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  #16  
Old October 23rd 18, 07:17 PM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Ken Blake[_5_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,221
Default Mozilla Problems

On Tue, 23 Oct 2018 08:05:53 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:

"Mayayana" on Tue, 23 Oct 2018 10:17:36
-0400 typed in alt.windows7.general the following:

That's the nice thing about newsgroups. I find it
odd that more people don't use public newsgroups. They
let Facebook control their lives. They let Reddit require
membership and "vote" their posts up or down. And
in the Mozilla group or Microsoft forums it's similar:
Privately owned, quasi-marketing forums that filter
minority opinions. Yet people somehow prefer that
humiliation to the "public square" of usenet.


I suspect that far too many have no idea that Usenet even exists,
let alone know what it is, or how to access it.




Ditto to all three of those statements. Microsoft, by moving all its
forum to their web site, has done a great job of killing Usenet.
Ads
  #17  
Old October 23rd 18, 08:53 PM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Harry Bloomfield
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 14
Default Mozilla Problems

After serious thinking freemantle wrote :
Firefox locks up where Chrome (I do not like Chrome) does not.

This happens on a Win XP Pro and a Windows 7 PC.
Latest version for both OS.

The red form close [X] only gives a box that DOES NOT CLOSE Firefox !
I have to use another program to kill FireFox.


I'm subscribed to Familysearch and every time I visit that site, it
locks FF up completely. Some other less frequented sites have the same
effect. It locks all of the open FF tabs - The only way out it via
using Win10's Task Manager and Close Program.

So, for that one site, I have to open Microsoft Edge, which works fine
though I prefer FF.
  #18  
Old October 23rd 18, 09:21 PM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
VanguardLH[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,881
Default Mozilla Problems

nospam wrote:

In article , VanguardLH
wrote:

A dislike of Brave is that its author has an inbuilt adblocker but
deliberately lets paying advertisers get through.


that's not how it works.

https://brave.com/faq/#allowing-ads
Ads and trackers are blocked by default. You can allow ads and
trackers in the preferences panel. Later, as mentioned above, Brave
will let you opt into receiving a reduced ad load that comes without
trackers, maintains your privacy and helps support the publishers you
like.


From the Arstechnica article:

Double dip
It's one thing for a Web browser to block ads by default, but quite
another for that Web browser to insert its own ads and generate revenue
in the process.

You really think Eich has his own ads? Nope. Those "own ads" are those
the advertisers paid to circumvent his inbuilt adblocker. Brave also
has a rewards system but I'll let you read about it.

https://brave.com/faq/#brave-payments

They try to make it sound like users are getting rewarded. Wrong. The
"grants" given to users gets donated to the sites the user most visits.
This is akin to when coal mining companies paid their employees in
script that could only be spent at the company store, like how rebates
from Menards are script that can only be spent at Menards.

https://brave.com/brave-users-get-rewarded-to-browse/
https://brave.com/brave-launches-use...or-opt-in-ads/
https://www.ccn.com/brave-announces-...rds-for-users/

Even Eich doesn't lie that Brave has an ad model. Rewarding the ad
sources is how Eich is trying to dig into the web browser marketplace.
Rewarding sites to play nice in their ad content isn't new. Adblocker
Plus did the same thing with their whitelist of acceptable ad sources
which was enabled by default and enraged lots of users of that
extension. It was an attempt to coerce unacceptable site to become
acceptable in the ad behavior and content.
  #19  
Old October 23rd 18, 09:39 PM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
J. P. Gilliver (John)[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,679
Default Mozilla Problems

In message , Paul
writes:
[]
Any solutions, like a better free browser and newsgroup reader ?

[]
For a newsreader, there are some crusty ones, but there

[]
There are other options, but nothing are refined as
Thunderbird or Agent. Some mail tools pretend to do
USENET as well, but that doesn't always end well.

[]
"Pretend"? As far as the user is concerned, I don't know about any
pretence: OE, Turnpike, and Thunderbird all succeed. (What's going on
"under the hood" - like TB being mostly a browser - doesn't bother me.)

As for not ending well, I'm not going to take that challenge: I prefer
to put it as "some people do not like that idea, some do", or something
like that. The only argument against it that cuts any ice with me is the
suggestion that one might forget which one was using and post when you
meant to email or vice versa. I concede the possibility; in practice, I
think I've come across maybe five or ten examples in 30 years or so of
posts that were intended as emails, which is the more drastic way round.
(That's not counting gmail users misled by Google Groups' user
interface, which isn't part of that discussion.)
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

(Petitions - at least e-petitions - should collect votes both for and
against, if they're going to be reported as indicative of public
opinion. If you agree, please click below, unless you already have.) [UK only]
https://petition.parliament.uk/petit...BYobumelL9J54c

One of my tricks as an armchair futurist is to "predict" things that are
already happening and watch people tell me it will never happen.
Scott Adams, 2015-3-9
  #20  
Old October 23rd 18, 09:45 PM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,718
Default Mozilla Problems

In article , VanguardLH
wrote:

A dislike of Brave is that its author has an inbuilt adblocker but
deliberately lets paying advertisers get through.


that's not how it works.

https://brave.com/faq/#allowing-ads
Ads and trackers are blocked by default. You can allow ads and
trackers in the preferences panel. Later, as mentioned above, Brave
will let you opt into receiving a reduced ad load that comes without
trackers, maintains your privacy and helps support the publishers you
like.


From the Arstechnica article:


stop reading articles and try using the app.

i've been using it since the early summer. it blocks ads and a lot of
other garbage, and it's actually very good at doing so.

there is an *opt* *in* alternative, which is entirely voluntary.
  #21  
Old October 24th 18, 12:03 AM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
J. P. Gilliver (John)[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,679
Default Mozilla Problems

In message , VanguardLH
writes:
[]
Web browsers are the biggest infection vector (and so is
e-mail)


Make your mind up (-:
[]
I don't use combination clients. If you've been in Usenet for awhile,
you'll see where someone composed a message intending to send it to a
specific person via e-mail but instead posted it publicly in Usenet.


That's the only criticism (apart from "you can't do both optimally")
I've seen for "combination clients". And I think I've seen about five to
ten examples - in over 30 years. [Not counting gmail users misled by
Google Groups' atrocious UI, which is nothing to do with clients.]
[]
extensions that performed overlapping functions, many got abandoned (and
another reason Mozilla changed to WebExtensions to shake off all the
abandonware)


I find a lot of good stuff in abandonware (not just Firefox extensions).
[]
well over a decade. Even ancient NNTP clients work very well. I use

[]
Not everything (web, email, newsgroups) needs to get rolled into one
client. Handyman of several trades means less than stellar expertise in


But some of us _like_ a common interface for email and news. However,
I'm not saying _you_ _should_ use a combined client - just that I get a
little tired of others saying _I_ _shouldn't_.

any one trade. Not all ancient clients are useless. NNTP has changed
little, so old newsreaders work just fine. Unless you need to use a
proprietary protocol (Microsoft's Exchange or Google's mail API) and
just need POP, IMAP, or SMTP for e-mail, then old e-mail clients still
work very well (um, except regarding secured connections which many
servers requires SSL 3.0 or TLS 2.0, or later).


Which things like stunnel can solve, I gather.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

(Petitions - at least e-petitions - should collect votes both for and
against, if they're going to be reported as indicative of public
opinion. If you agree, please click below, unless you already have.) [UK only]
https://petition.parliament.uk/petit...BYobumelL9J54c

The early worm gets the bird.
  #22  
Old October 24th 18, 12:42 AM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Mayayana
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,438
Default Mozilla Problems

"pyotr filipivich" wrote

| I suspect that far too many have no idea that Usenet even exists,
| let alone know what it is, or how to access it.
|

Yes. Odd, though, isn't it? When I tell friends they
could go get or share advice on nearly any topic
they show no interest. If it's not coming from
Google then.... well... it's not coming from Google!


  #23  
Old October 24th 18, 12:56 AM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
VanguardLH[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,881
Default Mozilla Problems

nospam wrote:

In article , VanguardLH
wrote:

A dislike of Brave is that its author has an inbuilt adblocker but
deliberately lets paying advertisers get through.

that's not how it works.

https://brave.com/faq/#allowing-ads
Ads and trackers are blocked by default. You can allow ads and
trackers in the preferences panel. Later, as mentioned above, Brave
will let you opt into receiving a reduced ad load that comes without
trackers, maintains your privacy and helps support the publishers you
like.


From the Arstechnica article:


stop reading articles and try using the app.

i've been using it since the early summer. it blocks ads and a lot of
other garbage, and it's actually very good at doing so.

there is an *opt* *in* alternative, which is entirely voluntary.


Sorry, I forgot I was talking to a delusional poster who thinks he is
God. brave.com must be lying about the Brave web browser. Eich must be
lying about his web browser. nospam must be correct because, gee, he is
our God here and how he thinks things should be is how they must be.
  #24  
Old October 24th 18, 01:44 AM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
SilverSlimer[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 120
Default Mozilla Problems

On 2018-10-23 1:34 p.m., VanguardLH wrote:
SilverSlimer wrote:

On 2018-10-23 1:58 a.m., freemantle wrote:
Firefox locks up where Chrome (I do not like Chrome) does not.

This happens on a Win XP Pro and a Windows 7 PC.
Latest version for both OS.

The red form close [X] only gives a box that DOES NOT CLOSE Firefox !
I have to use another program to kill FireFox.

Junk !

Then Seamonkey turns into a SLUG !

Can't they write code ?

If I try to post on Mozilla they block this post !

Any solutions, like a better free browser and newsgroup reader ?


You can always use Brave which is developed by the guy who originally
created Mozilla (Brendan Eich). He was kicked out of Mozilla for
donating to an organization which believed in traditional families
(unthinkable in this day and age where dressing up as a dog for sexual
gratification is normal).


A dislike of Brave is that its author has an inbuilt adblocker but
deliberately lets paying advertisers get through. Guess Eich wasn't
making enough money at Mozilla, so he came up with a revenue-generating
model for a web browser. He also jumped ships moving from Gecko/Quantum
(Firefox) to Blink (Chromium).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brave_...ical_reception
https://arstechnica.com/information-...ds-by-default/

Only if Brave lets you disable its own adblocker and install a 3rd party
extension for adblocking that YOU can configure as to what it blocks
would I bother trialing it. I see a few extensions listed at
https://brave.com/features/. Are others allowed?

https://brave.com/loading-chrome-extensions-in-brave/

Hmm, guess you can use Chrom(e|ium) extensions in Brave. But can you
disable Brave's own ad-allowing, er, adblocking function to rely solely
on your choice of an adblocker extension?

There is also Vivaldi which uses the same base as Chrome but has none of
Google's spyware in it.


So, your suggesting is to move from Firefox or any of its variants to
Chromium or one of those variants.


I think that Eich's approach to Brave is that it would have everything a
user is likely to need built-in. For that, I can't really fault him.
Regardless of how simple it is, I do believe that many Firefox users are
entirely unaware of the fact that the browser allows them to install
additional features to enhance their browsing experience.

I don't use Brave myself because I like some DRM-enabled content and
Brave doesn't support that (in Linux at least) but it seems like a good
choice for many people. I prefer Vivaldi myself.


--
SilverSlimer
  #25  
Old October 24th 18, 01:51 AM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
SilverSlimer[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 120
Default Mozilla Problems

On 2018-10-23 1:38 p.m., nospam wrote:
In article , VanguardLH
wrote:

A dislike of Brave is that its author has an inbuilt adblocker but
deliberately lets paying advertisers get through.


that's not how it works.

https://brave.com/faq/#allowing-ads
Ads and trackers are blocked by default. You can allow ads and
trackers in the preferences panel. Later, as mentioned above, Brave
will let you opt into receiving a reduced ad load that comes without
trackers, maintains your privacy and helps support the publishers you
like.


That's what I thought but I imagined that Vanguard was referring to some
sort of recent development I was unaware of. Brave essentially allows
you to block all ads, allow them all or allow only the "ethical" ones
which adopted Brave's system. I don't know if any did but, in the
meantime, people who feel that their favourite sites deserve
compensation as a result of ad revenue lost can donate to them through
cryptocurrency automatically.

--
SilverSlimer
  #26  
Old October 24th 18, 04:37 AM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
VanguardLH[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,881
Default Mozilla Problems

SilverSlimer wrote:

On 2018-10-23 1:34 p.m., VanguardLH wrote:
SilverSlimer wrote:

On 2018-10-23 1:58 a.m., freemantle wrote:
Firefox locks up where Chrome (I do not like Chrome) does not.

This happens on a Win XP Pro and a Windows 7 PC.
Latest version for both OS.

The red form close [X] only gives a box that DOES NOT CLOSE Firefox !
I have to use another program to kill FireFox.

Junk !

Then Seamonkey turns into a SLUG !

Can't they write code ?

If I try to post on Mozilla they block this post !

Any solutions, like a better free browser and newsgroup reader ?

You can always use Brave which is developed by the guy who originally
created Mozilla (Brendan Eich). He was kicked out of Mozilla for
donating to an organization which believed in traditional families
(unthinkable in this day and age where dressing up as a dog for sexual
gratification is normal).


A dislike of Brave is that its author has an inbuilt adblocker but
deliberately lets paying advertisers get through. Guess Eich wasn't
making enough money at Mozilla, so he came up with a revenue-generating
model for a web browser. He also jumped ships moving from Gecko/Quantum
(Firefox) to Blink (Chromium).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brave_...ical_reception
https://arstechnica.com/information-...ds-by-default/

Only if Brave lets you disable its own adblocker and install a 3rd party
extension for adblocking that YOU can configure as to what it blocks
would I bother trialing it. I see a few extensions listed at
https://brave.com/features/. Are others allowed?

https://brave.com/loading-chrome-extensions-in-brave/

Hmm, guess you can use Chrom(e|ium) extensions in Brave. But can you
disable Brave's own ad-allowing, er, adblocking function to rely solely
on your choice of an adblocker extension?

There is also Vivaldi which uses the same base as Chrome but has none of
Google's spyware in it.


So, your suggesting is to move from Firefox or any of its variants to
Chromium or one of those variants.


I think that Eich's approach to Brave is that it would have everything a
user is likely to need built-in. For that, I can't really fault him.
Regardless of how simple it is, I do believe that many Firefox users are
entirely unaware of the fact that the browser allows them to install
additional features to enhance their browsing experience.

I don't use Brave myself because I like some DRM-enabled content and
Brave doesn't support that (in Linux at least) but it seems like a good
choice for many people. I prefer Vivaldi myself.


https://community.brave.com/t/amazon...drm-issue/1627

You sure Brave doesn't support DRM content (using the Widevine plug-in)?

https://www.willchatham.com/internet...es-my-default/

Looks like Google is going to remove the option to disable their
Widevine plug-in. Oops, already happened ...

https://www.ghacks.net/2017/01/29/go...s-from-chrome/

You can't even go to chrome://plugins anymore. Brave still lets users
disable the WideVine plug-in. I don't know the default or install-time
default for that plug-in and why I pointed at the forum thread about how
to enable that plug-in.

https://www.ghacks.net/2018/09/28/br...brave-1-0-out/

Yikes, I didn't realize Brave was just out of dev phase and just got
into a beta release. Tis one of the reasons I didn't bother with
Vivaldi for a long time. At the bottom of the brave.com pages, there is
a "Build Channels" section, and it has a link to Brave Release (versus
Brave Dev and Brave Beta). Maybe it just went out of beta in the last
month.

https://brave.com/new-brave-browser-...eral-download/

Hmm, looks like they published a released (GA = general availability)
version on October 18 ... just 5 days ago. Yet their blog says the
released version is 0.55, not 1.0. With other products, anything less
than 1.0 is a beta or alpha version.
  #27  
Old October 24th 18, 09:01 AM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Lucifer
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 226
Default Mozilla Problems

On Tue, 23 Oct 2018 16:45:45 -0400, nospam
wrote:

In article , VanguardLH
wrote:

A dislike of Brave is that its author has an inbuilt adblocker but
deliberately lets paying advertisers get through.

that's not how it works.

https://brave.com/faq/#allowing-ads
Ads and trackers are blocked by default. You can allow ads and
trackers in the preferences panel. Later, as mentioned above, Brave
will let you opt into receiving a reduced ad load that comes without
trackers, maintains your privacy and helps support the publishers you
like.


From the Arstechnica article:


stop reading articles and try using the app.

i've been using it since the early summer. it blocks ads and a lot of
other garbage, and it's actually very good at doing so.

there is an *opt* *in* alternative, which is entirely voluntary.


Use punctuation.
  #28  
Old October 24th 18, 09:16 AM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Lucifer
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 226
Default Mozilla Problems

On Tue, 23 Oct 2018 12:24:22 -0400, nospam
wrote:

In article , Mayayana
wrote:

That's the nice thing about newsgroups. I find it
odd that more people don't use public newsgroups.


usenet doesn't get the traffic that web forums do, other than spam,
which web forums block or remove.


Yes it does.

They
let Facebook control their lives.


no they don't.


Yes they do.

They let Reddit require
membership


usenet requires a membership with a usenet provider.


But not punctuation.

and "vote" their posts up or down.


that's one of the best parts, which makes it easier to sort through the
crap and find the helpful posts. many web forums do that.


They should block posters who don't punctuate.

And
in the Mozilla group or Microsoft forums it's similar:
Privately owned, quasi-marketing forums that filter
minority opinions.


create your own forum and filter as you see fit.

Yet people somehow prefer that
humiliation to the "public square" of usenet.


the 'public square' is why usenet is overrun with spam.


And people who don't punctuate.
  #29  
Old October 24th 18, 09:18 AM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Lucifer
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 226
Default Mozilla Problems

On Tue, 23 Oct 2018 09:55:25 -0500, Mathedman
wrote:

On 23/10/2018 (date fixed) 12:58 AM, freemantle wrote:
Firefox locks up where Chrome (I do not like Chrome) does not.

This happens on a Win XP Pro and a Windows 7 PC.
Latest version for both OS.

The red form close [X] only gives a box that DOES NOT CLOSE Firefox !
I have to use another program to kill FireFox.

Junk !

Then Seamonkey turns into a SLUG !

Can't they write code ?

If I try to post on Mozilla they block this post !

Any solutions, like a better free browser and newsgroup reader ?


Chrome is malware! It also does tracking info for Google.
I unfortunately got it for "free" with some small freeware software.
(apparently google bought up all those little applets
that used to bee free-ware or share-ware.
I've tried everything I know to try and could/can not get it all removed


Just don't use Chrome.
  #30  
Old October 24th 18, 01:41 PM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
SilverSlimer[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 120
Default Mozilla Problems

On 2018-10-23 3:53 p.m., Harry Bloomfield wrote:
After serious thinking freemantle wrote :
Firefox locks up where Chrome (I do not like Chrome) does not.

This happens on a Win XP Pro and a Windows 7 PC.
Latest version for both OS.

The red form close [X] only gives a box that DOES NOT CLOSE Firefox !
I have to use another program to kill FireFox.


I'm subscribed to Familysearch and every time I visit that site, it
locks FF up completely. Some other less frequented sites have the same
effect. It locks all of the open FF tabs - The only way out it via using
Win10's Task Manager and Close Program.

So, for that one site, I have to open Microsoft Edge, which works fine
though I prefer FF.


I assume it's Familysearch.com?

--
SilverSlimer
 




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