Believe it or not but PC is coming back...

On 19/12/14 09:02, Wolf K wrote:
On 2014-12-18 2:16 PM, Gene E. Bloch wrote:
On Wed, 17 Dec 2014 23:17:50 -0500, Mayayana wrote:

| The Brits are very prone to cutesy terms. So terrestrial
|may sound a bit overly technical, but we can be grateful
|they don't call them something like "widgie" and "smidgie".
|
| Would you care to give some examples?

I'm drawing a blank. That doesn't ring a bell for you?
It seems to me that Brits are often adding "ie" or coming
up with quirky words, which sound out of place in formal
speech. Also with names. It seems the more refined and
stuffy a person is, the more likely they are to have a
diminutive name ending in "ie". (I once dated an English
woman whose mother had remarried into the family of a
lord. The mother was a rather stuffy, status-conscious
woman. Yet she called herself "Cherry", seemingly unaware
that to an American ear that could only refer to a stripper
or cabaret dancer.

Not to this American ear...

But I was moved to look the name up. It seems to have started life as a
short form of Charity, back when names like Faith, Hope, and Charity
were more popular.

Caveat: the book I looked it up in is British :-)

IMO it's also a derivative/anglicised pronunciation of Cherie, which has
been used a given name occasionally. Names often have multiple sources.

I once knew a young woman named Sherry. Same derivation, I imagine.

--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org

On 19/12/2014 12:06, Peter Moylan wrote:
On 19/12/14 09:02, Wolf K wrote:
On 2014-12-18 2:16 PM, Gene E. Bloch wrote:
On Wed, 17 Dec 2014 23:17:50 -0500, Mayayana wrote:

| The Brits are very prone to cutesy terms. So terrestrial
|may sound a bit overly technical, but we can be grateful
|they don't call them something like "widgie" and "smidgie".
|
| Would you care to give some examples?

I'm drawing a blank. That doesn't ring a bell for you?
It seems to me that Brits are often adding "ie" or coming
up with quirky words, which sound out of place in formal
speech. Also with names. It seems the more refined and
stuffy a person is, the more likely they are to have a
diminutive name ending in "ie". (I once dated an English
woman whose mother had remarried into the family of a
lord. The mother was a rather stuffy, status-conscious
woman. Yet she called herself "Cherry", seemingly unaware
that to an American ear that could only refer to a stripper
or cabaret dancer.

Not to this American ear...

But I was moved to look the name up. It seems to have started life as a
short form of Charity, back when names like Faith, Hope, and Charity
were more popular.

Caveat: the book I looked it up in is British :-)

IMO it's also a derivative/anglicised pronunciation of Cherie, which has
been used a given name occasionally. Names often have multiple sources.

I once knew a young woman named Sherry. Same derivation, I imagine.

The French "cherie" and sherry have got noting in common even though
they sound similar with just the accents on different syllables. Sherry
takes its name from a port city in Portugal, namely Jerez.
--
choro
*****

On Fri, 19 Dec 2014 14:04:16 +0000, choro wrote:

On 19/12/2014 12:06, Peter Moylan wrote:
On 19/12/14 09:02, Wolf K wrote:
On 2014-12-18 2:16 PM, Gene E. Bloch wrote:
On Wed, 17 Dec 2014 23:17:50 -0500, Mayayana wrote:

| The Brits are very prone to cutesy terms. So terrestrial
|may sound a bit overly technical, but we can be grateful
|they don't call them something like "widgie" and "smidgie".
|
| Would you care to give some examples?

I'm drawing a blank. That doesn't ring a bell for you?
It seems to me that Brits are often adding "ie" or coming
up with quirky words, which sound out of place in formal
speech. Also with names. It seems the more refined and
stuffy a person is, the more likely they are to have a
diminutive name ending in "ie". (I once dated an English
woman whose mother had remarried into the family of a
lord. The mother was a rather stuffy, status-conscious
woman. Yet she called herself "Cherry", seemingly unaware
that to an American ear that could only refer to a stripper
or cabaret dancer.

Not to this American ear...

But I was moved to look the name up. It seems to have started life as a
short form of Charity, back when names like Faith, Hope, and Charity
were more popular.

Caveat: the book I looked it up in is British :-)

IMO it's also a derivative/anglicised pronunciation of Cherie, which has
been used a given name occasionally. Names often have multiple sources.

I once knew a young woman named Sherry. Same derivation, I imagine.

The French "cherie" and sherry have got noting in common even though
they sound similar with just the accents on different syllables. Sherry
takes its name from a port city in Portugal, namely Jerez.


Yes, that's where the name of the wine comes from. But it's not
necessarily where the name of someone named Sherry comes from. The
parents get to pick the name, and they get to choose whatever they
want, name it after whomever they want, spell it any way they want,
and so on.

Some Sherrys certainly come from the French Cheri, some come from the
name of the wine, some undoubtedly come from something like a
grandfather's name (perhaps Sherwood, Shelby, Sheridan, etc.), and
some come from nothing at all (the parents just liked the sound of
it).

As an exaple of how parents get to choose whatever they want, I once
met a young boy named Dacron.

On Fri, 19 Dec 2014 10:26:35 -0500, Wolf K
wrote:

On 2014-12-19 5:14 AM, Steve Hayes wrote:
On Fri, 19 Dec 2014 09:03:34 +0000, Andy Burns
wrote:

Steve Hayes wrote:

J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:

I only call it VoIP if _I_ arrange the conversion box.

Skype doesn't seem to require a box.

You consider Skype to be VoIP?

Yes.

Interesting. Over here, VoIP is thought of as voice only, so most people
don't think of Skype as VoIP. Your comment prompted some research, but I
still don't think of Skype as VoIP.


I don't consider it VoIP either.

* Wolf K:

On 2014-12-19 5:14 AM, Steve Hayes wrote:
On Fri, 19 Dec 2014 09:03:34 +0000, Andy Burns
wrote:

Steve Hayes wrote:

J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:

I only call it VoIP if _I_ arrange the conversion box.

Skype doesn't seem to require a box.

You consider Skype to be VoIP?

Yes.

Interesting. Over here, VoIP is thought of as voice only, so most people
don't think of Skype as VoIP. Your comment prompted some research, but I
still don't think of Skype as VoIP.

The usual VoIP standard, SIP, can be used for video calls, too, so
I don't think that is a good way to distinguish them.

For me, the key criterion is that VoIP uses legacy phone numbers,
but that is not a technical necessity for SIP, so I'm afraid the
lines are really blurry.

--
"Bother", said the Borg, as they assimilated Pooh.

* Peter Duncanson [BrE]:

On Fri, 19 Dec 2014 08:53:23 +0200, Steve Hayes
wrote:

On Fri, 19 Dec 2014 00:03:03 +0000, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
wrote:

In message , Oliver Cromm
writes:
[]
AFAIK mobile phones in Europe don't have area codes. In their
place, there's a vendor- or service-specific sequence. So these
numbers aren't geographically specific below the country level.

Certainly in the UK, all mobile 'phone numbers begin 07 (and very few
landline ones do - only ones for so-called "personal" number I think,
which are expensive to call). Also, the vendor-specific bit (what comes
just after the 07) is only the vendor the number service was provided by
initially; we can now transfer our numbers between network operators.
[]
I'm with you there. I only call it VoIP service if you have to
plug your phone into an adapter box that connects to your router
or modem.

Indeed. What the 'phone company does at the other end of the wire
doesn't really concern me, though as an engineer it _interests_ me to
some extent. I agree, I only call it VoIP if _I_ arrange the conversion
box.

Skype doesn't seem to require a box.

Except for the computer you are using.

There are phones that can do skype, though. I'm not talking about
smartphones, AIUI these are VoIP phones with built-in Skype
capability, so these would require the box. Nevertheless, it's
easy for non-technical people to get confused by that.

--
Ice hockey is a form of disorderly conduct
in which the score is kept.
-- Doug Larson

On Fri, 19 Dec 2014 12:29:32 -0500, Oliver Cromm
wrote:

* Peter Duncanson [BrE]:

On Fri, 19 Dec 2014 08:53:23 +0200, Steve Hayes
wrote:

On Fri, 19 Dec 2014 00:03:03 +0000, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
wrote:

In message , Oliver Cromm
writes:
[]
AFAIK mobile phones in Europe don't have area codes. In their
place, there's a vendor- or service-specific sequence. So these
numbers aren't geographically specific below the country level.

Certainly in the UK, all mobile 'phone numbers begin 07 (and very few
landline ones do - only ones for so-called "personal" number I think,
which are expensive to call). Also, the vendor-specific bit (what comes
just after the 07) is only the vendor the number service was provided by
initially; we can now transfer our numbers between network operators.
[]
I'm with you there. I only call it VoIP service if you have to
plug your phone into an adapter box that connects to your router
or modem.

Indeed. What the 'phone company does at the other end of the wire
doesn't really concern me, though as an engineer it _interests_ me to
some extent. I agree, I only call it VoIP if _I_ arrange the conversion
box.

Skype doesn't seem to require a box.

Except for the computer you are using.

There are phones that can do skype, though. I'm not talking about
smartphones, AIUI these are VoIP phones with built-in Skype
capability, so these would require the box. Nevertheless, it's
easy for non-technical people to get confused by that.

Technical people can get confused, too, if they let their concentration
lapse for a nanosecond or two.

--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.usage.english)

On Thu, 18 Dec 2014 16:17:55 +0000, "Peter Duncanson [BrE]"
wrote:

What is weird in the UK is the use in the broadcasting world of
"digital" to refer to certain channels. Before the switch-off of
analogue TV transmitters the main TV channels were broadcast on
analogue. Other "secondary" channels were broadcast on digital *only*.
It was reasonable to label that group as "digital channels". That
designation has been retain even though all channels are now broadcast
digitally.

Here in the States, starting with the lead-up to the analog to digital
conversion, antenna ("aerial" in the UK) manufacturers began to market
"digital" antennas, preying on the unsuspecting public's fears that their
existing rooftop antennas would somehow cease to function in the presence of
digital signals. The antenna, of course, doesn't know the difference between
an analog signal and its digital counterpart.


--

Char Jackson

On Fri, 19 Dec 2014 10:26:35 -0500, Wolf K wrote:

On 2014-12-19 5:14 AM, Steve Hayes wrote:
On Fri, 19 Dec 2014 09:03:34 +0000, Andy Burns
wrote:

Steve Hayes wrote:

J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:

I only call it VoIP if _I_ arrange the conversion box.

Skype doesn't seem to require a box.

You consider Skype to be VoIP?

Yes.

Interesting. Over here, VoIP is thought of as voice only, so most people
don't think of Skype as VoIP. Your comment prompted some research, but I
still don't think of Skype as VoIP.

Well I have a DSL line, and the voice phones go through the PSTN and are
metered at the telephone exchange, so I usually have to pay for them.

But on Skype the conversation goes via the DSL line through the internet, and
bypasses the meter. So it's voice over internet, not voice over PSTN. I don't
know what they do at the telephone exchange, but at this end we have special
filers to keep the normal voice traffic from interfering with the Internet
traffic, and Skype is definitely part of the latter and not part of the
former.


--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
Web: http://www.khanya.org.za/stevesig.htm
Blog: http://khanya.wordpress.com
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk

On Fri, 19 Dec 2014 00:12:46 +0000, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
wrote:

So although her service is now "cell-based", it still only works at her
home premises? That seems a little odd - the whole point of cellular is
that it continually adapts and re-routes as you move about.

That's one of the more attractive features of 'cell-based' communications
services, but hardly the whole point.

I suppose a
cellular operator/network might have a sufficient surplus of capacity in
a given area that it can afford to tie up some of it providing fixed
alternative coverage, but as an engineer it seems an inefficient use of
resources.

I never worked *in* capacity planning, but I worked *with* the capacity
planning team for nearly a decade, and I don't think there would have been a
single engineer there who agreed with your assessment of inefficient use of
resources. Usage is usage, regardless of whether tower handoffs are
involved. Here in the States, the vast majority of 'mobile' communications
start and end on the same tower. It's been about 5 years now, but the last
numbers I saw were around 80%.

--

Char Jackson

On Fri, 19 Dec 2014 14:04:16 UTC, choro wrote:

Sherry
takes its name from a port city in Portugal, namely Jerez.

That would be a port city in Spain, except that its name isn't
Jerez, it's Jerez de la Frontera and it's not a port. It's where the
wine is made. Jerez used to be spelled Xerez, back when Castilian
Spanish still had the "sh" sound (recall Fallstaff's sherris sack)
which is why in English it's called sherry, not hairy.

--
John Varela

On Fri, 19 Dec 2014 15:48:25 -0500, Wolf K wrote:

On 2014-12-19 2:20 PM, Steve Hayes wrote:
On Fri, 19 Dec 2014 10:26:35 -0500, Wolf K wrote:

On 2014-12-19 5:14 AM, Steve Hayes wrote:
On Fri, 19 Dec 2014 09:03:34 +0000, Andy Burns
wrote:

Steve Hayes wrote:

J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:

I only call it VoIP if _I_ arrange the conversion box.

Skype doesn't seem to require a box.

You consider Skype to be VoIP?

Yes.

Interesting. Over here, VoIP is thought of as voice only, so most people
don't think of Skype as VoIP. Your comment prompted some research, but I
still don't think of Skype as VoIP.

Well I have a DSL line, and the voice phones go through the PSTN and are
metered at the telephone exchange, so I usually have to pay for them.

But on Skype the conversation goes via the DSL line through the internet, and
bypasses the meter. So it's voice over internet, not voice over PSTN. I don't
know what they do at the telephone exchange, but at this end we have special
filers to keep the normal voice traffic from interfering with the Internet
traffic, and Skype is definitely part of the latter and not part of the
former.

True, but we use Skype for visual. In fact to us "skyping" means
"seeing & talking to someone via Skype". That's why we don't think of it
as VoIP. See?

Well we could too, but it costs more, because, as far as I know, it uses more
bandwidth than voice only.

Of course whether it is video or voice, it is over the Internet, and so isn't
metered for the duration of the call, like a PSTN call, but one is charged for
the bandwidth used.

So Skype is VoIP, whether the V stands for Voice or Video.



--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
Web: http://www.khanya.org.za/stevesig.htm
Blog: http://khanya.wordpress.com
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk

Oliver Cromm writes:

* Dr Nick:

I think I'd (BrE) use "landline" /of a phone service/ to mean "has a
geographic number rather than a mobile one".

However, this distinction does not exist in North America, at
least not usually. My landline and my mobile number share the same
area code.

I was vaguely aware of that, but didn't know enough to speak
authoritatively about it (which is one reason I threw my "BrE" in).

Oliver Cromm writes:

* John Varela:

On Wed, 17 Dec 2014 23:02:42 UTC, Oliver Cromm
wrote:

* Dr Nick:

I think I'd (BrE) use "landline" /of a phone service/ to mean "has a
geographic number rather than a mobile one".

However, this distinction does not exist in North America, at
least not usually. My landline and my mobile number share the same
area code.

I took Dr Nick to mean that the whole telephone number -- all ten
digits, not just the area code -- is tied to a physical location or
the whole number is tied to a mobile phone. My landline and cell
phone share an area code.

AFAIK mobile phones in Europe don't have area codes. In their
place, there's a vendor- or service-specific sequence. So these
numbers aren't geographically specific below the country level.

Yes, so I meant that I'd expect a landline to have a number starting +1
or +2 while a mobile would start +7.

But, with a few strange exceptions, the two concepts are very closely
tied together: a phone anchored to a physical location will be a
landline and (here) have a geographical number. A phone with no
physical location is a mobile and has a mobile number.

I'm with you there. I only call it VoIP service if you have to
plug your phone into an adapter box that connects to your router
or modem.

I'd agree with that.

| Er, in most American and Canadian dialects merry, marry, and Mary all
| rhyme with hairy. That's why people are so creative spelling "Sherry".
|

?? I don't know of any. I hear/speak those
words like bed, cat, air and I don't find that
I have trouble with other peoples' pronunciation.
Perhaps in the Pacific Northwest, where they
pronounce "sure" as shrrr and seem to squeeze
their jaw up when they speak, the words may
sound more alike. On the other hand, my "dialect"
also doesn't include the word "er", so I guess you
may be speaking some sort of exotic, Canadian
backwoods version of English.