If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below. |
|
|
|
Thread Tools | Display Modes |
#1
|
|||
|
|||
MS says pirating is illegal, but are their PA rules illegal?
Basically, I've heard both sides of the story, but I want to confirm if the following is true:
MS's product activation rules are illegal because: The law says: "Title 17, Chapter 1, Section 117. - Limitations on exclusive rights: Computer programs (a) Making of Additional Copy or Adaptation by Owner of Copy. - Notwithstanding the provisions of section 106, it is not an infringement for the owner of a copy of a computer program to make or authorize the making of another copy or adaptation of that computer program provided: (1) that such a new copy or adaptation is created as an essential step in the utilization of the computer program in conjunction with a machine and that it is used in no other manner, or (2) that such new copy or adaptation is for archival purposes only and that all archival copies are destroyed in the event that continued possession of the computer program should cease to be rightful. MS Says: The following is a translation of Section 117 (a) from the legalese using MS's own definitions: Title 17 Chapter 1 Section 117. - Limitations on the exclusive rights of Copyright Owners: Computer programs (a) Making of Additional Installation by the Owner of a Copy of Software. - It is not infringement for the owner of a copy of software to make another installation provided: (1) that such a new installation is made as a necessary step in making use of the software together with a previously unknown computer and that it is used in no other manner, or "(2) that such new copy or adaptation is for archival purposes only and that all archival copies are destroyed in the event that continued possession of the computer program should cease to be rightful" So if this is true, how is MS *legally* allowed to enforce the EULA, and Product Activation? And if it is, could MS be sued if they won't let you activate? As well, provided this is true, how come the government hasn't stepped in to say, "Sorry MS, you can't prevent users from installing an additional copy for home and private use"? I'm not taking sides, but I will admit, this is pretty convincing to me. -- Member of "Newsgroups are for everyone" (Perdita X. Dream is a self-righteous, ruthless net-cop too!) Email address is fake to prevent SPAM. Real email address is pcyr2000 AT hotmail DOT com Change the obvious to the obvious. ------------------ |
Ads |
#2
|
|||
|
|||
MS says pirating is illegal, but are their PA rules illegal?
On Mon, 4 Aug 2003 12:08:44 -0400, PCyr pondered exceedingly, then took quill in
hand and carefully composed... | Basically, I've heard both sides of the story, but I want to confirm if the following is true: | MS's product activation rules are illegal because: | | The law says: | "Title 17, Chapter 1, Section 117. - Limitations on exclusive rights: Computer programs | | (a) Making of Additional Copy or Adaptation by Owner of Copy. - Notwithstanding the provisions of section 106, it is not an infringement for the owner of a copy of a computer program to make or authorize the making of another copy or adaptation of that computer program provided: | | (1) that such a new copy or adaptation is created as an essential step in the utilization of the computer program in conjunction with a machine and that it is used in no other manner, or | | (2) that such new copy or adaptation is for archival purposes only and that all archival copies are destroyed in the event that continued possession of the computer program should cease to be rightful. | | MS Says: | | The following is a translation of Section 117 (a) from the legalese using MS's own definitions: | | Title 17 Chapter 1 Section 117. - Limitations on the exclusive rights of Copyright Owners: Computer programs | | (a) Making of Additional Installation by the Owner of a Copy of Software. - It is not infringement for the owner of a copy of software to make another installation provided: | | (1) that such a new installation is made as a necessary step in making use of the software together with a previously unknown computer and that it is used in no other manner, or | | "(2) that such new copy or adaptation is for archival purposes only and that all archival copies are destroyed in the event that continued possession of the computer program should cease to be rightful" | | | So if this is true, how is MS *legally* allowed to enforce the EULA, and Product Activation? All this says is that it's legal for you to make a copy of your XP install CD. It doesn't say anything about installing XP on a second computer. Microsoft has never said it's not OK to copy the CD. In fact, the install copy of XP I would use if I needed to re-install is one I burned with SP1 slipstreamed in. The original CD is stored for safekeeping. Larc §§§ - Please raise temperature of mail to reply by e-mail - §§§ |
#3
|
|||
|
|||
MS says pirating is illegal, but are their PA rules illegal?
What you've quoted discusses making a copy of the software, which has
nothing to do with WPA. You make a copy of the CD, put it in your safe, and that's that. Activation doesn't come into play when you're making a copy of the disk. Or is there some other point here that I've missed? "PCyr" wrote in message ... Basically, I've heard both sides of the story, but I want to confirm if the following is true: MS's product activation rules are illegal because: The law says: "Title 17, Chapter 1, Section 117. - Limitations on exclusive rights: Computer programs (a) Making of Additional Copy or Adaptation by Owner of Copy. - Notwithstanding the provisions of section 106, it is not an infringement for the owner of a copy of a computer program to make or authorize the making of another copy or adaptation of that computer program provided: (1) that such a new copy or adaptation is created as an essential step in the utilization of the computer program in conjunction with a machine and that it is used in no other manner, or (2) that such new copy or adaptation is for archival purposes only and that all archival copies are destroyed in the event that continued possession of the computer program should cease to be rightful. MS Says: The following is a translation of Section 117 (a) from the legalese using MS's own definitions: Title 17 Chapter 1 Section 117. - Limitations on the exclusive rights of Copyright Owners: Computer programs (a) Making of Additional Installation by the Owner of a Copy of Software. - It is not infringement for the owner of a copy of software to make another installation provided: (1) that such a new installation is made as a necessary step in making use of the software together with a previously unknown computer and that it is used in no other manner, or "(2) that such new copy or adaptation is for archival purposes only and that all archival copies are destroyed in the event that continued possession of the computer program should cease to be rightful" So if this is true, how is MS *legally* allowed to enforce the EULA, and Product Activation? And if it is, could MS be sued if they won't let you activate? As well, provided this is true, how come the government hasn't stepped in to say, "Sorry MS, you can't prevent users from installing an additional copy for home and private use"? I'm not taking sides, but I will admit, this is pretty convincing to me. -- Member of "Newsgroups are for everyone" (Perdita X. Dream is a self-righteous, ruthless net-cop too!) Email address is fake to prevent SPAM. Real email address is pcyr2000 AT hotmail DOT com Change the obvious to the obvious. ------------------ |
#4
|
|||
|
|||
MS says pirating is illegal, but are their PA rules illegal?
This is talking about making copies of the software installation media, not
day to day running of the software. "PCyr" wrote in message ... Basically, I've heard both sides of the story, but I want to confirm if the following is true: MS's product activation rules are illegal because: The law says: "Title 17, Chapter 1, Section 117. - Limitations on exclusive rights: Computer programs (a) Making of Additional Copy or Adaptation by Owner of Copy. - Notwithstanding the provisions of section 106, it is not an infringement for the owner of a copy of a computer program to make or authorize the making of another copy or adaptation of that computer program provided: (1) that such a new copy or adaptation is created as an essential step in the utilization of the computer program in conjunction with a machine and that it is used in no other manner, or (2) that such new copy or adaptation is for archival purposes only and that all archival copies are destroyed in the event that continued possession of the computer program should cease to be rightful. MS Says: The following is a translation of Section 117 (a) from the legalese using MS's own definitions: Title 17 Chapter 1 Section 117. - Limitations on the exclusive rights of Copyright Owners: Computer programs (a) Making of Additional Installation by the Owner of a Copy of Software. - It is not infringement for the owner of a copy of software to make another installation provided: (1) that such a new installation is made as a necessary step in making use of the software together with a previously unknown computer and that it is used in no other manner, or "(2) that such new copy or adaptation is for archival purposes only and that all archival copies are destroyed in the event that continued possession of the computer program should cease to be rightful" So if this is true, how is MS *legally* allowed to enforce the EULA, and Product Activation? And if it is, could MS be sued if they won't let you activate? As well, provided this is true, how come the government hasn't stepped in to say, "Sorry MS, you can't prevent users from installing an additional copy for home and private use"? I'm not taking sides, but I will admit, this is pretty convincing to me. -- Member of "Newsgroups are for everyone" (Perdita X. Dream is a self-righteous, ruthless net-cop too!) Email address is fake to prevent SPAM. Real email address is pcyr2000 AT hotmail DOT com Change the obvious to the obvious. ------------------ |
#6
|
|||
|
|||
MS says pirating is illegal, but are their PA rules illegal?
Microsoft hires a bevy of highly paid and highly skilled lawyers. You could
however take the EULA into a high price corporate law firm and see what they have to say about it if you think you can make a case. Just remember to bring your platinum card 8^) -- Harry Ohrn MS-MVP [Shell\User] www.webtree.ca/windowsxp "PCyr" wrote in message ... Basically, I've heard both sides of the story, but I want to confirm if the following is true: MS's product activation rules are illegal because: The law says: "Title 17, Chapter 1, Section 117. - Limitations on exclusive rights: Computer programs (a) Making of Additional Copy or Adaptation by Owner of Copy. - Notwithstanding the provisions of section 106, it is not an infringement for the owner of a copy of a computer program to make or authorize the making of another copy or adaptation of that computer program provided: (1) that such a new copy or adaptation is created as an essential step in the utilization of the computer program in conjunction with a machine and that it is used in no other manner, or (2) that such new copy or adaptation is for archival purposes only and that all archival copies are destroyed in the event that continued possession of the computer program should cease to be rightful. MS Says: The following is a translation of Section 117 (a) from the legalese using MS's own definitions: Title 17 Chapter 1 Section 117. - Limitations on the exclusive rights of Copyright Owners: Computer programs (a) Making of Additional Installation by the Owner of a Copy of Software. - It is not infringement for the owner of a copy of software to make another installation provided: (1) that such a new installation is made as a necessary step in making use of the software together with a previously unknown computer and that it is used in no other manner, or "(2) that such new copy or adaptation is for archival purposes only and that all archival copies are destroyed in the event that continued possession of the computer program should cease to be rightful" So if this is true, how is MS *legally* allowed to enforce the EULA, and Product Activation? And if it is, could MS be sued if they won't let you activate? As well, provided this is true, how come the government hasn't stepped in to say, "Sorry MS, you can't prevent users from installing an additional copy for home and private use"? I'm not taking sides, but I will admit, this is pretty convincing to me. -- Member of "Newsgroups are for everyone" (Perdita X. Dream is a self-righteous, ruthless net-cop too!) Email address is fake to prevent SPAM. Real email address is pcyr2000 AT hotmail DOT com Change the obvious to the obvious. ------------------ |
#7
|
|||
|
|||
MS says pirating is illegal, but are their PA rules illegal?
Sorry, I was talking about installing an additional copy for private home
use. Since the law says (1) that such a new copy or adaptation is created as an essential step in the utilization of the computer program in conjunction with a machine and that it is used in no other manner. -- Member of "Newsgroups are for everyone" (Perdita X. Dream is a self-righteous, ruthless net-cop too!) Email address is fake to prevent SPAM. Real email address is pcyr2000 AT hotmail DOT com Change the obvious to the obvious. ------------------ "Larc" wrote in message ... On Mon, 4 Aug 2003 12:08:44 -0400, PCyr pondered exceedingly, then took quill in hand and carefully composed... | Basically, I've heard both sides of the story, but I want to confirm if the following is true: | MS's product activation rules are illegal because: | | The law says: | "Title 17, Chapter 1, Section 117. - Limitations on exclusive rights: Computer programs | | (a) Making of Additional Copy or Adaptation by Owner of Copy. - Notwithstanding the provisions of section 106, it is not an infringement for the owner of a copy of a computer program to make or authorize the making of another copy or adaptation of that computer program provided: | | (1) that such a new copy or adaptation is created as an essential step in the utilization of the computer program in conjunction with a machine and that it is used in no other manner, or | | (2) that such new copy or adaptation is for archival purposes only and that all archival copies are destroyed in the event that continued possession of the computer program should cease to be rightful. | | MS Says: | | The following is a translation of Section 117 (a) from the legalese using MS's own definitions: | | Title 17 Chapter 1 Section 117. - Limitations on the exclusive rights of Copyright Owners: Computer programs | | (a) Making of Additional Installation by the Owner of a Copy of Software. - It is not infringement for the owner of a copy of software to make another installation provided: | | (1) that such a new installation is made as a necessary step in making use of the software together with a previously unknown computer and that it is used in no other manner, or | | "(2) that such new copy or adaptation is for archival purposes only and that all archival copies are destroyed in the event that continued possession of the computer program should cease to be rightful" | | | So if this is true, how is MS *legally* allowed to enforce the EULA, and Product Activation? All this says is that it's legal for you to make a copy of your XP install CD. It doesn't say anything about installing XP on a second computer. Microsoft has never said it's not OK to copy the CD. In fact, the install copy of XP I would use if I needed to re-install is one I burned with SP1 slipstreamed in. The original CD is stored for safekeeping. Larc §§§ - Please raise temperature of mail to reply by e-mail - §§§ |
#8
|
|||
|
|||
MS says pirating is illegal, but are their PA rules illegal?
Sorry, I was talking about installing an additional copy for private home
use. Since the law says (1) that such a new copy or adaptation is created as an essential step in the utilization of the computer program in conjunction with a machine and that it is used in no other manner. -- Member of "Newsgroups are for everyone" (Perdita X. Dream is a self-righteous, ruthless net-cop too!) Email address is fake to prevent SPAM. Real email address is pcyr2000 AT hotmail DOT com Change the obvious to the obvious. ------------------ "Robert Moir" wrote in message ... This is talking about making copies of the software installation media, not day to day running of the software. "PCyr" wrote in message ... Basically, I've heard both sides of the story, but I want to confirm if the following is true: MS's product activation rules are illegal because: The law says: "Title 17, Chapter 1, Section 117. - Limitations on exclusive rights: Computer programs (a) Making of Additional Copy or Adaptation by Owner of Copy. - Notwithstanding the provisions of section 106, it is not an infringement for the owner of a copy of a computer program to make or authorize the making of another copy or adaptation of that computer program provided: (1) that such a new copy or adaptation is created as an essential step in the utilization of the computer program in conjunction with a machine and that it is used in no other manner, or (2) that such new copy or adaptation is for archival purposes only and that all archival copies are destroyed in the event that continued possession of the computer program should cease to be rightful. MS Says: The following is a translation of Section 117 (a) from the legalese using MS's own definitions: Title 17 Chapter 1 Section 117. - Limitations on the exclusive rights of Copyright Owners: Computer programs (a) Making of Additional Installation by the Owner of a Copy of Software. - It is not infringement for the owner of a copy of software to make another installation provided: (1) that such a new installation is made as a necessary step in making use of the software together with a previously unknown computer and that it is used in no other manner, or "(2) that such new copy or adaptation is for archival purposes only and that all archival copies are destroyed in the event that continued possession of the computer program should cease to be rightful" So if this is true, how is MS *legally* allowed to enforce the EULA, and Product Activation? And if it is, could MS be sued if they won't let you activate? As well, provided this is true, how come the government hasn't stepped in to say, "Sorry MS, you can't prevent users from installing an additional copy for home and private use"? I'm not taking sides, but I will admit, this is pretty convincing to me. -- Member of "Newsgroups are for everyone" (Perdita X. Dream is a self-righteous, ruthless net-cop too!) Email address is fake to prevent SPAM. Real email address is pcyr2000 AT hotmail DOT com Change the obvious to the obvious. ------------------ |
#9
|
|||
|
|||
MS says pirating is illegal, but are their PA rules illegal?
Sorry, I was talking about installing an additional copy for private home
use. Since the law says (1) that such a new copy or adaptation is created as an essential step in the utilization of the computer program in conjunction with a machine and that it is used in no other manner. -- Member of "Newsgroups are for everyone" (Perdita X. Dream is a self-righteous, ruthless net-cop too!) Email address is fake to prevent SPAM. Real email address is pcyr2000 AT hotmail DOT com Change the obvious to the obvious. ------------------ "D.Currie" wrote in message ... What you've quoted discusses making a copy of the software, which has nothing to do with WPA. You make a copy of the CD, put it in your safe, and that's that. Activation doesn't come into play when you're making a copy of the disk. Or is there some other point here that I've missed? "PCyr" wrote in message ... Basically, I've heard both sides of the story, but I want to confirm if the following is true: MS's product activation rules are illegal because: The law says: "Title 17, Chapter 1, Section 117. - Limitations on exclusive rights: Computer programs (a) Making of Additional Copy or Adaptation by Owner of Copy. - Notwithstanding the provisions of section 106, it is not an infringement for the owner of a copy of a computer program to make or authorize the making of another copy or adaptation of that computer program provided: (1) that such a new copy or adaptation is created as an essential step in the utilization of the computer program in conjunction with a machine and that it is used in no other manner, or (2) that such new copy or adaptation is for archival purposes only and that all archival copies are destroyed in the event that continued possession of the computer program should cease to be rightful. MS Says: The following is a translation of Section 117 (a) from the legalese using MS's own definitions: Title 17 Chapter 1 Section 117. - Limitations on the exclusive rights of Copyright Owners: Computer programs (a) Making of Additional Installation by the Owner of a Copy of Software. - It is not infringement for the owner of a copy of software to make another installation provided: (1) that such a new installation is made as a necessary step in making use of the software together with a previously unknown computer and that it is used in no other manner, or "(2) that such new copy or adaptation is for archival purposes only and that all archival copies are destroyed in the event that continued possession of the computer program should cease to be rightful" So if this is true, how is MS *legally* allowed to enforce the EULA, and Product Activation? And if it is, could MS be sued if they won't let you activate? As well, provided this is true, how come the government hasn't stepped in to say, "Sorry MS, you can't prevent users from installing an additional copy for home and private use"? I'm not taking sides, but I will admit, this is pretty convincing to me. -- Member of "Newsgroups are for everyone" (Perdita X. Dream is a self-righteous, ruthless net-cop too!) Email address is fake to prevent SPAM. Real email address is pcyr2000 AT hotmail DOT com Change the obvious to the obvious. ------------------ |
#10
|
|||
|
|||
MS says pirating is illegal, but are their PA rules illegal?
"PCyr" wrote in message
... Sorry, I was talking about installing an additional copy for private home use. Since the law says (1) that such a new copy or adaptation is created as an essential step in the utilization of the computer program in conjunction with a machine and that it is used in no other manner. PCyr, If you are in any doubt about the legality and enforcement of the EULA or the use of any terms there in. I suggest rather then us all going around in circles you do one of 2 things. 1. Take professional qualified legal advice 2. Contact Microsoft Legal and Corporate Affairs at the Head Office address and ask your questions of them. Advice sort in a peer to peer technical support forum will not be of sound legal standing unless given by either a properly qualified individual or a member of Microsoft LCA. Also it was not necessary to cross post to so many unrelated forums. -- Regards, Mike -- Mike Brannigan [Microsoft] This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights Please note I cannot respond to e-mailed questions, please use these newsgroups "PCyr" wrote in message ... Sorry, I was talking about installing an additional copy for private home use. Since the law says (1) that such a new copy or adaptation is created as an essential step in the utilization of the computer program in conjunction with a machine and that it is used in no other manner. -- Member of "Newsgroups are for everyone" (Perdita X. Dream is a self-righteous, ruthless net-cop too!) Email address is fake to prevent SPAM. Real email address is pcyr2000 AT hotmail DOT com Change the obvious to the obvious. ------------------ "Larc" wrote in message ... On Mon, 4 Aug 2003 12:08:44 -0400, PCyr pondered exceedingly, then took quill in hand and carefully composed... | Basically, I've heard both sides of the story, but I want to confirm if the following is true: | MS's product activation rules are illegal because: | | The law says: | "Title 17, Chapter 1, Section 117. - Limitations on exclusive rights: Computer programs | | (a) Making of Additional Copy or Adaptation by Owner of Copy. - Notwithstanding the provisions of section 106, it is not an infringement for the owner of a copy of a computer program to make or authorize the making of another copy or adaptation of that computer program provided: | | (1) that such a new copy or adaptation is created as an essential step in the utilization of the computer program in conjunction with a machine and that it is used in no other manner, or | | (2) that such new copy or adaptation is for archival purposes only and that all archival copies are destroyed in the event that continued possession of the computer program should cease to be rightful. | | MS Says: | | The following is a translation of Section 117 (a) from the legalese using MS's own definitions: | | Title 17 Chapter 1 Section 117. - Limitations on the exclusive rights of Copyright Owners: Computer programs | | (a) Making of Additional Installation by the Owner of a Copy of Software. - It is not infringement for the owner of a copy of software to make another installation provided: | | (1) that such a new installation is made as a necessary step in making use of the software together with a previously unknown computer and that it is used in no other manner, or | | "(2) that such new copy or adaptation is for archival purposes only and that all archival copies are destroyed in the event that continued possession of the computer program should cease to be rightful" | | | So if this is true, how is MS *legally* allowed to enforce the EULA, and Product Activation? All this says is that it's legal for you to make a copy of your XP install CD. It doesn't say anything about installing XP on a second computer. Microsoft has never said it's not OK to copy the CD. In fact, the install copy of XP I would use if I needed to re-install is one I burned with SP1 slipstreamed in. The original CD is stored for safekeeping. Larc §§§ - Please raise temperature of mail to reply by e-mail - §§§ |
#11
|
|||
|
|||
MS says pirating is illegal, but are their PA rules illegal?
PCyr wrote:
Sorry, I was talking about installing an additional copy for private home use. Since the law says (1) that such a new copy or adaptation is created as an essential step in the utilization of the computer program in conjunction with a machine and that it is used in no other manner. I'm well aware of that. None the less, my comments still stand as my opinion. If you want to discuss the matter seriously you should certainly take up Mike's advice too. I'm not a lawyer in my country let alone yours. |
#12
|
|||
|
|||
MS says pirating is illegal, but are their PA rules illegal?
"Larc" wrote in message
... On Mon, 4 Aug 2003 12:08:44 -0400, PCyr pondered exceedingly, then took quill in hand and carefully composed... | Basically, I've heard both sides of the story, but I want to confirm if the following is true: | MS's product activation rules are illegal because: | | The law says: | "Title 17, Chapter 1, Section 117. - Limitations on exclusive rights: Computer programs SNIP All this says is that it's legal for you to make a copy of your XP install CD. It doesn't say anything about installing XP on a second computer. Microsoft has never said it's not OK to copy the CD. In fact, the install copy of XP I would use if I needed to re-install is one I burned with SP1 slipstreamed in. The original CD is stored for safekeeping. Larc §§§ - Please raise temperature of mail to reply by e-mail - §§§ "I burned with SP1 slipstreamed in" Do you have a link telling how to do this?? thanks George Girard, Programmer/FiddlerArounder, Your Current Internet Information can be found he http://www.canufly.net/~georgegg/You...et.Information http://www.canufly.net/~georgegg/dns/Dns.Whois.Nslookup |
#13
|
|||
|
|||
MS says pirating is illegal, but are their PA rules illegal?
On Mon, 04 Aug 2003 21:57:47 GMT, george pondered exceedingly, then took quill
in hand and carefully composed... | "I burned with SP1 slipstreamed in" | Do you have a link telling how to do this?? Sure. Go to this page and look under Guide in the left column. You'll find links to slipstreaming SP1 into XP and burning a bootable CD using EZ CD Creator or Nero. http://www.etplanet.com/ Larc §§§ - Please raise temperature of mail to reply by e-mail - §§§ |
#14
|
|||
|
|||
MS says pirating is illegal, but are their PA rules illegal?
"PCyr" wrote in
: Sorry, I was talking about installing an additional copy for private home use. Since the law says (1) that such a new copy or adaptation is created as an essential step in the utilization of the computer program in conjunction with a machine and that it is used in no other manner. The key word is "Essential" It is not essential in any way to install XP on more then one machine in order to use it on one machine. David |
#15
|
|||
|
|||
MS says pirating is illegal, but are their PA rules illegal?
"Larc" wrote in message
... On Mon, 04 Aug 2003 21:57:47 GMT, george pondered exceedingly, then took quill in hand and carefully composed... | "I burned with SP1 slipstreamed in" | Do you have a link telling how to do this?? Sure. Go to this page and look under Guide in the left column. You'll find links to slipstreaming SP1 into XP and burning a bootable CD using EZ CD Creator or Nero. http://www.etplanet.com/ Larc Thanks, burning now George |
|
Thread Tools | |
Display Modes | |
|
|