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Transferring all data from a suspect HDD.



 
 
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  #16  
Old January 19th 19, 12:49 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Paul[_32_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 11,873
Default Transferring all data from a suspect HDD.

Peter Jason wrote:
On Fri, 18 Jan 2019 17:33:38 -0500, Paul
wrote:

Peter Jason wrote:
On Fri, 18 Jan 2019 16:39:21 -0500, nospam
wrote:

In article , Peter Jason
wrote:

I notice the errant HDD is not recognized by
Macrium 7, so I can't try to clone it.
can it be seen otherwise?
Yes, in Disk Management & File Explorer. So I'll
buy the new disk & start transferring this very
day.

Do you have any info on the drive ?

https://i.postimg.cc/fbFckGnG/some-disk-info.gif

Even that little bit doesn't tell us very much.

Some of the utilities I'd like to use, are
too hard to get (Cygwin "disktype.exe" being
an example).

There has got to be some reason Macrium
cannot see it.

Paul


Thank you; I've shunted into panic mode (steels
the resolve) and connected a new 4TB HDD and the
data is being transferred as I type this. The
speed is woeful at between 6 & 50MB/sec. I'll
check things as soon as the contents have been
copied across.


I hope it's not too far gone.

Nobody really likes my gddrescue recipe :-)

*******

https://www.technibble.com/guide-usi...-recover-data/

ddrescue -d -f -r3 /dev/sda /dev/sdb /media/PNY_usb/rescue.logfile

That shows how you transfer from "bad" sda disk to "good" sdb disk.
I wouldn't put the logfile on a USB stick, in case of the
write pattern that would result. If the /tmp is relatively big
and RAM based, I might use /tmp/rescue.logfile as a place for
the logfile. If the power goes off, of course /tmp/rescue.logfile
would be lost.

On other distros, the syntax and options might look different

sudo apt install gddrescue

man ddrescue # look up the command options

sudo ddrescue ... /dev/sda /dev/sdb /tmp/rescue.logfile

It depends on whether a LiveCD has you running as root, or
it uses a regular user account plus "sudo" for elevation.

The benefit of ddrescue, is it makes a fast first pass and
gets most of the data on that first pass. Because it keeps
a "logfile", it keeps track of the "hard to get" stuff.
Repeated runs of the tool, with the tool reading in the
logfile and seeing what needs to be done, means the tool
focuses on the hard to get stuff on subsequent runs.

Eventually you reach a point where no additional data can
be read.

Using the information about which LBAs could not be copied,
you can (with "maths"), figure out which file or files
are corrupted and "not expected to live". Those are the
files you would then search in your backup collection,
to see if you have versions suitable for replacement.

Heavy damage to OS partitions will likely mean a Repair Install
of some sort. On Vista+, Repair Install is only possible if
the existing (damaged) OS will boot.

Paul
Ads
  #17  
Old January 19th 19, 07:43 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Frank Slootweg
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,226
Default Transferring all data from a suspect HDD.

Paul wrote:
[...]

In Unix, issuing several sync() commands would cause flushing
of content to actual storage, in an attempt to eliminate
damage that could happen soon after that.

https://linux.die.net/man/2/sync

"sync() causes all buffered modifications to file metadata
and data to be written to the underlying file systems."


The several sync's in a row routine was just poor usage when people
didn't know how to properly *shutdown* ('shutdown', hint, hint) the
*system*.

For stopping/disconnecting/whatever a *disk-drive*, one could and
can just umount the logical volume(s) and all would/will be well.
  #18  
Old January 20th 19, 09:47 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Peter Jason
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,310
Default Transferring all data from a suspect HDD.

On Fri, 18 Jan 2019 18:49:22 -0500, Paul
wrote:

Peter Jason wrote:
On Fri, 18 Jan 2019 17:33:38 -0500, Paul
wrote:

Peter Jason wrote:
On Fri, 18 Jan 2019 16:39:21 -0500, nospam
wrote:

In article , Peter Jason
wrote:

I notice the errant HDD is not recognized by
Macrium 7, so I can't try to clone it.
can it be seen otherwise?
Yes, in Disk Management & File Explorer. So I'll
buy the new disk & start transferring this very
day.
Do you have any info on the drive ?

https://i.postimg.cc/fbFckGnG/some-disk-info.gif

Even that little bit doesn't tell us very much.

Some of the utilities I'd like to use, are
too hard to get (Cygwin "disktype.exe" being
an example).

There has got to be some reason Macrium
cannot see it.

Paul


Thank you; I've shunted into panic mode (steels
the resolve) and connected a new 4TB HDD and the
data is being transferred as I type this. The
speed is woeful at between 6 & 50MB/sec. I'll
check things as soon as the contents have been
copied across.


I hope it's not too far gone.

Nobody really likes my gddrescue recipe :-)

*******

https://www.technibble.com/guide-usi...-recover-data/

ddrescue -d -f -r3 /dev/sda /dev/sdb /media/PNY_usb/rescue.logfile

That shows how you transfer from "bad" sda disk to "good" sdb disk.
I wouldn't put the logfile on a USB stick, in case of the
write pattern that would result. If the /tmp is relatively big
and RAM based, I might use /tmp/rescue.logfile as a place for
the logfile. If the power goes off, of course /tmp/rescue.logfile
would be lost.

On other distros, the syntax and options might look different

sudo apt install gddrescue

man ddrescue # look up the command options

sudo ddrescue ... /dev/sda /dev/sdb /tmp/rescue.logfile

It depends on whether a LiveCD has you running as root, or
it uses a regular user account plus "sudo" for elevation.

The benefit of ddrescue, is it makes a fast first pass and
gets most of the data on that first pass. Because it keeps
a "logfile", it keeps track of the "hard to get" stuff.
Repeated runs of the tool, with the tool reading in the
logfile and seeing what needs to be done, means the tool
focuses on the hard to get stuff on subsequent runs.

Eventually you reach a point where no additional data can
be read.

Using the information about which LBAs could not be copied,
you can (with "maths"), figure out which file or files
are corrupted and "not expected to live". Those are the
files you would then search in your backup collection,
to see if you have versions suitable for replacement.

Heavy damage to OS partitions will likely mean a Repair Install
of some sort. On Vista+, Repair Install is only possible if
the existing (damaged) OS will boot.

Paul


I transferred all the data over to the new 4TB
HDD, successfully. I did this bit by bit,
deleting unnecessary stuff and this new drive
chkdsked OK & was recognized by Macrium.

The old faulty 4TB drive I quick-formatted after
which this also chkdsked OK & was recognized by
Macrium too.

So it was some software problem on the old HDD,
and I wonder what this was & how I account for
this in the future. Was it some partition problem
& is there some diagnostic for this?
  #19  
Old January 20th 19, 09:49 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,718
Default Transferring all data from a suspect HDD.

In article , Peter Jason
wrote:

The old faulty 4TB drive I quick-formatted after
which this also chkdsked OK & was recognized by
Macrium too.


zeroing all sectors will remap any bad blocks.

So it was some software problem on the old HDD,
and I wonder what this was & how I account for
this in the future. Was it some partition problem
& is there some diagnostic for this?


check smart data, although it may not be conclusive.
  #20  
Old January 20th 19, 09:51 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
David B.[_10_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 286
Default Transferring all data from a suspect HDD.

On 20/01/2019 20:47, Peter Jason wrote:
[....]
& is there some diagnostic for this?


https://howtorecover.me/hdd-test-dia...s-repair-tools

HTH :-)

--
David B.
  #21  
Old January 20th 19, 10:15 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Paul[_32_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 11,873
Default Transferring all data from a suspect HDD.

Peter Jason wrote:


I transferred all the data over to the new 4TB
HDD, successfully. I did this bit by bit,
deleting unnecessary stuff and this new drive
chkdsked OK & was recognized by Macrium.

The old faulty 4TB drive I quick-formatted after
which this also chkdsked OK & was recognized by
Macrium too.

So it was some software problem on the old HDD,
and I wonder what this was & how I account for
this in the future. Was it some partition problem
& is there some diagnostic for this?


I don't think you'd like my tools for this anyway.

You can try HDTune or any other SMART readout and
have a look for physical level trouble. This is what
a good hard drive looks like, zoned recording and all.
Note that HDTune free version cannot properly test a
large drive, as the program is kinda intended for
1TB to 2TB drives or so. The paid version is kept up
to date with newer technology, so might well be
better at this.

https://i.postimg.cc/rpJpKMTR/no-domino-flaws-here.gif

For partitions, I like this program. I got a Windows
copy by installing Cygwin, installing the package
for this, then keeping the necessary three files and
uninstalling Cygwin. If a partition is "flaky", like
one level of metadata is damaged, this utility might
say something in the log.

http://disktype.sourceforge.net/

disktype.exe 143KB \
cygwin1.dll 3123KB \___ portable Cygwin version.
cyggcc_s-1.dll 102KB / the last two files are part of the base Cygwin

CHKDSK is less likely to be "honest" about what
it's doing. It could repair something and not tell
you, or it may choose to *only* repair something,
with some of the newer command line parameters enabled.

In any case, if you want to do forensics on a sick
drive, you can't steam roll the thing and then start
to work on it... Just leave it with the damaged partition
and files on it, then work on it and draw your conclusions.

Paul
  #22  
Old January 20th 19, 10:25 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Peter Jason
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,310
Default Transferring all data from a suspect HDD.

On Sun, 20 Jan 2019 16:15:18 -0500, Paul
wrote:

Peter Jason wrote:


I transferred all the data over to the new 4TB
HDD, successfully. I did this bit by bit,
deleting unnecessary stuff and this new drive
chkdsked OK & was recognized by Macrium.

The old faulty 4TB drive I quick-formatted after
which this also chkdsked OK & was recognized by
Macrium too.

So it was some software problem on the old HDD,
and I wonder what this was & how I account for
this in the future. Was it some partition problem
& is there some diagnostic for this?


I don't think you'd like my tools for this anyway.

You can try HDTune or any other SMART readout and
have a look for physical level trouble. This is what
a good hard drive looks like, zoned recording and all.
Note that HDTune free version cannot properly test a
large drive, as the program is kinda intended for
1TB to 2TB drives or so. The paid version is kept up
to date with newer technology, so might well be
better at this.

https://i.postimg.cc/rpJpKMTR/no-domino-flaws-here.gif

For partitions, I like this program. I got a Windows
copy by installing Cygwin, installing the package
for this, then keeping the necessary three files and
uninstalling Cygwin. If a partition is "flaky", like
one level of metadata is damaged, this utility might
say something in the log.

http://disktype.sourceforge.net/

disktype.exe 143KB \
cygwin1.dll 3123KB \___ portable Cygwin version.
cyggcc_s-1.dll 102KB / the last two files are part of the base Cygwin

CHKDSK is less likely to be "honest" about what
it's doing. It could repair something and not tell
you, or it may choose to *only* repair something,
with some of the newer command line parameters enabled.

In any case, if you want to do forensics on a sick
drive, you can't steam roll the thing and then start
to work on it... Just leave it with the damaged partition
and files on it, then work on it and draw your conclusions.

Paul


Thanks to all. I'm slow-formatting the old disk
right now (v.slow business). I do remember it had
some files it would not delete, if this is
relevant. Can I keep using this old drive now
after all this? Soon I'll do all the diagnostics
I can find.
  #23  
Old January 20th 19, 10:38 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,718
Default Transferring all data from a suspect HDD.

In article , Peter Jason
wrote:


Thanks to all. I'm slow-formatting the old disk
right now (v.slow business). I do remember it had
some files it would not delete, if this is
relevant. Can I keep using this old drive now
after all this? Soon I'll do all the diagnostics
I can find.


for a scratch drive, sure.
  #24  
Old January 20th 19, 11:16 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Carlos E.R.[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,356
Default Transferring all data from a suspect HDD.

On 20/01/2019 22.25, Peter Jason wrote:
Thanks to all. I'm slow-formatting the old disk
right now (v.slow business). I do remember it had
some files it would not delete, if this is
relevant. Can I keep using this old drive now
after all this? Soon I'll do all the diagnostics
I can find.


You need the long SMART test diagnostic. Depends what it says - sorry, I
do not know how to obtain it in Windows, but google helps:

https://www.howtogeek.com/134735/how-to-see-if-your-hard-drive-is-dying/

*How to See If Your Hard Drive Is Dying with S.M.A.R.T.*

«Hard drives use S.M.A.R.T. (Self-Monitoring, Analysis, and Reporting
Technology) to gauge their own reliability and determine if they’re
failing. You can view your hard drive’s S.M.A.R.T. data and see if it
has started to develop problems.

Hard drives don’t live forever, and you often can’t see the end coming.
Fortunately, most modern drives support S.M.A.R.T., so they can at least
do some basic self-monitoring. Unfortunately, Windows doesn’t have an
easy-to-use built-in tool that shows your hard disk’s S.M.A.R.T. data.
You can view a very basic S.M.A.R.T. status from the Command Prompt, but
to really see this information, you’ll need to grab a third-party app.»


https://www.maketecheasier.com/check-hard-disk-health-windows/

*Worried About Your Hard Disk? Here Are 4 Ways to Check Hard Disk Health
on Windows*

--
Cheers, Carlos.
  #25  
Old January 20th 19, 11:39 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,718
Default Transferring all data from a suspect HDD.

In article , Carlos E.R.
wrote:

Thanks to all. I'm slow-formatting the old disk
right now (v.slow business). I do remember it had
some files it would not delete, if this is
relevant. Can I keep using this old drive now
after all this? Soon I'll do all the diagnostics
I can find.


You need the long SMART test diagnostic. Depends what it says - sorry, I
do not know how to obtain it in Windows, but google helps:


multiple platforms:
https://www.smartmontools.org
  #26  
Old January 21st 19, 01:34 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Paul[_32_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 11,873
Default Transferring all data from a suspect HDD.

Peter Jason wrote:


Thanks to all. I'm slow-formatting the old disk
right now (v.slow business). I do remember it had
some files it would not delete, if this is
relevant. Can I keep using this old drive now
after all this? Soon I'll do all the diagnostics
I can find.


Amongst other things, you can use the manufacturer
diagnostic. Both Seagate and WDC have one.

One way to clean a drive, is like this:

(Administrator Command Prompt)

diskpart
list disk # make sure you select the correct disk

select disk 2
list partitions # list the info for the disk to be sure
select partition 1
detail partition
select partition 2
detail partition
...
clean all # "Clean all bytes" zeros *every byte* on the drive
exit # No partitions will remain when you are done

When you do a slow format, that doesn't write the drive!
It does a read verify. You create an NTFS partition and
format NTFS. It writes a $MFT, but then it scans every
cluster looking for CRC read errors and it adds the
bad cluster addresses to $BADCLUS. Thus, it doesn't do
the writing you would expect.

Doing a "clean all", then creating a partition and formatting
NTFS with the long format option, that at least should read
all the areas you just wiped with "clean all". Next, you
get one of the SMART tools already mentioned in the thread
and check your reallocated, or you use a disk read transfer
rate benchmark to evaluate the drive for "symptoms" of ill health.

The benchmark curve shows trouble, before SMART does.

Note that Windows 10 makes a **** poor test environment for
benchmark curves... sadly. If I needed photographic quality
transfer curves for a magazine, I'd use Win2K for the OS
and I'd use a VIA chipset (smooth SATA ports). Neither of
those options is "perfect" for every usage case obviously,
but those were two exemplary items at the time. Today if I
need to do a benchmark curve, I end up grinding my teeth,
and that isn't good for my teeth. There would be endless
misery, trying to get a good (artifact free) curve.

HTH,
Paul
 




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