Outlook too big

On 10/08/2017 02:54 PM, VanguardLH wrote:
T wrote:

VanguardLH wrote:

So was the hint about autoarchive useful?


No. I am looking for a database to off load their defunct junk to.
And it has to be something automatic.

Your new requirement now is the process be automatic. Autoarchiving
*is* automatic. You can setup a database and then install some add-on
into Outlook where it must be configured in that client to do its job.
or you can configure the clients to autoarchive.

You only mentioned your customers independently using an e-mail client
(Outlook). You never mentioned they are connecting to Exchange (or
other servers that support the Exchange protocol). So server-side
archiving is not, so far, an option.

Just what "database" did you want to use?

No idea

Sounds like you already have
something in mind other than the .pst database files for archives.

They WILL NOT interact with it.

What good is that database if they aren't going to use it? Old e-mails
are going into a bit bucket that the users aren't going to use.

They want the ability to use it if the need arises. Think of it
a YUGE dumpster, with indexes, that the trash company never picks up.

What I meant by the interacting part, was that they WOULD NOT
go through all the old rubbish and tag thing for deletion or archive.

https://www.webmd.com/mental-health/...sive-hoarder#1

An intense emotional attachment to objects that others see
as trivial -- or even trash. They’d feel a sense of major
loss if they had to throw this stuff away.

A sense that many items have an intrinsic value, like others
might see in artwork or driftwood.

The assumption that an item might be useful someday, which
compels them to save far more than “the drawer of hinges,
thumbtacks, string, and rubber bands� that many of us keep.

And *** ALL *** their old eMail!

On 10/08/2017 03:15 PM, VanguardLH wrote:
George wrote:

Take a look at program MailStore. It might meet your needs.

T wrote:

I got an annoying one for you guy.

I have several customer on Outlook (no they
won't convert to Thunderbird) who WILL NOT
THROW ANYTHING AWAY.Â* We are talking 30 GB PST
files.Â* Yikes!

Is there any database program out there that
will save and catalog for quick (ha ha) search
gobs of [ancient, useless] Outlook eMails?

T only mentioned his customers using Outlook so they are all using local
e-mail clients. There was no mention ever of those clients connecting
to Exchange or using any collaboration server that controls and manages
the message stores for the workstation clients. With T's customers,
they're all operating independently. Mailstore works with e-mail
service providers and their servers, not with single Outlook clients.


All local. They are connect to iMap servers

On 10/08/2017 03:23 PM, VanguardLH wrote:
T wrote:

I have several customer on Outlook (no they won't convert to
Thunderbird) who WILL NOT THROW ANYTHING AWAY. We are talking 30 GB
PST files. Yikes!

Is there any database program out there that will save and catalog
for quick (ha ha) search gobs of [ancient, useless] Outlook eMails?

In that huge 30GB message store, is a lot of it consumed by attachments,
especially large ones? If so, there are add-ons that can strip the
attachments from the e-mails to store them in a separate file and put a
link to that external file within the original e-mail. Stripping out
photos, movies, maps, zips, or other huge files (by users that don't
realize that e-mail was not intended to be a file transfer protocol) can
significantly reduce the size of the message store. Basically you end
up moving all the attachments out to a file and make the message store
much smaller.

https://www.mapilab.com/outlook/attachments_processor/
http://www.sperrysoftware.com/Email-...tachment-save/
https://www.techhit.com/ezdetach/out...tachments.html (*)

(*) Don't know if it adds file links within e-mails to point at the
stripped out and externally saved attachments.

That's just one example. There might be free Outlook add-ons to do
[nearly] the same thing of stripping out attachments. You can find some
free code examples for VBA macros, like:

https://www.slipstick.com/developer/...e-attachments/
https://www.slipstick.com/developer/...-a-new-folder/



Yes, a lot of that is attachments. Quotes from vendors back to
1836 or some such. And SOMEDAY THEY MAY BE USEFUL!!!

:'(

T wrote:

On 10/08/2017 03:23 PM, VanguardLH wrote:
T wrote:

I have several customer on Outlook (no they won't convert to
Thunderbird) who WILL NOT THROW ANYTHING AWAY. We are talking 30 GB
PST files. Yikes!

Is there any database program out there that will save and catalog
for quick (ha ha) search gobs of [ancient, useless] Outlook eMails?

In that huge 30GB message store, is a lot of it consumed by attachments,
especially large ones? If so, there are add-ons that can strip the
attachments from the e-mails to store them in a separate file and put a
link to that external file within the original e-mail. Stripping out
photos, movies, maps, zips, or other huge files (by users that don't
realize that e-mail was not intended to be a file transfer protocol) can
significantly reduce the size of the message store. Basically you end
up moving all the attachments out to a file and make the message store
much smaller.

https://www.mapilab.com/outlook/attachments_processor/
http://www.sperrysoftware.com/Email-...tachment-save/
https://www.techhit.com/ezdetach/out...tachments.html (*)

(*) Don't know if it adds file links within e-mails to point at the
stripped out and externally saved attachments.

That's just one example. There might be free Outlook add-ons to do
[nearly] the same thing of stripping out attachments. You can find some
free code examples for VBA macros, like:

https://www.slipstick.com/developer/...e-attachments/
https://www.slipstick.com/developer/...-a-new-folder/


Yes, a lot of that is attachments. Quotes from vendors back to
1836 or some such. And SOMEDAY THEY MAY BE USEFUL!!!

:'(

And your point? Stripping out the attachments to store in some store
folder with links to those files added to the e-mails still lets the
users find the e-mails and still find the folder. However, the PST file
gets a lot smaller without all the attachments.

Attachments are stored as long encoded text strings. The number of
bytes in the MIME part of an e-mail will be 130%, or larger, than the
attached file.

Stripping out the attachments to *save* them somewhere else with a file
link added to the e-mails reduces PST file without losing any of the
attachments or access to them.

Seems a quick and painless way to immediately reduce the size of
Outlook's message store without having to much as compared to moving
some e-mail items into an external database. You'd be the instant hero
by making Outlook snappy to its users with little interference (to
install the add-in and run it once) rather than having to interfere
longer with their workflow. Even setting up a multiple chain of
archives using AutoArchive would take longer.

T wrote:

On 10/08/2017 02:54 PM, VanguardLH wrote:
T wrote:

VanguardLH wrote:

So was the hint about autoarchive useful?


No. I am looking for a database to off load their defunct junk to.
And it has to be something automatic.

Your new requirement now is the process be automatic. Autoarchiving
*is* automatic. You can setup a database and then install some add-on
into Outlook where it must be configured in that client to do its job.
or you can configure the clients to autoarchive.

You only mentioned your customers independently using an e-mail client
(Outlook). You never mentioned they are connecting to Exchange (or
other servers that support the Exchange protocol). So server-side
archiving is not, so far, an option.

Just what "database" did you want to use?

No idea

Sounds like you already have
something in mind other than the .pst database files for archives.

They WILL NOT interact with it.

What good is that database if they aren't going to use it? Old e-mails
are going into a bit bucket that the users aren't going to use.

They want the ability to use it if the need arises. Think of it
a YUGE dumpster, with indexes, that the trash company never picks up.

Rather than have to go to some other dumpster to find old e-mails,
archives would still be there. The users can decide if and when they
would open one, or more archive files. If left open in Outlook, they do
not affect the performance of the current message store and the users
can go look at anytime they want without having to get you to move old
e-mails out of some monster archive database. They can leave the
archives open in Outlook but collapsed so all they see is a node in the
tree for each archive.

What I meant by the interacting part, was that they WOULD NOT
go through all the old rubbish and tag thing for deletion or archive.

I thought /YOU/ were going to set that up for them. If they are going
to implement Autoarchive then they don't need you. If some external
database for long-term storage is used, it will NOT be convenient for
them.

T wrote:

On 10/08/2017 01:46 AM, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
In message , VanguardLH
writes:
T wrote:

I have several customer on Outlook (no they
won't convert to Thunderbird) who WILL NOT
THROW ANYTHING AWAY.* We are talking 30 GB PST
files.* Yikes!

Is there any database program out there that
will save and catalog for quick (ha ha) search
gobs of [ancient, useless] Outlook eMails?

Use AutoArchive already built into Outlook.* Nothing has to be thrown
away but might be better, especially for performance, to have a small
message store for the active messages.

This [LONG - though good - explanation snipped] sounds as if it might be
just what T needs.
[]
Remember that you must open and leave open the old archive files so the
user can search through plus have Outlook exercise the autoarchive
[]
Although that does concern me: if the archive files must be opened and
left open, what - other than intellectual satisfaction (and perhaps
splitting the old emails into more than one file) - is achieved: will
Outlook run any faster etc.?

True. Two programs versus one program. It is like hitting
my head against a wall telling some folks they have to
throw out their old stuff.

They don't have to throw away anything. First, backups would provide
restoring .pst files that can be opened separately of the current
message store to get at old e-mails. Autoarchive would push old e-mails
into .pst files, not have to toss it away. The old archives can be
accessed just as easily, probably easier, than backup files by those
users.

While autoarchive is normally scheduled, you can run it manually. So
define a cutoff, like 5 years or 10 years or whatever, run autoarchive
once to push the old stuff into an archive file. Outlook will run
faster with a small current message store but old e-mails will still be
accessible from the archive(s). Autoarchive can be ran manually
whenever wanted or needed or schedule to run in the background.

Whether the archive files are created, I would still recommend backing
them up just like you should be backing up whatever external database
you find to do the same archiving function.

On 10/08/2017 08:42 PM, VanguardLH wrote:
I thought/YOU/ were going to set that up for them.

I wold have to ask them about EVERY eMail!

I was looking for something that would do it by date.

They also have about 200 (no kidding) folders. I
am looking at what would archive those too.

On 10/08/2017 08:47 PM, VanguardLH wrote:
Whether the archive files are created, I would still recommend backing
them up just like you should be backing up whatever external database
you find to do the same archiving function.

That would be mandatory!

T wrote:

On 10/08/2017 08:42 PM, VanguardLH wrote:
I thought/YOU/ were going to set that up for them.

I wold have to ask them about EVERY eMail!

I was looking for something that would do it by date.

What was it about AutoArchive that made you think it was performed
manually on each e-mail instead of date as *I* mentioned?

They also have about 200 (no kidding) folders. I
am looking at what would archive those too.

A backup program that can access Outlook database files while Outlook is
still running.

You could set autoarchive settings on every folder but 200 would become
tedious. However, since these users are NOT corroborating their e-mail
activities through a server, not every user would have 200 folders. I
suspect that is a one-off case.

On Sun, 8 Oct 2017 22:00:57 -0700, T wrote:

On 10/08/2017 08:42 PM, VanguardLH wrote:
I thought/YOU/ were going to set that up for them.

I wold have to ask them about EVERY eMail!

I was looking for something that would do it by date.

Outlook's Auto Archive feature can do exactly that.

They also have about 200 (no kidding) folders. I
am looking at what would archive those too.

Outlook's Auto Archive feature can do exactly that.

If you're lazy, just set it up for one folder, then click the button to
apply those settings to all folders. Collect your check and leave.

For some reason, you'd rather bang your head against the wall. You're
hell bent on designing some kind of database application when a
perfectly reasonable solution is staring you, and those customers, in
the face. If they have Outlook, they already have the solution. They
just need to enable it and possibly tweak its default settings. This is
an easy one. You're making it hard.

--

Char Jackson

Char Jackson wrote:

T wrote:

VanguardLH wrote:

I thought/YOU/ were going to set that up for them.

I wold have to ask them about EVERY eMail!
I was looking for something that would do it by date.

Outlook's Auto Archive feature can do exactly that.

They also have about 200 (no kidding) folders. I am looking at what
would archive those too.

Outlook's Auto Archive feature can do exactly that.

If you're lazy, just set it up for one folder, then click the button to
apply those settings to all folders. Collect your check and leave.

I was just about to look that up. Yep, in the global Autoarchive
settings, there's the "Apply these settings to all folders now".
Eliminates having to do it manually on each folder.

I have different autoarchive settings for my Archive folder (not an
autoarchive file, just a folder in my current message store where I move
Inbox items for awhile or into subfolders if I want to keep them
indefinitely), Delete Items, Junk, and Sent Items folders. I don't use
autoarchive on my Inbox folder because I've never used it to retain
every e-mail that I've received. After reading or determining an action
on an Inbox e-mail, it gets moved to somewhere else or deleted (and my
Deleted Items folder has an autoarchive of 1 month with action=delete).

I don't rely on AutoArhive for restoring old e-mails. Items in the
archive files are just as susceptible of getting lost (deleted) as they
are in the message current store - unless you don't open then in Outlook
making access rather difficult. However, files get corrupted as do file
systems and hard disks die. So I still backup all my messages stores
(current and archives). Some backup programs have problems backing up
..pst and .ost files that are inuse by Outlook but I've not had problems
with any backup program that supports VSS. I know the backed up .pst
files got backed up because I've had a couple occasions for restoring
them to get back to a prior state in Outlook. For those that don't
support VSS, some had an add-in you installed into Outlook to work as a
client with the backup program.

There was an old Personal Folders Backup (PFB) program from Microsoft
that would save a (that's just one) copy of the PST file upon exit from
Outlook (http://tinyurl.com/zqnqrsy). If the current message store was
huge, well, obviously it would take a long time for Outlook to exit as
it performed all that copying. As I recall, Microsoft dropped that
add-in so it probably won't work on anything past Office 2003. No idea
what version T's customers are using.

On Mon, 9 Oct 2017 00:39:11 -0500, VanguardLH wrote:

T wrote:

On 10/08/2017 08:42 PM, VanguardLH wrote:
I thought/YOU/ were going to set that up for them.

I wold have to ask them about EVERY eMail!

I was looking for something that would do it by date.

What was it about AutoArchive that made you think it was performed
manually on each e-mail instead of date as *I* mentioned?

As did I.

They also have about 200 (no kidding) folders. I
am looking at what would archive those too.

A backup program that can access Outlook database files while Outlook is
still running.

You could set autoarchive settings on every folder but 200 would become
tedious. However, since these users are NOT corroborating their e-mail
activities through a server, not every user would have 200 folders. I
suspect that is a one-off case.

Todd pretends he can't see my posts, but as I replied directly to him,
even if someone has 200 folders, it's not really a problem.

Open the AutoArchive settings dialog and set reasonable defaults. Then
click the button toward the bottom of that dialog called, "Apply these
settings to all folders now." Done and done.

--

Char Jackson

In message , VanguardLH
writes:
[]
And your point? Stripping out the attachments to store in some store
folder with links to those files added to the e-mails still lets the
users find the e-mails and still find the folder. However, the PST file
gets a lot smaller without all the attachments.
[]
Seems a quick and painless way to immediately reduce the size of
Outlook's message store without having to much as compared to moving
some e-mail items into an external database. You'd be the instant hero
by making Outlook snappy to its users with little interference (to
install the add-in and run it once) rather than having to interfere
longer with their workflow. Even setting up a multiple chain of
archives using AutoArchive would take longer.

Yes, I think we need to ask T, why you're NOT going to: *EITHER* set up
an auto-archiving cascade (or even single file), as has been described -
AND WHICH WOULD BE AUTOMATIC, NOT OBLIGE THE USERS TO DO ANYTHING
MANUALLY - *OR* implement the above suggestion of
exporting-and-them-removing attachments and replacing them with links.
(Or both.)

Without an answer as yo why you're NOT going to do either (or both) of
these things, there's little point in continuing the discussion.

[The one minor thing I'm not sure about is whether the
replace-attachments-with-links utility is one-off, or can be set to
carry on working - but even if, as I suspect, it's one-off, it could
still be something you do for them, say once a year.]
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

"Does Barbie come with Ken?"
"Barbie comes with G.I. Joe. She fakes it with Ken." - anonymous

On Sun, 8 Oct 2017 14:48:38 -0700, T wrote:

On 10/08/2017 11:36 AM, George wrote:
Take a look at program MailStore.* It might meet your needs.

Thank you!

I don't know about the particular needs, but it's a great program,
free for personal non-commercial use. Much better for searching IMAP
accounts than Alpine!

On Sun, 8 Oct 2017 19:56:15 -0700, T wrote:

Yes, a lot of that is attachments. Quotes from vendors back to
1836 or some such. And SOMEDAY THEY MAY BE USEFUL!!!

Yes, suprising sometimes how useful such old vendor quotes can be,
though the standard of email back in 1836 was a bit dicey!