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  #31  
Old October 11th 12, 07:22 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-8
Ed Cryer
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,576
Default Windows 8 SP1

Zaphod Beeblebrox wrote:
On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 18:50:56 +0100, "Ed Cryer"
wrote in article ...

Zaphod Beeblebrox wrote:
On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 11:29:42 -0400, "Chris S." cside38
@nospamverizon.net wrote in article ...

"Bob Henson" wrote in message
...


On 11/10/2012 3:39 PM, Zaphod Beeblebrox wrote:
On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 15:30:33 +0100, "Bob Henson"
wrote in article ...

On 11/10/2012 2:57 PM, Zaphod Beeblebrox wrote:
On Wed, 10 Oct 2012 16:09:05 +0100, "Bob Henson"
wrote in article ...

Broken before it starts! Not yet on the market and the first major fix
is ready.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/10..._8_rtm_update/

This is not a Service Pack. It is just a handful of updates - and as I
recall, there were a hand full of updates for Windows 7 shortly after
release, as with Windows Vista and XP as well, so this just means they
are getting a bit better at delivering updates.

As to "broken before it starts", name a single modern OS that doesn't
release patches and fixes on a regular schedule, often shortly after
the OS is released.


But not often *before* it is released.


And I repeat:

this just means they are getting a bit better at delivering
updates.

Or do you think they should wait longer before releasing the updates
for some reason? It is foolish to think that all of the bugs that the
updates released shortly after Win 7 etc. were released to fix were
discovered and fixed after the OS was released. So, as with previous
OS releases, folks on the consumer preview and early adopters of the
RTM reported bugs and MS fixed and tested some of them and released
them - in this case, more quickly than before. What in the world is
wrong with that?


Nothing - but all the beta testing and changes should be done before the
release is announced and initiated. Otherwise they are taking money for
a product known to be faulty. Naturally other things will need patching
from time to time as the hackers get smarter and get to grips with the
newly released software, but on release day the product should be
complete as far as Microsoft know.

--
Bob
Tetbury, Gloucestershire, UK

ALL software products are "known to be faulty" when they are released.
Is this your first computer?



+1


-1

When I spent a whole weekend on site testing a DOE stock-system on an
old ICL mainframe I certainly didn't know it to be faulty.
It did show up some hiccups, but we all mucked in and ironed them out.
And when we gave the go ahead to move into parallel running with the old
system, we didn't know that it was faulty.
And after amendments discovered at that phase we certainly didn't know
that it was faulty when we gave the green light for it to move "live".

Ok, so it did show up one or two problems even after that. But we got
the blame; and deservedly. For what? For insufficient testing!!!


I'll see your -1 and raise you -2.

You may not know of any specific bugs in the software when you release
it, but you *should* know that there are bugs in it somewhere. Almost
certainly, any software more complicated than a "hello world" routine
contains at least one bug. Programmer's axiom: Working code is not
bug-free code.


Salesman's axiom: This is the best ever.
Customer's scepticism: Are you sure?
Salesman: Sure thing.
Customer: That's better than the guy next door. He's saying that there
are loads of bugs in his wares. Right then, I'll buy yours.

Ed
--
Two plus two equals four is only true in a rational world.
Try proving it.
You'll require the pre-existence of an axiom system which is universally
accepted.
And that axiom system will be unprovable from within the same system.
What then proves that 2+2=4?
Only a human conspiracy that it stay true.





Ads
  #32  
Old October 11th 12, 07:23 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-8
Zaphod Beeblebrox
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 868
Default Windows 8 SP1

On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 11:09:39 -0700, "Ken Blake"
wrote in article ...

On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 15:30:33 +0100, Bob Henson
wrote:



On 11/10/2012 2:57 PM, Zaphod Beeblebrox wrote:
On Wed, 10 Oct 2012 16:09:05 +0100, "Bob Henson"
wrote in article ...

Broken before it starts! Not yet on the market and the first major fix
is ready.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/10..._8_rtm_update/

This is not a Service Pack. It is just a handful of updates - and as I
recall, there were a hand full of updates for Windows 7 shortly after
release, as with Windows Vista and XP as well, so this just means they
are getting a bit better at delivering updates.

As to "broken before it starts", name a single modern OS that doesn't
release patches and fixes on a regular schedule, often shortly after
the OS is released.


But not often *before* it is released.



It's not really before it's released. Windows 8 was released on August
15. True, it isn't yet for sale, but it was released, not only to
manufacturers but also to those of us with MSDN or Technet
subscriptions. I have it here, and lots of others around the world
also do.


+1

--
Zaphod

Voted "Worst Dressed Sentient Being in the Known Universe" for seven
years in a row.
  #33  
Old October 11th 12, 07:28 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-8
Gene E. Bloch[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,485
Default Windows 8 SP1

On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 14:06:38 -0400, Zaphod Beeblebrox wrote:

On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 18:50:56 +0100, "Ed Cryer"
wrote in article ...

Zaphod Beeblebrox wrote:
On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 11:29:42 -0400, "Chris S." cside38
@nospamverizon.net wrote in article ...

"Bob Henson" wrote in message
...


On 11/10/2012 3:39 PM, Zaphod Beeblebrox wrote:
On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 15:30:33 +0100, "Bob Henson"
wrote in article ...

On 11/10/2012 2:57 PM, Zaphod Beeblebrox wrote:
On Wed, 10 Oct 2012 16:09:05 +0100, "Bob Henson"
wrote in article ...

Broken before it starts! Not yet on the market and the first major fix
is ready.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/10..._8_rtm_update/

This is not a Service Pack. It is just a handful of updates - and as I
recall, there were a hand full of updates for Windows 7 shortly after
release, as with Windows Vista and XP as well, so this just means they
are getting a bit better at delivering updates.

As to "broken before it starts", name a single modern OS that doesn't
release patches and fixes on a regular schedule, often shortly after
the OS is released.


But not often *before* it is released.


And I repeat:

this just means they are getting a bit better at delivering
updates.

Or do you think they should wait longer before releasing the updates
for some reason? It is foolish to think that all of the bugs that the
updates released shortly after Win 7 etc. were released to fix were
discovered and fixed after the OS was released. So, as with previous
OS releases, folks on the consumer preview and early adopters of the
RTM reported bugs and MS fixed and tested some of them and released
them - in this case, more quickly than before. What in the world is
wrong with that?


Nothing - but all the beta testing and changes should be done before the
release is announced and initiated. Otherwise they are taking money for
a product known to be faulty. Naturally other things will need patching
from time to time as the hackers get smarter and get to grips with the
newly released software, but on release day the product should be
complete as far as Microsoft know.

--
Bob
Tetbury, Gloucestershire, UK

ALL software products are "known to be faulty" when they are released.
Is this your first computer?



+1


-1

When I spent a whole weekend on site testing a DOE stock-system on an
old ICL mainframe I certainly didn't know it to be faulty.
It did show up some hiccups, but we all mucked in and ironed them out.
And when we gave the go ahead to move into parallel running with the old
system, we didn't know that it was faulty.
And after amendments discovered at that phase we certainly didn't know
that it was faulty when we gave the green light for it to move "live".

Ok, so it did show up one or two problems even after that. But we got
the blame; and deservedly. For what? For insufficient testing!!!

I'll see your -1 and raise you -2.

You may not know of any specific bugs in the software when you release
it, but you *should* know that there are bugs in it somewhere. Almost
certainly, any software more complicated than a "hello world" routine
contains at least one bug. Programmer's axiom: Working code is not
bug-free code.


Not to mention Godel's proof (or Gödel's, if you prefer).

Also, given the infrastructure behind Hello World in let's say Java or
Android programming, I wouldn't even bet on a bug-free Hello World
program :-)

--
Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch)
  #34  
Old October 11th 12, 08:29 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-8
Zaphod Beeblebrox
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 868
Default Windows 8 SP1

On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 11:28:43 -0700, "Gene E. Bloch" not-
lid wrote in article
...

On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 14:06:38 -0400, Zaphod Beeblebrox wrote:

On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 18:50:56 +0100, "Ed Cryer"
wrote in article ...

Zaphod Beeblebrox wrote:
On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 11:29:42 -0400, "Chris S." cside38
@nospamverizon.net wrote in article ...

"Bob Henson" wrote in message
...


On 11/10/2012 3:39 PM, Zaphod Beeblebrox wrote:
On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 15:30:33 +0100, "Bob Henson"
wrote in article ...

On 11/10/2012 2:57 PM, Zaphod Beeblebrox wrote:
On Wed, 10 Oct 2012 16:09:05 +0100, "Bob Henson"
wrote in article ...

Broken before it starts! Not yet on the market and the first major fix
is ready.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/10..._8_rtm_update/

This is not a Service Pack. It is just a handful of updates - and as I
recall, there were a hand full of updates for Windows 7 shortly after
release, as with Windows Vista and XP as well, so this just means they
are getting a bit better at delivering updates.

As to "broken before it starts", name a single modern OS that doesn't
release patches and fixes on a regular schedule, often shortly after
the OS is released.


But not often *before* it is released.


And I repeat:

this just means they are getting a bit better at delivering
updates.

Or do you think they should wait longer before releasing the updates
for some reason? It is foolish to think that all of the bugs that the
updates released shortly after Win 7 etc. were released to fix were
discovered and fixed after the OS was released. So, as with previous
OS releases, folks on the consumer preview and early adopters of the
RTM reported bugs and MS fixed and tested some of them and released
them - in this case, more quickly than before. What in the world is
wrong with that?


Nothing - but all the beta testing and changes should be done before the
release is announced and initiated. Otherwise they are taking money for
a product known to be faulty. Naturally other things will need patching
from time to time as the hackers get smarter and get to grips with the
newly released software, but on release day the product should be
complete as far as Microsoft know.

--
Bob
Tetbury, Gloucestershire, UK

ALL software products are "known to be faulty" when they are released.
Is this your first computer?



+1


-1

When I spent a whole weekend on site testing a DOE stock-system on an
old ICL mainframe I certainly didn't know it to be faulty.
It did show up some hiccups, but we all mucked in and ironed them out.
And when we gave the go ahead to move into parallel running with the old
system, we didn't know that it was faulty.
And after amendments discovered at that phase we certainly didn't know
that it was faulty when we gave the green light for it to move "live".

Ok, so it did show up one or two problems even after that. But we got
the blame; and deservedly. For what? For insufficient testing!!!

I'll see your -1 and raise you -2.

You may not know of any specific bugs in the software when you release
it, but you *should* know that there are bugs in it somewhere. Almost
certainly, any software more complicated than a "hello world" routine
contains at least one bug. Programmer's axiom: Working code is not
bug-free code.


Not to mention Godel's proof (or Gödel's, if you prefer).

Also, given the infrastructure behind Hello World in let's say Java or
Android programming, I wouldn't even bet on a bug-free Hello World
program :-)


LOL too true!

--
Zaphod

Voted "Worst Dressed Sentient Being in the Known Universe" for seven
years in a row.
  #35  
Old October 11th 12, 11:51 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-8
SC Tom[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,051
Default Windows 8 SP1



"Bob Henson" wrote in message
...


On 11/10/2012 4:29 PM, Chris S. wrote:

"Bob Henson" wrote in message
...


On 11/10/2012 3:39 PM, Zaphod Beeblebrox wrote:
On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 15:30:33 +0100, "Bob Henson"
wrote in article ...

On 11/10/2012 2:57 PM, Zaphod Beeblebrox wrote:
On Wed, 10 Oct 2012 16:09:05 +0100, "Bob Henson"
wrote in article ...

Broken before it starts! Not yet on the market and the first major
fix
is ready.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/10..._8_rtm_update/

This is not a Service Pack. It is just a handful of updates - and as
I
recall, there were a hand full of updates for Windows 7 shortly after
release, as with Windows Vista and XP as well, so this just means
they
are getting a bit better at delivering updates.

As to "broken before it starts", name a single modern OS that doesn't
release patches and fixes on a regular schedule, often shortly after
the OS is released.


But not often *before* it is released.


And I repeat:

this just means they are getting a bit better at delivering
updates.

Or do you think they should wait longer before releasing the updates
for some reason? It is foolish to think that all of the bugs that the
updates released shortly after Win 7 etc. were released to fix were
discovered and fixed after the OS was released. So, as with previous
OS releases, folks on the consumer preview and early adopters of the
RTM reported bugs and MS fixed and tested some of them and released
them - in this case, more quickly than before. What in the world is
wrong with that?


Nothing - but all the beta testing and changes should be done before the
release is announced and initiated. Otherwise they are taking money for
a product known to be faulty. Naturally other things will need patching
from time to time as the hackers get smarter and get to grips with the
newly released software, but on release day the product should be
complete as far as Microsoft know.

--
Bob
Tetbury, Gloucestershire, UK

ALL software products are "known to be faulty" when they are released.
Is this your first computer?


Perfection is hard to achieve, but many programs come close, and you
certainly don't have to apply a service pack on Day 1. I wrote a
pharmacy dispensing program (using DOS, and then QuickBasic) in the
early days of computing (before you were born, maybe - 1985?) of which I
sold a few copies, and no bugs were ever reported back to me. I, and
others, tested it for months - it wasn't by accident that it worked
straight out of the box.


Not to belittle your accomplishment, but do you really think a few hundred
lines of code are as hard to troubleshoot as a few million (or however many
lines there are)? A lot easier to test and troubleshoot your lines of
interactive code than that of an operating system, I would be willing to
bet. I used to write CAM programs for different makes and models of
machining centers, and I know what a PITA it was to troubleshoot the output
of the post-processor we had, and edit the programs to create the proper
output commands that a machine could use without running amok. I can't even
imagine trying to find faults in something as complex as an OS. Granted,
there are probably thousands (hundreds?) of people whose job it is to test
that stuff, but still, the interaction of each person's block with the
others must seem daunting.
--
SC Tom


Just for one other example - there are hundreds
- I'll pick a Microsoft one. My copy of Outlook 2007 has never fallen
over since I installed it (it has had the odd background patch, of
course). Neither did the last one - 2003.

Standards have fallen, yes, but not as far as you think - there is still
some good stuff out there. Windows 8 isn't one of them. Don't worry,
Windows 9 won't be far behind. Windows 7 support will be extended long
enough for me not to care either way. But you'll have to forgive me for
laughing at Windows 8 - because that's what it is - a joke.

--
Bob
Tetbury, Gloucestershire, UK


A preposition must never be used to end a sentence with.
And never start a sentence with a conjunction.


 




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