Any way to limit Windows\installer size?

Hi All,

I have a customer with undersized SSD drives. Their
c:\Windows\Installer directory is always filling
up with hundreds of GB of data. Pretty easy
to fix.

Is there a way to give the system a limit as to how
much data can go into this directory?

Many thanks,
-T

On 2020-07-12 4:49 p.m., T wrote:
Hi All,

I have a customer with undersized SSD drives.Â* Their
c:\Windows\Installer directory is always filling
up with hundreds of GB of data.Â* Pretty easy
to fix.

Is there a way to give the system a limit as to how
much data can go into this directory?

Many thanks,
-T

I thought all 2 1/2 inch SSDs were about 2 3/4 x 4 inches, I didn't know
they made undersized ones! :-)

Rene

T wrote:
Hi All,

I have a customer with undersized SSD drives. Their
c:\Windows\Installer directory is always filling
up with hundreds of GB of data. Pretty easy
to fix.

Is there a way to give the system a limit as to how
much data can go into this directory?

Many thanks,
-T

Removing materials from there, at a guess, damages your
"Add/Remove" capability. When you go to Programs and Features
and select an item for "Remove", I believe for some program
installations, there is a .msi stored on C: already. That's
what might be used to support the remove operation, is some
file in there. The .msi is opened up and parsed again,
before the Remove starts.

I don't particularly see a problem with cleaning it out,
with that small caveat. If the user becomes ****ed because
"Remove" or "Repair for Office" get zorched, then you
have to manage that expectation.

Moving the files would be an option, like archiving
on the NAS. Lots of unhappy customer syndrome
potential if you do this.

It's also possible that folder is getting parsed
during the Migration phase of a Windows 10 Upgrade.

*******

If you need a hobby, this shows a more selective approach.
Detecting stuff which is "duff" and does not belong there.
Don't expect to "save half a disk" doing this. That's why
it's a hobby - it doesn't scale all that well.

https://www.raymond.cc/blog/safely-d...taller-folder/

*******

And while you can do this, some day this will come
back to haunt you.

https://skimfeed.com/blog/symbolic-l...-drive-or-ssd/

*******

There's no reason for this to be controlled by a quota.
If C: runs out of space during a program install, you
could either consider Program Files to be "overflowed"
or Installer to be "overflowed". It's all part of a process.
The user caused the problem. the user cleans up the problem.
I won't waste your time with the MSFT blog entry on this :-/

Paul

Rene Lamontagne wrote:
On 2020-07-12 4:49 p.m., T wrote:
Hi All,

I have a customer with undersized SSD drives. Their
c:\Windows\Installer directory is always filling
up with hundreds of GB of data. Pretty easy
to fix.

Is there a way to give the system a limit as to how
much data can go into this directory?

Many thanks,
-T

I thought all 2 1/2 inch SSDs were about 2 3/4 x 4 inches, I didn't know
they made undersized ones! :-)

Rene

If you're at the lake, you're supposed to
throw those ones back.

The PCB inside, can be quite small.

https://images.anandtech.com/reviews...O/DSC_1057.jpg

Paul

Paul wrote:
Rene Lamontagne wrote:
On 2020-07-12 4:49 p.m., T wrote:
Hi All,

I have a customer with undersized SSD drives. Their
c:\Windows\Installer directory is always filling
up with hundreds of GB of data. Pretty easy
to fix.

Is there a way to give the system a limit as to how
much data can go into this directory?

Many thanks,
-T

I thought all 2 1/2 inch SSDs were about 2 3/4 x 4 inches, I didn't
know they made undersized ones! :-)

Rene

If you're at the lake, you're supposed to
throw those ones back.

The PCB inside, can be quite small.

https://images.anandtech.com/reviews...O/DSC_1057.jpg

Paul

OK, this is a bit better. They could still remove a bit
of content here. Flash, controller, DRAM. The DRAM isn't
needed. You could make a worse drive, with only two chips.

https://images.tweaktown.com/content...ssd-review.png

Eventually you get to the point there's only one
screw holding it down.

Paul

On 2020-07-12 7:12 p.m., Paul wrote:
Rene Lamontagne wrote:
On 2020-07-12 4:49 p.m., T wrote:
Hi All,

I have a customer with undersized SSD drives.Â* Their
c:\Windows\Installer directory is always filling
up with hundreds of GB of data.Â* Pretty easy
to fix.

Is there a way to give the system a limit as to how
much data can go into this directory?

Many thanks,
-T

I thought all 2 1/2 inch SSDs were about 2 3/4 x 4 inches, I didn't
know they made undersized ones!Â* :-)

Rene

If you're at the lake, you're supposed to
throw those ones back.

Yes, about 10 years ago my wife caught a couple little walleys and said
"these are like sardines and threw them back.

Why do we call SSDs 2.5 inch drives when they are in fact 2.75 inches,
To be more precise they are 70mm x 100mm x 7 or 9 mm.


The PCB inside, can be quite small.

Yes I took my one dead one apart to see how they were constructed, it
was a 120 GB unit and there were pads for 2 or 4 more. chips.


https://images.anandtech.com/reviews...O/DSC_1057.jpg

Â*Â* Paul



Rene

In article , Rene Lamontagne
wrote:


Why do we call SSDs 2.5 inch drives when they are in fact 2.75 inches,
To be more precise they are 70mm x 100mm x 7 or 9 mm.

the platter(s) inside are 2.5" in diameter.

On 2020-07-12 7:37 p.m., nospam wrote:
In article , Rene Lamontagne
wrote:


Why do we call SSDs 2.5 inch drives when they are in fact 2.75 inches,
To be more precise they are 70mm x 100mm x 7 or 9 mm.

the platter(s) inside are 2.5" in diameter.


These are SSDs, do they have square platters? :-)

Rene

In article , Rene Lamontagne
wrote:

Why do we call SSDs 2.5 inch drives when they are in fact 2.75 inches,
To be more precise they are 70mm x 100mm x 7 or 9 mm.

the platter(s) inside are 2.5" in diameter.

These are SSDs, do they have square platters? :-)

they're the same size as 2.5" hard drives for compatibility, making it
easy to swap, although still limited by sata.

m.2 ssds are not limited by either one.

On 2020-07-12 8:01 p.m., nospam wrote:
In article , Rene Lamontagne
wrote:

Why do we call SSDs 2.5 inch drives when they are in fact 2.75 inches,
To be more precise they are 70mm x 100mm x 7 or 9 mm.

the platter(s) inside are 2.5" in diameter.

These are SSDs, do they have square platters? :-)

they're the same size as 2.5" hard drives for compatibility, making it
easy to swap, although still limited by sata.

m.2 ssds are not limited by either one.


Makes good sense, Thanks.

Rene

On 2020-07-12 8:01 p.m., nospam wrote:
In article , Rene Lamontagne
wrote:

Why do we call SSDs 2.5 inch drives when they are in fact 2.75 inches,
To be more precise they are 70mm x 100mm x 7 or 9 mm.

the platter(s) inside are 2.5" in diameter.

These are SSDs, do they have square platters? :-)

they're the same size as 2.5" hard drives for compatibility, making it
easy to swap, although still limited by sata.

m.2 ssds are not limited by either one.


I answered This at 8:04 but on looking at it, it is blank! (shrug).
Anyway That makes perfect sense, never having ever used 2.5 inch hard
drives or laptops it never crossed my mind.

Thanks, Rene

T wrote:

I have a customer with undersized SSD drives. Their
c:\Windows\Installer directory is always filling up with hundreds of
GB of data. Pretty easy to fix.

Is there a way to give the system a limit as to how much data can go
into this directory?

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\Curr entVersion\Uninstall

That holds the Add/Remove uninstall entries. When a program uses MSI,
it is supposed to keep a log of the changes it makes (but obviously
cannot record changes that using the program will make, or changes
Windows makes related to using the program). When you uninstall a
program, the uninstall registry entry specifies the installer program
(which becomes the uninstaller). Under that registry key, you find an
entry for each MSI install, and under there you find the UninstallString
that the installer said to use to uninstall the program. Not all
installers use MSI, so to uninstall them you have to run the program to
do its own uninstall.

C:\Windows\Installer is the Windows Installer Cache, and use to store
important files for programs that were installed using "Windows
Installer technology" which, to me, means using MSI (*M*icro*s*oft
*I*nstaller). This cache should not be deleted; else, you may find
uninstalls will fail, will not complete, or leave behind even more
remnant crap than when this cache is defined. The MSI cache is not only
used to remove (uninstall) programs, but also the update them.

If the user is running out of free space on the SSD(s) then they should
get bigger SSDs, or start cleaning up their host by removing seldom used
or never used programs. "Is there a way to give the system a limit as
to how much data can go into this directory?" Sure there is. Stop
installing every piece of software that is too shiny for the user to
resist. Have them log into restricted/normal Windows accounts where
they cannot install software, and assign to you that job of sysadmin
instead of them thinking they know what the hell they're doing. Gun
locks and safes aren't just to protect loaded guns from the kids. They
prevent misuse from other adults, too. You know, the boobs that have
never practiced at a shooting range, and slide their finger onto the
trigger when holding the gun instead of resting alongside the trigger
guard. Just because someone can shoot a gun doesn't mean they're
qualified to touch one. Same for installing software. Same for using
regedit.exe. And even more when using a registry cleaner. Boobs that
cannot actually admin a system shouldn't be installing software or any
other sysadmin duties.

In a command shell, using "cd c:\windows" and running "dir installer"
will show the number of subfolders with cached installer/update info,
and the total size of all files therein. For me, dir shows the files in
subfolders under \Windows\Installer amass a grand total of 1 GB (same
when I use TreeSize Free). However, my C: drive is on a 1 TB NVMe m.2
SSD, so the Installer folder consumes one thousandth (0.1%) of the
space, and there is currently about 852 GB free on that SSD. Even if I
was back on my old 256 GB SSD (migrated into my new build from my old
build, but as just a data drive), the Installer folder would consume
only 0.4% of the drive's capacity.

There are lots of far better ways to increase free space on the drive
than delete the Installer folder. Have you run cleanmgr.exe (and
selected System) to see how much crap can be deleted? Just the WinSxS
folder which is far more huge can be trimmed down but eliminating the
ability to undo OS updates. If I were to include "Windows Update
Cleanup" in cleanmgr, that would delete close to 8 GB of files.

If even more free space is needed, the user could delete the reserved
storage for ensuring updates get applied correctly. Of course, that
means later the updates may not have enough free space not only to
download but to extract to then have the files installed.

https://www.windowslatest.com/2020/0...erved-storage/

If the user, or you on their behalf, an incapable or unwilling to add
events to Task Scheduler that run CCleaner or Windows Drive Cleanup
wizard, as in:

- "ccleaner.exe /auto" for using CCleaner with its the current config of
cleanup items.
- "cleanmgr.exe /sagerun:n" (where n is the number for a profile you
saved using "cleanmgr.exe /sageset:n")

then enable Storage Sense to do the cleanup when disk space gets low.

https://www.windowscentral.com/how-u...reators-update
https://www.windowscentral.com/how-d...nse-windows-10

Rene Lamontagne wrote:

Yes, about 10 years ago my wife caught a couple little walleys and said
"these are like sardines and threw them back.

When my dad was still alive, and with his Cessna 180, we went fishing
every weekend in some rather distant locales up north. We only kept
enough keepers for a shore lunch. All the rest were catch and release.
Didn't even bother keeping any to take back home since we'd be fishing
next weekend. Nearby boaters were awestruck we released big ones.
After lunch, we'd only keep those that wouldn't survive a release, and
gave those away before flying back home.

Why do we call SSDs 2.5 inch drives when they are in fact 2.75 inches,
To be more precise they are 70mm x 100mm x 7 or 9 mm.

The measurement is the diameter of the HDD platter, not its case.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...e_form_factors
3.5" form factor: 4" wide (101.85 mm)
2.5" form factor: 2.75" wide ( 69.85 mm)

Since [cased] SSDs have to fit in bays or cages designed for HDDs, they
have the same form factors. There are SSDs that have no case, so you
mount them elsewhere, and m.2 SSDs are fitted onto the mobo.

On 2020-07-12 9:57 p.m., VanguardLH wrote:
Rene Lamontagne wrote:

Yes, about 10 years ago my wife caught a couple little walleys and said
"these are like sardines and threw them back.

When my dad was still alive, and with his Cessna 180, we went fishing
every weekend in some rather distant locales up north. We only kept
enough keepers for a shore lunch. All the rest were catch and release.
Didn't even bother keeping any to take back home since we'd be fishing
next weekend. Nearby boaters were awestruck we released big ones.
After lunch, we'd only keep those that wouldn't survive a release, and
gave those away before flying back home.

Why do we call SSDs 2.5 inch drives when they are in fact 2.75 inches,
To be more precise they are 70mm x 100mm x 7 or 9 mm.

The measurement is the diameter of the HDD platter, not its case.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...e_form_factors
3.5" form factor: 4" wide (101.85 mm)
2.5" form factor: 2.75" wide ( 69.85 mm)

Since [cased] SSDs have to fit in bays or cages designed for HDDs, they
have the same form factors. There are SSDs that have no case, so you
mount them elsewhere, and m.2 SSDs are fitted onto the mobo.


Good, I have it all straight now,. Yes I have 2 NVMe drives onboard.

Why do we Canadians call walleye, pickerel? :-)

Thanks, Rene

"Paul" wrote

| Removing materials from there, at a guess, damages your
| "Add/Remove" capability. When you go to Programs and Features
| and select an item for "Remove", I believe for some program
| installations, there is a .msi stored on C: already. That's
| what might be used to support the remove operation, is some
| file in there. The .msi is opened up and parsed again,
| before the Remove starts.
|
| I don't particularly see a problem with cleaning it out,
| with that small caveat. If the user becomes ****ed because
| "Remove" or "Repair for Office" get zorched, then you
| have to manage that expectation.
|
That's my sense, too. Microsoft was trying to be
clever and plan for possibilities like very complex
programs with multiple "features" and "components",
in MSI lingo, so that you could, for instance, install
an office suite and then decide later that you want
French spellcheck. That could be accommodated by
the installer.

The problem is that such programs are very rare.
Most programs have few if any install options. So
the only likely cost would be that if you ever want
to uninstall it might be slightly messy.

The more relevant question to me is how anyone
could possibly have hundreds of GB of MSI backup.
That implies even more installed software. And it's
not even counting winsxs folder, system, etc. I'm
guessing that T has misunderstood something, or
typed a typo in his post. I've never heard of a 1 TB
C drive before there's any data.