (whether that be about:blank or an add-on loading a blank document. Typically I am clicking on a URL (aka hyperlink), selecting one from a shortcut or bookmark, or entering a URL in an address bar (Explorer, taskbar's address bar, etc). While I have the home page set to about:blank, it is rare that I load the web browser and then decide to go elsewhere. I have already decided where I'm going before I load the web browser. Mostly I configure about:blank as the home page to thwart any of that crap Mozilla or Google want to shove at me, and why I also don't like their choices for the default document for the home page (initial tab) or for subsequent new tabs. |
#11
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logging in to YouTube (Google)
In message , VanguardLH
writes: [] hosts intranet (local) IP address but Google Voice still works. I have WebRTC disabled in both web browsers which means I can use Google Voice in Chrome but not in Firefox. Google has its advantages, though, over Firefox and why I continue to use it. For example, Google came out with the Spectre mitigating [] I can log in to YouTube (now Google generally, but I had a YouTube login before the takeover, if that's relevant) with my old Firefox 27, but not my up-to-date Chrome. (This is on a Windows-7/32-with-Classic-Shell machine, if that's relevant.) When I click SIGN IN from a YouTube page, I get: Sign in Continue to YouTube ___Email or phone___ Forgot email? Not your computer? Use Guest mode to sign in privately. Create account NEXT , where "Email or phone" is a line I can type on, Forgot and Create are links, and NEXT is a button. If I type my email into the relevant line and either press enter or click NEXT, nothing happens. (Well, the NEXT button darkens briefly, so the click is registered.) If I click Forgot or Create, again they darken briefly which shows the click has been registered, but nothing else happens. I _don't_ get any error message of _any_ sort - not even "you are already logged in"; I've even tried logging out via Firefox in case that _was_ the problem, and it didn't make any difference. I wondered if it was due to some entry in my hosts file that is causing the problem, but surely that would prevent me from being able to log back in via Firefox 27, which I _can_ do. FWIW, the sign-in page in Firefox 27 looks different: Sign in to continue to YouTube [picture of me] [my email] Password box Sign in button It's obviously using cookies or something as it knows it's me and displays my picture and email. But, if I type my password and press enter, it logs me in. (The email I'm trying, in Chrome, is the same one as is pre-filled for me in Forefox 27.) Obviously, my concern is that eventually, they'll break their system so that I can't log in at all with Firefox 27 - plus, various aspects of YouTube don't work properly with it anyway (but do with up-to-date Chrome). OK, some people have strong objections to logging in to YouTube (and thus Google) anyway, but that's outside the scope of this puzzle. (I mainly use it for adding comments in YouTube.) I have far fewer - only six! - addons to Chrome; the only one that could conceivably have any effect is their own "Google Analytics Opt-out Add-on (by Google)"; it would have been ironic if that was the cause, but I've just tried unticking it, and no change. And I don't think I've disabled scripting or whatever - I can login to and use, for example, ebay, and many other sites. Any suggestions? [Unhelpful ones, such as "stop logging in to YouTube", will of course be ignored (-:!] -- J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf Reality television. It's eroding the ability of good scripted television to survive. - Patrick Duffy in Radio Times 2-8 February 2013 |
#12
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logging in to YouTube (Google)
"J. P. Gilliver (John)" wrote
| Any suggestions? [Unhelpful ones, such as "stop logging in to YouTube", | will of course be ignored (-:!] You can lead a horse to water..... I wonder if it could be two different server functions. You mention a password for FF but email/phone for Chrome. My guess would be that the page FF goes to is sending the password to one server/script while the Chrome page sends email/phone to a different server/ script -- and that your account is not updated for the new system. But then you mention the Chrome page not working at all. In that case I'd look for 3rd-party script being blocked. Do you have NoScript? That can easily tell you what external script/cookies links are being used, which you could compare to your HOSTS file. I think uMatrix can also tell you that. Since the two pages you get perform different tasks, it can't be assumed they're the same. They're either different URLs or Youtube is checking the userAgent on load and customizing the page. |
#13
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logging in to YouTube (Google)
In message , Mayayana
writes: "J. P. Gilliver (John)" wrote | Any suggestions? [Unhelpful ones, such as "stop logging in to YouTube", | will of course be ignored (-:!] You can lead a horse to water..... I wonder if it could be two different server functions. You mention a password for FF but email/phone for Chrome. My guess would be that the page FF goes to FF used email as well, but had pre-filled it in for me. I've just "opened a private window" in FF, and gone to YouTube - the Sign in button has appeared, so it's not reading cookies or whatever (doesn't know I'm already logged in). I click it - it goes to https://accounts.google.com/ServiceL...ttps%3A%2F%2Fw ww.youtube.com%2Fsignin%3Fhl%3Den-GB%26app%3Ddesktop%26next%3D%252Fsuppor ted_browsers%253Fnext_url%253D%25252F%26action_han dle_signin%3Dtrue%26fea ture%3Dsign_in_button&service=youtube&passive=true &hl=en-GB#identifier, which now shows an "Email or phone" box and a Next button. Entering my email, so going to the subsequent page that has a password box, results in a successful login. (Despite lots of warnings that the browser is no longer supported!) is sending the password to one server/script while the Chrome page sends email/phone to a different server/ script -- and that your account is not updated for the new system. When I click SIGN IN in Chrome from a YouTube page, it goes to https://accounts.google.com/signin/v...ue&hl=en-GB&ui lel=3&continue=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fsig nin%3Fnext%3D%252F%26ac tion_handle_signin%3Dtrue%26hl%3Den-GB%26app%3Ddesktop&service=youtube&fl owName=GlifWebSignIn&flowEntry=ServiceLogin, which has the page I described before - an "Email or phone" box and a NEXT button, along with a few other things. But then you mention the Chrome page not working at all. In that case I'd look for 3rd-party script being When I say it doesn't work at all, I mean nothing happens, apart from a brief flash of different colour of the button or link when I activate them. It isn't replaced by another page, what's in the address bar doesn't change - nothing moves. blocked. Do you have NoScript? That can easily tell you what external script/cookies links are being used, which you could compare to your HOSTS file. I think uMatrix can also tell you that. The only extras I have in Chrome a Blank New Tab Page Easy! Show Title Plus EditThisCookie Google Analytics Opt-out Add-on (by Google) Show Title Tag Video DownloadHelper [not enabled] (Chrome is not my _default_ browser). I can't see _any_ of those blocking scripts (apart from the Analytics Opt-out, but I tried disabling that and it made no difference). Since the two pages you get perform different tasks, it can't be assumed they're the same. They're either different URLs or Youtube is checking the userAgent on load and customizing the page. I assume the latter. They certainly _look_ (now that I've invoked the Private Browsing function in Firefox 27) as if they perform the _same_ function, i. e. logging me in by prompting for email. -- J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf Radio 4 is one of the reasons being British is good. It's not a subset of Britain - it's almost as if Britain is a subset of Radio 4. - Stephen Fry, in Radio Times, 7-13 June, 2003. |
#14
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logging in to YouTube (Google)
"J. P. Gilliver (John)" wrote
FF used email as well, but had pre-filled it in for me. That's probably FF remembering form fields, rather than a cookie. I don't know what to make of all that, but it does seem like you're getting different scripts. The two URLs are different. They then each load the same URL, but with different parameters. The basic differences are like so: next=/supported_browsers next_url=/ feature=sign_in_button passive=true next=/ flowName=GlifWebSignIn flowEntry=ServiceLogin There's no explanation for that based on simply using different browsers. But Google webpages are extremely complex, with a lot of script. It's hard to know what they might be doing. It could also be a bug on their end. I wonder what would happen if you enter the FF URL into Chrome. |
#15
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logging in to YouTube (Google)
J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
snipped the quoting of my prior reply - doesn't seem relevant this should have been a new thread instead of hijacking another I can log in to YouTube (now Google generally, but I had a YouTube login before the takeover, if that's relevant) with my old Firefox 27, but not my up-to-date Chrome. (This is on a Windows-7/32-with-Classic-Shell machine, if that's relevant.) When I click SIGN IN from a YouTube page, I get: Sign in Continue to YouTube ___Email or phone___ Forgot email? Not your computer? Use Guest mode to sign in privately. Create account NEXT , where "Email or phone" is a line I can type on, Forgot and Create are links, and NEXT is a button. If I type my email into the relevant line and either press enter or click NEXT, nothing happens. (Well, the NEXT button darkens briefly, so the click is registered.) If I click Forgot or Create, again they darken briefly which shows the click has been registered, but nothing else happens. I _don't_ get any error message of _any_ sort - not even "you are already logged in"; I've even tried logging out via Firefox in case that _was_ the problem, and it didn't make any difference. I wondered if it was due to some entry in my hosts file that is causing the problem, but surely that would prevent me from being able to log back in via Firefox 27, which I _can_ do. FWIW, the sign-in page in Firefox 27 looks different: Sign in to continue to YouTube [picture of me] [my email] Password box Sign in button It's obviously using cookies or something as it knows it's me and displays my picture and email. But, if I type my password and press enter, it logs me in. (The email I'm trying, in Chrome, is the same one as is pre-filled for me in Forefox 27.) Obviously, my concern is that eventually, they'll break their system so that I can't log in at all with Firefox 27 - plus, various aspects of YouTube don't work properly with it anyway (but do with up-to-date Chrome). OK, some people have strong objections to logging in to YouTube (and thus Google) anyway, but that's outside the scope of this puzzle. (I mainly use it for adding comments in YouTube.) I have far fewer - only six! - addons to Chrome; the only one that could conceivably have any effect is their own "Google Analytics Opt-out Add-on (by Google)"; it would have been ironic if that was the cause, but I've just tried unticking it, and no change. And I don't think I've disabled scripting or whatever - I can login to and use, for example, ebay, and many other sites. Have you tried the following? - Try incognito mode. From a current instance of Chrome, use incognito mode which opens a new window, or use the --incognito command-line switch. - Exit the web browser and use Task Manager to ensure there are no remnant instances of the web browser process(es). Then load Chrome in with any extensions (use the --disable-extensions command-line switch) and retest. - Disable all security software (anti-virus/malware, 3rd party firewall, URL filtering, privacy software, etc), exit Chrome, load it again, and retest. - Boot into Windows' safe mode with networking to ensure no startup programs are interfering with Chrome, and retest. - Check that Chrome is NOT using a proxy (that you told it to use, a VPN changed, or malware altered): Settings - Advanced - System - Open proxy settings). Looks like Chrome uses the proxy settings in the OS, so I would think Firefox would also be affected; however, Firefox presents its own proxy settings dialog instead of opening the one from the OS. I don't know if Firefox is merely presenting its own dialog that duplicates the OS dialog or if Firefox uses its own independent proxy settings. Firefox tends to use internal functionality rather than rely on platform-dependent functionality; e.g., Firefox has its on internal certificate manager instead of using the OS' cert manager (certmgr.msc), so a web browser using the global cert store from the OS might work but not Firefox which is missing a cert. - Firefox lets you do a reset. That creates a new profile. Chrome lets you do the same using chrome://settings/resetProfileSettings (or go to Settings - Advanced - Reset and cleanup - Restore settings to their original defaults - Reset settings). - A reset in Firefox creates a new profile, or you can do it manually through Firefox's Profile Manager. Chrome has profiles, too. Go to Settings - People - Manage other people. You can add and remove users, so create a new user and test using that profile. See: https://www.howtogeek.com/255653/how...mac-and-linux/ - Under settings - Advanced - System, try disabling hardware acceleration. Doesn't seem Youtube should use it just to deliver streaming video but then maybe they do. GPU acceleration relies on support from the video driver but too often the interface between the web browser and driver doesn't work correctly. |
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