7 to 10 upgrade, now what can I get rid of?

I've now past the restore to & date, I've had a look at drive C and
there are hidden files which I assume I can delete.

$windows - BT is empty
$windows - WS has sources/Panther(folder)/windows(folder) and lots of
other stuff
there are a couple of folder with alphanumeric names containing msi and
exe files
windows.old which I assume is the way of re-installing 7

Any help or pointer to a site which explains what to get rid of
gratefully received.

Mike

--
Michael Swift We do not regard Englishmen as foreigners.
Kirkheaton We look on them only as rather mad Norwegians.
Yorkshire Halvard Lange

Mike Swift wrote:

I've now past the restore to & date, I've had a look at drive C and
there are hidden files which I assume I can delete.

$windows - BT is empty
$windows - WS has sources/Panther(folder)/windows(folder) and lots of
other stuff
there are a couple of folder with alphanumeric names containing msi and
exe files
windows.old which I assume is the way of re-installing 7

Any help or pointer to a site which explains what to get rid of
gratefully received.

Mike


You can use Disk Cleanup (cleanmgr.exe). That will remove
windows.old for you. If you wait 31 days after the Upgrade
Install, the windows.old will be removed for you automatically.
But if you want it removed faster, you can use cleanmgr.exe.
The policy on Windows.old changed sometime during Windows 8 era,
so late Windows 8 upgrades, or Windows 10 upgrades, the windows.old
deletes itself eventually.

The C:\$WINDOWS.~BT and C:\$WINDOWS.~WS can be deleted. You'd
keep them if re-installing perhaps. Or maybe you want to
keep the log files held in there for a rainy day. I happen
to have "snapshotted" both of those here, and kept a copy
when they were populated, for later.

Microsoft has a bad habit of putting the "numerical" folders
where ever it feels like. It's hard to be 100% sure there
won't be a downstream issue by deleting them. I leave them
for a while, before getting too excited about them.

If you're tight for space (on an SSD), you can:

1) Disable System Restore.
2) powercfg -h off
That disables hibernation, and deletes the hiberfil.sys.
That frees up a few gigabytes of space.
3) Reduce the pagefile setting. I made mine 1GB in size
and fixed the size so it could not grow.

If you needed further inspiration, maybe a program like
CCleaner can "clean" more things for you than we can
suggest manually. Just don't touch the Registry with it.
Fixing the Registry is not necessary.

Paul

On Thu, 10 Sep 2015 15:17:28 +0100, Mike Swift
wrote:


I've now past the restore to & date, I've had a look at drive C and
there are hidden files which I assume I can delete.

$windows - BT is empty
$windows - WS has sources/Panther(folder)/windows(folder) and lots of
other stuff
there are a couple of folder with alphanumeric names containing msi and
exe files
windows.old which I assume is the way of re-installing 7

Any help or pointer to a site which explains what to get rid of
gratefully received.

Mike

When I decided to go back to W7 from W10 I let the automatic reversion
do everything for me. I have forgotten where it was in W10 but nothing
was hidden.

When I got back to W7 there were a few applications that needed
reinstalling before they would work. These included a Microsoft game
that would not work in W10 or W7 after reverting. VS 2005 needed
reinstalling as well because Microsoft thought I was using VS 2015
because some user history says I have a copy! All I ever did in VS
2015 was check if it would run on my main PC.

Steve

--
Neural Network Software for Windows http://www.npsnn.com

EasyNN-plus More than just a neural network http://www.easynn.com

In article , Paul writes
If you needed further inspiration, maybe a program like
CCleaner can "clean" more things for you than we can
suggest manually. Just don't touch the Registry with it.
Fixing the Registry is not necessary.

Paul

Many thanks for the advice, today is the calendar month since I upgraded
so I'll see if windows.old vanishes, I'll leave the others for a while.

Mike

--
Michael Swift We do not regard Englishmen as foreigners.
Kirkheaton We look on them only as rather mad Norwegians.
Yorkshire Halvard Lange

Mike Swift wrote on 9/10/2015 11:07 AM:
In article , Paul writes
If you needed further inspiration, maybe a program like
CCleaner can "clean" more things for you than we can
suggest manually. Just don't touch the Registry with it.
Fixing the Registry is not necessary.

Paul

Many thanks for the advice, today is the calendar month since I upgraded so I'll see if windows.old vanishes, I'll leave
the others for a while.

Mike

PS, run the disk cleanup as Admin. It allows you to gracefully clean out windows updates and the windows.old etc. Of
course cleaning out Windows Updates means you can't revert any update.

Stephen Wolstenholme wrote on 9/10/2015 10:51 AM:
On Thu, 10 Sep 2015 15:17:28 +0100, Mike Swift
wrote:


I've now past the restore to & date, I've had a look at drive C and
there are hidden files which I assume I can delete.

$windows - BT is empty
$windows - WS has sources/Panther(folder)/windows(folder) and lots of
other stuff
there are a couple of folder with alphanumeric names containing msi and
exe files
windows.old which I assume is the way of re-installing 7

Any help or pointer to a site which explains what to get rid of
gratefully received.

Mike

When I decided to go back to W7 from W10 I let the automatic reversion
do everything for me. I have forgotten where it was in W10 but nothing
was hidden.

When I got back to W7 there were a few applications that needed
reinstalling before they would work. These included a Microsoft game
that would not work in W10 or W7 after reverting. VS 2005 needed
reinstalling as well because Microsoft thought I was using VS 2015
because some user history says I have a copy! All I ever did in VS
2015 was check if it would run on my main PC.

Steve

The windows 7 games are still available for windows 10. Someone has made a new stand alone install program, they don't
come with windows 10. Hope that wasn't the sole reason from reverting to W7. :-)

There used to be a patcher for the old win7 games that would just change the limiting OS versions # but that seems to
have disappeared off the net. I used to have it but once converted, I just keep the folders on a zip and any reload I
just plunk it back in.

On Thu, 10 Sep 2015 10:44:57 -0400, Paul wrote:

Mike Swift wrote:

I've now past the restore to & date, I've had a look at drive C and
there are hidden files which I assume I can delete.

$windows - BT is empty
$windows - WS has sources/Panther(folder)/windows(folder) and lots of
other stuff
there are a couple of folder with alphanumeric names containing msi and
exe files
windows.old which I assume is the way of re-installing 7

Any help or pointer to a site which explains what to get rid of
gratefully received.

Mike


You can use Disk Cleanup (cleanmgr.exe). That will remove
windows.old for you. If you wait 31 days after the Upgrade
Install, the windows.old will be removed for you automatically.
But if you want it removed faster, you can use cleanmgr.exe.
The policy on Windows.old changed sometime during Windows 8 era,
so late Windows 8 upgrades, or Windows 10 upgrades, the windows.old
deletes itself eventually.

The C:\$WINDOWS.~BT and C:\$WINDOWS.~WS can be deleted. You'd
keep them if re-installing perhaps. Or maybe you want to
keep the log files held in there for a rainy day. I happen
to have "snapshotted" both of those here, and kept a copy
when they were populated, for later.

Microsoft has a bad habit of putting the "numerical" folders
where ever it feels like. It's hard to be 100% sure there
won't be a downstream issue by deleting them. I leave them
for a while, before getting too excited about them.

If you're tight for space (on an SSD), you can:

1) Disable System Restore.
2) powercfg -h off
That disables hibernation, and deletes the hiberfil.sys.
That frees up a few gigabytes of space.
3) Reduce the pagefile setting. I made mine 1GB in size
and fixed the size so it could not grow.

If you needed further inspiration, maybe a program like
CCleaner can "clean" more things for you than we can
suggest manually. Just don't touch the Registry with it.
Fixing the Registry is not necessary.

Paul

If memory serves, you have to use cleanmgr.exe as administrator in
order to wipe out the old version of Windows, etc. I set up a
separate shortcut on my system called "cleanmgr as admin" with the Run
as Administrator attribute set on the shortcut for just this purpose.
As admin, it offers a few additional cleanup options not available
otherwise.

--
//Steve//

On Thu, 10 Sep 2015 11:24:33 -0400, Big Al wrote:

The windows 7 games are still available for windows 10. Someone has made a new stand alone install program, they don't
come with windows 10. Hope that wasn't the sole reason from reverting to W7. :-)


W10 won't run any games that use SafeDisc even if they are Microsoft
games.

The main reason I reverted to W7 was that the VS 2005 development
system would not work properly on W10.

Steve

--
Neural Network Software for Windows http://www.npsnn.com

EasyNN-plus More than just a neural network http://www.easynn.com

On Fri, 11 Sep 2015 09:23:38 +0100, Stephen Wolstenholme
wrote:

W10 won't run any games that use SafeDisc even if they are Microsoft
games.

The main reason I reverted to W7 was that the VS 2005 development
system would not work properly on W10.

Please refresh my memory. What is SafeDisc, was that a
copy-protection scheme?

--
//Steve//

Steve Silverwood [KB6OJS] wrote:
On Fri, 11 Sep 2015 09:23:38 +0100, Stephen Wolstenholme
wrote:

W10 won't run any games that use SafeDisc even if they are Microsoft
games.

The main reason I reverted to W7 was that the VS 2005 development
system would not work properly on W10.

Please refresh my memory. What is SafeDisc, was that a
copy-protection scheme?


There was some software component in Windows, to support it.
The component was present in some of the early Win10 Preview
versions, but it disappeared from the release version. And that
may be why SafeDisc no longer works. SafeDisc is a method of
protecting game disks from copying.

And Microsoft's "position" on that necessary component, is
addressed in a comment here.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safedisc

It probably doesn't help that Macrovision has moved on. There
might not be any staff to work on the component for Win10.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macrovision_Corporation

"In that era of the company they were known more for
digital protection but now focus on metadata licensing"

Whatever that is...

Paul

On Fri, 11 Sep 2015 14:26:03 -0700, "Steve Silverwood [KB6OJS]"
wrote:

On Fri, 11 Sep 2015 09:23:38 +0100, Stephen Wolstenholme
wrote:

W10 won't run any games that use SafeDisc even if they are Microsoft
games.

The main reason I reverted to W7 was that the VS 2005 development
system would not work properly on W10.

Please refresh my memory. What is SafeDisc, was that a
copy-protection scheme?

do you not have google on your computer. i did the legwork for you. i
typed safedisk into google (i have it on my computer) i dont know
where it came from, but i like it. it makes me seem intellegent to
other people.


well here you go steve....
SafeDisc is a copy protection program for Microsoft Windows
applications and games that are distributed on optical disc. Created
by Macrovision Corporation, it aims to hinder unauthorized disc
duplication.

Although the stated use is to prevent piracy, many, including the
Electronic Frontier Foundation, believe it is used to restrict one's
fair-use rights.[1][2]

Contents

1 History
2 Circumvention
3 Operation
4 Windows 10
5 Version History
5.1 SafeDisc (V1)
5.2 SafeDisc (V2)
5.3 SafeDisc (V3)
5.4 SafeDisc (V4)
6 SafeDisc driver vulnerabilities
7 See also
8 References
9 External links

History

There have been several editions of SafeDisc over the years. Each one
has the goals of making discs harder to copy. The current revision is
marketed as SafeDisc Advanced.

The early versions of SafeDisc did not make the discs very difficult
to copy. Recent versions 2.9+ can produce discs that are difficult to
copy or reverse engineer, requiring specific burners capable of
emulating the "weak sectors" and odd data formats that are
characteristic of SafeDisc.
Circumvention

Previous versions of SafeDisc were overcome by disc image emulator
software such as Daemon Tools and Alcohol 120%. SafeDisc currently
blacklists such software, meaning that those who want to use this
method must install additional software to cloak the mounter; examples
include CureRom and Y.A.S.U.

Another potential attack on SafeDisc is to pull the encrypted
application out of the archive it is contained in. All SafeDisc
encrypted discs contain an ICD file, an encrypted format used by
SafeDisc to ensure that the original CD is loaded. UnSafeDisc
circumvents and decrypts SafeDisc encrypted files by opening the ICD
file format, decrypting it, and converting it to an EXE file. However,
each program requires a specific patch to enable full functionality.
Operation

SafeDisc adds a unique digital signature to the optical media at the
time of replication. Each time a SafeDisc-protected program runs, the
SafeDisc authenticator performs various security checks and verifies
the SafeDisc signature on the optical media. The authentication
process takes about 10 to 20 seconds. Once verification has been
established, the sequence is complete and the program will start
normally. The SafeDisc signature is designed to be difficult to copy
or transfer from the original media. (For example, it might change as
a result of error correction during the copying process.) Certain
multimedia programs are designed to run from the PC's hard drive
without accessing files from the program disc after the initial
installation. SafeDisc will permit this as long as the consumer
retains the original CD or DVD, which is required for authentication
each time the program is launched. Failure to place the original disc
in the drive when loading the program will prevent validation of the
SafeDisc signature.
Windows 10

Shortly after the release of Windows 10, Microsoft announced that
games with SafeDisc DRM will not run on its new operating system.
Citing security concerns over the software due to the way in which it
becomes "deeply embedded" in the system, Microsoft said "That’s where
Windows 10 says, 'Sorry'." Supporting SafeDisc could have been a
possible loophole for computer viruses to exploit. [3][4]
Version History
SafeDisc (V1)

SafeDisk V1 protected CDs can be recognized by several files on the
CD:

00000001.TMP
CLCD16.DLL
CLCD32.DLL
CLOKSPL.EXE
DPLAYERX.DLL

And also by the existence of two files GAME.EXE and GAME.ICD
(where GAME is replaced with the actual game's name).

The EXE executable is only a loader which decrypts and loads the
protected game executable in the encrypted ICD file.

The initial version of SafeDisc was easy for home users and
professional duplicators alike to copy, due to the fact that the ICD
file can be decrypted and converted into an EXE file.
SafeDisc (V2)

The following files should exist on every original CD:

00000001.TMP
00000002.TMP (not always present)

The loader file (GAME.EXE) is now integrated into the main
executable, making the GAME.ICD file obsolete. Also the CLOKSPL.EXE
file, which was present in SafeDisc v1, no longer exists.

The SD2 version can be found inside the GAME.EXE file through its
string: "BoG_ *90.0&!! Yy", followed by three unsigned longs, these
are the version, subversion and revision numbers (in hex). When making
a backup, read errors will be encountered between sectors 806-10663.

The protection also has "weak" sectors, introduced with this version,
which causes synchronization problems with certain CD-Writers. Digital
signatures are still present in this version. But this has no effect
on disc images mounted in Daemon Tools or similar programs. In
addition, SafeDisc Version 2.50 added ATIP detection making it
impossible to use a copy in a burner unless software that masks this
is used (CloneCD has the ability to do this.[5]) SafeDisc Versions
2.90 and above make burning copies more difficult requiring burners
that are capable of burning the "weak sectors"; these drives are
uncommon. However, there are software solutions that eliminate the
need for specialized hardware.[6]
SafeDisc (V3)

SafeDisc v3 uses a key to encrypt the main executable (EXE or DLL) and
creates a corresponding digital signature which is added to the
CD-ROM/DVD-ROM when they are replicated. The size of the digital
signature varies from 3 to 20 MB depending how good the encryption
must be. The authentication process takes about 10 to 20 seconds.

SafeDisc v3 is capable of encrypting multiple executables over one or
more CDs/DVDs, as long as the executables are encrypted with the same
key and the digital signature is added to each media. SafeDisc v3
supports Virtual Drives as long as the original CD/DVD is available.
Once the CD has been authenticated the game should continue to run
from the virtual drive, provided the virtual drive software has not
been blacklisted.

CloneCD is able to make fair use copies of V3.[7]
SafeDisc (V4)

The current SafeDisc version is Version 4. As of November 2006, DVDs
use SafeDisc v4.70
SafeDisc driver vulnerabilities

On November 7, 2007 Microsoft stated that "there is vulnerability in
Macrovision SECDRV.SYS driver [8] on Windows and it could allow
elevation of privilege. This vulnerability was patched by Microsoft on
December 11, 2007 [9] This vulnerability does not affect Windows
Vista. The driver, secdrv.sys, is used by games which use Macrovision
SafeDisc. Without the driver, games with SafeDisc protection would be
unable to play on Windows".
See also

SafeCast
SecuROM
CD-Cops
StarForce
XCP
TAGES
LaserLock
Y.A.S.U.

References

Electronic Frontier Foundation's website's DRM section
Commentary by Fred Lohmann of the EFF, "So this is just another
example of the way in which the MPAA companies use DRM not to stop
piracy...but rather to control those who make devices that play
movies." (emphasis added) [1]
http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2015/0...s-microsoft-2/
http://uk.ign.com/articles/2015/08/1...sk-securom-drm
Clone CD Change log
CloneCD product web page
Clone CD Change log
vulnerability in Macrovision SafeDisc SECDRV.SYS driver

Vulnerability in Macrovision Driver Could Allow Local Elevation of
Privilege (944653)

External links

On Fri, 11 Sep 2015 14:26:03 -0700, "Steve Silverwood [KB6OJS]"
wrote:

On Fri, 11 Sep 2015 09:23:38 +0100, Stephen Wolstenholme
wrote:

W10 won't run any games that use SafeDisc even if they are Microsoft
games.

The main reason I reverted to W7 was that the VS 2005 development
system would not work properly on W10.

Please refresh my memory. What is SafeDisc, was that a
copy-protection scheme?

See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SafeDisc

Steve

--
Neural Network Software for Windows http://www.npsnn.com

EasyNN-plus More than just a neural network http://www.easynn.com

On Sat, 12 Sep 2015 09:09:36 +0100, Stephen Wolstenholme
wrote:

Please refresh my memory. What is SafeDisc, was that a
copy-protection scheme?

See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SafeDisc

Thanks, got it.

--
//Steve//