Technical & legal background using copyrighted fonts in custom road signs in PowerPoint

In article

,
"Andre G. Isaak" wrote:

In article ,
Your Name wrote:

On 2017-09-11 20:25:51 +0000, Andre G. Isaak said:
In article ,
Your Name wrote:
On 2017-09-12 00:31:19 +0000, Chaya Eve said:
On Mon, 11 Sep 2017 12:20:39 -0600, "Andre G. Isaak"

wrote:

I pointed out already that DIN *is* included with Macs.

Thanks for clarifying that a DIN font is included native with the Mac.
You're the only Mac expert here who knew that. Even the Windows experts
didn't know that a DIN 1451 compatible font exists on Windows (named
Barnshrift) until you mentioned the DIN compatible font on the Mac.

Since the name may make all the difference in compatibility, do you
know the name of that DIN 1451 compatible font on the Mac?

There is no "DIN" font installed by default on the Mac. You can
download it and it may be installed by some third-party applications.

There are no doubt lots of fonts that are close enough to be lookalikes.

I just double checked. DIN is definitely installed in /Library/Fonts.
C
I verified this against the Sierra and Yosemite installers. It is
present in both.

It is in my Sierra folder as well, but it's not a standard Mac OS X font.

I've verified that it is installed by Sierra.

However, this font has fallen victim to a well-known apple bug which I
forgot that I'd already fixed on my system.

If you find a font in fonts folder which doesn't show up in your
applications, try renaming the file. That should fix it.

(this bug is tied to system integrity protection -- if there is any
discrepancy between a font and the information contained in the .ATSD
file with the same name, the system will assume the font has been
damaged and will prevent it from loading. In a few cases apple has
updated their fonts but left an old .ATSD file in place. Renaming the
font file will fix this)

P.S. other fonts which have fallen victim to this bug at various times
have included Athelas, Charter, Marion, Seravek, and SuperClarendon.
Usually it gets fixed with the next update but not always.

(AFAIK the .ATSD files serve no actual purpose other than to
differentiate between apple and 3rd party fonts)

Andre

--
To email remove 'invalid' & replace 'gm' with well known Google mail service.

Andre G. Isaak wrote:

In article ,
Your Name wrote:

On 2017-09-12 00:31:19 +0000, Chaya Eve said:
On Mon, 11 Sep 2017 12:20:39 -0600, "Andre G. Isaak"
wrote:

I pointed out already that DIN *is* included with Macs.

Thanks for clarifying that a DIN font is included native with the Mac.
You're the only Mac expert here who knew that. Even the Windows experts
didn't know that a DIN 1451 compatible font exists on Windows (named
Barnshrift) until you mentioned the DIN compatible font on the Mac.

Since the name may make all the difference in compatibility, do you
know the name of that DIN 1451 compatible font on the Mac?

There is no "DIN" font installed by default on the Mac. You can
download it and it may be installed by some third-party applications.

There are no doubt lots of fonts that are close enough to be lookalikes.

I just double checked. DIN is definitely installed in /Library/Fonts.

I verified this against the Sierra and Yosemite installers. It is
present in both.

That is correct, but the font cannot be selected by the user in recent
OS versions: DIN Alternate Bold and DIN Condensed Bold don't show up in
Font Book, nor in font selection menus in application. They also don't
show up if attempting to install the same files as a user font.

Apple's document on fonts included in Sierra doesn't mention those
fonts:

https://support.apple.com/HT206872

but they were in the corresponding document for Mavericks:

https://support.apple.com/HT201375

I couldn't find corresponding documents for Yosemite and El Capitan (nor
does Wikipedia have links for those versions).

Given the list of "Fonts available for document support in macOS Sierra"
in the first document, I suspect DIN Alternate Bold and DIN Condensed
Bold are supposed to be on that list but were accidentally omitted.

Testing older OS versions, those two fonts only appear in Font Book for
OS X 10.9 Mavericks and OS X 10.10 Yosemite. They are missing from Font
Book (and applications) for OS X 10.11 El Capitan and macOS 10.12
Sierra, despite the font files being present in /Library/Fonts.

Using TextEdit as an example, I was able to save a document using those
fonts in Yosemite then open it in Sierra, where they display correctly.
With that document open, those fonts are able to be selected from the
the recent list at the top of the font popup menu in the TextEdit
toolbar. They still don't appear in the Show Fonts floating window and
they disappear if that document is closed then TextEdit is quit and
relaunched.

This is consisent with those fonts being retained for use in existing
documents when referenced by name, but not being available for use in
new documents, as described in the Sierra support document for a long
list of other fonts.

The DIN font files are not identical between Yosemite and Sierra, but
the Yosemite version of the font also doesn't show up if installed as a
user font in Sierra. Recent OS X versions must have a master list of
fonts previously supplied by Apple which are no longer available for
selection.

If someone wanted to use that font in new documents, they would probably
need to get a separately licensed copy from Linotype. (I don't know what
would be involved to get around the OS blocking the availability of a
font with that name, unless that mechanism is tied to Apple-supplied
font files.)

--
David Empson

In article ,
(David Empson) wrote:

Andre G. Isaak wrote:

In article ,
Your Name wrote:

On 2017-09-12 00:31:19 +0000, Chaya Eve said:
On Mon, 11 Sep 2017 12:20:39 -0600, "Andre G. Isaak"

wrote:

I pointed out already that DIN *is* included with Macs.

Thanks for clarifying that a DIN font is included native with the Mac.
You're the only Mac expert here who knew that. Even the Windows experts
didn't know that a DIN 1451 compatible font exists on Windows (named
Barnshrift) until you mentioned the DIN compatible font on the Mac.

Since the name may make all the difference in compatibility, do you
know the name of that DIN 1451 compatible font on the Mac?

There is no "DIN" font installed by default on the Mac. You can
download it and it may be installed by some third-party applications.

There are no doubt lots of fonts that are close enough to be lookalikes.

I just double checked. DIN is definitely installed in /Library/Fonts.

I verified this against the Sierra and Yosemite installers. It is
present in both.

That is correct, but the font cannot be selected by the user in recent
OS versions: DIN Alternate Bold and DIN Condensed Bold don't show up in
Font Book, nor in font selection menus in application. They also don't
show up if attempting to install the same files as a user font.

This is a known bug. Simply rename the font files and they will work.


This is consisent with those fonts being retained for use in existing
documents when referenced by name, but not being available for use in
new documents, as described in the Sierra support document for a long
list of other fonts.

Compatibility fonts are stored in /Library/Application
Support/Apple/Fonts/ whereas DIN is installed in /Library/Fonts/

Andre

--
To email remove 'invalid' & replace 'gm' with well known Google mail service.

On Tue, 12 Sep 2017 02:04:56 -0600, "Andre G. Isaak"
wrote:

I think you misunderstood my point -- I'm pointing out that it's not a
good idea to place bundled fonts in the same category as freeware fonts.
The latter can generally be redistributed, whereas the former cannot be.

Thanks for clarifying that the bundled fonts might not be legally
distributable.

I think the problem with bundled fonts is even worse, in that the
distribution would have to be by us (particularly for the Mac DIN bundled
fonts) rather than by a simple link.

That is, there are three scenarios:
* If we pick a free font, such as Roadgeek, we can point Mac uses to the
download site for that font and we can embed the font into the PowerPoint
document for Windows users.

* If we pick a Windows bundled font, such as Bahnschrift, we can't point
the Mac users to the download site and the Mac users can't "see" the
embedded font in the PowerPoint document - so effectively we'd have to
somehow distribute the font with the document as a separate file.

* If we pick a Mac bundled font, such as DIN, we can't point the Windows
users to that download site, and the Mac can't embed the font into the
PowerPoint document, so, again, effectively, we'd have to somehow
distribute the font with the document as a separate file.

Hence, the Mac & Windows native fonts are useless, effectively, for our
purposes as far as I can see.

On Tue, 12 Sep 2017 02:28:20 -0600, "Andre G. Isaak"
wrote:

If you find a font in fonts folder which doesn't show up in your
applications, try renaming the file. That should fix it.

This may be a crazy idea, but if we rename the DIN font to "Bahnschrift" on
the Mac, will the Mac then be able to use the DIN font in place of the
Bahnschrift font if the Mac edits a PowerPoint that came from Windows that
had the Windows Bahnschrift font embedded in it?

In article ,
Chaya Eve wrote:

On Tue, 12 Sep 2017 02:28:20 -0600, "Andre G. Isaak"
wrote:

If you find a font in fonts folder which doesn't show up in your
applications, try renaming the file. That should fix it.

This may be a crazy idea, but if we rename the DIN font to "Bahnschrift" on
the Mac, will the Mac then be able to use the DIN font in place of the
Bahnschrift font if the Mac edits a PowerPoint that came from Windows that
had the Windows Bahnschrift font embedded in it?

No.

The font's filename has nothing to do with the font's internal name, and
even were you to change the internal name you'd likely run into problems
since the two fonts will likely have different metrics and different
character sets.

Andre

--
To email remove 'invalid' & replace 'gm' with well known Google mail service.

On Tue, 12 Sep 2017 07:56:56 -0600, "Andre G. Isaak"
wrote:

No.

The font's filename has nothing to do with the font's internal name, and
even were you to change the internal name you'd likely run into problems
since the two fonts will likely have different metrics and different
character sets.

I was afraid of that. Thanks.

Basically, it's great that the Mac comes with DIN if we stay on the Mac.
And it's great that Windows comes with Bahnschrift, if we stay on Windows.
But 'ner the twain shall meet.

Hence, the only logical choice for cross-platform editing compatibility is
either a (maybe free) Highway Gothic or a definitely free Roadgeek font
where the font is embedded into the document from Windows and where the Mac
user downloads the font and then deletes it when done.

Andre G. Isaak wrote:

In article ,
(David Empson) wrote:

Andre G. Isaak wrote:

In article ,
Your Name wrote:

On 2017-09-12 00:31:19 +0000, Chaya Eve said:
On Mon, 11 Sep 2017 12:20:39 -0600, "Andre G. Isaak"

wrote:

I pointed out already that DIN *is* included with Macs.

Thanks for clarifying that a DIN font is included native with the
Mac. You're the only Mac expert here who knew that. Even the
Windows experts didn't know that a DIN 1451 compatible font exists
on Windows (named Barnshrift) until you mentioned the DIN
compatible font on the Mac.

Since the name may make all the difference in compatibility, do you
know the name of that DIN 1451 compatible font on the Mac?

There is no "DIN" font installed by default on the Mac. You can
download it and it may be installed by some third-party applications.

There are no doubt lots of fonts that are close enough to be lookalikes.

I just double checked. DIN is definitely installed in /Library/Fonts.

I verified this against the Sierra and Yosemite installers. It is
present in both.

That is correct, but the font cannot be selected by the user in recent
OS versions: DIN Alternate Bold and DIN Condensed Bold don't show up in
Font Book, nor in font selection menus in application. They also don't
show up if attempting to install the same files as a user font.

This is a known bug. Simply rename the font files and they will work.

Thanks for clarifying it for me. Based on details in your other post, it
would be an easy bug for Apple to fix. Low priority, I suppose.

This is consisent with those fonts being retained for use in existing
documents when referenced by name, but not being available for use in
new documents, as described in the Sierra support document for a long
list of other fonts.

Compatibility fonts are stored in /Library/Application
Support/Apple/Fonts/ whereas DIN is installed in /Library/Fonts/

Good to know, thanks.

It still makes this font difficult to use for the application in
question, because the font will appear to be unavailable on the majority
of Macs unless someone jumps through hoops to install a renamed copy.

--
David Empson

Q1: How do I embed a TT font into PowerPoint 2007 for others to edit, and,

Just saw this elesewhere so I'm reposting Alan Browne's helpful information
verbatim below so that it's available in this thread.

On Mon, 11 Sep 2017 14:59:39 -0400, Alan Browne
wrote:

1. Close all MS Office programs on the Mac.
2. Install the desired font as per custom on the Mac.
3. CLEAR THE MS FONT CACHE FILE BY DELETING IT:

/Users/username/Library/Preferences/Microsoft/Office 2008/
Proofing Tools Preferences/Office Font Cache (11)
(or similar). This applies for later versions of Office.
ie: I did the above with Office 2016 - it still uses files from the 2008
cache if they are there...

Re-open PowerPoint. The desired font that you downloaded (ie:
http://www.fontspace.com/michael-d-adams/roadgeek-2005 )
Is available and works perfectly well.

Of course MS are ape-heads and don't refresh the font list for some
idiotic, only MS knows, reason.

On 2017-09-12 20:18:54 +0000, David Empson said:
Andre G. Isaak wrote:
In article ,
(David Empson) wrote:
Andre G. Isaak wrote:
In article ,
Your Name wrote:
On 2017-09-12 00:31:19 +0000, Chaya Eve said:
On Mon, 11 Sep 2017 12:20:39 -0600, "Andre G. Isaak"

wrote:

I pointed out already that DIN *is* included with Macs.

Thanks for clarifying that a DIN font is included native with the
Mac. You're the only Mac expert here who knew that. Even the
Windows experts didn't know that a DIN 1451 compatible font exists
on Windows (named Barnshrift) until you mentioned the DIN
compatible font on the Mac.

Since the name may make all the difference in compatibility, do you
know the name of that DIN 1451 compatible font on the Mac?

There is no "DIN" font installed by default on the Mac. You can
download it and it may be installed by some third-party applications.

There are no doubt lots of fonts that are close enough to be lookalikes.

I just double checked. DIN is definitely installed in /Library/Fonts.

I verified this against the Sierra and Yosemite installers. It is
present in both.

That is correct, but the font cannot be selected by the user in recent
OS versions: DIN Alternate Bold and DIN Condensed Bold don't show up in
Font Book, nor in font selection menus in application. They also don't
show up if attempting to install the same files as a user font.

This is a known bug. Simply rename the font files and they will work.

Thanks for clarifying it for me. Based on details in your other post, it
would be an easy bug for Apple to fix. Low priority, I suppose.

This is consisent with those fonts being retained for use in existing
documents when referenced by name, but not being available for use in
new documents, as described in the Sierra support document for a long
list of other fonts.

Compatibility fonts are stored in /Library/Application
Support/Apple/Fonts/ whereas DIN is installed in /Library/Fonts/

Good to know, thanks.

It still makes this font difficult to use for the application in
question, because the font will appear to be unavailable on the majority
of Macs unless someone jumps through hoops to install a renamed copy.

It also seems a bit peculiar that the DIN fonts (and a few others) *do*
appear in Microsoft Office apps^ and that they are no longer listed by
Apple as being a standard Mac OS X font in Sierra.

That would *seem* to indicate that the font is actually installed by
Microsoft Office and is only meant to be used within those apps.
Renaming it may be the real bug that gets around that "lock out" and
causes the fonts to appear for use in other apps, possibly against the
licencing agreement terms.




^ I know Micorosft Office uses its own caching system, so there are complaints
about the reverse occuring - sometimes fonts won't appear in Office apps,
but do appear in all other Mac apps.

In article ,
Your Name wrote:

On 2017-09-12 20:18:54 +0000, David Empson said:
Andre G. Isaak wrote:
In article ,
(David Empson) wrote:
Andre G. Isaak wrote:
In article ,
Your Name wrote:
On 2017-09-12 00:31:19 +0000, Chaya Eve said:
On Mon, 11 Sep 2017 12:20:39 -0600, "Andre G. Isaak"

wrote:

I pointed out already that DIN *is* included with Macs.

Thanks for clarifying that a DIN font is included native with the
Mac. You're the only Mac expert here who knew that. Even the
Windows experts didn't know that a DIN 1451 compatible font exists
on Windows (named Barnshrift) until you mentioned the DIN
compatible font on the Mac.

Since the name may make all the difference in compatibility, do you
know the name of that DIN 1451 compatible font on the Mac?

There is no "DIN" font installed by default on the Mac. You can
download it and it may be installed by some third-party applications.

There are no doubt lots of fonts that are close enough to be lookalikes.

I just double checked. DIN is definitely installed in /Library/Fonts.

I verified this against the Sierra and Yosemite installers. It is
present in both.

That is correct, but the font cannot be selected by the user in recent
OS versions: DIN Alternate Bold and DIN Condensed Bold don't show up in
Font Book, nor in font selection menus in application. They also don't
show up if attempting to install the same files as a user font.

This is a known bug. Simply rename the font files and they will work.

Thanks for clarifying it for me. Based on details in your other post, it
would be an easy bug for Apple to fix. Low priority, I suppose.

This is consisent with those fonts being retained for use in existing
documents when referenced by name, but not being available for use in
new documents, as described in the Sierra support document for a long
list of other fonts.

Compatibility fonts are stored in /Library/Application
Support/Apple/Fonts/ whereas DIN is installed in /Library/Fonts/

Good to know, thanks.

It still makes this font difficult to use for the application in
question, because the font will appear to be unavailable on the majority
of Macs unless someone jumps through hoops to install a renamed copy.

It also seems a bit peculiar that the DIN fonts (and a few others) *do*
appear in Microsoft Office apps^ and that they are no longer listed by
Apple as being a standard Mac OS X font in Sierra.

That would *seem* to indicate that the font is actually installed by
Microsoft Office and is only meant to be used within those apps.

Microsoft Office keeps its private fonts within folders inside the
individual application bundles (and DIN isn't included there), and I've
verified that the font *is* installed by the Sierra installer (both by
looking in the installer itself and by checking various VMs I have lying
around which don't have office installed). In addition, the version
number of the font corresponds to apple numbering schemes.

Unlike Pages, Textedit, etc., Office doesn't rely on CoreText to create
its font menus, but rather uses its own routines. I suspect that's why
the font shows up in Office applications.

Andre

--
To email remove 'invalid' & replace 'gm' with well known Google mail service.

On Wed, 13 Sep 2017 08:18:54 +1200, David Empson
wrote:

Good to know, thanks.

Everything in this thread is good to know, so it's wonderful that together,
the Mac and Windows experts unraveled the unintuitive details to a succinct
summary.

It still makes this font difficult to use for the application in
question, because the font will appear to be unavailable on the majority
of Macs unless someone jumps through hoops to install a renamed copy.

The Graphics Arts teacher wrote the following, which seems to indicate that
the fonts on the Mac won't be a problem for her when printing the signs!

"I can easily download the necessary typefaces into our Adobe
applications. That is not a problem. As soon as the metal for the signage
is brought in we can get started. As for doing a project involving signage,
we already have something lined up in regards to signage for the year.
Thank you for your consideration on this.

I have been building signs professionally for a long time and feel
confident that you will be happy with our end result for your request. The
vinyl to build your signs is inexpensive. It should only cost around 5$
per sign."

From that, I suspect two things:
* The teacher isn't going to use MS Office but an Adobe product instead.
* That Adobe product on the Mac can handle whatever road fonts we need.

In article , Chaya Eve
wrote:

From that, I suspect two things:
* The teacher isn't going to use MS Office but an Adobe product instead.

no surprise there. office is the wrong tool. most likely she will be
using adobe illustrator.

* That Adobe product on the Mac can handle whatever road fonts we need.

of course it can.

On 2017-09-13 09:38:11 +0000, Andre G. Isaak said:

In article ,
Your Name wrote:

On 2017-09-12 20:18:54 +0000, David Empson said:
Andre G. Isaak wrote:
In article ,
(David Empson) wrote:
Andre G. Isaak wrote:
In article ,
Your Name wrote:
On 2017-09-12 00:31:19 +0000, Chaya Eve said:
On Mon, 11 Sep 2017 12:20:39 -0600, "Andre G. Isaak"

wrote:

I pointed out already that DIN *is* included with Macs.

Thanks for clarifying that a DIN font is included native with the
Mac. You're the only Mac expert here who knew that. Even the
Windows experts didn't know that a DIN 1451 compatible font exists
on Windows (named Barnshrift) until you mentioned the DIN
compatible font on the Mac.

Since the name may make all the difference in compatibility, do you
know the name of that DIN 1451 compatible font on the Mac?

There is no "DIN" font installed by default on the Mac. You can
download it and it may be installed by some third-party applications.

There are no doubt lots of fonts that are close enough to be lookalikes.

I just double checked. DIN is definitely installed in /Library/Fonts.

I verified this against the Sierra and Yosemite installers. It is
present in both.

That is correct, but the font cannot be selected by the user in recent
OS versions: DIN Alternate Bold and DIN Condensed Bold don't show up in
Font Book, nor in font selection menus in application. They also don't
show up if attempting to install the same files as a user font.

This is a known bug. Simply rename the font files and they will work.

Thanks for clarifying it for me. Based on details in your other post, it
would be an easy bug for Apple to fix. Low priority, I suppose.

This is consisent with those fonts being retained for use in existing
documents when referenced by name, but not being available for use in
new documents, as described in the Sierra support document for a long
list of other fonts.

Compatibility fonts are stored in /Library/Application
Support/Apple/Fonts/ whereas DIN is installed in /Library/Fonts/

Good to know, thanks.

It still makes this font difficult to use for the application in
question, because the font will appear to be unavailable on the majority
of Macs unless someone jumps through hoops to install a renamed copy.

It also seems a bit peculiar that the DIN fonts (and a few others) *do*
appear in Microsoft Office apps^ and that they are no longer listed by
Apple as being a standard Mac OS X font in Sierra.

That would *seem* to indicate that the font is actually installed by
Microsoft Office and is only meant to be used within those apps.

Microsoft Office keeps its private fonts within folders inside the
individual application bundles (and DIN isn't included there), and I've
verified that the font *is* installed by the Sierra installer (both by
looking in the installer itself and by checking various VMs I have lying
around which don't have office installed). In addition, the version
number of the font corresponds to apple numbering schemes.

Unlike Pages, Textedit, etc., Office doesn't rely on CoreText to create
its font menus, but rather uses its own routines. I suspect that's why
the font shows up in Office applications.

I did a very quick search and didn't turn up anything saying it was a
known bug, let alone any mention of why or how to fix it in Sierra.
There were a few people complaining about particular fonts in older
verions of Mac OS X, where apparently a fix can be to delete certain
caches and plist file, and then repair permissions and reboot ... of
course Repair Permissions is no longer an option in Sierra.

It's very weird. :-\

In article ,
Your Name wrote:

On 2017-09-13 09:38:11 +0000, Andre G. Isaak said:

In article ,
Your Name wrote:

On 2017-09-12 20:18:54 +0000, David Empson said:
Andre G. Isaak wrote:
In article ,
(David Empson) wrote:
Andre G. Isaak wrote:
In article ,
Your Name wrote:
On 2017-09-12 00:31:19 +0000, Chaya Eve said:
On Mon, 11 Sep 2017 12:20:39 -0600, "Andre G. Isaak"

wrote:

I pointed out already that DIN *is* included with Macs.

Thanks for clarifying that a DIN font is included native with the
Mac. You're the only Mac expert here who knew that. Even the
Windows experts didn't know that a DIN 1451 compatible font exists
on Windows (named Barnshrift) until you mentioned the DIN
compatible font on the Mac.

Since the name may make all the difference in compatibility, do you
know the name of that DIN 1451 compatible font on the Mac?

There is no "DIN" font installed by default on the Mac. You can
download it and it may be installed by some third-party applications.

There are no doubt lots of fonts that are close enough to be
lookalikes.

I just double checked. DIN is definitely installed in /Library/Fonts.

I verified this against the Sierra and Yosemite installers. It is
present in both.

That is correct, but the font cannot be selected by the user in recent
OS versions: DIN Alternate Bold and DIN Condensed Bold don't show up in
Font Book, nor in font selection menus in application. They also don't
show up if attempting to install the same files as a user font.

This is a known bug. Simply rename the font files and they will work.

Thanks for clarifying it for me. Based on details in your other post, it
would be an easy bug for Apple to fix. Low priority, I suppose.

This is consisent with those fonts being retained for use in existing
documents when referenced by name, but not being available for use in
new documents, as described in the Sierra support document for a long
list of other fonts.

Compatibility fonts are stored in /Library/Application
Support/Apple/Fonts/ whereas DIN is installed in /Library/Fonts/

Good to know, thanks.

It still makes this font difficult to use for the application in
question, because the font will appear to be unavailable on the majority
of Macs unless someone jumps through hoops to install a renamed copy.

It also seems a bit peculiar that the DIN fonts (and a few others) *do*
appear in Microsoft Office apps^ and that they are no longer listed by
Apple as being a standard Mac OS X font in Sierra.

That would *seem* to indicate that the font is actually installed by
Microsoft Office and is only meant to be used within those apps.

Microsoft Office keeps its private fonts within folders inside the
individual application bundles (and DIN isn't included there), and I've
verified that the font *is* installed by the Sierra installer (both by
looking in the installer itself and by checking various VMs I have lying
around which don't have office installed). In addition, the version
number of the font corresponds to apple numbering schemes.

Unlike Pages, Textedit, etc., Office doesn't rely on CoreText to create
its font menus, but rather uses its own routines. I suspect that's why
the font shows up in Office applications.

I did a very quick search and didn't turn up anything saying it was a
known bug, let alone any mention of why or how to fix it in Sierra.
There were a few people complaining about particular fonts in older
verions of Mac OS X, where apparently a fix can be to delete certain
caches and plist file, and then repair permissions and reboot ... of
course Repair Permissions is no longer an option in Sierra.

It's very weird. :-\


It is discussed he

http://www.jklstudios.com/misc/osxfonts.html

This document, however, predates the problem with DIN. Search that page
for 'Athelas' for a description of the problem. It seems to affect
different fonts with each new release.

Andre

--
To email remove 'invalid' & replace 'gm' with well known Google mail service.