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[OT]: DNA pioneer James Watson stripped of honours after 'reckless'race remarks



 
 
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  #1  
Old January 13th 19, 04:23 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,talk.politics.misc,misc.survivalism
😉 Good Guy 😉
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Posts: 420
Default [OT]: DNA pioneer James Watson stripped of honours after 'reckless'race remarks

In the latest documentary, the molecular biologist says that genes
cause a difference on average between black people and white people in
IQ tests.


https://news.sky.com/story/dna-pioneer-james-watson-stripped-of-honours-after-reckless-race-remarks-11606108



--
With over 950 million devices now running Windows 10, customer
satisfaction is higher than any previous version of windows.

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  #2  
Old January 13th 19, 09:44 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,talk.politics.misc,misc.survivalism
Peter Jason
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Posts: 2,024
Default [OT]: DNA pioneer James Watson stripped of honours after 'reckless' race remarks

On Sun, 13 Jan 2019 03:23:51 +0000, ? Good Guy ?
wrote:

In the latest documentary, the molecular biologist says that genes
cause a difference on average between black people and white people in
IQ tests.


https://news.sky.com/story/dna-pioneer-james-watson-stripped-of-honours-after-reckless-race-remarks-11606108



Not the first man hanged for speaking up.
Ever since the end of colonialism in the 1960s
Africa has gone back to be the feotid steaming bog
of old, with any of its wealth ending up in Swiss
banks and overseas real estate.
  #3  
Old January 13th 19, 10:13 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,talk.politics.misc,misc.survivalism
😉 Good Guy 😉
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 420
Default [OT]: DNA pioneer James Watson stripped of honours after'reckless' race remarks

On 13/01/2019 20:44, Peter Jason wrote:

Not the first man hanged for speaking up.
Ever since the end of colonialism in the 1960s
Africa has gone back to be the feotid steaming bog
of old, with any of its wealth ending up in Swiss
banks and overseas real estate.


One thing I have noticed is that people talk about "unsupported by
science" but when somebody publishes a paper about these things, they
are fired or prosecuted or strip off everything they have achieved in
their lifetime like in this case!!. How can you you have scientific
evidence if the rules are against them and other scientists are not
allowed to continue with the research!!.

Mind you I am against anybody making any claims without proof but I
allow them to produce the proof which can be scrutinised by the
academics and people with the relevant experience and knowledge. I am
also against anybody silencing anybody who makes controversial
statements. People should be allowed to say whatever they want as long
as there a "right-of-reply" which is given equal prominence.


--
With over 950 million devices now running Windows 10, customer
satisfaction is higher than any previous version of windows.

  #4  
Old January 14th 19, 03:42 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,talk.politics.misc,misc.survivalism
Eric Stevens
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Posts: 301
Default [OT]: DNA pioneer James Watson stripped of honours after 'reckless' race remarks

On Sun, 13 Jan 2019 21:13:31 +0000, ? Good Guy ?
wrote:

On 13/01/2019 20:44, Peter Jason wrote:

Not the first man hanged for speaking up.
Ever since the end of colonialism in the 1960s
Africa has gone back to be the feotid steaming bog
of old, with any of its wealth ending up in Swiss
banks and overseas real estate.


One thing I have noticed is that people talk about "unsupported by
science" but when somebody publishes a paper about these things, they
are fired or prosecuted or strip off everything they have achieved in
their lifetime like in this case!!. How can you you have scientific
evidence if the rules are against them and other scientists are not
allowed to continue with the research!!.

Mind you I am against anybody making any claims without proof


Read 'The Bell Curve'.

but I
allow them to produce the proof which can be scrutinised by the
academics and people with the relevant experience and knowledge. I am
also against anybody silencing anybody who makes controversial
statements. People should be allowed to say whatever they want as long
as there a "right-of-reply" which is given equal prominence.

--

Regards,

Eric Stevens
  #5  
Old January 14th 19, 06:58 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,talk.politics.misc,misc.survivalism
Junco
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Posts: 3
Default [OT]: DNA pioneer James Watson stripped of honours after'reckless' race remarks

On 01/12/2019 07:23 PM, 😉 Good Guy 😉 wrote:
In the latest documentary, the molecular biologist says that genes
cause a difference on average between black people and white people in
IQ tests.


I see a great opportunity in this.
If we exported you from England to, say, Cameroon, we'd raise the
average IQ of both countries.

  #6  
Old January 14th 19, 08:44 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,talk.politics.misc,misc.survivalism
Martin Edwards[_2_]
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Posts: 33
Default [OT]: DNA pioneer James Watson stripped of honours after'reckless' race remarks

On 1/13/2019 8:44 PM, Peter Jason wrote:
On Sun, 13 Jan 2019 03:23:51 +0000, ? Good Guy ?
wrote:

In the latest documentary, the molecular biologist says that genes
cause a difference on average between black people and white people in
IQ tests.


https://news.sky.com/story/dna-pioneer-james-watson-stripped-of-honours-after-reckless-race-remarks-11606108



Not the first man hanged for speaking up.
Ever since the end of colonialism in the 1960s
Africa has gone back to be the feotid steaming bog
of old, with any of its wealth ending up in Swiss
banks and overseas real estate.

Apart from that how was your goat hunt?
  #7  
Old January 14th 19, 05:04 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,talk.politics.misc,misc.survivalism
nospam
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Posts: 2,508
Default [OT]: DNA pioneer James Watson stripped of honours after 'reckless' race remarks

In article , Wolf K
wrote:

You can't infer individual characteristics from a bell curve, or _any_
averages. Yet that is what proponents of "average scores" want to do.
Else why bother?

The fact is that a bell curve means there are multiple factors affecting
the thing you're measuring. You don't know what those factors are.


not always. sometimes it's just one variable.

What's more, it's devilishly difficult to figure out what those factors
might be, and to discover the extent of their influence. What's more,
you can be sure that any one factor's effect will depend on at least one
other factor's effect.


if it's more than one, that's true, but that's not always the case.
  #8  
Old January 14th 19, 06:16 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,talk.politics.misc,misc.survivalism
Ant Man
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Posts: 1
Default [OT]: DNA pioneer James Watson stripped of honours after 'reckless' race remarks

On Sun, 13 Jan 2019 21:58:27 -0800, Junco wrote:

On 01/12/2019 07:23 PM, ? Good Guy ? wrote:
In the latest documentary, the molecular biologist says that genes
cause a difference on average between black people and white people in
IQ tests.


I see a great opportunity in this.
If we exported you from England to, say, Cameroon, we'd raise the
average IQ of both countries.


Pithy and insightful. Kudos.

  #9  
Old January 14th 19, 09:39 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,talk.politics.misc,misc.survivalism
Peter Jason
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Posts: 2,024
Default [OT]: DNA pioneer James Watson stripped of honours after 'reckless' race remarks

On Mon, 14 Jan 2019 07:44:02 +0000, Martin Edwards
wrote:

On 1/13/2019 8:44 PM, Peter Jason wrote:
On Sun, 13 Jan 2019 03:23:51 +0000, ? Good Guy ?
wrote:

In the latest documentary, the molecular biologist says that genes
cause a difference on average between black people and white people in
IQ tests.

https://news.sky.com/story/dna-pioneer-james-watson-stripped-of-honours-after-reckless-race-remarks-11606108



Not the first man hanged for speaking up.
Ever since the end of colonialism in the 1960s
Africa has gone back to be the feotid steaming bog
of old, with any of its wealth ending up in Swiss
banks and overseas real estate.

Apart from that how was your goat hunt?


Rhodesia?

  #10  
Old January 15th 19, 03:33 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Jim H[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 42
Default [OT]: DNA pioneer James Watson stripped of honours after 'reckless' race remarks

The author has marked this message not to be archived. This post will be deleted on January 22, 2019.

On Mon, 14 Jan 2019 10:14:30 -0500, in
, Wolf K wrote:

On 2019-01-13 21:42, Eric Stevens wrote:
On Sun, 13 Jan 2019 21:13:31 +0000, ? Good Guy ?
wrote:

On 13/01/2019 20:44, Peter Jason wrote:

Not the first man hanged for speaking up.
Ever since the end of colonialism in the 1960s
Africa has gone back to be the feotid steaming bog
of old, with any of its wealth ending up in Swiss
banks and overseas real estate.

One thing I have noticed is that people talk about "unsupported by
science" but when somebody publishes a paper about these things, they
are fired or prosecuted or strip off everything they have achieved in
their lifetime like in this case!!. How can you you have scientific
evidence if the rules are against them and other scientists are not
allowed to continue with the research!!.

Mind you I am against anybody making any claims without proof


Read 'The Bell Curve'.


You can't infer individual characteristics from a bell curve, or _any_
averages. Yet that is what proponents of "average scores" want to do.
Else why bother?


"The Bell Curve" is the title of a book.

If this subject interests you it's a "must read." No cavalier
assertions, plenty of data, and an appropriate concern for the
societal implications. The deniers of the former make addressing the
latter much more difficult.


--
Jim H
  #11  
Old January 15th 19, 03:53 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
😉 Good Guy 😉
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 420
Default [OT]: DNA pioneer James Watson stripped of honours after'reckless' race remarks

On 15/01/2019 02:33, Jim H wrote:
"The Bell Curve" is the title of a book.


Of course I know that. That is why I created the post in the first
place to high-light how much the society has changed or NOT changed
since the mass migration began.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Bell-Curve-Intelligence-Structure-Paperbacks/dp/0684824299

It seems people are more politically correct these days than they were
in the 80's and 90s. Read the reviews:

Milton Friedman This brilliant, original, objective, and lucidly
written book will force you to rethink your biases and prejudices
about the role that individual difference in intelligence plays in our
economy, our policy, and our society.

Michael Novak /National Review/ Our intellectual landscape has been
disrupted by the equivalent of an earthquake.

David Brooks /The Wall Street Journal/ Has already kicked up more
reaction than any social?science book this decade.

Peter Brimelow /Forbes/ Long-awaited...massive, meticulous, minutely
detailed, clear. Like Darwin's /Origin of Species/ -- the intellectual
event with which it is being seriously compared -- /The Bell Curve/
offers a new synthesis of research...and a hypothesis of far-reaching
explanatory power.

Prof. Thomas J. Bouchard /Contemporary Psychology/ [The authors] have
been cast as racists and elitists and /The Bell Curve/ has been
dismissed as pseudoscience....The book's message cannot be dismissed
so easily. Herrnstein and Murray have written one of the most
provocative social science books published in many years....This is a
superbly written and exceedingly well documented book.

Christopher Caldwell /American Spectator The Bell Curve/ is a
comprehensive treatment of its subject, never mean-spirited or
gloating. It gives a fair hearing to those who dissent scientifically
from its propositions -- in fact, it bends over backward to be
fair....Among the dozens of hostile articles that have thus far
appeared, none has successfully refuted any of its science.

Prof. Eugene D. Genovese /National Review/ Richard Herrnstein and
Charles Murray might not feel at home with Daniel Patrick Moynihan and
Lani Guinier, but they should....They have all [made] brave attempts
to force a national debate on urgent matters that will not go away.
And they have met the same fate. Once again, academia and the mass
media are straining every muscle to suppress debate.

Chester E. Finn, Jr. /Commentary The Bell Curve's/ implications will
be as profound for the beginning of the new century as Michael
Harrington's discovery of "the other America" was for the final part
of the old. Richard Herrnstein's bequest to us is a work of great
value. Charles Murray's contribution goes on.

Malcolme W. Browne /The New York Times Book Review/ Mr. Murray and Mr.
Herrnstein write that "for the last 30 years, the concept of
intelligence has been a pariah in the world of ideas," and that the
time has come to rehabilitate rational discourse on the subject. It is
hard to imagine a democratic society doing otherwise.

Prof. Earl Hunt /American Scientist/ The first reactions to /The Bell
Curve/ were expressions of public outrage. In the second round of
reaction, some commentators suggested that Herrnstein and Murray were
merely bringing up facts that were well known in the scientific
community, but perhaps best not discussed in public. A Papua New
Guinea language has a term for this, /Mokita./ It means "truth that we
all know, but agree not to talk about." ...There are fascinating
questions here for those interested in the interactions between
sociology, economics, anthropology and cognitive science. We do not
have the answers yet. We may need them soon, for policy makers who
rely on /Mokita/ are flying blind.



Academics need to be protected if we want to advance our knowledge. They
should be allowed to say or write anything within the confines of
academic research. At present they are fired; Even holocaust deniers
should be allowed to espouse their theories and debated. i know this is
not very popular to say but that is what we should aim as far as
possible. If we don't then the Chinese will do so and then we would all
be slaves of them. They will have advanced science and technology and
we would all be struggling with Windows 10 updates!!.



--
With over 950 million devices now running Windows 10, customer
satisfaction is higher than any previous version of windows.

  #12  
Old January 15th 19, 08:46 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,talk.politics.misc,misc.survivalism
Martin Edwards[_2_]
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Posts: 33
Default [OT]: DNA pioneer James Watson stripped of honours after'reckless' race remarks

On 1/14/2019 4:04 PM, nospam wrote:
In article , Wolf K
wrote:

You can't infer individual characteristics from a bell curve, or _any_
averages. Yet that is what proponents of "average scores" want to do.
Else why bother?

The fact is that a bell curve means there are multiple factors affecting
the thing you're measuring. You don't know what those factors are.


not always. sometimes it's just one variable.

What's more, it's devilishly difficult to figure out what those factors
might be, and to discover the extent of their influence. What's more,
you can be sure that any one factor's effect will depend on at least one
other factor's effect.


if it's more than one, that's true, but that's not always the case.

In my teaching days one head wanted exam scores to come under a bell
curve. When some of mine didn't a senior teacher told me to change
them. No disrespect, he was only obeying orders.
  #13  
Old January 15th 19, 08:48 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,talk.politics.misc,misc.survivalism
Martin Edwards[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 33
Default [OT]: DNA pioneer James Watson stripped of honours after'reckless' race remarks

On 1/14/2019 8:39 PM, Peter Jason wrote:
On Mon, 14 Jan 2019 07:44:02 +0000, Martin Edwards
wrote:

On 1/13/2019 8:44 PM, Peter Jason wrote:
On Sun, 13 Jan 2019 03:23:51 +0000, ? Good Guy ?
wrote:

In the latest documentary, the molecular biologist says that genes
cause a difference on average between black people and white people in
IQ tests.

https://news.sky.com/story/dna-pioneer-james-watson-stripped-of-honours-after-reckless-race-remarks-11606108


Not the first man hanged for speaking up.
Ever since the end of colonialism in the 1960s
Africa has gone back to be the feotid steaming bog
of old, with any of its wealth ending up in Swiss
banks and overseas real estate.

Apart from that how was your goat hunt?


Rhodesia?

See Ghana. It is now a democracy and has had governments of different
ideological tendency. It was the first of ours to go free. These
things take time.
  #14  
Old January 16th 19, 01:14 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,talk.politics.misc,misc.survivalism
Eric Stevens
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Posts: 301
Default [OT]: DNA pioneer James Watson stripped of honours after 'reckless' race remarks

On Mon, 14 Jan 2019 10:14:30 -0500, Wolf K
wrote:

On 2019-01-13 21:42, Eric Stevens wrote:
On Sun, 13 Jan 2019 21:13:31 +0000, ? Good Guy ?
wrote:

On 13/01/2019 20:44, Peter Jason wrote:

Not the first man hanged for speaking up.
Ever since the end of colonialism in the 1960s
Africa has gone back to be the feotid steaming bog
of old, with any of its wealth ending up in Swiss
banks and overseas real estate.

One thing I have noticed is that people talk about "unsupported by
science" but when somebody publishes a paper about these things, they
are fired or prosecuted or strip off everything they have achieved in
their lifetime like in this case!!. How can you you have scientific
evidence if the rules are against them and other scientists are not
allowed to continue with the research!!.

Mind you I am against anybody making any claims without proof


Read 'The Bell Curve'.


You can't infer individual characteristics from a bell curve, or _any_
averages. Yet that is what proponents of "average scores" want to do.
Else why bother?

Good Guy said " I am against anybody making any claims without proof".
I merely gave him a reference to someone who had. Make what you like
of it.

The fact is that a bell curve means there are multiple factors affecting
the thing you're measuring. You don't know what those factors are.
What's more, it's devilishly difficult to figure out what those factors
might be, and to discover the extent of their influence. What's more,
you can be sure that any one factor's effect will depend on at least one
other factor's effect.

The difficulty is especially the case when you are measuring the end
result of of some developmental process. Eg, consider height. Suppose
you find that Italians on average are shorter than Swedes. Check the
overlap of the two bell curves. If the averages are 1 SD or less apart,
then the majority of each group will be within the same range of
heights. You'll find more of one or the other only at the extremes (and
even there, the differences will be small). The same goes for
differences in any other measurable feature.

There are studies that claim to quantify the effects of environment and
genetics on human development. Problem is, the effect of genetics
depends on the environment, and vice versa. Take height again: If you
don't get enough food while growing up, you will not reach the
genetically determined limit of your height. And that's a simple
relationship. Most of our traits depend on the interactions of genes
with the environment and other genes; and for many of these, there's a
timetable.

Sure, there are more tall black NBA players than white ones. But while
height is very useful if you want to play basketball, it's not enough.
That's why most tall people, of any race, do not become NBA players.


That, and the fact that reaching the top in the NBA is not the
ultimate ambition of many people.

but I
allow them to produce the proof which can be scrutinised by the
academics and people with the relevant experience and knowledge. I am
also against anybody silencing anybody who makes controversial
statements. People should be allowed to say whatever they want as long
as there a "right-of-reply" which is given equal prominence.


Allow the converse: any quack or nutbar then has the right to "reply" to
well-supported insights with his nonsense, and has the right to claim
equal prominence. Yup, and that's why so many people these days believe
and disbelieve whatever they want.

Slow, careful analysis takes time and effort. It also takes a kind of
humility: accepting that your gut feelings are wrong is difficult.

Conversely, accepting that the result of a slow and careful analysis is
wrong is probably even more difficult.

Both methods of arriving at the truth suffer from the same two fatal
flaws: a) the available evidence is always limited; and b) a single
"inconvenient fact" is enough to destroy the inference.

The best we can do is an approximation to the truth. (And the past
century's work on the foundations of math/logic imply that not even
axiomatic systems are exempt from this uncomfortable insight.)

--

Regards,

Eric Stevens
  #15  
Old January 16th 19, 01:15 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,talk.politics.misc,misc.survivalism
Eric Stevens
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Posts: 301
Default [OT]: DNA pioneer James Watson stripped of honours after 'reckless' race remarks

On Tue, 15 Jan 2019 07:46:16 +0000, Martin Edwards
wrote:

On 1/14/2019 4:04 PM, nospam wrote:
In article , Wolf K
wrote:

You can't infer individual characteristics from a bell curve, or _any_
averages. Yet that is what proponents of "average scores" want to do.
Else why bother?

The fact is that a bell curve means there are multiple factors affecting
the thing you're measuring. You don't know what those factors are.


not always. sometimes it's just one variable.

What's more, it's devilishly difficult to figure out what those factors
might be, and to discover the extent of their influence. What's more,
you can be sure that any one factor's effect will depend on at least one
other factor's effect.


if it's more than one, that's true, but that's not always the case.

In my teaching days one head wanted exam scores to come under a bell
curve. When some of mine didn't a senior teacher told me to change
them. No disrespect, he was only obeying orders.


Heil!
--

Regards,

Eric Stevens
 




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