What is SP2 doing - apart from trashing everybody's PC??

Do I detect a thread here, lotsa people seem to be
updating to XP SP2 and then start losing things like
soundcards, lan ports, printers, scanners, drives,
removable drives

Is it me - am I paranoid or has MS screwed it up
completely???

Hugh

Yes, you are indeed paranoid. A well-maintained PC will
install SP2 without any adverse installation issues.

Windows XP Service Pack 2 Checklist
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/xpsp2.htm

[Courtesy of MS-MVP Jupiter Jones]

--
Carey Frisch
Microsoft MVP
Windows XP - Shell/User

Be Smart! Protect Your PC!
http://www.microsoft.com/athome/secu...t/default.aspx

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

"Hugh" wrote:

| Do I detect a thread here, lotsa people seem to be
| updating to XP SP2 and then start losing things like
| soundcards, lan ports, printers, scanners, drives,
| removable drives
|
| Is it me - am I paranoid or has MS screwed it up
| completely???
|
| Hugh

Not necessarily--ever try upgrading a Prescott processor with too low of a
microcode update??
Luckily, Mat highlights the issue on your cited link.

Such broad statements are dangerous and can cause users to lose valuable
data. Laptop users especially should ALWAYS check with the manufacturer
before performing service pack upgrades.


--
Larry Samuels MS-MVP (Windows-Shell/User)
Associate Expert
Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone
Unofficial FAQ for Windows Server 2003 at
http://pelos.us/SERVER.htm
"Carey Frisch [MVP]" wrote in message
...
Yes, you are indeed paranoid. A well-maintained PC will
install SP2 without any adverse installation issues.

Windows XP Service Pack 2 Checklist
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/xpsp2.htm

[Courtesy of MS-MVP Jupiter Jones]

--
Carey Frisch
Microsoft MVP
Windows XP - Shell/User

Be Smart! Protect Your PC!
http://www.microsoft.com/athome/secu...t/default.aspx

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

"Hugh" wrote:

| Do I detect a thread here, lotsa people seem to be
| updating to XP SP2 and then start losing things like
| soundcards, lan ports, printers, scanners, drives,
| removable drives
|
| Is it me - am I paranoid or has MS screwed it up
| completely???
|
| Hugh

It's you!

--

Regards:

Richard Urban

aka Crusty (-: Old B@stard :-)

"Hugh" wrote in message
...
Do I detect a thread here, lotsa people seem to be
updating to XP SP2 and then start losing things like
soundcards, lan ports, printers, scanners, drives,
removable drives

Is it me - am I paranoid or has MS screwed it up
completely???

Hugh

Paranoid? Not necessarily. It's important to realize that most people
posting on newsgroups do so because they have a problem. You don't get the
others that installed just fine (like myself) posting saying that everything
is okay. The best advice is to do all you can to research the upgrade for
your particular system, backup your data and configuration (or your entire
system), then do the upgrade with the option to uninstall it if it doesn't
work out.

Remember, things can go wrong even with the best maintained system. Making
sure you can recover from problems is an important part of any major
upgrade.

"Hugh" wrote in message
...
Do I detect a thread here, lotsa people seem to be
updating to XP SP2 and then start losing things like
soundcards, lan ports, printers, scanners, drives,
removable drives

Is it me - am I paranoid or has MS screwed it up
completely???

Hugh

Hugh;
These newsgroups are for computer issues and thus a majority of posts
deal with problems.
SP-2 is a major recent update and because of that gets a lot of
coverage here.

Microsoft has nor screwed up unless you say not testing SP-2 on all
possible combinations is a screw up.
Consider the total number of Windows XP computers in the world.
No two are identical.
No one, not even Microsoft could possibly test anything on all
possible combinations.
Even so SP-2 is possibly the most tested piece of software ever
released.

Check for possible hardware and software issues before starting:
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/xpsp2.htm
Follow the Service Pack Installation Checklist to install SP-2:
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/spackins.htm

--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/


"Hugh" wrote in message
...
Do I detect a thread here, lotsa people seem to be
updating to XP SP2 and then start losing things like
soundcards, lan ports, printers, scanners, drives,
removable drives

Is it me - am I paranoid or has MS screwed it up
completely???

Hugh

Hugh wrote:
Do I detect a thread here, lotsa people seem to be
updating to XP SP2 and then start losing things like
soundcards, lan ports, printers, scanners, drives,
removable drives

Is it me - am I paranoid or has MS screwed it up
completely???

I don't believe Microsoft "screwed it up completely" as you put it.

What I see is a minority of users having trouble because their system
already had trouble, possibly unseen, before installing SP2. Loads of
adware/spyware/malware.. Incompatable applications, possibly even key
loggers and other trojan-like apps. A little cleanup before SP2 is
installed will help.

An even smaller minority of users actually have hardware/software that has
not been upgraded to work with the improved security or other changes SP2
entailed. For example, "EndNote 8" does not work with SP2, but did work on
XP prior to that. They even admit on their web page that users of EndNote 6
and 7 will not have trouble, only their latest and greatest (8) has problems
and THEY are working on the patch to remedy the situation. Their product,
their problem. Other similar situations have come up with hardware drivers
and the likes... The sad part is that these companies all had access to the
SP2 Betas like everyone else - very few tested beforehand.

My bet is 10% - maybe 20% of Windows XP SP1 users will have trouble.. of
that 10-20%, 75% will probably fall into the former - meaning they should
have better checked their hardware/software patches, scanned for malware in
various ways, defragmented and check their hard drives for errors, updated
their BIOS where appropriate before installing a Windows patch that is
almost as large as the original install! A little planning, preperation and
knowledge would go a long way.. Don't have that type of time - everyone has
a geek friend, 16 year old son/daughter or something - and for the rest -
research, plan or get someone to help if it makes you nervous.

I have had my share of trouble with it in the workplace - none at home. A
few popups were blocked at work that shouldn't have been or a few security
settings were too high - a little GPO manipulation and everything is
better - better than before, not just better since I fixed the SP2
problems - overall. After all, the control of the Windows Firewall from a
GPO is fantastic - External and internal firewalls...

Anyway - although I am not saying anything is wrong with your statement, I
hope I have at least contributed to your thought process.. With a little
pre-planning, Windows XP SP2 will work for MOST people without a hitch. And
if they did that same pre-planning, for those that it wouldn't work for -
they already know.

--
- Shenan -
--
The information is provided "as is", it is suggested you research for
yourself before you take any advice - you are the one ultimately
responsible for your actions/problems/solutions. Know what you are
getting into before you jump in with both feet.

On Sun, 19 Sep 2004 13:40:59 -0700, "Hugh"
wrote:

Do I detect a thread here, lotsa people seem to be
updating to XP SP2 and then start losing things like
soundcards, lan ports, printers, scanners, drives,
removable drives

Is it me - am I paranoid or has MS screwed it up
completely???

Hugh

All you are seeing is a very vocal minority who report problems when
they apply the service pack. What you don't read are the vast
majority who applied the service pack and had no problems. They don't
post "It went great love it" messages. unlike the negative nellies who
have had problems. Those problems are usually due to unsupported
hardware more often than not...and that's not Microsoft's fault.

Carey Frisch [MVP] wrote:

Yes, you are indeed paranoid. A well-maintained PC will
install SP2 without any adverse installation issues.

Windows XP Service Pack 2 Checklist
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/xpsp2.htm

[Courtesy of MS-MVP Jupiter Jones]


Bull$hit. My well-maintained PC didn't. And I'm tired of people like you
having the gall to suggest otherwise. You have no basis in knowledge
other than your personal experience to suggest otherwise.

Jupiter Jones [MVP] wrote:

Hugh;
These newsgroups are for computer issues and thus a majority of posts
deal with problems.
SP-2 is a major recent update and because of that gets a lot of
coverage here.

Microsoft has nor screwed up unless you say not testing SP-2 on all
possible combinations is a screw up.
Consider the total number of Windows XP computers in the world.
No two are identical.
No one, not even Microsoft could possibly test anything on all
possible combinations.
Even so SP-2 is possibly the most tested piece of software ever
released.

Check for possible hardware and software issues before starting:
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/xpsp2.htm
Follow the Service Pack Installation Checklist to install SP-2:
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/spackins.htm

Which the original XP release should have been.

Shenan Stanley wrote:

Hugh wrote:

Do I detect a thread here, lotsa people seem to be
updating to XP SP2 and then start losing things like
soundcards, lan ports, printers, scanners, drives,
removable drives

Is it me - am I paranoid or has MS screwed it up
completely???


I don't believe Microsoft "screwed it up completely" as you put it.

What I see is a minority of users having trouble because their system
already had trouble, possibly unseen, before installing SP2. Loads of
adware/spyware/malware.. Incompatable applications, possibly even key
loggers and other trojan-like apps. A little cleanup before SP2 is
installed will help.

An even smaller minority of users actually have hardware/software that has
not been upgraded to work with the improved security or other changes SP2
entailed. For example, "EndNote 8" does not work with SP2, but did work on
XP prior to that. They even admit on their web page that users of EndNote 6
and 7 will not have trouble, only their latest and greatest (8) has problems
and THEY are working on the patch to remedy the situation. Their product,
their problem. Other similar situations have come up with hardware drivers
and the likes... The sad part is that these companies all had access to the
SP2 Betas like everyone else - very few tested beforehand.

My bet is 10% - maybe 20% of Windows XP SP1 users will have trouble.. of
that 10-20%, 75% will probably fall into the former - meaning they should
have better checked their hardware/software patches, scanned for malware in
various ways, defragmented and check their hard drives for errors, updated
their BIOS where appropriate before installing a Windows patch that is
almost as large as the original install! A little planning, preperation and
knowledge would go a long way.. Don't have that type of time - everyone has
a geek friend, 16 year old son/daughter or something - and for the rest -
research, plan or get someone to help if it makes you nervous.

I have had my share of trouble with it in the workplace - none at home. A
few popups were blocked at work that shouldn't have been or a few security
settings were too high - a little GPO manipulation and everything is
better - better than before, not just better since I fixed the SP2
problems - overall. After all, the control of the Windows Firewall from a
GPO is fantastic - External and internal firewalls...

Anyway - although I am not saying anything is wrong with your statement, I
hope I have at least contributed to your thought process.. With a little
pre-planning, Windows XP SP2 will work for MOST people without a hitch. And
if they did that same pre-planning, for those that it wouldn't work for -
they already know.


Can you point me to a reference that categorically identifies *any*
piece of adware or spyware which is known to conflict with SP2 or
*known* to create installation problems? Now granted, common sense
tells us, or should tell us, that those are undesireable things, but you
are being nothing more than a parrot, and not a very bright one, when
you repeat the problems-are-caused-by-spyware mantra. I find it very
amusing that SP2 apologists like Carey and Jupiter are fond of saying
that MS couldn't possibly have tested SP2 on all possible
configurations, which is certainly true, but out of the other sides of
their mouths they tell us, as Carey does in this very thread, "A
well-maintained PC will install SP2 without any adverse installation
issues." But if MS didn't test all possible configurations, how does he
know that to be true? He doesn't.

You failed to specify any specific issue you had attempting
to install SP2. How in the world do you expect any help
if you cannot provide even a smidgeon of issues you had?

Please review the following:

How to Make a Good Newsgroup Post
http://www.dts-l.org/goodpost.htm

--
Carey Frisch
Microsoft MVP
Windows XP - Shell/User

Be Smart! Protect Your PC!
http://www.microsoft.com/athome/secu...t/default.aspx

------------------------------------------------------------------------

"Herb Fritatta" wrote:

Basically, nothing.

Herb Fritatta wrote:
Can you point me to a reference that categorically identifies *any*
piece of adware or spyware which is known to conflict with SP2 or
*known* to create installation problems? Now granted, common sense
tells us, or should tell us, that those are undesireable things, but
you are being nothing more than a parrot, and not a very bright one,
when you repeat the problems-are-caused-by-spyware mantra. I find it
very amusing that SP2 apologists like Carey and Jupiter are fond of
saying that MS couldn't possibly have tested SP2 on all possible
configurations, which is certainly true, but out of the other sides of
their mouths they tell us, as Carey does in this very thread, "A
well-maintained PC will install SP2 without any adverse installation
issues." But if MS didn't test all possible configurations, how does
he know that to be true? He doesn't.

First off, I do not appreciate the implication that I am not intelligent. I
presented you with an intelligent argument and essentially received the
response of "Bawk Bawk".

I have personally removed adware that was installed on the machines prior to
SP2's installation and SP2 had, in its ignorance of what the application
did, opened the appropriate holes in the firewall. I have also been to
machines where users installed applications known to contain spyware/malware
and because they wanted their Bonzi Buddy/Weatherbug/iWon/P2P crud to work,
they just answered "Yes, allow it" to whatever they saw - thus opening the
necessary ports to allow more spying/ads, etc - then wonder why they are
getting them.

I never stated that ALL well maintained PCs would install SP2 without
adverse effects - I did quite the obvious. I did state that the ratio is
far from 50/50 and closer to 80% good/20% bad with 75% of that 20% bad
being user controllable and 25% being either Microsoft's or some third party
application/hardware manufacturer's fault. (Just like when people started
going from Windows 98 to Windows XP and the Printer/Scanner manufacturers
did not put out drivers so that people would be (in essence) forced to buy
new compatible scanners/printers.)

I have seen SP2's firewall mess with HP printers, whose full drivers for
some reason want HP to send them data - what's up with that?!

Random find..
http://chris-cohen.blogspot.com/2004...ce-pack-2.html

As for what Carey or Jupiter or anyone else says - *shrug*, again - I
beleive someone should do their own research before doing anything,
especially something that is as large as a service pack where their computer
and all the information on it is concerned. Essentially, although I may
respect what you, Jupiter and/or Carey have to say - I will not blindly
follow the advice.

If you are going to quote me on the next post, quote this next paragraph:

I never said that all the problems were caused merely by spyware.. I said
that of the 20% bad that seem to be common, 75% of those could be fixed by a
user putting forth the effort to make sure their PC is ready for SP2 - it's
not a small upgrade, it's not a minor change - common sense says you don't
go buy a new couch for your home before you measure the door to make sure it
will fit. (Or make sure it goes with the decor, won't clash with your other
furniture, etc.) Spyware is ONE part, hardware drivers another, software
patches and looking to see if your current software has had problems with
SP2 (visit their web page - they usually have messages in their support
section if they have had issues), defragmenting your hard drive, backing up
important files and folders (again - MAJOR change here - don't be a moron
about it), checking to make sure even your system BIOS is compatible.

As with any system-wide upgrade; go in with a plan, don't go in blind.

--
- Shenan -
--
The information is provided "as is", it is suggested you research for
yourself before you take any advice - you are the one ultimately
responsible for your actions/problems/solutions. Know what you are
getting into before you jump in with both feet.

Carey Frisch [MVP] wrote:
You failed to specify any specific issue you had attempting
to install SP2. How in the world do you expect any help
if you cannot provide even a smidgeon of issues you had?

Please review the following:

How to Make a Good Newsgroup Post
http://www.dts-l.org/goodpost.htm


I wasn't *asking* for help, but you can bet that if I ever do, I won't
be asking you. And you want to tell *me* how to make a good post? Why
don't you follow your own advice, and try reading before cutting and
pating your droning responses?

This is a Microsoft "help"newsgroup.
Why bother posting here if you cannot
ask an intelligent question that could
possibly lead to a solution to a problem
you have with the Windows XP operating
system or installing SP2?

--
Carey Frisch
Microsoft MVP
Windows XP - Shell/User

Be Smart! Protect Your PC!
http://www.microsoft.com/athome/secu...t/default.aspx

-----------------------------------------------------------------

"Herb Fritatta" wrote:

| I wasn't *asking* for help, but you can bet that if I ever do, I won't
| be asking you. And you want to tell *me* how to make a good post? Why
| don't you follow your own advice, and try reading before cutting and
| pating your droning responses?