170 important updates available

Wow, I just held the cursor over the Update icon in the systray and up
poppeed a screen that said 170 important updates available

11 optional update available.

And this after I just installed some. (I know from experience it does
this in tiers)

Anything other than installing them all that I should do?

Thanks


This is what happens when someone either lets a win7 laptop sit for
months or upgrades from Vista and doesn't do the updates.

micky wrote:
Wow, I just held the cursor over the Update icon in the systray and up
poppeed a screen that said 170 important updates available

11 optional update available.

And this after I just installed some. (I know from experience it does
this in tiers)

Anything other than installing them all that I should do?

Thanks


This is what happens when someone either lets a win7 laptop sit for
months or upgrades from Vista and doesn't do the updates.

It depends on what your objectives are.

Are you picky about your updates, and don't want Microsoft
to have its own way ?

If you don't care about a single thing, just
install all 170 of them. It could take two hours,
it could take all day.

You can go through the optional ones later, and
select the ones you want. Maybe you don't
want the time zone change for Somalia for example :-)
There's all sorts of stuff of minimal interest in
the Optional list.

*******

You can use the URL generator tool here, which uses
the wsusscn2 file from the Microsoft server to work
out the update set. It will download all the updates
from the Microsoft server, onto your machine. The
files come straight from Microsoft, and not off
this server. It will also download files you don't
actually need, and might do 3x as much downloading
as might minimally be needed. But it does give you
an update set in your hand, if you know what to
do with it (manually pick and choose). It certainly
runs in one-button-click mode, and the update
process could be marginally faster. But of course,
it'll take time to download the files. And you
don't have to worry about any "make a CD" or
"load a Flash stick" tick boxes. The folder can
just be copied in total, to a new machine,
and the update launched that way.

http://download.wsusoffline.net/

You can also grab a copy of MBSA 2.3 (Microsoft
Baseline Security Analyzer), and generate that list
of 170 things. Then look them up, one by one, using
the KB number, on catalog.update.microsoft.com .
I've updated three OSes manually that way.
Be prepared for blurry vision, as it takes
hours to do them that way. That is reserved
for cases where Windows Update isn't working,
and is won't even list the updates on the screen.
It sounds like yours is working right now, so
maybe you don't need a lot of shenanigans.

The catalog.update,microsoft.com has the files in
..msu format, just click and install. The Wsusoffline
may include ones in .cab format, and there is
a different invocation to install those manually.
The .cab method does not update the Windows Update
history page, so there is no visual record of them.
But, the OS is not confused, and the OS knows
which ones are in there. Once you've used either
type of update installer, the OS won't try to do that
same update twice out of ignorance. All the bookkeeping
works properly. It's just the feedback in the history
list that is missing with one of the methods.

*******

I'm not going to make any suggestions, as I think
you're just the push-button guy, and are perfectly
happy to leave the laptop running for 24 hours
until they're all done. Being picky about what
updates to accept, is for picky people. Maybe
you don't want CEIP, or support for UWP executables
from Microsoft or something. You'd have to slip on a
tinfoil hat while doing your researches.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Univer...ndows_Platform

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CEIP

(Applications rat you out, onto a Microsoft server database.
Ostensibly, so developers get feedback about program usage
or program failures while they're running. Like RAM usage
by Firefox, as an example of the kind of objective CEIP
is designed for. Firefox uses its own private CEIP system,
so Firefox doesn't use the Microsoft API.)

None of the updates should result in the machine
doing a GWX and installing Win10.

Have fun,

Paul

In alt.windows7.general, on Sat, 26 Aug 2017 22:02:05 -0400, Paul
wrote:

micky wrote:
Wow, I just held the cursor over the Update icon in the systray and up
poppeed a screen that said 170 important updates available

11 optional update available.

And this after I just installed some. (I know from experience it does
this in tiers)

Anything other than installing them all that I should do?

Thanks


This is what happens when someone either lets a win7 laptop sit for
months or upgrades from Vista and doesn't do the updates.

It depends on what your objectives are.

I dunno know.

Are you picky about your updates, and don't want Microsoft
to have its own way ?

I don't like MS to have it's own way, but I don't know what my way is.

If you don't care about a single thing, just
install all 170 of them. It could take two hours,
it could take all day.

You can go through the optional ones later, and
select the ones you want. Maybe you don't
want the time zone change for Somalia for example :-)
There's all sorts of stuff of minimal interest in
the Optional list.

Somalia is muy importante conmigo.
*******

You can use the URL generator tool here, which uses
the wsusscn2 file from the Microsoft server to work
out the update set. It will download all the updates
from the Microsoft server, onto your machine. The
files come straight from Microsoft, and not off
this server. It will also download files you don't
actually need, and might do 3x as much downloading
as might minimally be needed. But it does give you
an update set in your hand, if you know what to
do with it (manually pick and choose). It certainly
runs in one-button-click mode, and the update
process could be marginally faster. But of course,
it'll take time to download the files. And you
don't have to worry about any "make a CD" or
"load a Flash stick" tick boxes. The folder can
just be copied in total, to a new machine,
and the update launched that way.

http://download.wsusoffline.net/

Interesting. I'll look into it.

Thanks.
You can also grab a copy of MBSA 2.3 (Microsoft
Baseline Security Analyzer), and generate that list
of 170 things. Then look them up, one by one, using
the KB number, on catalog.update.microsoft.com .
I've updated three OSes manually that way.
Be prepared for blurry vision, as it takes
hours to do them that way. That is reserved
for cases where Windows Update isn't working,
and is won't even list the updates on the screen.
It sounds like yours is working right now, so
maybe you don't need a lot of shenanigans.

The catalog.update,microsoft.com has the files in
.msu format, just click and install. The Wsusoffline
may include ones in .cab format, and there is
a different invocation to install those manually.
The .cab method does not update the Windows Update
history page, so there is no visual record of them.
But, the OS is not confused, and the OS knows
which ones are in there. Once you've used either
type of update installer, the OS won't try to do that
same update twice out of ignorance. All the bookkeeping
works properly. It's just the feedback in the history
list that is missing with one of the methods.

*******

I'm not going to make any suggestions, as I think
you're just the push-button guy, and are perfectly
happy to leave the laptop running for 24 hours
until they're all done. Being picky about what
updates to accept, is for picky people. Maybe
you don't want CEIP, or support for UWP executables
from Microsoft or something. You'd have to slip on a
tinfoil hat while doing your researches.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Univer...ndows_Platform

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CEIP

(Applications rat you out, onto a Microsoft server database.
Ostensibly, so developers get feedback about program usage
or program failures while they're running. Like RAM usage
by Firefox, as an example of the kind of objective CEIP
is designed for. Firefox uses its own private CEIP system,
so Firefox doesn't use the Microsoft API.)

None of the updates should result in the machine
doing a GWX and installing Win10.

Have fun,

Paul

In alt.windows7.general, on Sat, 26 Aug 2017 22:02:05 -0400, Paul
wrote:


Wow, I just held the cursor over the Update icon in the systray and up
poppeed a screen that said 170 important updates available

11 optional update available.

And this after I just installed some. (I know from experience it does
this in tiers)

I was wrong. The last update date was August 6.

Anything other than installing them all that I should do?

Thanks


This is what happens when someone either lets a win7 laptop sit for
months or upgrades from Vista and doesn't do the updates.

It depends on what your objectives are.

micky wrote:
In alt.windows7.general, on Sat, 26 Aug 2017 22:02:05 -0400, Paul
wrote:

Wow, I just held the cursor over the Update icon in the systray and up
poppeed a screen that said 170 important updates available

11 optional update available.

And this after I just installed some. (I know from experience it does
this in tiers)

I was wrong. The last update date was August 6.

Maybe you only picked up SP1 service pack on your first visit ?

Or, you visited on Aug.6 and just closed the window without
changing anything or something.

Paul

On Sun, 27 Aug 2017 02:15:09 -0400, Paul wrote:
micky wrote:
[quoted text muted]
And this after I just installed some. (I know from experience it does
this in tiers)

I was wrong. The last update date was August 6.

Maybe you only picked up SP1 service pack on your first visit ?


Well, maybe. But this has happened to em more than once, with
virtual machines at work.

1. Run Windows update, check for updates, let it install everything.
2. Reboot (because Windows says it's required).
3. Log on, and it says important updates are available.

Not too long ago, I had a VM where after two rounds of the above, the
THIRD time I ran Windows Update there were still more updates
waiting.

I don't remember details, but I do remember the phenomenon of
installing all Windows updates and then having Windows want to
install still more updates, and I distinctly remember going through
three cycles of that, on at least one VM.

--
Stan Brown, Oak Road Systems, Tompkins County, New York, USA
http://BrownMath.com/
http://OakRoadSystems.com/
Shikata ga nai...

Stan Brown wrote:
On Sun, 27 Aug 2017 02:15:09 -0400, Paul wrote:
micky wrote:
[quoted text muted]
And this after I just installed some. (I know from experience it does
this in tiers)
I was wrong. The last update date was August 6.
Maybe you only picked up SP1 service pack on your first visit ?


Well, maybe. But this has happened to em more than once, with
virtual machines at work.

1. Run Windows update, check for updates, let it install everything.
2. Reboot (because Windows says it's required).
3. Log on, and it says important updates are available.

Not too long ago, I had a VM where after two rounds of the above, the
THIRD time I ran Windows Update there were still more updates
waiting.

I don't remember details, but I do remember the phenomenon of
installing all Windows updates and then having Windows want to
install still more updates, and I distinctly remember going through
three cycles of that, on at least one VM.


Yes, that happens.

It seems to work out dependencies after the first batch
were installed, and decide a bunch of new things are needed.
No idea why. Don't know how to root cause that either.

Paul

On 08/27/2017 07:58 AM, Paul wrote:
Stan Brown wrote:
On Sun, 27 Aug 2017 02:15:09 -0400, Paul wrote:
micky wrote:
[quoted text muted]
And this after I just installed some. (I know from experience it does
this in tiers)
I was wrong. The last update date was August 6.
Maybe you only picked up SP1 service pack on your first visit ?


Well, maybe. But this has happened to em more than once, with virtual
machines at work.

1. Run Windows update, check for updates, let it install everything.
2. Reboot (because Windows says it's required).
3. Log on, and it says important updates are available.

Not too long ago, I had a VM where after two rounds of the above, the
THIRD time I ran Windows Update there were still more updates waiting.

I don't remember details, but I do remember the phenomenon of
installing all Windows updates and then having Windows want to install
still more updates, and I distinctly remember going through three
cycles of that, on at least one VM.


Yes, that happens.

It seems to work out dependencies after the first batch
were installed, and decide a bunch of new things are needed.
No idea why. Don't know how to root cause that either.

Paul
IMHO its just the nature of the beast.
MS makes an update say package A to some feature.
Then they find that A needs a fix but you can't change package A, you
have to make a B package. Then again a C package for the next fix.
So when you do updates and get A which seems like the only one needed,
after it's installed MS sees that B is needed and so on through C.

It would be nice if they could see that if A then also B and if B also C
all in one download but I guess that's asking a bit too much AI.

On 08/26/2017 07:30 PM, micky wrote:
Wow, I just held the cursor over the Update icon in the systray and up
poppeed a screen that said 170 important updates available

11 optional update available.

And this after I just installed some. (I know from experience it does
this in tiers)

Anything other than installing them all that I should do?

Thanks


This is what happens when someone either lets a win7 laptop sit for
months or upgrades from Vista and doesn't do the updates.




When I am setting up a Win7 machine I now just upgrade it to Win10.

It's a smoother and faster operation than installing all the Win7
updates plus MSE

In alt.windows7.general, on Sun, 27 Aug 2017 15:49:29 -0500, philo
wrote:

On 08/26/2017 07:30 PM, micky wrote:
Wow, I just held the cursor over the Update icon in the systray and up
poppeed a screen that said 170 important updates available

11 optional update available.

And this after I just installed some. (I know from experience it does
this in tiers)

Anything other than installing them all that I should do?

Thanks


This is what happens when someone either lets a win7 laptop sit for
months or upgrades from Vista and doesn't do the updates.




When I am setting up a Win7 machine I now just upgrade it to Win10.

It's a smoother and faster operation than installing all the Win7
updates plus MSE

After all the stories about win10, I was happy to get a win7. If it's
ever obsolete, I can upgrade then.

As tedious as installing updates is, I still find it interesting. For
example, my internet chose the past 36 hours to give the worst service
in several years.

In alt.windows7.general, on Sun, 27 Aug 2017 08:06:33 -0400, Wolf K
wrote:

On 2017-08-26 20:30, micky wrote:
Wow, I just held the cursor over the Update icon in the systray and up
poppeed a screen that said 170 important updates available

11 optional update available.

And this after I just installed some. (I know from experience it does
this in tiers)

Anything other than installing them all that I should do?

Thanks


This is what happens when someone either lets a win7 laptop sit for
months or upgrades from Vista and doesn't do the updates.

FWIW, we bought an off-lease Dell Latitude same as yours about 18 months
ago. It was "clean", no data, but almost up-to-date, with the usual
basic software the refurbisher had (re-)installed. W7 Pro 64. I've
updated it from time to time, all Important ones, and no Optional, and
there have been no issues.

Good to know. And to know I'm not the only one buying such a thing. I
think it has a new screen too. On automatic, it actually might be too
bright too look at!

HTH

On Sun, 27 Aug 2017 23:59:08 -0400, micky
wrote:

After all the stories about win10, I was happy to get a win7. If it's
ever obsolete, I can upgrade then.



What you do is of course up to you, but let me point out that whenever
any new version comes out, what you hear is almost always negative.
Almost nobody comes to the newsgroups or to the Windows 10 forums to
tell you how wonderful it is. What you hear is only the problems.

As someone once pointed out, hang around a transmission shop for a
while and you'll think that all cars have transmission problems.

My experience with Windows 10 on both machines here is positive. No
problems at all. There are countless people all over the world whose
experience is similar to mine.

Ken Blake wrote:
On Sun, 27 Aug 2017 23:59:08 -0400, micky
wrote:

After all the stories about win10, I was happy to get a win7. If it's
ever obsolete, I can upgrade then.



What you do is of course up to you, but let me point out that whenever
any new version comes out, what you hear is almost always negative.
Almost nobody comes to the newsgroups or to the Windows 10 forums to
tell you how wonderful it is. What you hear is only the problems.

As someone once pointed out, hang around a transmission shop for a
while and you'll think that all cars have transmission problems.

My experience with Windows 10 on both machines here is positive. No
problems at all. There are countless people all over the world whose
experience is similar to mine.

1) You can freeze Win10.
Similar test cases on WinXP, pass (the program exits).
They still haven't fixed the test case I reported via Feedback Hub.

Under pressure, Task Manager is ineffective/useless.
Hit the power button or use reset, are your options.

WinXP has some similar failure cases, but they're much less annoying.
When WinXP is oversubscribed (too many copies of Prime95),
it simply kills the ones it doesn't like :-) The only time WinXP
really flakes out, is failures in games leaving the graphics stuck
in some 3D mode.

2) Privacy-degrading feature set. Win10 had some features that were
so stupid, they were actually removed! (Wifi password scheme)

3) Interference with user expectation, by means
of the Win10 "maintenance activity". Interruption of
long computations runs, by a "need to reboot", which of
course, is entirely unnecessary. There is no more "need to reboot",
than I "need a shoe shine". A simple visual indicator would have
sufficed. The computer, after all, belongs to the user...

I bet, if given a chance, Microsoft Research could come up with
a design that doesn't need reboots. But they would never ship
such a solution. Busting the users computation run, is too much fun.

Paul

On 08/28/2017 12:36 PM, Paul wrote:


snip
were actually removed! (Wifi password scheme)

3) Interference with user expectation, by means
of the Win10 "maintenance activity". Interruption of
long computations runs, by a "need to reboot", which of
course, is entirely unnecessary. There is no more "need to reboot",
than I "need a shoe shine". A simple visual indicator would have
sufficed. The computer, after all, belongs to the user...

I bet, if given a chance, Microsoft Research could come up with
a design that doesn't need reboots. But they would never ship
such a solution. Busting the users computation run, is too much fun.

Paul




The mandatory reboot is the main complaint I have with Win10.

Unless things have changed, after an update that requires a reboot, the
maximum it can be put off for is 24 hours.

That's insane for anyone who is in the middle of a job.


Though that behavior can be changed using Policy Editor, I preferred
when the update could be put off according to the user's desires rather
than than of Microsoft.

One thing I especially like about Win10 is that it seems to have drivers
for just about everything.

On Mon, 28 Aug 2017 09:32:30 -0700, Ken Blake wrote:
What you do is of course up to you, but let me point out that whenever
any new version comes out, what you hear is almost always negative.



I don't really think that's true. It's true (to a first
approximation) when every _second_ version comes out: Windows ME,
Windows Vista, Windows 8, Windows 10. But there were general sighs of
relief at Windows XP and Windows 7 and Windows 8.1, as I recall.

--
Stan Brown, Oak Road Systems, Tompkins County, New York, USA
http://BrownMath.com/
http://OakRoadSystems.com/
Shikata ga nai...