UPGRADE OR FULL VERSION

Leythos wrote:
On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 08:33:47 -0500, kurttrail wrote:

Leythos wrote:
On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 21:13:07 -0500, kurttrail wrote:

So it is not illegal by the present laws and legal precedents, and
it is not even a valid violation claim of MS's present Win XP OEM
EULA.

You know full well what the discussion was about - nice trolling.

Really Lamethos?

Alias told the OP to buy OEM over the full version or the upgrade of
XP, because they are cheaper.

Then Yves bullsh*tted, "And just as illegal as Devils Own. OEM
copies are not legal without hardware being purchased with it.
'Original Equipment Manufacturer'. Your best just buying a new copy
out right."

Had Alias stated that he was speaking for Spainish OEM's in the start
it would never have got to Yves's comments.

Again, whether it is Spain or the US, it is not illegal to use OEM
software. Which is what Jason (my mistake) was saying. "And just as
illegal as Devils Own."


Then Alias replied to Yves that he is wrong at least as far as Spain
goes.

Again, Alias replied without stating (the first time) that he was
talking about the Spanish version of the OEM rules and since he
didn't know where the OP was it was just a much BS/FUD as everything
you post.

You are a moron, fool, and a scumbag! OEM software is legally sold in
Wal-Mart and you know it. It is you and Yves that a full of BS/FUD!


Then you replied that, "In the USA he's right, in Spain you're right
- do you know what country
the OP was in?"

And I replied that you are both you and Yves are full of sh*t, and
logically explained why it is not illegal in the US, nor is it even a
violation of MS's OEM EULA.

Illegal is open for discussion at several levels, I don't approve of
your definition, but it's is against the licensing agreement to
purchase OEM software of MS's in the USA without purchasing some
hardware item at the same time.


Wrong, it is against the OEM resellers agreement. MS's OEM EULA,
doesn't make that distintion. And Alias NEVER said anything about
buying software without the hardware!

Then you replied to me by cutting out the conversation and most of my
post, and tried to bullsh*t that I was just trolling, and not
following the conversation.

I like to cut out what I consider BS or not relevant - in the case of
your posts, that just happens to be most of what you spew forth.

LOL! At least I don't go around saying things are "illegal" when I
can't show a law or legal precedent that backs up the assertion of
illegality.


You are just a fool that ain't proud enough to back up your opinion
rationally, so you tried to divert from that by calling me a troll.
Unfortunately for you, I am man enough to back up my words, and am
proud enough to have my words archived for all time.

You are a troll - you contribute nothing by hate and BS to this group,
never a constructive bit of assistance to anyone, and you are always a
smart-ass, snide, immature little brat in almost every conversation -
sure looks like a troll to me.

LOL! That's because you just see your reflection in your monitor!


You should have just stayed quiet, and not replied at all, because
every time you reply to me you just look more foolish and irrational.

Yea, but I look better than you - and there's another difference, you
don't contribute ANYTHING CONSTRUCTIVE TO ANY THREAD.

Yes, I did, in my fist post in this thread, replying to Morituri-|-Max's
post to the OP.

"This is the best answer of the group. You can also use Win95 to
qualify for the upgrade. Also, go for XP Pro Upgrade. XP Pro can't be
repair installed with a XP Home CD. And you can't downgrade to XP Home
without doing a clean install."

Not only did I post in support of another's advice, but I added to it
with some very construtive advise of my own.

See, you are just full of sh*t, as is the norm for you. Again, you
should just shut the f*#k up, cuz I'll always own you. Your irrational
posts are just too easy to expose for the BS/FUD that they really are!

--
Peace!
Kurt
Self-anointed Moderator
microscum.pubic.windowsexp.gonorrhea
http://microscum.com/mscommunity
"Trustworthy Computing" is only another example of an Oxymoron!
"Produkt-Aktivierung macht frei"

"Leythos" wrote in message
news
On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 10:00:53 -0500, kurttrail wrote:

OEM software is legally sold in Wal-Mart and you know it.

And you have missed the point - WalMart packages it with a MS Mouse too,
proving that OEM purchases in the US require a hardware purchase in order
to comply with the MS agreement. Heck, they even say that the PURCHASER is
required to comply with the Systems Builders Licensing!

As quoted from the following site:
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/produ...%3A3951%3A3954

Microsoft XP Pro IS designed for businesses of any size and individuals
upgrading from Windows 98 SE, Me, NT 4.0 or 2000 Professional.

* This OEM version is intended for system builders only and cannot be
transferred to another PC once it is installed.

* The purchaser of this software is required to comply with the terms
of the System Builder license , including the responsibility of
providing all end user support for the software.

* includes 2-button mouse

Notice it doesn't say anything about a motherboard.

AHAHAHAHAHA!

Alias

Leythos wrote:
On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 10:00:53 -0500, kurttrail wrote:

OEM software is legally sold in Wal-Mart and you know it.

And you have missed the point - WalMart packages it with a MS Mouse
too, proving that OEM purchases in the US require a hardware purchase
in order to comply with the MS agreement. Heck, they even say that
the PURCHASER is required to comply with the Systems Builders
Licensing!

As quoted from the following site:
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/produ...%3A3951%3A3954

Microsoft XP Pro IS designed for businesses of any size and
individuals upgrading from Windows 98 SE, Me, NT 4.0 or 2000
Professional.

* This OEM version is intended for system builders only and cannot
be transferred to another PC once it is installed.

* The purchaser of this software is required to comply with the
terms of the System Builder license , including the responsibility
of providing all end user support for the software.

* includes 2-button mouse

Yes, I am aware of that. And it is not illegal as "Devils Own."

There is nothing in the law or MS's End User License Agreement that
makes using that OEM software without the mouse.

Alias orginal post mentioned nothing about buying OEM software in any
way that could be contrued as illegal, yet Jason replied that it was.
He was wrong.

--
Peace!
Kurt
Self-anointed Moderator
microscum.pubic.windowsexp.gonorrhea
http://microscum.com/mscommunity
"Trustworthy Computing" is only another example of an Oxymoron!
"Produkt-Aktivierung macht frei"

Leythos wrote:
On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 10:00:53 -0500, kurttrail wrote:

See, you are just full of sh*t, as is the norm for you. Again, you
should just shut the f*#k up, cuz I'll always own you. Your
irrational posts are just too easy to expose for the BS/FUD that
they really are!

It's almost fun to watch you turn completely immature.

LOL! It is fun to watch you respond to my these statements, while
ignoring the meat of the post.

And that just goes to show what a real idiot you are. Instead of trying
to back up your erroneous beliefs, you rather dwell in the nonsense.

But nonsense is all you have, as your beliefs are totally irrational,
and unsupportable.

--
Peace!
Kurt
Self-anointed Moderator
microscum.pubic.windowsexp.gonorrhea
http://microscum.com/mscommunity
"Trustworthy Computing" is only another example of an Oxymoron!
"Produkt-Aktivierung macht frei"

"Leythos" wrote in message
news
On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 16:16:04 +0100, Alias wrote:


"Leythos" wrote in message
news
On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 10:00:53 -0500, kurttrail wrote:

OEM software is legally sold in Wal-Mart and you know it.

And you have missed the point - WalMart packages it with a MS Mouse too,
proving that OEM purchases in the US require a hardware purchase in
order
to comply with the MS agreement. Heck, they even say that the PURCHASER
is
required to comply with the Systems Builders Licensing!

As quoted from the following site:
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/produ...%3A3951%3A3954

Microsoft XP Pro IS designed for businesses of any size and individuals
upgrading from Windows 98 SE, Me, NT 4.0 or 2000 Professional.

* This OEM version is intended for system builders only and cannot be
transferred to another PC once it is installed.

* The purchaser of this software is required to comply with the terms
of the System Builder license , including the responsibility of
providing all end user support for the software.

* includes 2-button mouse

Notice it doesn't say anything about a motherboard.

AHAHAHAHAHA!

Alias

You only wish - as usual you only see part of the text - it fully says
that you MUST COMPLY WITH THE SYSTEMS BUILDERS LICENSE - Guess what the
Systems Builder Site states about OEM software and Motherboard? Oh, that's
right, you won't visit the site because you have to REGISTER and you don't
want to be proven wrong, so you claim that you won't register for some
half-baked reason.

It's right in the type Alias - you just have to read it. They even provide
the link to the start of the SB website in their web-page!

I knew you'd say that. I changed my MOBO yesterday and it got activated
without a hitch, the web site you love notwithstanding.

Alias

Leythos wrote:
On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 16:16:04 +0100, Alias wrote:


"Leythos" wrote in message
news
On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 10:00:53 -0500, kurttrail wrote:

OEM software is legally sold in Wal-Mart and you know it.

And you have missed the point - WalMart packages it with a MS Mouse
too, proving that OEM purchases in the US require a hardware
purchase in order to comply with the MS agreement. Heck, they even
say that the PURCHASER is required to comply with the Systems
Builders Licensing!

As quoted from the following site:
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/produ...%3A3951%3A3954

Microsoft XP Pro IS designed for businesses of any size and
individuals upgrading from Windows 98 SE, Me, NT 4.0 or 2000
Professional.

* This OEM version is intended for system builders only and
cannot be transferred to another PC once it is installed.

* The purchaser of this software is required to comply with the
terms of the System Builder license , including the
responsibility of providing all end user support for the
software.

* includes 2-button mouse

Notice it doesn't say anything about a motherboard.

AHAHAHAHAHA!

Alias

You only wish - as usual you only see part of the text - it fully says
that you MUST COMPLY WITH THE SYSTEMS BUILDERS LICENSE - Guess what
the Systems Builder Site states about OEM software and Motherboard?
Oh, that's right, you won't visit the site because you have to
REGISTER and you don't want to be proven wrong, so you claim that you
won't register for some half-baked reason.

It's right in the type Alias - you just have to read it. They even
provide the link to the start of the SB website in their web-page!


MICROSOFT OEM SYSTEM BUILDER LICENSE
(Visit www.microsoft.com/oem for additional OEM system builder
information)
1. AUTHORIZED DISTRIBUTION AND ACCEPTANCE. Distribution of individual
software licenses or hardware units contained in this Microsoft System
Builder Pack ("package") is not authorized unless you accept this
license. You accept this license when you open this package. By
accepting this license, you agree that you are a system builder. "System
builder" means an original equipment manufacturer, or an assembler,
reassembler, or installer of software on computer systems. If you choose
not to accept this license, promptly return the unopened package to your
distributor. Individual software licenses or hardware units cannot be
returned after this package is opened.

2. PARTIES. This license is granted to you by Microsoft Licensing, GP
("MLGP"), a Nevada corporation, unless you are located in Europe,
Africa, or the Middle East (for a complete list of countries, consult
www.microsoft.com/oem/sblicense), in which case this license is granted
by Microsoft Ireland Operations Limited. ("MIOL"), an Irish company. The
terms "we," "our," or "Microsoft" are used below to mean either MLGP or
MIOL, as appropriate.

3. LIMITED LICENSE. This is a limited license to distribute the
individual software licenses or hardware units contained in this
package. "Individual software license" means any individual software
license that comes in this package, including software media,
documentation, certifi cates of authenticity, end-user license
agreements, and security devices. "Hardware unit" means any hardware
that comes in this package, including any hardwarerelated software and
user documentation.

4. SOFTWARE DISTRIBUTION.
4.1 If the individual software license is a desktop operating system
(including Windows XP Media Center Edition), we grant you a nonexclusive
right to distribute individual software licenses; provided that each one
is distributed with either (a) a fully assembled computer system or (b)
a nonperipheral computer hardware component. A "fully assembled computer
system" means a computer system consisting of at least a central
processing unit, a motherboard, a hard drive, a power supply, and a
case. A "nonperipheral computer hardware component" means a component
that will be an integral part of the fully assembled computer system on
which the individual software license will be installed.
4.2 If the individual software license is application or server
software, we grant you a nonexclusive right to distribute individual
software licenses; provided that each one is distributed with a fully
assembled computer system.
4.3 Each individual software license must be distributed pursuant to the
end-user license agreement ("EULA") that accompanies the individual
software license. Under the terms of the EULA, you are the licensor.

5. HARDWARE DISTRIBUTION. If this package contains hardware units, we
grant you a nonexclusive right to distribute each hardware unit only
with either (a) a fully assembled computer system or (b) other
non-Microsoft computer hardware component. If you distribute a hardware
unit with a fully assembled computer system, you must preinstall the
associated software drivers and programs supplied in this package, if
any, on the fully assembled computer system's hard drive. Neither
Microsoft, its affi liates, nor its distributors or suppliers makes any
warranty regarding compliance of the hardware units with any federal,
state, provincial, or local laws or regulations, or the laws or
regulations of any non-U.S. jurisdiction, relating to computing devices
or items sold to the public. You have the sole responsibility to
assemble, test, and certify the hardware units in conjunction with other
equipment that you manufacture, distribute, or sell.

6. DISTRIBUTION OTHER THAN WITH A FULLY ASSEMBLED COMPUTER SYSTEM. We
grant you a nonexclusive right to distribute individual software
licenses for desktop operating systems or hardware units to another
system builder if the software and hardware are distributed with a
nonperipheral computer hardware component; provided that the other
system builder accepts this license. A copy of this license is posted at
www.microsoft.com/oem/sblicense to facilitate its acceptance by the
other system builder. You are required to keep records of any
distributions pursuant to this section to show that its requirements
were met.

7. PREINSTALLATION REQUIREMENT. If you distribute a desktop operating
system with a fully assembled computer system, you must (a) preinstall
it on the computer system's hard drive and (b) use the OEM
Preinstallation Kit ("OPK") provided in this package, if any.
Preinstallation is limited to one copy of each individual software
license. You may not copy or modify the OPK or OPK instructions provided
in this package, if any. You may not distribute the OPK or OPK
instructions to an end user. For updates regarding OEM preinstallation
tools and support, see www.microsoft.com/oem. If you distribute a
hardware unit with a fully assembled computer system, you must
preinstall the associated software drivers and programs supplied in this
package, if any, on the fully assembled computer system's hard drive.

8. CERTIFICATE OF AUTHENTICITY (COA) LABEL/PROOF OF LICENSE (POL) LABEL.
If the individual software license includes a COA or combination COA/POL
label, the system builder who installs the individual software license
must attach the COA or combination COA/POL label, as applicable, to the
outside of the fully assembled computer system case in an easily
accessible location.

9. END-USER SUPPORT. The system builder who installs the individual
software license and distributes hardware units must provide end-user
support on terms at least as favorable as the terms under which the
system builder provides end-user support for any fully assembled
computer system. The system builder must place its support phone number
in a noticeable location in the fully assembled computer system help
files or end-user documentation.

10. DISCLAIMER OF ALL WARRANTIES. Unless mandatory under applicable law
despite this provision, Microsoft, its affi liates, and their
distributors (and their suppliers) disclaim and exclude all warranties,
conditions, and representations (express or implied, by statute or
otherwise) in relation to the individual software licenses and hardware
units, including, without limitation, warranties and conditions of
title, merchantability, satisfactory quality, noninfringement, fitness
for a particular purpose, or any implied warranty or condition arising
from course of dealing or usage of trade.

11. LIMITATION OF LIABILITY. You agree that Microsoft, its affi liates,
and their distributors (and their suppliers) will not be liable for any
damages (including any caused by negligence) related to this license or
any transaction contemplated herein, including for any consequential,
incidental, indirect, economic, or punitive damages even if Microsoft,
its affi liates, distributors (or their suppliers) have been advised of
the possibility of such damages. You acknowledge and agree that this
limitation of liability shall apply even if any remedies fail of their
essential purpose. Your and our total liability for direct damages
related to this license or any transaction contemplated herein will be
limited to 100% of the amount actually paid by you for this package.

12. TRADEMARK RIGHTS. You agree to comply with all trademark guidelines
found at http://www.microsoft.com/mscorp/ip/t...s/oemguide.asp.

13. EXPORT RESTRICTIONS. You acknowledge that the individual software
licenses and hardware units are subject to U.S. export jurisdiction. You
agree to comply with all applicable international and national laws that
apply to the individual software licenses and hardware units, including
the U.S. Export Administration Regulations, as well as end-user,
end-use, and destination restrictions issued by the U.S. and other
governments. For additional information, see
www.microsoft.com/exporting.

14. LICENSE COMPLIANCE. You must not engage or participate with any
third party in the unauthorized manufacture, duplication, delivery,
transfer, or use of counterfeit, pirated, or illegal software and you
must not otherwise infringe any of our other intellectual property
rights.

15. ACTIVATION. Under the terms of the EULA, use of the individual
software license will be limited to the first (a) 30 days after the end
user launches Microsoft Windows XP or Windows Server 2003 software or
(b) 50 times the end user launches Microsoft Offi ce software; unless
either (i) the system builder activates the software in the manner
described in its setup sequence or (ii) the end user activates the
software in the manner described during its launch. You must provide the
following or substantially similar notice in a clear and conspicuous
manner to end users before their purchase of the software (for example,
in advertisements, packaging, or point of purchase materials): Certain
Microsoft® software product(s) included with this computer may use
technological measures for copy protection. In such event, you will not
be able to use the product if you do not fully comply with the product
activation procedures. Product activation procedures and Microsoft's
privacy policy will be detailed during initial launch of the product, or
upon certain reinstallations of the software product(s) or reconfi
gurations of this computer, and may be completed by Internet or
telephone (toll charges may apply).

16. MISCELLANEOUS.
16.1 You must not advertise, provide a separate price for, or otherwise
market or distribute individual software licenses, or any part of them,
as separate items from the fully assembled computer system or
nonperipheral computer component, as applicable; except to the extent
necessary to advertise, set a price or fee, or otherwise market or
distribute Microsoft software that you are expressly authorized by
Microsoft to market or distribute as separate items from the fully
assembled computer system or nonperipheral computer component, as
applicable. Except as granted in this license, you may not use, run,
distribute, copy, modify, display, repackage, or reassemble any
individual software licenses or hardware units, or any part of them.
16.2 You are solely responsible for all applicable taxes, fees, duties,
and tariffs that may be levied in connection with this license and the
ordering and distributing of software and hardware under this license.
16.3 You may not reverse engineer, decompile, or disassemble any
individual software license or hardware unit except and only to the
extent that it is expressly permitted by applicable law notwithstanding
this provision. All rights not expressly granted are reserved.
16.4 If a court holds any provision of this license to be illegal,
invalid, or unenforceable, the remaining provisions will remain in full
force and effect and the parties will amend the agreement to give effect
to the stricken clause to the maximum extent possible.
16.5 If the contracting party to this license is MLGP, the laws of the
State of Washington, U.S.A. govern this license. If the contracting
party to this license is MIOL, the laws of Ireland govern this license.
16.6 Nothing in this license restricts you from supporting, promoting,
distributing, or using non-Microsoft software or hardware.
16.7 Microsoft may assign this license at any time to an affi liated
company.
16.8 This license does not create a "technology transfer" agreement, as
defi ned by applicable law because (a) the technology (including any
software) made available under this license is not an integrated part of
a technology chain for production or management purposes and (b) the
technology (including any software) will have its own technology
license. You will not hold yourself out as our technology recipient and
will not attempt to identify us as a technology provider under this
license.


So you can see that even the System Builders License [SBL] doesn't
mention that the motherboard can't be changed. MS uses post-SBL and
post-EULA policies to spread that nonsense that the motherboard can't be
upgraded.

The ONLY mention of the "motherboard" in the SBL is that it is a PART of
a "fully assembled computer." There is not mention of the "motherboard"
in the EULA at all!

SBL- 4.1 "If the individual software license is a desktop operating
system (including Windows XP Media Center Edition), we grant you a
nonexclusive right to distribute individual software licenses; provided
that each one is distributed with either (a) a fully assembled computer
system or (b) a nonperipheral computer hardware component. A 'fully
assembled computer system' means a computer system consisting of at
least a central processing unit, a motherboard, a hard drive, a power
supply, and a case. A 'nonperipheral computer hardware component' means
a component that will be an integral part of the fully assembled
computer system on which the individual software license will be
installed."

"Each individual software license must be distributed pursuant to the
end-user license agreement ('EULA') that accompanies the individual
software license. Under the terms of the EULA, you are the licensor."

Under the terms of the SBL, the system builder is the licensor of OEM XP
to the End User, so if I'm the System Builder of my own computer, I am
both the licensor and the licensee of my OEM software, and as such, I am
always following MY interpretation of the the EULA. And my post-EULA
policies are that my End Users may upgrade their motherboard at any time
they want to!

--
Peace!
Kurt
Self-anointed Moderator
microscum.pubic.windowsexp.gonorrhea
http://microscum.com/mscommunity
"Trustworthy Computing" is only another example of an Oxymoron!
"Produkt-Aktivierung macht frei"

Leythos wrote:
On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 16:31:01 +0100, Alias wrote:

It's right in the type Alias - you just have to read it. They even
provide the link to the start of the SB website in their web-page!

I knew you'd say that. I changed my MOBO yesterday and it got
activated without a hitch, the web site you love notwithstanding.

Alias, I've never claimed that Activation is perfect, never claimed
that MS won't allow re-activation of OEM installs, never claimed that
you can't do the 120 Day wait and re-activate. I've never said that
OEM stops anything from being re-done.

And you completely ignored that your statement doesn't have a pile of
beans to do with OEM Licensing - especially since you wont even read
the SB site to see what OEM licensing is.

I did, and I'm not afraid to actually quote the whole thing, like you
are, because no where in the SBL or the EULA does either license say
that the System Builder or the End User can't upgrade the motherboard on
a computer running OEM XP.

MS's Post-SBL and Post-EULA policies are nothing but wishful thinking!

--
Peace!
Kurt
Self-anointed Moderator
microscum.pubic.windowsexp.gonorrhea
http://microscum.com/mscommunity
"Trustworthy Computing" is only another example of an Oxymoron!
"Produkt-Aktivierung macht frei"

Leythos wrote:
On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 10:21:20 -0500, kurttrail wrote:

And that just goes to show what a real idiot you are. Instead of
trying to back up your erroneous beliefs, you rather dwell in the
nonsense.

Since there is almost never a post I read from you where you are not
snide to the person you are disagreeing with, I personally don't see
much need in holding a proper conversation with you, you're really
just a toy to play with.

Which is just your excuse for not backing up your irrational opinions.

If you were to hold a conversation without
being rude or snotty I would change my method of communicating with
you, but as I don't hold any respect for a snotty, whiney,
foul-mouthed, little kid, I don't see the point in forming any type
of meaningful conversation with you.

Because you can't. You are irrational. And I expose it every time.


Change your attitude and stop using foul comments and changing
people's nicks to show your immaturity and I'll be happy converse
with you - here or in email, but I wont' chat, in a proper manner,
with a trolling, immature, whiner, foul-mouthed little brat.

LOL! Run Away! Run Away from you own irrationality!

--
Peace!
Kurt
Self-anointed Moderator
microscum.pubic.windowsexp.gonorrhea
http://microscum.com/mscommunity
"Trustworthy Computing" is only another example of an Oxymoron!
"Produkt-Aktivierung macht frei"

In article ,
says...

Since the OEM provided by the major manufacturers do not need activation as
long as they are installed on the original computer, most will not see the
issue.
Those who have installed that OEM on a different computer using a generic
OEM CD with the Product Key on the side of the computer may have a problem,
but they should not be installing the OEM on that different computer.

Those who have upgraded to a motherboard from a different manufacturer or
discarded the original OEM CD for the generic OEM CD are more likely to get
hit by this.

This is the way I understand it works, I may or may not be correct on all
counts.


Where did I say anything about attempting to install a generic OEM on a
different computer than it was originally installed on? I am speaking
of installs which meet the terms of the OEM EULA. You always seem to
put a spin on things which attempt to put Microsoft in the best light.

While this is your right, it is not completely honest. Microsoft would
not be in business at all if it were not for its customers. In fact,
Microsoft is in business for its customers, I hope. If not, they really
need to get a new mindset.

The fact is, I am persuaded that Microsoft is planning to disable ALL
attempts to activate OEM CDs via the Internet.

Maybe you can afford to purchase your OS at Microsoft's retail price.
Millions of others like me cannot. Up until now, purchasing a Generic
OEM which was manufactured by Microsoft was a good deal for those of us
on very limited budgets. I thought Microsoft had finally seen the light
when they liberalized their rules to allow purchase of an OEM with just
a power cord or mouse. I certainly couldn't afford to buy the OS PLUS a
hard drive. I only have a computer because my brother was kind enough
to hand his old one down to me when he purchased a new Mac. He can
afford to do this. I cannot.

Now I will be required to talk to some Indian named "Fred" who can
barely speak English if I want to activate my OS (again, according to
the OEM EULA). I've done my part, and kept the terms of the OEM EULA.
Now Microsoft is saying "Screw you! Your money is worthless!" to the
deal they made with me.

Now I will have to prove to this "Fred" that I have a legal OEM. (again,
NOT an OEM provided with a new machine, but one mass-produced by
Microsoft.) HE is going to ask me questions relating to an OEM
installed on a new machine by a huge system builder. I will have to try
to persuade him that my OEM is a legally purchased-and-installed copy.
I have no idea where I purchased the sucker from, even. He will go into
the conversation with the mindset that I am an evil pirate. I guarantee
you that Microsoft has instructed him to shoot first and ask questions
later.

Here in the United States, a man is supposed to be innocent until proved
quilty. "Fred" is going to have the attitude that I am guilty until I
can prove myself innocent.

Some how, I will have to find the money to purchase a retail copy of XP,
so that Microsoft can no longer disavow their EULA with me...or can they
still? Microsoft will find SOME way to trash their deal with me,
eventually, because they will want to get rid of XP, and turn every one
into Longhorn users. Ol' Bill is sitting in his expensive chair
laughing out loud, thinking to himself "This is easier than taking candy
from a baby -- all I have to do is change the OEM Eula after they agree
to it, and they will shell out more money for another copy of MY
software."

--
Donald L McDaniel
Post all replies to the original
thread so that it may remain intact.
================================================== ==

Alias wrote:
"Leythos" wrote in message
news
On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 16:16:04 +0100, Alias wrote:


"Leythos" wrote in message
news On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 10:00:53 -0500, kurttrail wrote:

OEM software is legally sold in Wal-Mart and you know it.

And you have missed the point - WalMart packages it with a MS
Mouse too, proving that OEM purchases in the US require a hardware
purchase in order
to comply with the MS agreement. Heck, they even say that the
PURCHASER is
required to comply with the Systems Builders Licensing!

As quoted from the following site:
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/produ...%3A3951%3A3954

Microsoft XP Pro IS designed for businesses of any size and
individuals upgrading from Windows 98 SE, Me, NT 4.0 or 2000
Professional. * This OEM version is intended for system builders
only and
cannot be transferred to another PC once it is installed.

* The purchaser of this software is required to comply with the
terms of the System Builder license , including the
responsibility of providing all end user support for the
software. * includes 2-button mouse

Notice it doesn't say anything about a motherboard.

AHAHAHAHAHA!

Alias

You only wish - as usual you only see part of the text - it fully
says that you MUST COMPLY WITH THE SYSTEMS BUILDERS LICENSE - Guess
what the Systems Builder Site states about OEM software and
Motherboard? Oh, that's right, you won't visit the site because you
have to REGISTER and you don't want to be proven wrong, so you claim
that you won't register for some half-baked reason.

It's right in the type Alias - you just have to read it. They even
provide the link to the start of the SB website in their web-page!

I knew you'd say that. I changed my MOBO yesterday and it got
activated without a hitch, the web site you love notwithstanding.

Alias

Lamethos is just lying when it comes to the SBL anyway Alias. No where
in it does it say you the System Builder, or you the End User cannot
replace your motherboard.

Lamethos uses MS's post-SBL and post-EULA non-binding policies to rip
off his customers by selling more copies of software than his End Users
really need.

--
Peace!
Kurt
Self-anointed Moderator
microscum.pubic.windowsexp.gonorrhea
http://microscum.com/mscommunity
"Trustworthy Computing" is only another example of an Oxymoron!
"Produkt-Aktivierung macht frei"

"kurttrail" wrote in message
...
Alias wrote:
"Leythos" wrote in message
news
On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 16:16:04 +0100, Alias wrote:


"Leythos" wrote in message
news On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 10:00:53 -0500, kurttrail wrote:

OEM software is legally sold in Wal-Mart and you know it.

And you have missed the point - WalMart packages it with a MS
Mouse too, proving that OEM purchases in the US require a hardware
purchase in order
to comply with the MS agreement. Heck, they even say that the
PURCHASER is
required to comply with the Systems Builders Licensing!

As quoted from the following site:
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/produ...%3A3951%3A3954

Microsoft XP Pro IS designed for businesses of any size and
individuals upgrading from Windows 98 SE, Me, NT 4.0 or 2000
Professional. * This OEM version is intended for system builders only
and
cannot be transferred to another PC once it is installed.

* The purchaser of this software is required to comply with the
terms of the System Builder license , including the
responsibility of providing all end user support for the
software. * includes 2-button mouse

Notice it doesn't say anything about a motherboard.

AHAHAHAHAHA!

Alias

You only wish - as usual you only see part of the text - it fully
says that you MUST COMPLY WITH THE SYSTEMS BUILDERS LICENSE - Guess
what the Systems Builder Site states about OEM software and
Motherboard? Oh, that's right, you won't visit the site because you
have to REGISTER and you don't want to be proven wrong, so you claim
that you won't register for some half-baked reason.

It's right in the type Alias - you just have to read it. They even
provide the link to the start of the SB website in their web-page!

I knew you'd say that. I changed my MOBO yesterday and it got
activated without a hitch, the web site you love notwithstanding.

Alias

Lamethos is just lying when it comes to the SBL anyway Alias. No where in
it does it say you the System Builder, or you the End User cannot replace
your motherboard.

Lamethos uses MS's post-SBL and post-EULA non-binding policies to rip off
his customers by selling more copies of software than his End Users really
need.

--
Peace!
Kurt

Leythos has to have the last word (must be an immature ego thing). I gave it
to him because I know he's wrong. You know he's wrong. MS knows he's wrong
and I am sure all the good people who read this ng know he's wrong.

Alias

Leythos wrote:
On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 10:48:21 -0500, kurttrail wrote:

[snipped the Licensing information, since we agree with it being
valid]

No I didn't. I agreed that that is what it is. The validity of it is
something that MS must prove in a Court of Law.


So you can see that even the System Builders License [SBL] doesn't
mention that the motherboard can't be changed. MS uses post-SBL and
post-EULA policies to spread that nonsense that the motherboard
can't be upgraded.

As I see it, the Systems Builder agreement is between the OEM and MS,

And it says nothing about nothing about the motherboard can't be
changed.

and the OEM is bound by rules that include the EULA, the Builders
Agreement, and any addendum to the agreement they want. I also
believe it's within their "right" to clarify sections of the
agreement at any time.

After the fact of the SBL acceptance? After the fact of the sale?
Without notifying the other party in a direct communication?

LOL! A contract can't be renegotiated unless both parties agree. MS
can't just add contractual terms after the fact of the contract any time
it wants.

MS is not a law unto itself!


Thanks for posting in a reasonable manner this time - I would rather
have a conversation with you than a battle.

F*#K YOU! You aren't man enough to acknowledge the fact of reality,
that neither the SBL nor the EULA doesn't mention at all anything about
invalidating the license of OEM XP when the motherboard is changed.

You just keep up the MicroFUD! And that's why I don't treat you with
any respect! Because you don't deserve any. People like you that
willingly accept and spread BS, FUD and misinformation only deserve to
be treated like the little sycophantic sh*ts that you really are!

--
Peace!
Kurt
Self-anointed Moderator
microscum.pubic.windowsexp.gonorrhea
http://microscum.com/mscommunity
"Trustworthy Computing" is only another example of an Oxymoron!
"Produkt-Aktivierung macht frei"

Leythos wrote:
On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 11:04:02 -0500, kurttrail wrote:

Alias wrote:
"Leythos" wrote in message
news On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 16:16:04 +0100, Alias wrote:


"Leythos" wrote in message
news On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 10:00:53 -0500, kurttrail wrote:

OEM software is legally sold in Wal-Mart and you know it.

And you have missed the point - WalMart packages it with a MS
Mouse too, proving that OEM purchases in the US require a
hardware purchase in order
to comply with the MS agreement. Heck, they even say that the
PURCHASER is
required to comply with the Systems Builders Licensing!

As quoted from the following site:
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/produ...%3A3951%3A3954

Microsoft XP Pro IS designed for businesses of any size and
individuals upgrading from Windows 98 SE, Me, NT 4.0 or 2000
Professional. * This OEM version is intended for system builders
only and
cannot be transferred to another PC once it is installed.

* The purchaser of this software is required to comply with
the terms of the System Builder license , including the
responsibility of providing all end user support for the
software. * includes 2-button mouse

Notice it doesn't say anything about a motherboard.

AHAHAHAHAHA!

Alias

You only wish - as usual you only see part of the text - it fully
says that you MUST COMPLY WITH THE SYSTEMS BUILDERS LICENSE - Guess
what the Systems Builder Site states about OEM software and
Motherboard? Oh, that's right, you won't visit the site because you
have to REGISTER and you don't want to be proven wrong, so you
claim that you won't register for some half-baked reason.

It's right in the type Alias - you just have to read it. They even
provide the link to the start of the SB website in their web-page!

I knew you'd say that. I changed my MOBO yesterday and it got
activated without a hitch, the web site you love notwithstanding.

Alias

Lamethos is just lying when it comes to the SBL anyway Alias. No
where in it does it say you the System Builder, or you the End User
cannot replace your motherboard.

Lamethos uses MS's post-SBL and post-EULA non-binding policies to rip
off his customers by selling more copies of software than his End
Users really need.

And just when I though you were going to be able to have proper
conversations you turn all immature and childish again. This is really
very telling about your character Kurt. There is a difference between
being wrong, being mistaken, being right, and being immature/childish.

And being a liar like you!

You've not proven anything about the OEM licensing, at least not from
what I read on the MS site concerning it - it's very clear. As
always, if you don't like the licensing you don't have to use the
product.


I have posted the entire SBL to this group, which you have avoided like
a plague, because you know that nothing in it says anything about that
the motherboard can't be changed. That is the only thing that is clear.
The POST-SBL Dreams of MS are not contractually binding at all, since no
one ever agreed to abide with it.

You are just a sycophant that uses the post-SBL nonsense to get your
customers to buy more software than they legally need to buy!

--
Peace!
Kurt
Self-anointed Moderator
microscum.pubic.windowsexp.gonorrhea
http://microscum.com/mscommunity
"Trustworthy Computing" is only another example of an Oxymoron!
"Produkt-Aktivierung macht frei"

Leythos wrote:
On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 11:31:13 -0500, kurttrail wrote:

You are just a sycophant

I see you are back to being your trollish self. It's really to bad, I
almost thought you were actually human, but I can see that you're not.

And you have proven that you are just a sycophant, as you are unwilling
to admit the the SBL and the EULA do not mention anything about a
motherboard can't be changed under the terms of either of those
licenses!

You have chosen to reply only to my style, rather than the substance of
what I was saying, in order to avoid backing up your own obvious
misinformation.

As Alias said, you are just trying to get the last word, because of your
mistaken impression that the last post wins. Any rational human being
can see that I'm right about the SBL and the EULA, and that you are
nothing but a sycophant. I sorry that being called a sycophant hurts
you, but the truth does hurt.

--
Peace!
Kurt
Self-anointed Moderator
microscum.pubic.windowsexp.gonorrhea
http://microscum.com/mscommunity
"Trustworthy Computing" is only another example of an Oxymoron!
"Produkt-Aktivierung macht frei"

As Alias said, you are just trying to get the last word, because of your
mistaken impression that the last post wins.

You miserable f#&*ng hypocrite!

--
LB