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Is the XP classic start menu back (finally) with Windows 10?



 
 
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  #61  
Old June 12th 15, 04:22 AM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.windows-xp,alt.comp.os.windows-8
Dave Doe
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Posts: 481
Default Is the XP classic start menu back (finally) with Windows 10?

In article , , Slimer says...

On 2015-06-10 9:44 PM, Dave Doe wrote:
In article , , Paul
B. Andersen says...

Dave Doe wrote in message


The good thing is, Windows 10 is free. And I reckon after a year, MS
will leave it that way. Desktop OS's don't have any monetary value
anymore IMO.

Pretty much there's nothing in Windows' desktops that Linux desktops
don't already have, so, I would tend to agree with you since Linux
desktops are free.


There is *heaps* in the Windows 7, 8.1, 10 desktop GUI that Linux
doesn't have!

Linux GUI's are so immature. I don't understand why the Linux dev team
don't put more into that. I think it's vital.
**** the command line

If you can suggest or recommend a nice Linux GUI, I'm all ears. But
Gnome and KDE are truly ****en horrible. Not gonna go into the details,
just express my opinion


GNOME 3 is honestly as good as it gets in my opinion. If you're willing
to learn and appreciate how it works, it's surprisingly intuitive.
Nevertheless, I agree with you about maturity. As a result of the fact
that these Linux losers insist on working on a dozen or more desktop
environments rather than focusing all of their energy on one or two, the
developers are spread thin and adding feature or correcting ones which
don't work either doesn't happen or takes time. GNOME would be much
better if Ubuntu hadn't insisted on creating Unity and KDE would be a
lot more stable if the people behind say XFCE or GNOME pooled their
efforts towards improving it.

It's hard to build a decent car if everyone in the company is building
their own vehicle.


Gnome is my choice too. I wish they'd just make it *smooth*. It still
looks and feels cheap. The dev team need to make it beautiful and
fluid. And they need to get their zones a little better - a couple of
pixels out at least. They need to redo their zone maths completely (eg
the sensitivity for grabbing a window / corner etc.

On fluidy and beautiful-ness - they need to get their head around
blending and make it work.

--
Duncan.
Ads
  #63  
Old June 12th 15, 06:33 AM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.windows-xp,alt.comp.os.windows-8
Char Jackson
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,449
Default Is the XP classic start menu Commentary.

On Thu, 11 Jun 2015 22:29:20 -0400, knuttle
wrote:

On 6/11/2015 6:48 PM, Char Jackson wrote:
On Thu, 11 Jun 2015 15:54:49 -0400, knuttle
wrote:

The easiest way to get to the System Screen when on the desktop, right
click on the MS Icon on the taskbar, and select System from the pop up
menu. There is no waiting. System is the fifth item down from the
top. It is right above Device Manager, Network Connecton and Disk
Management.


I don't have an MS icon, but I found the System Info screen. :-)
Click the Start Orb, start typing system...

Thanks.

The MS Icon is on the extreme right side of the taskbar both on the
Desktop and on the Metro Start screen. (It looks like a white box with a
cross on it.) On the desktop it is always visible. On the Metro Start
you have to move the cursor down to the exteme lower right cornor of the
screen.

Right clicking on either gives the same options, including the
shutdown/reboot option.


I don't have such an icon (on either interface) and don't remember ever
seeing it, even before installing Classic Shell. That was a long time ago,
though.

  #64  
Old June 12th 15, 10:38 AM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.windows-xp,alt.comp.os.windows-8
Jeff Layman
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 621
Default Is the XP classic start menu back (finally) with Windows 10?

On 11/06/15 01:05, Slimer wrote:
On 2015-06-10 7:01 PM, Paul B. Andersen wrote:
knuttle wrote in message


Until the advent of Ubuntu, Linux was far too much trouble (in comparison).
Even now, Linux is just a little bit too much trouble.
I agree, Windows is ubiquitous (as is Macintosh) in the stores.


Ubuntu was indeed a Godsend and it has made Linux more acceptable for
the common user. The problem is that it still has a tremendous amount of
problems which appear after an update or two. Disappearing controls,
hardware stopped working, no longer able to boot to desktop, functions
which are visible but don't actually do anything, etc..


Spot on, in my experience. I installed Ubuntu 14.10 and several desktops
(from a magazine DVD) on a new laptop about 6 months ago. Many years
ago I had tried a liveCD on an XP desktop (Ubuntu 6?) seemed to work ok.
A couple of years later I tried version 9 also on a liveCD on the same
desktop (I forget the stupid names which seem to infest Linux, from
distros, desktops, and programs. It's one of my pet hates about Linux).
But while v6 was fine, v9 just failed to work at all, with "kernel
panic" error messages. Seems the new version just didn't like something
about the desktop hardware, which v6 had no problem with. It really put
me off Linux for years.

I was quite impressed with Ubuntu 14.10, although I didn't like Unity.
Xfce seemed the best desktop for me, although it had a couple of
annoying quirks, so I changed to KDE. That worked well enough, until the
update to Ubuntu 15.04 killed it. It also killed LXDE. Mate works, but
the desktop manager now doesn't, so I can't personalise it. Xfce
soldiers on.

I don't know how many error messages I've had, and in the 6 months I've
had the laptop I've had to do a forced cold reboot at least 6 times. I
never had to do that with Win7, and maybe that number of times with XP,
but over 9 years! I've never had a Windows Update cause a problem in all
that time. At least Linux always seems to recover from errors without
problem - it's never failed to boot.

As to the different programs, yes, much of what I used in Windows has a
Linux equivalent - sort of. It just isn't so polished. I installed WINE
to run an old program I had. And I miss IrfanView and PDF ExChange. I
believe they work with WINE, but haven't tried yet.

Yes you do not need to fork over any cash for Linux. However your time
is worth something. In my experience to install a new operating system
find the drivers, and get it set up for your purposes, takes 3 to 4
hours. That is 3 to 4 hours you must spend to get a Linux computer vs
an Apple of MS computer.


Actually, it's even worse than you stated, in a way, because all the Linux
boxes I have were once Microsoft, so, I've essentially paid for Microsoft
in order to get Linux for free. I guess you can buy a linux box in the
store and save about a hundred dollars on the operating system, but, I
personally have never seen one in the USA where I am.


Well, not from the mainstream suppliers, but the smaller, independent
ones do (I have a rebadged Clevo here in the UK, but I am sure you could
get a similar machine in the US).

It used to be worse for Linux drivers than it is now. Pretty much, Linux
drivers work just fine for all the existing laptop and desktop hardware,
right out of the box (IMHO).


Not on my MSI GT72. It's a mess.

The one place I still find Linux drivers sometimes lacking is in peripheral
hardware such as WiFi adapters and the like (mostly with Realtek chips).


How about Canon hardware?! I've spent hours trying to get an old Pixma
ip3000 printer working with Ubuntu. It half works, allowing colour
printing to paper, but to photographs, no - forget it. Wrong colours,
wrong dimensions. I've now given up, and have to use my failing Win7
laptop if I want to print any photos. I know long-term Linux users
criticise Canon for not supporting Linux, but distros should really make
it clear that there is at least one major supplier whose hardware might
not work with Linux.

So remove the anti-virus on Windows. Yes, you MIGHT get infected but
today's malware requires user intervention and generally, the user has
to be one Hell of a ****ing moron.


Not sure that's fair. Yes, anyone clicking on a *.exe or zip email
attachment is asking for it, but it isn't difficult to hide such files
(eg as a Myphoto.jpg .exe), and with a spoofed email address
from a "friend" it isn't always easy to spot. But at least at present I
run Linux without any antimalware programs or internet security suites.
Just not necessary. Maybe that will change if Linux gets more popular,
but I can't see it if Win10 is better than 8/8.1

But, the learning curve *is* steep. It's not that you can't do anything
(you can do far more on Linux than anywhere else); but the program names
are all different (so that's a large one-time learning curve, I agree).


And the Windows "unlearning" curve is even steeper! But I really haven't
had to use a terminal that much.

And none of the names make any sense except for RhythmBox. Banshee is a
music player, Totem is a video player and Midori is a browser. How was
anyone supposed to know that without clicking on the app first?


Don't start me on idiotic Linux names (see above). And don't forget that
if you install several desktops you’re likely to get identical programs
under different names! Maybe slightly tweaked for different
functionality, but otherwise identical.

I've not given up on Linux, and maybe when I reinstall it'll be with
Mint rather than Ubuntu.

--

Jeff
  #65  
Old June 12th 15, 11:03 AM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.windows-xp,alt.comp.os.windows-8
Jonas Klein
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 30
Default Is the XP classic start menu Commentary.

Am 12.06.2015 um 04:29 schrieb knuttle:
The MS Icon is on the extreme right side of the taskbar both
on the Desktop and on the Metro Start screen.


Really? On my desktop it is on the extreme LEFT side!
  #66  
Old June 12th 15, 01:18 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.windows-xp,alt.comp.os.windows-8
knuttle
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 262
Default Is the XP classic start menu Commentary.

On 6/12/2015 1:33 AM, Char Jackson wrote:
On Thu, 11 Jun 2015 22:29:20 -0400, knuttle
wrote:

On 6/11/2015 6:48 PM, Char Jackson wrote:
On Thu, 11 Jun 2015 15:54:49 -0400, knuttle
wrote:

The easiest way to get to the System Screen when on the desktop, right
click on the MS Icon on the taskbar, and select System from the pop up
menu. There is no waiting. System is the fifth item down from the
top. It is right above Device Manager, Network Connecton and Disk
Management.

I don't have an MS icon, but I found the System Info screen. :-)
Click the Start Orb, start typing system...

Thanks.

The MS Icon is on the extreme right side of the taskbar both on the
Desktop and on the Metro Start screen. (It looks like a white box with a
cross on it.) On the desktop it is always visible. On the Metro Start
you have to move the cursor down to the exteme lower right cornor of the
screen.

Right clicking on either gives the same options, including the
shutdown/reboot option.


I don't have such an icon (on either interface) and don't remember ever
seeing it, even before installing Classic Shell. That was a long time ago,
though.

The classic shell is probably removing it, so you have never seen it.
  #67  
Old June 12th 15, 01:19 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.windows-xp,alt.comp.os.windows-8
knuttle
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 262
Default Is the XP classic start menu Commentary.

On 6/12/2015 6:03 AM, Jonas Klein wrote:
Am 12.06.2015 um 04:29 schrieb knuttle:
The MS Icon is on the extreme right side of the taskbar both
on the Desktop and on the Metro Start screen.


Really? On my desktop it is on the extreme LEFT side!



So I just had a dyslexic event. Sorry.
  #68  
Old June 12th 15, 02:05 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.windows-xp,alt.comp.os.windows-8
Neil
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 714
Default Is the XP classic start menu Commentary.

On 6/11/2015 10:29 PM, knuttle wrote:
The MS Icon is on the extreme right side of the taskbar both on the
Desktop and on the Metro Start screen. (It looks like a white box with a
cross on it.) On the desktop it is always visible. On the Metro Start
you have to move the cursor down to the exteme lower right cornor of the
screen.

Perhaps you've done something to alter the positioning of the MS Icon,
but on all the Win8.x systems I have, the icon is on the extreme _left_
of the taskbar, and accessing it from the Metro screen requires hovering
over the lower left corner.

I think that for those using other shells it's replaced with things like
the "old fashioned" Start Orb. 8-D
--
Best regards,

Neil
  #69  
Old June 12th 15, 02:50 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.windows-xp,alt.comp.os.windows-8
Slimer
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 300
Default Is the XP classic start menu back (finally) with Windows 10?

On 2015-06-11 11:22 PM, Dave Doe wrote:
In article , , Slimer says...

On 2015-06-10 9:44 PM, Dave Doe wrote:
In article , , Paul
B. Andersen says...

Dave Doe wrote in message


The good thing is, Windows 10 is free. And I reckon after a year, MS
will leave it that way. Desktop OS's don't have any monetary value
anymore IMO.

Pretty much there's nothing in Windows' desktops that Linux desktops
don't already have, so, I would tend to agree with you since Linux
desktops are free.

There is *heaps* in the Windows 7, 8.1, 10 desktop GUI that Linux
doesn't have!

Linux GUI's are so immature. I don't understand why the Linux dev team
don't put more into that. I think it's vital.
**** the command line

If you can suggest or recommend a nice Linux GUI, I'm all ears. But
Gnome and KDE are truly ****en horrible. Not gonna go into the details,
just express my opinion


GNOME 3 is honestly as good as it gets in my opinion. If you're willing
to learn and appreciate how it works, it's surprisingly intuitive.
Nevertheless, I agree with you about maturity. As a result of the fact
that these Linux losers insist on working on a dozen or more desktop
environments rather than focusing all of their energy on one or two, the
developers are spread thin and adding feature or correcting ones which
don't work either doesn't happen or takes time. GNOME would be much
better if Ubuntu hadn't insisted on creating Unity and KDE would be a
lot more stable if the people behind say XFCE or GNOME pooled their
efforts towards improving it.

It's hard to build a decent car if everyone in the company is building
their own vehicle.


Gnome is my choice too. I wish they'd just make it *smooth*. It still
looks and feels cheap. The dev team need to make it beautiful and
fluid. And they need to get their zones a little better - a couple of
pixels out at least. They need to redo their zone maths completely (eg
the sensitivity for grabbing a window / corner etc.

On fluidy and beautiful-ness - they need to get their head around
blending and make it work.


In terms of aesthetics, it's already a lot prettier than KDE. For some
reason, people think KDE looks nice but I imagine the glaucoma they're
suffering from is pretty severe. I agree with you about GNOME's
smoothness but I believe that 3.16 addresses most of the problems.


--
Slimer
Proud "wintroll"
Encrypt.
  #70  
Old June 12th 15, 02:54 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.windows-xp,alt.comp.os.windows-8
Slimer
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 300
Default Is the XP classic start menu back (finally) with Windows 10?

On 2015-06-12 5:38 AM, Jeff Layman wrote:
On 11/06/15 01:05, Slimer wrote:
On 2015-06-10 7:01 PM, Paul B. Andersen wrote:
knuttle wrote in message


Until the advent of Ubuntu, Linux was far too much trouble (in
comparison).
Even now, Linux is just a little bit too much trouble.
I agree, Windows is ubiquitous (as is Macintosh) in the stores.


Ubuntu was indeed a Godsend and it has made Linux more acceptable for
the common user. The problem is that it still has a tremendous amount of
problems which appear after an update or two. Disappearing controls,
hardware stopped working, no longer able to boot to desktop, functions
which are visible but don't actually do anything, etc..


Spot on, in my experience. I installed Ubuntu 14.10 and several desktops
(from a magazine DVD) on a new laptop about 6 months ago. Many years
ago I had tried a liveCD on an XP desktop (Ubuntu 6?) seemed to work ok.
A couple of years later I tried version 9 also on a liveCD on the same
desktop (I forget the stupid names which seem to infest Linux, from
distros, desktops, and programs. It's one of my pet hates about Linux).
But while v6 was fine, v9 just failed to work at all, with "kernel
panic" error messages. Seems the new version just didn't like something
about the desktop hardware, which v6 had no problem with. It really put
me off Linux for years.

I was quite impressed with Ubuntu 14.10, although I didn't like Unity.
Xfce seemed the best desktop for me, although it had a couple of
annoying quirks, so I changed to KDE. That worked well enough, until the
update to Ubuntu 15.04 killed it. It also killed LXDE. Mate works, but
the desktop manager now doesn't, so I can't personalise it. Xfce
soldiers on.

I don't know how many error messages I've had, and in the 6 months I've
had the laptop I've had to do a forced cold reboot at least 6 times. I
never had to do that with Win7, and maybe that number of times with XP,
but over 9 years! I've never had a Windows Update cause a problem in all
that time. At least Linux always seems to recover from errors without
problem - it's never failed to boot.

As to the different programs, yes, much of what I used in Windows has a
Linux equivalent - sort of. It just isn't so polished. I installed WINE
to run an old program I had. And I miss IrfanView and PDF ExChange. I
believe they work with WINE, but haven't tried yet.


You'd be called a liar if you cited all of the problems you've faced
with Linux over on comp.os.linux.advocacy. In the minds of the Linux
Loser Liar's Club over there, it is absolutely impossible for the
operating system to cause the issues you've faced.

The one place I still find Linux drivers sometimes lacking is in
peripheral
hardware such as WiFi adapters and the like (mostly with Realtek chips).


How about Canon hardware?! I've spent hours trying to get an old Pixma
ip3000 printer working with Ubuntu. It half works, allowing colour
printing to paper, but to photographs, no - forget it. Wrong colours,
wrong dimensions. I've now given up, and have to use my failing Win7
laptop if I want to print any photos. I know long-term Linux users
criticise Canon for not supporting Linux, but distros should really make
it clear that there is at least one major supplier whose hardware might
not work with Linux.


With Linux, if it doesn't already work after it's plugged in, chances
are that it won't no matter what you do.

snip

--
Slimer
Proud "wintroll"
Encrypt.
  #72  
Old June 12th 15, 05:04 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.windows-xp,alt.comp.os.windows-8
Ken Blake, MVP[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,699
Default Is the XP classic start menu Commentary.

On Fri, 12 Jun 2015 08:19:50 -0400, knuttle
wrote:

On 6/12/2015 6:03 AM, Jonas Klein wrote:
Am 12.06.2015 um 04:29 schrieb knuttle:
The MS Icon is on the extreme right side of the taskbar both
on the Desktop and on the Metro Start screen.


Really? On my desktop it is on the extreme LEFT side!



So I just had a dyslexic event. Sorry.



But neither answer is always correct!

Although by default the task bar appears on the bottom of the screen,
it can be on any of the sides you prefer it on. To move it from any
side to another, simply click on an unused part of it and drag it
where you want it. Be sure to click *within* it, not on the edge;
clicking on the edge and dragging will resize it, not move it.

If it won't move, it may be locked. In that case, right click on it
and uncheck "Lock the taskbar," then try again.

By the way, with today's wide-screen monitors, I prefer the task bar
on the left or right side of the screen. I think that makes a better
use of screen real estate than having it at the bottom.

And where the start orb is depends on where you have the task bar. On
my computer, the start orb is in the upper left corner.

  #73  
Old June 12th 15, 06:02 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.windows-xp,alt.comp.os.windows-8
Mike Barnes[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 537
Default Is the XP classic start menu Commentary.

Ken Blake, MVP wrote:
By the way, with today's wide-screen monitors, I prefer the task bar
on the left or right side of the screen. I think that makes a better
use of screen real estate than having it at the bottom.


Agreed. Also the taskbar at the side accommodates many more items
without the inconvenience of multiple rows/columns.

--
Mike Barnes
Cheshire, England
  #74  
Old June 12th 15, 09:18 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.windows-xp,alt.comp.os.windows-8
Tough Guy no. 1265
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 364
Default Is the XP classic start menu back (finally) with Windows 10?

On Wed, 10 Jun 2015 02:34:50 +0100, Paul B. Andersen wrote:

Slimer mentioned this nice web page in a recent thread:
http://www.itechcolumn.com/2014/10/c...indows-10.html

Which seems to indicate that Windows 10 has the ability to get back
the missing WinXp Start Menu (whose only flaw was that people didn't
know how to make their own start menu OUTSIDE of the Windows default).

Am I reading that web page correctly that the user-customized start menu
(always outside of the default start menu) is back finally in Windows 10?

NOTE that the WinXP start menu works just fine if you create your own
hierarchy just below the top level, so that nothing goes into *your*
menu hierarchy except what *you* manually put there.

That way, the WinXP start menu style (classic style?) is extremely
manageable and functional. I had Dell set my kid up on Windows 8.1 with
this classic start menu, which turned out to be a folder hierarchy
embedded in the craziest place (something about roaming directories),
but once set up, it worked mostly like it should.

Is the Windows XP classic start menu (with a custom directory all of
your own being a requirement for usability!) back with Windows 10?


I prefer (and use via a 3rd party utility in Windows 8) the Windows 7 start menu. I open 99% of things from the recently used apps list on the left.

--
I take loads of laxatives when the pollen count rises. It stops me sneezing - I daren't.
  #75  
Old June 12th 15, 10:33 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.windows-xp,alt.comp.os.windows-8
Jonas Klein
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 30
Default Is the XP classic start menu Commentary.

Am 12.06.2015 um 18:04 schrieb Ken Blake, MVP: On Fri, 12
Jun 2015 08:19:50 -0400, knuttle
wrote:

On 6/12/2015 6:03 AM, Jonas Klein wrote:
Am 12.06.2015 um 04:29 schrieb knuttle:
The MS Icon is on the extreme right side of the taskbar both
on the Desktop and on the Metro Start screen.

Really? On my desktop it is on the extreme LEFT side!



So I just had a dyslexic event. Sorry.



But neither answer is always correct!

Although by default the task bar appears on the bottom of the screen,
it can be on any of the sides you prefer it on.


ACK. But I'm not going to change the default location. See
below.


By the way, with today's wide-screen monitors, I prefer the task bar
on the left or right side of the screen. I think that makes a better
use of screen real estate than having it at the bottom.


ACK, if you use your monitor mainly for looking at movies,
drawing with AutoCad etc. But I spend over 99% of my
computer time reading texts. The first time I saw a monitor
with pivot function, it was a mind-opening experience.
 




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