Sharing between XP & Win7: workgroups vs. homegroups?

Okay basic question here, are what were known as "workgroups" in XP and
earlier, now known as "homegroups" in Vista and later?

Why do you need to set passwords when creating a homegroup, when there
was none needed with workgroups? If you want to connect to an XP machine
with workgroups, do you need to disable or enable homegroups? Will a
password-enabled homegroup work with a non-passworded workgroup?

Yousuf Khan

Yousuf Khan wrote in -
lp.com:

Okay basic question here, are what were known as "workgroups" in XP and
earlier, now known as "homegroups" in Vista and later?

Why do you need to set passwords when creating a homegroup, when there
was none needed with workgroups? If you want to connect to an XP machine
with workgroups, do you need to disable or enable homegroups? Will a
password-enabled homegroup work with a non-passworded workgroup?

Yousuf Khan


Connecting to an XP machine with Win7 is the same as always. And sharing
files on a Win7 machine is the same as always. I don't even know what a
"homegroup" is, and didn't need to know to share files between Win7 and XP.
For that matter, I ignored the Microsoft definition of "workgroups" as
well. If I want to connect to a machine, I always do it via its ip address,
and could not care less what "workgroup" or "homegroup" it is a member of.

YMMV - doing it this way may not be desirable for you.

Edit: OK, so I looked up the definition of "homegroup". And my reaction was
yippee freakin' doo....it does not change how I do things.

Look he

http://www.microsoft.com/windows/win...homegroup.aspx

On Sat, 20 Feb 2010 22:48:20 -0600, Zootal
wrote:

Connecting to an XP machine with Win7 is the same as always. And sharing
files on a Win7 machine is the same as always. I don't even know what a
"homegroup" is, and didn't need to know to share files between Win7 and XP.
For that matter, I ignored the Microsoft definition of "workgroups" as
well. If I want to connect to a machine, I always do it via its ip address,
and could not care less what "workgroup" or "homegroup" it is a member of.

YMMV - doing it this way may not be desirable for you.

Same here, I use IP's and ignore workgroup names, but that works for
me because all of the IP's on my network are statically assigned.
People who use DHCP might have some issues with your and my approach.

On 2/21/2010 12:13 AM, Char Jackson wrote:
On Sat, 20 Feb 2010 22:48:20 -0600, Zootal
wrote:

Connecting to an XP machine with Win7 is the same as always. And sharing
files on a Win7 machine is the same as always. I don't even know what a
"homegroup" is, and didn't need to know to share files between Win7 and XP.
For that matter, I ignored the Microsoft definition of "workgroups" as
well. If I want to connect to a machine, I always do it via its ip address,
and could not care less what "workgroup" or "homegroup" it is a member of.

YMMV - doing it this way may not be desirable for you.

Same here, I use IP's and ignore workgroup names, but that works for
me because all of the IP's on my network are statically assigned.
People who use DHCP might have some issues with your and my approach.

I use a program called Network Magic from Cisco
(http://www.purenetworks.com/). It makes setting up a home network
super easy for those who are technically challenged.

--

Roy Smith
Windows 7 Home Premium

Timestamp: Sunday, February 21, 2010 5:31:18 AM

"HomeGroup" is only for Windows 7 computers (it doesn't exist on Vista
or earlier systems). It is used to connect Windows 7 computers to each
other to share document and media libraries.

It has no relevance to your networking of Windows 7 with Vista or XP.

http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/w...ures/homegroup

http://www.neowin.net/news/main/09/0...group-overview

--
Glen Ventura, MS MVP Oct. 2002 - Sept. 2009
A+
http://dts-l.net/


"Yousuf Khan" wrote in message
...
Okay basic question here, are what were known as "workgroups" in XP
and earlier, now known as "homegroups" in Vista and later?

Why do you need to set passwords when creating a homegroup, when there
was none needed with workgroups? If you want to connect to an XP
machine with workgroups, do you need to disable or enable homegroups?
Will a password-enabled homegroup work with a non-passworded
workgroup?

Yousuf Khan

On Sat, 20 Feb 2010 18:55:27 -0500, Yousuf Khan
wrote:

Okay basic question here, are what were known as "workgroups" in XP and
earlier, now known as "homegroups" in Vista and later?


No.

First of all, homegroups are in Windows 7, not in Vista.

Second, homegroups and workgroups are somewhat different, and in
Windows 7, you can use either.



Why do you need to set passwords when creating a homegroup, when there
was none needed with workgroups? If you want to connect to an XP machine
with workgroups, do you need to disable or enable homegroups? Will a
password-enabled homegroup work with a non-passworded workgroup?

Yousuf Khan

--
Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP - Windows Desktop Experience
Please Reply to the Newsgroup

Char Jackson wrote in
:

On Sat, 20 Feb 2010 22:48:20 -0600, Zootal
wrote:

Connecting to an XP machine with Win7 is the same as always. And
sharing files on a Win7 machine is the same as always. I don't even
know what a "homegroup" is, and didn't need to know to share files
between Win7 and XP. For that matter, I ignored the Microsoft
definition of "workgroups" as well. If I want to connect to a machine,
I always do it via its ip address, and could not care less what
"workgroup" or "homegroup" it is a member of.

YMMV - doing it this way may not be desirable for you.

Same here, I use IP's and ignore workgroup names, but that works for
me because all of the IP's on my network are statically assigned.
People who use DHCP might have some issues with your and my approach.


Yah, good point - I assign specific IP address to all of my machines, and
know what they are. Not all routers let you do this, and not everyone out
there knows how to find the ip address for any specific machine. In a case
like that, a workgroup and machine name can be real handy.

I'm back and forth between Linux and Windows so much that I don't bother
relying on what Windows thinks any individual box is called.

"Zootal" wrote in message
7.131...
Same here, I use IP's and ignore workgroup names, but that works for
me because all of the IP's on my network are statically assigned.
People who use DHCP might have some issues with your and my approach.


Yah, good point - I assign specific IP address to all of my machines, and
know what they are. Not all routers let you do this, and not everyone out
there knows how to find the ip address for any specific machine. In a case
like that, a workgroup and machine name can be real handy.

I'm back and forth between Linux and Windows so much that I don't bother
relying on what Windows thinks any individual box is called.

I've never bothered with workgroups and the Network Neighbo(u)rhood / My
Network to locate other PCs on the network. I simply refer to resources by
entering the UNC name of the form \\server\share\folder\file wherever it's
needed - when doing a net use (or the Explorer "Map Drive") equivalent, when
setting up a connection to a shared printer or when setting up a SyncToy
folder pair.

I tend not to bother with IP addresses, partly because it's easier to
remember a PC name than its IP address and partly because my present Dlink
router doesn't seem to have a way of getting its DHCP to permanently
allocate the same address to a given PC, unlike the (now brain-dead) Netgear
router that it replaces. I suppose I oughtn't to be a cheapskate and
actually buy another Netgear instead of using the Dlink which I happened to
have spare.

The only time I use IP addresses is if the router/PC stops resolving
hostname to IP and I need to access something quickly and can't be arsed to
reboot the PC(s) and/or router.

I've never bothered with workgroups and the Network Neighbo(u)rhood /
My Network to locate other PCs on the network. I simply refer to
resources by entering the UNC name of the form
\\server\share\folder\file wherever it's needed - when doing a net use
(or the Explorer "Map Drive") equivalent, when setting up a connection
to a shared printer or when setting up a SyncToy folder pair.

I tend not to bother with IP addresses, partly because it's easier to
remember a PC name than its IP address and partly because my present
Dlink router doesn't seem to have a way of getting its DHCP to
permanently allocate the same address to a given PC, unlike the (now
brain-dead) Netgear router that it replaces. I suppose I oughtn't to
be a cheapskate and actually buy another Netgear instead of using the
Dlink which I happened to have spare.

The only time I use IP addresses is if the router/PC stops resolving
hostname to IP and I need to access something quickly and can't be
arsed to reboot the PC(s) and/or router.



I'm a bit of a control freak . Plus I need static IP addresses for my
web, ftp, and half-life servers.

Linksys routers are pretty good, the older WRT54G models (up to V3 or so,
before Linksys emasculated the hardware to keep us from messing with the
firmware), but you have to use alternative firmwares because for some
reason only known to Linksys, they refuse to put static ip ability into
their firmware. I use a couple WRT54Gs, V2 and V3 with tomato firmware.
They are rock solid. Avoid alchemy or talisman - despite the years of work
put into them, they are still flaky.

On Sun, 21 Feb 2010 17:41:05 -0600, Zootal
wrote:

Linksys routers are pretty good, the older WRT54G models (up to V3 or so,
before Linksys emasculated the hardware to keep us from messing with the
firmware), but you have to use alternative firmwares because for some
reason only known to Linksys, they refuse to put static ip ability into
their firmware. I use a couple WRT54Gs, V2 and V3 with tomato firmware.
They are rock solid. Avoid alchemy or talisman - despite the years of work
put into them, they are still flaky.

I'm running 6 Linksys WRT54GL's here, all with dd-wrt firmware. The
GL's are basically the old WRT54G v4 model, the last good model in
that line.

Roy Smith wrote:
I use a program called Network Magic from Cisco
(http://www.purenetworks.com/). It makes setting up a home network
super easy for those who are technically challenged.


So what part of the process does this tool simplify, exactly?

Yousuf Khan

Mortimer wrote:
I tend not to bother with IP addresses, partly because it's easier to
remember a PC name than its IP address and partly because my present
Dlink router doesn't seem to have a way of getting its DHCP to
permanently allocate the same address to a given PC, unlike the (now
brain-dead) Netgear router that it replaces. I suppose I oughtn't to be
a cheapskate and actually buy another Netgear instead of using the Dlink
which I happened to have spare.

The only time I use IP addresses is if the router/PC stops resolving
hostname to IP and I need to access something quickly and can't be arsed
to reboot the PC(s) and/or router.

That's unusual, all Dlink routers that I've had before always had a
mechanism for assigning static DHCP IP addresses to machines, based on
their MAC addresses. Besides, dynamic DHCP addresses are absolutely
necessary when you have mobile computers coming and going on your network.

Yousuf Khan

Ken Blake, MVP wrote:
On Sat, 20 Feb 2010 18:55:27 -0500, Yousuf Khan
wrote:

Okay basic question here, are what were known as "workgroups" in XP and
earlier, now known as "homegroups" in Vista and later?


No.

First of all, homegroups are in Windows 7, not in Vista.

Second, homegroups and workgroups are somewhat different, and in
Windows 7, you can use either.

Is the idea that they are going to stop using workgroups in favour of
homegroups after this?

What was the reason for bringing out homegroups, which wasn't available
in workgroups?

Yousuf Khan

glee wrote:
"HomeGroup" is only for Windows 7 computers (it doesn't exist on Vista
or earlier systems). It is used to connect Windows 7 computers to each
other to share document and media libraries.

It has no relevance to your networking of Windows 7 with Vista or XP.

Okay, interesting, so what's the advantage over workgroups? Couldn't you
do all of that with workgroups?

Any idea why it takes so long for a Windows 7 computer to discover other
computers on the network? It could be several minutes after startup
before a Windows 7 machine lists other machines on the network. That's
part of the reason why I'm asking about homegroups vs. workgroups, is
there some interference between them?

Yousuf Khan

On 2/21/10, Zootal posted:
I've never bothered with workgroups and the Network Neighbo(u)rhood /
My Network to locate other PCs on the network. I simply refer to
resources by entering the UNC name of the form
\\server\share\folder\file wherever it's needed - when doing a net use
(or the Explorer "Map Drive") equivalent, when setting up a connection
to a shared printer or when setting up a SyncToy folder pair.

I tend not to bother with IP addresses, partly because it's easier to
remember a PC name than its IP address and partly because my present
Dlink router doesn't seem to have a way of getting its DHCP to
permanently allocate the same address to a given PC, unlike the (now
brain-dead) Netgear router that it replaces. I suppose I oughtn't to
be a cheapskate and actually buy another Netgear instead of using the
Dlink which I happened to have spare.

The only time I use IP addresses is if the router/PC stops resolving
hostname to IP and I need to access something quickly and can't be
arsed to reboot the PC(s) and/or router.



I'm a bit of a control freak . Plus I need static IP addresses for my
web, ftp, and half-life servers.

Linksys routers are pretty good, the older WRT54G models (up to V3 or so,
before Linksys emasculated the hardware to keep us from messing with the
firmware), but you have to use alternative firmwares because for some
reason only known to Linksys, they refuse to put static ip ability into
their firmware. I use a couple WRT54Gs, V2 and V3 with tomato firmware.
They are rock solid. Avoid alchemy or talisman - despite the years of work
put into them, they are still flaky.

The statement "they refuse to put static ip ability into their
firmware" surprised me.

I have a WRT54GS, originally V2.1, currently running Linksys firmware
V4.7. It has always let me use static IP addresses in my network.

On the setup page under DHCP, there are two entries for this. First is
"Starting IP Address", where I can change only the last octet - I guess
because my subnet mask is 255.255.255.0. The next field is the maximum
number of DHCP users.

I can - and do - manually assign any unused IP address which is less
than the starting address and more than the sum of the two values (up
to 255, of course).

--
Gene Bloch 650.366.4267 lettersatblochg.com