Acronis True Image 2014 Premium

On 5/25/2014 4:41 AM, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
In message , BillW50 writes:
[]
Boy we sure do many things the same way. Although I have delayed longer
on my older machines to SSD and I just started recently. And they are
going to all get 120GB SSD I believe for now. I was a bit concern about
an SSD on this machine in particular, since it also has a TV tuner
connected and does a far amount of TV recording sometimes. Although
monitoring the lifetime writes, I don't think I'll hit the limit for at
least 10 years. Plus it won't be long before this one is cloned and
replaced with another SSD anyway. Maybe 256GB next time around.

I take it that the two of you cloners (I agree cloning's better than
backing up if you can afford all the extra drives) always swap the
drives, i. e. remove and store the drive you cloned from and install the
clone, whenever you do it - as a (quick and dirty, see next post) way of
ensuring the clone is successful.

When you do this, and the drive you are putting into storage is an SSD,
do you label it with how much life it has left?

I always keep track of my drives noting the hours on and the
S.M.A.R.T. readings. I've been using SSDs for some time now so I'm
curious how long one might take to fail. This curiosity is unfulfilled
to date as I keep replacing them for larger ones. Now the older smaller
ones go on a shelf or in an external enclosure. I do label them also
just so I can keep track of which one is which. Sometimes I save a notes
file explaining more. As to how much life is left that I feel is an
unknown. Sort of like myself at my age. I'm already keeping notes in my
pockets. Some say "look in other pocket".

In ,
J. P. Gilliver (John) typed:
In message , BillW50
writes:
In ,
Gene E. Bloch typed:
[]
Also, a clone needs to be tested too. Even a supposed exact copy
could end up being inexact.

Oh yes, absolutely! I clone and use the clone and save the original
(you were using it and you know that one works). If the clone fails,
you would know right away if it doesn't boot. And you will be using
it until the next clone. So you have time to make sure everything
works ok.
How do you decide when the testing is complete? Obviously if it
doesn't boot, it has failed, but if it does boot, what further
testing (e. g. of applications) do you do - if any?

I got burned once with one of my Asus EeePC. I found out months later my
method of cloning broke MS Works v9. I almost never use it, as I use
Office instead. But when I did, MS Works won't load and a message saying
that MS Works needs to be reinstalled. Asus didn't supply me with a MS
Works install CD. Rather they only supplied me with an image of Windows
XP and Works preinstalled.

About this time (back in 2009), booting Ubuntu 8 Live from a flash drive
and I doing nothing else with Ubuntu and shutting it down. XP would hang
on the desktop with a Window saying Windows Installer and that is all. I
believe Ubuntu auto mounts the XP drive, but it shouldn't be changing
anything on the drive itself. But somehow something changed.

Paul and myself tried to duplicate this problem recently and neither one
of us could cause it reoccur again. And now suddenly (as I am typing
this) I am thinking that maybe this is the missing piece. I was cloning
by using BartPE and A43 (file manager) and by copying everything except
the System Volume Information folder and the temp folders. Apparently
something was wrong using that method. If MS Works didn't break, I might
be still using this method today because everything else was working
just fine.

--
Bill
Motion Computing LE1700 Tablet ('09 era) - OE-QuoteFix v1.19.2
Centrino Core2 Duo L7400 1.5GHz - 2GB RAM
Windows XP Tablet PC Edition 2005 SP2

In ,
AlDrake typed:
On 5/22/2014 12:50 PM, BillW50 wrote:
In ,
AlDrake typed:
On 5/21/2014 5:55 PM, BillW50 wrote:
In ,
Boy we sure do many things the same way. Although I have delayed
longer on my older machines to SSD and I just started recently. And
they are going to all get 120GB SSD I believe for now. I was a bit
concern about an SSD on this machine in particular, since it also
has a TV tuner connected and does a far amount of TV recording
sometimes. Although monitoring the lifetime writes, I don't think
I'll hit the limit for at least 10 years. Plus it won't be long
before this one is cloned and replaced with another SSD anyway.
Maybe 256GB next time around.

I can't see myself going larger than the Crucial M550 512GB but
I'm waiting to see if they start using faster chips than the Micron.

My newer machines came stock with SSD and they are fine and I haven't
had a desire to upgrade those yet. The ones that I am upgrading right
now had SATA (type 1) 7200rpm hard drives. Since the SATA port can
only handle 150MB/s tops, I am not interested in anything faster
anyway. So cheap, slow, and reliable will get the job done on these
machines. I wasn't sure what to expect on such systems. Since 95% of
the time
the hard drive wasn't doing anything anyway. But boy, it is a huge
difference. Boot times are 5 times faster, games loads five times
faster, and most applications load in a blink of an eye. Nor do I
have to be careful about bumping the machine while moving around
with it. Head crashes are a thing of the past.

You have an advantage because they're much cheaper then when I
started purchasing SSDs. I put one in my ASUS Eee PC and at the time
the SSD cost more than the netbook.

Oh yes, I remember. Although what I liked in the early days of SSD,
was most SSD were the SLC type and MLC type were the ones that were
hard to find. Today it is just the opposite. I would prefer SLC
SSDs, but they are so hard to find nowadays. But MLC SSDs are more
reliable as ever and cheaper than they ever have been. So I guess it
isn't so bad anymore. :-)

Yes, I like the speed too. I think it's not beneficial to keep an HDD
installed as it's powered and produces heat. The only system I have
any in is my InWin BUC666

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showpr...odid=CA-017-IW

that has side access though a locked door.

Oh wow! I really like that! That could make me move away from laptops
and tablets and go back to desktops once again. :-D

--
Bill
Motion Computing LE1700 Tablet ('09 era) - OE-QuoteFix v1.19.2
Centrino Core2 Duo L7400 1.5GHz - 2GB RAM
Windows XP Tablet PC Edition 2005 SP2

In ,
AlDrake typed:
On 5/25/2014 4:41 AM, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
In message , BillW50
writes: []
Boy we sure do many things the same way. Although I have delayed
longer on my older machines to SSD and I just started recently. And
they are going to all get 120GB SSD I believe for now. I was a bit
concern about an SSD on this machine in particular, since it also
has a TV tuner connected and does a far amount of TV recording
sometimes. Although monitoring the lifetime writes, I don't think
I'll hit the limit for at least 10 years. Plus it won't be long
before this one is cloned and replaced with another SSD anyway.
Maybe 256GB next time around.

I take it that the two of you cloners (I agree cloning's better than
backing up if you can afford all the extra drives) always swap the
drives, i. e. remove and store the drive you cloned from and install
the clone, whenever you do it - as a (quick and dirty, see next
post) way of ensuring the clone is successful.

When you do this, and the drive you are putting into storage is an
SSD, do you label it with how much life it has left?

I always keep track of my drives noting the hours on and the
S.M.A.R.T. readings. I've been using SSDs for some time now so I'm
curious how long one might take to fail. This curiosity is unfulfilled
to date as I keep replacing them for larger ones. Now the older
smaller ones go on a shelf or in an external enclosure. I do label
them also just so I can keep track of which one is which. Sometimes I
save a notes file explaining more. As to how much life is left that I
feel is an unknown. Sort of like myself at my age. I'm already
keeping notes in my pockets. Some say "look in other pocket".

Yes I too just use the SMART info for checking the health of the SSD
(see below). Although I do label each drive with from what machine, OS,
and the date cloned. This tablet I am on right now still has a hard
drive 1.8" with a ZIF connector. And 1.8" SSD with ZIF connectors are
rare and expensive yet. So I haven't changed this one yet. But I also
have another machine running now and grabbed the SMART info from the
SSD. As you can see it reports things like hours, lifetime writes,
temperature, etc.

SMART READ DATA
Revision: 10
Attributes List
1: (SSD Raw Read Error Rate) Normalized Rate: 95
Sectors Read: 9235732 Read Errors: 0
5: (SSD Retired Block Count) Spare blocks remaining
100% Retired Block 0
9: (SSD Power-On Hours) Value 100 Total 79 hrs 55
mins
12: (SSD Power Cycle Count) Power Cycle Life Remaining
100% Number of power cycles 32
171: (SSD Program Fail Count) Program Error Count 0
172: (SSD Erase Fail Count) Erase Error Count 0
174: (SSD Unexpected power loss count) Unexpected power loss
Count 4
177: (Wear Range Delta) Wear Range Delta 0%
181: (Program Fail Count) Program Error Count 0
182: (Erase Fail Count) Erase Error Count 0
187: (SSD Reported Uncorrectable Errors) Normalized Value 100
lifetime URAISE Errors 0
189: (Unrecognized Attribute) Value: 38 Raw Data: 26 00
30 00 14 00 00
194: (SSD Temperature Monitoring) Normalized temp 38
Current 38 High 48 Low 20
195: (SSD ECC On-the-fly Count) Normalized Value 120
Sectors Read 9235732 UECC Count 0
196: (SSD Reallocation Event Count) Normalized Value 100
Reallocation Event Count 0
201: (SSD Uncorrectable Soft Read Error Rate)Normalized Value 120
Sectors Read 9235732 Uncorrectable Soft Error Count 0
204: (SSD Soft ECC Correction Rate (RAISE) Normalized Value 120
Sectors Read 9235732 Soft ECC Correction Count 0
230: (SSD Life Curve Status) Normalized Value 100
231: (SSD Life Left) Life Remaining 100%
233: (SSD Internal Reserved) 155
234: (SSD Internal Reserved) 169
241: (SSD Lifetime writes from host) lifetime writes 169
242: (SSD Lifetime reads from host) lifetime reads 137

--
Bill
Motion Computing LE1700 Tablet ('09 era) - OE-QuoteFix v1.19.2
Centrino Core2 Duo L7400 1.5GHz - 2GB RAM
Windows XP Tablet PC Edition 2005 SP2

On 5/27/2014 5:57 AM, BillW50 wrote:
In ,
AlDrake typed:
On 5/22/2014 12:50 PM, BillW50 wrote:
In ,
AlDrake typed:
On 5/21/2014 5:55 PM, BillW50 wrote:
In ,
Boy we sure do many things the same way. Although I have delayed
longer on my older machines to SSD and I just started recently. And
they are going to all get 120GB SSD I believe for now. I was a bit
concern about an SSD on this machine in particular, since it also
has a TV tuner connected and does a far amount of TV recording
sometimes. Although monitoring the lifetime writes, I don't think
I'll hit the limit for at least 10 years. Plus it won't be long
before this one is cloned and replaced with another SSD anyway.
Maybe 256GB next time around.

I can't see myself going larger than the Crucial M550 512GB but
I'm waiting to see if they start using faster chips than the Micron.

My newer machines came stock with SSD and they are fine and I haven't
had a desire to upgrade those yet. The ones that I am upgrading right
now had SATA (type 1) 7200rpm hard drives. Since the SATA port can
only handle 150MB/s tops, I am not interested in anything faster
anyway. So cheap, slow, and reliable will get the job done on these
machines. I wasn't sure what to expect on such systems. Since 95% of
the time
the hard drive wasn't doing anything anyway. But boy, it is a huge
difference. Boot times are 5 times faster, games loads five times
faster, and most applications load in a blink of an eye. Nor do I
have to be careful about bumping the machine while moving around
with it. Head crashes are a thing of the past.

You have an advantage because they're much cheaper then when I
started purchasing SSDs. I put one in my ASUS Eee PC and at the time
the SSD cost more than the netbook.

Oh yes, I remember. Although what I liked in the early days of SSD,
was most SSD were the SLC type and MLC type were the ones that were
hard to find. Today it is just the opposite. I would prefer SLC
SSDs, but they are so hard to find nowadays. But MLC SSDs are more
reliable as ever and cheaper than they ever have been. So I guess it
isn't so bad anymore. :-)

Yes, I like the speed too. I think it's not beneficial to keep an HDD
installed as it's powered and produces heat. The only system I have
any in is my InWin BUC666

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showpr...odid=CA-017-IW

that has side access though a locked door.

Oh wow! I really like that! That could make me move away from laptops
and tablets and go back to desktops once again. :-D

I think I done buying cases though. I probably will reuse the ones I
have and just upgrade the motherboards and all that goes along with them.
All my cases have plenty of room for water cooling if I get real serious.

http://store.antec.com/Product/enclo...5-15920-3.aspx

This one was fun to work with although a bit heavy.

On 5/27/2014 6:45 AM, BillW50 wrote:
In ,
AlDrake typed:
On 5/25/2014 4:41 AM, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
In message , BillW50
writes: []
Boy we sure do many things the same way. Although I have delayed
longer on my older machines to SSD and I just started recently. And
they are going to all get 120GB SSD I believe for now. I was a bit
concern about an SSD on this machine in particular, since it also
has a TV tuner connected and does a far amount of TV recording
sometimes. Although monitoring the lifetime writes, I don't think
I'll hit the limit for at least 10 years. Plus it won't be long
before this one is cloned and replaced with another SSD anyway.
Maybe 256GB next time around.

I take it that the two of you cloners (I agree cloning's better than
backing up if you can afford all the extra drives) always swap the
drives, i. e. remove and store the drive you cloned from and install
the clone, whenever you do it - as a (quick and dirty, see next
post) way of ensuring the clone is successful.

When you do this, and the drive you are putting into storage is an
SSD, do you label it with how much life it has left?

I always keep track of my drives noting the hours on and the
S.M.A.R.T. readings. I've been using SSDs for some time now so I'm
curious how long one might take to fail. This curiosity is unfulfilled
to date as I keep replacing them for larger ones. Now the older
smaller ones go on a shelf or in an external enclosure. I do label
them also just so I can keep track of which one is which. Sometimes I
save a notes file explaining more. As to how much life is left that I
feel is an unknown. Sort of like myself at my age. I'm already
keeping notes in my pockets. Some say "look in other pocket".

Yes I too just use the SMART info for checking the health of the SSD
(see below). Although I do label each drive with from what machine, OS,
and the date cloned. This tablet I am on right now still has a hard
drive 1.8" with a ZIF connector. And 1.8" SSD with ZIF connectors are
rare and expensive yet. So I haven't changed this one yet. But I also
have another machine running now and grabbed the SMART info from the
SSD. As you can see it reports things like hours, lifetime writes,
temperature, etc.

SMART READ DATA
Revision: 10
Attributes List
1: (SSD Raw Read Error Rate) Normalized Rate: 95
Sectors Read: 9235732 Read Errors: 0
5: (SSD Retired Block Count) Spare blocks remaining
100% Retired Block 0
9: (SSD Power-On Hours) Value 100 Total 79 hrs 55
mins
12: (SSD Power Cycle Count) Power Cycle Life Remaining
100% Number of power cycles 32
171: (SSD Program Fail Count) Program Error Count 0
172: (SSD Erase Fail Count) Erase Error Count 0
174: (SSD Unexpected power loss count) Unexpected power loss
Count 4
177: (Wear Range Delta) Wear Range Delta 0%
181: (Program Fail Count) Program Error Count 0
182: (Erase Fail Count) Erase Error Count 0
187: (SSD Reported Uncorrectable Errors) Normalized Value 100
lifetime URAISE Errors 0
189: (Unrecognized Attribute) Value: 38 Raw Data: 26 00
30 00 14 00 00
194: (SSD Temperature Monitoring) Normalized temp 38
Current 38 High 48 Low 20
195: (SSD ECC On-the-fly Count) Normalized Value 120
Sectors Read 9235732 UECC Count 0
196: (SSD Reallocation Event Count) Normalized Value 100
Reallocation Event Count 0
201: (SSD Uncorrectable Soft Read Error Rate)Normalized Value 120
Sectors Read 9235732 Uncorrectable Soft Error Count 0
204: (SSD Soft ECC Correction Rate (RAISE) Normalized Value 120
Sectors Read 9235732 Soft ECC Correction Count 0
230: (SSD Life Curve Status) Normalized Value 100
231: (SSD Life Left) Life Remaining 100%
233: (SSD Internal Reserved) 155
234: (SSD Internal Reserved) 169
241: (SSD Lifetime writes from host) lifetime writes 169
242: (SSD Lifetime reads from host) lifetime reads 137

Yup, gotta have it. I am not happy with Acronis Drive Monitor though.
It tries to get be to believe my OCZ Agility 3 is running at 212 Deg. F
and my new Crucial M550 512 GB reports Reallocation Event Count
Degradation Smart Attribute ID 196. Crystal Disk Info 4.5.0 says no
such thing.

It's been a while since I've seen a Ziff connector. I think I might
need one for a few Hitachi 6BG Microdrives I have while it's smaller
than the standard size. If it's even that indeed.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/370782152622?lpid=82

On Tue, 27 May 2014 03:42:45 -0400, AlDrake wrote:

As to how much life is left that I feel is an
unknown. Sort of like myself at my age. I'm already keeping notes in my
pockets. Some say "look in other pocket".

Thanks. You may have given me a solution to my problem.

:-)

--
Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch)

In message , AlDrake
writes:
On 5/25/2014 4:41 AM, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
[]
When you do this, and the drive you are putting into storage is an SSD,
do you label it with how much life it has left?

I always keep track of my drives noting the hours on and the
S.M.A.R.T. readings. I've been using SSDs for some time now so I'm
curious how long one might take to fail. This curiosity is unfulfilled
to date as I keep replacing them for larger ones. Now the older smaller
ones go on a shelf or in an external enclosure. I do label them also
just so I can keep track of which one is which. Sometimes I save a
notes file explaining more. As to how much life is left that I feel is
an unknown. Sort of like myself at my age. I'm already keeping notes in
my pockets. Some say "look in other pocket".


LOL! I like it.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

10.0 times 0.1 is hardly ever 1.0.

In message , BillW50
writes:
[]
On 5/25/2014 4:41 AM, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
[]
When you do this, and the drive you are putting into storage is an
SSD, do you label it with how much life it has left?
[]
Yes I too just use the SMART info for checking the health of the SSD
(see below). Although I do label each drive with from what machine, OS,
[]
SMART READ DATA
[]
230: (SSD Life Curve Status) Normalized Value 100
231: (SSD Life Left) Life Remaining 100%
233: (SSD Internal Reserved) 155
234: (SSD Internal Reserved) 169
241: (SSD Lifetime writes from host) lifetime writes 169
242: (SSD Lifetime reads from host) lifetime reads 137

I'm puzzled by "Life Remaining 100%". From all I've read here (and I
think in the XP 'group too), I understood that SSDs had a definite and
finite life, in terms of numbers of writes - and, even if they might
actually last longer in practice, had a built-in counter that counted
down as you used them, and eventually suddenly declares them read-only.
With that (probably mis-!)understanding, I wasn't expecting to see a
100% remaining one.

(And are values 241 and 242 above given with some indication of what
proportion of the total allowable they are?)
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

10.0 times 0.1 is hardly ever 1.0.

[]
In ,
AlDrake typed:
[]
Yes, I like the speed too. I think it's not beneficial to keep an HDD
installed as it's powered and produces heat. The only system I have
any in is my InWin BUC666

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showpr...odid=CA-017-IW

that has side access though a locked door.
[]
Side access is good - but what purpose does the lock serve? If someone's
going to steal them, they'll either take the whole computer, or wrench
off the door thus damaging the case if it's locked?
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

10.0 times 0.1 is hardly ever 1.0.

In ,
J. P. Gilliver (John) typed:
In message , BillW50
writes:
[]
On 5/25/2014 4:41 AM, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
[]
When you do this, and the drive you are putting into storage is an
SSD, do you label it with how much life it has left?
[]
Yes I too just use the SMART info for checking the health of the SSD
(see below). Although I do label each drive with from what machine,
OS, [] SMART READ DATA
[]
230: (SSD Life Curve Status) Normalized Value 100
231: (SSD Life Left) Life Remaining 100%
233: (SSD Internal Reserved) 155
234: (SSD Internal Reserved) 169
241: (SSD Lifetime writes from host) lifetime writes 169
242: (SSD Lifetime reads from host) lifetime reads 137

I'm puzzled by "Life Remaining 100%". From all I've read here (and I
think in the XP 'group too), I understood that SSDs had a definite and
finite life, in terms of numbers of writes - and, even if they might
actually last longer in practice, had a built-in counter that counted
down as you used them, and eventually suddenly declares them
read-only. With that (probably mis-!)understanding, I wasn't
expecting to see a 100% remaining one.

(And are values 241 and 242 above given with some indication of what
proportion of the total allowable they are?)

Yes, a MLC SSD has to ability to write to every cell generally speaking
10,000 times. So say that SSD is a 120GB SSD. That means you can write
120GB x 10000 = 1,200,000GB or 1200TB. In practice it isn't quite that
simple due to wear leveling, trim, and all. But it does give you a
ballpark figure.

So why is it stating 100% life remaining? Well the real number is
probably something like 99.99999% and it is rounded to 100%. It will
probably stay there until it hits less than 99.5%. Then it probably will
report 99%.

I am not sure what lifetime writes (241) and lifetime reads (242) are
reporting. But lifetime writes will no doubt go up and at some point and
the life remaining will drop to 99%. So I will know it when it happens.
This machine has the same make and model SSD and lifetime writes reports
150 and lifetime reads reports 67. Both are about a month old so far. I
have three more of these SSD unopened to keep in stock until I need
them. I'll probably order 3 every month or so until I have enough to
start rotating them.

--
Bill
Gateway M465e ('06 era) - Kingston 120GB SSD - OE-QuoteFix v1.19.2
Centrino Core2 Duo T5600 1.83GHz - 4GB - Windows XP SP2

On Wed, 28 May 2014 19:15:52 -0500, BillW50 wrote:

I have three more of these SSD unopened to keep in stock until I need
them. I'll probably order 3 every month or so until I have enough to
start rotating them.

I thought SSD's were non-rotating drives...

(Bad joke. Don't laugh, just groan.)

--
Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch)

On 29/05/2014 04:33, Gene E. Bloch wrote:
On Wed, 28 May 2014 19:15:52 -0500, BillW50 wrote:

I have three more of these SSD unopened to keep in stock until I need
them. I'll probably order 3 every month or so until I have enough to
start rotating them.
I thought SSD's were non-rotating drives...

(Bad joke. Don't laugh, just groan.)


SSD? Bill into SSD and using XP? Now this is news to me.

--
Good Guy
Website: http://mytaxsite.co.uk
Website: http://html-css.co.uk
Email: http://mytaxsite.co.uk/contact-us

On 5/28/2014 6:27 PM, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
[]
In ,
AlDrake typed:
[]
Yes, I like the speed too. I think it's not beneficial to keep an HDD
installed as it's powered and produces heat. The only system I have
any in is my InWin BUC666

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showpr...odid=CA-017-IW

that has side access though a locked door.
[]
Side access is good - but what purpose does the lock serve? If someone's
going to steal them, they'll either take the whole computer, or wrench
off the door thus damaging the case if it's locked?

Actually I think the lock prevents the door from falling off. An easy
way to close it without a knob sticking out.

On 5/28/2014 10:40 PM, Good Guy wrote:
On 29/05/2014 04:33, Gene E. Bloch wrote:
On Wed, 28 May 2014 19:15:52 -0500, BillW50 wrote:

I have three more of these SSD unopened to keep in stock until I need
them. I'll probably order 3 every month or so until I have enough to
start rotating them.
I thought SSD's were non-rotating drives...

(Bad joke. Don't laugh, just groan.)

SSD? Bill into SSD and using XP? Now this is news to me.

You think Bill only runs one OS?

--
Bill
Dell Latitude Slate Tablet 128GB SSD ('12 era) - Thunderbird v24.4.0
Intel Atom Z670 1.5GHz - 2GB RAM - Windows 7 Pro SP1